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Post by Gwydden on Jul 18, 2018 23:26:08 GMT
What am I seeing. A Spellforce thread? I was a huge fan of the first game (and its very significant expansions) back in 2003-6 but IMO the world lost its attraction with the rune warriors gone. While I did enjoy SF2, its Shaikan weren't nearly as fascinating as a concept, and the end of the "Dragon Storm" expansion I found so annoying that I disown its story. I was part of the beta test of "Faith in Destiny" which resulted in me not buying it. I haven't bought SF3 so far but we'll see. From what I've seen, it does look good though for me personally, doesn't match the first game's attraction as well.
I still have the intro of SF1 in my eye and ear (well, I did replay it last year), which drew me into its world quite thoroughly, and though the VA was really bad in parts of the game, this never applied to the German voice of the female Rune Warrior, which matched my view of my main character as perfectly as nothing else since then. Her calm determination and understated non-ideological passion has always been what I'd like more fantasy heroes to be like. I even wrote a fanfic about her (non-published) where she discovered the secrets of the Circle mages, regained her immortality and then went away, disgusted about the witch hunts at the end of Dragon Storm and aware that the world wasn't ready for those secrets again as yet.
I remember really enjoying SF2. I've never tried the first one, though I've heard some good things. What exactly is its selling point relative to the sequel? I'm still not sure what rune warriors are, only that they are mentioned a lot in SF2 and that the player character of Dragon Storm used to be one.
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Post by Ieldra on Jul 19, 2018 12:32:12 GMT
What am I seeing. A Spellforce thread? I was a huge fan of the first game (and its very significant expansions) back in 2003-6 but IMO the world lost its attraction with the rune warriors gone. While I did enjoy SF2, its Shaikan weren't nearly as fascinating as a concept, and the end of the "Dragon Storm" expansion I found so annoying that I disown its story. I was part of the beta test of "Faith in Destiny" which resulted in me not buying it. I haven't bought SF3 so far but we'll see. From what I've seen, it does look good though for me personally, doesn't match the first game's attraction as well.
I still have the intro of SF1 in my eye and ear (well, I did replay it last year), which drew me into its world quite thoroughly, and though the VA was really bad in parts of the game, this never applied to the German voice of the female Rune Warrior, which matched my view of my main character as perfectly as nothing else since then. Her calm determination and understated non-ideological passion has always been what I'd like more fantasy heroes to be like. I even wrote a fanfic about her (non-published) where she discovered the secrets of the Circle mages, regained her immortality and then went away, disgusted about the witch hunts at the end of Dragon Storm and aware that the world wasn't ready for those secrets again as yet.
I remember really enjoying SF2. I've never tried the first one, though I've heard some good things. What exactly is its selling point relative to the sequel? I'm still not sure what rune warriors are, only that they are mentioned a lot in SF2 and that the player character of Dragon Storm used to be one. My answers to your two questions:
I. SF1 vs. SF2
When SF2 came out, I criticized the following points:
(1) Smaller maps, smaller armies and an inability to zoom out far enough to have an overview of even part of a battle. In short, SF1 is more epic. *Way* more. Some people complained about "long treks" but most fans I know have seen the larger maps, where many more things could happen, as an asset. In SF2, you never have the impression of looking at a real landscape, and you always reach the end of the map just as you start enjoying it. Also, this is supposed to be a big conflict with involving armies, not squads. In a review, I said you felt like a general in SF1, but only like a colonel, if that, in SF2.
(2) An unappealing story The story of SF1 is at least somewhat original, and the intro is outstanding in introducing it. Also, while the primary antagonist (whose name I'll not disclose just in case) acts quite stereotypically at times, and his plots where always seems one step ahead of the protagonist, he has stature and ends up feeling a worthy enemy of any epic fantasy hero, unlike that screeching harpy Sorvina and the pitiable madman Malacay (I described them as such in my review back in 2007). SF2's story is OK, but not more than that, and don't get me started on Dragon Storm.
(3) The skill system is complete crap. Considering SF2's skill system can get me incensed even after more than 10 years have passed. It's an abysmal system for any game with roleplaying elements, preventing meaningful specialization and making characters too similar for 2/3 of the game. In SF1, I had about 8 different characters which were very different in their skills, and that made itself felt right from the start of a new game and continued down to the end of the second expansion. In SF2, I had just two, and even they didn't feel very different.
SF1's major downside in comparison is problems with balance. The skill system contributed to that, but mission design in terms of actions taken (not in terms of landscapes covered) wasn't all that compelling most of the time. That changed with the expansions though. Also, I should add that the German voice of the female rune warrior was a major feature of identification for me. I don't think I would still play the game occasionally if not for her.
II. Lore
The original rune warriors were semi-immortal elite slave soldiers in service to the Circle. The Circle mages could use the Allfire (sometimes also called Archfire or Essence in the English translation) to forge a bond between a human soul and a rune, with the effect that the person so enspelled could always be called back to life (real life, not unlife) after having died, while being under the control of the rune's owner. Rune warriors could accumulate skills and experience through several lifetimes, and thus became unmatched experts in their fields. Of course, this also meant a kind of slavery even death couldn't end, with the Circle mages being virtually immortal, so the Rune Warriors' attitude to their masters varied greatly depending on their own feeling and how they were treated and used by their different masters, and probably changed significantly as the Circle grew more corrupt.
There was a hierarchy among the Rune Warriors. The elite had individual runes, and were not only feared for their individual skills throughout the age of the Circle, they could also summon armies of lesser rune warriors collectively bound to a special rune who served as cannon fodder in the Convocation Wars. The sage Darius in SF1 said: "Oh how we hated you. Armies out of nowhere, ravaging the lands"
The two protagonists of SF1, the Guardian of the Phoenix and the Shadow Warrior, were such rune warriors, only that they were free because they possessed their own runes, given to them by those who summoned them at the start of SF1 and the Breath of Winter expansion, respectively, while retaining all the other powers coming with being rune warriors. There was some inconsistency in the use of this lore to explain the respawn mechanics and the summoning of armies in SF1, but overall it worked quite well.
One reason why I detest Dragon Storm is also related to lore. In SF1, history told us the Circle could use the Allfire, a dangerous kind of magic, to create magical effects unknown and unmatched by any other magical lore, like the aforementioned rune magic. They became mad for power because of their competition, and were then lured by dark gods into an attempt to control the world elements, which were said to be uncontrollable except by Aonir, the head god of the pantheon of the Northlands. That attempt, to be made at a certain astronomical conjunction called the Convocation, destroyed the world and fractured it into islands separated by wild elemental forces. In the later lore, the Allfire and the world elements weren't properly separated any more, and so both, and the Circle's magic with them, aquired an aura of "things Man wasn't meant to know" (possibly my most hated trope), while before, it had only been dangerous magic prone to being abused like any other powerful tool. The Shapers were said to be addicted and mad just because they used the Allfire, while in SF1, it was a major point of the main story that you could look beyond the delusion and the greed for power and acquire the wisdom to use your power responsibly, even if you were a Circle mage. I detest the pessimistic attitude in Dragon Storm and the witch hunt for Allfire users that came of it and is even seen as a good thing in its epilogue. I much prefer the optimistic attitude of SF1's story.
BTW, have you played SF3? It's said to take place around the time when the Circle was created. One would think a few of the later lore elements would make an appearance, but apparently that's not the case.
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Nyralim
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Post by Nyralim on Jul 19, 2018 19:03:46 GMT
*snip*
BTW, have you played SF3? It's said to take place around the time when the Circle was created. One would think a few of the later lore elements would make an appearance, but apparently that's not the case.
Spellforce 3 takes place about 500 years before the events of Spellforce 1. So indeed it is the correct time period for the formation of the Cirlce as an organisation. Looking in hindsight to what we learned in game 1 and in 2, I find enough references to both games in this installment. Game 1 has for obvious reasons more influence on this story than game 2, but still new reveals (in story) to draw connections to everything we know up until now. Escpecially the your (numerous) companions are a blast to have around, but won't spoil cus that would be horrible if you do want to play the game in the end. I really have to be careful because a lot of topics you mentioned are kinda spoilery to talk about.
Maps are far more fluid into landscape, I don't think you would have any problem with that. In fact you would adore it, pretty much all of the maps are pieces of artworks IMO. None is the same. Jungles, deserts, forests/plains, populated, etc. and actually feel like realistic places. Far more than a few recognisable regions before they were shattered into small land pieces.
As for your optimistic and pessimistic view on the story deals with the Archfire, well it turns out as a major/main topic in the story itself. So I think at least you would find it interesting because you have pro and contra viewpoints instead of 1 side. Small spoiler Shapers get far more nuanced, even their madness.addiction is being curtailed somewhat.
Any fan of the previous games (1 and/or 2) would like the story but mabye that is just my biased (with rosetan glasses I try to keep check) opinion. I do have to say this, the story and MC you play in game 3 (and any character for that matter) has far (far) more personality than any of the previous ones. Especially the VA is astounding with the limited budget they had.
While it is different to both the first game and the second, I find that this game has did pretty well to still be different from both games (to prevent copy pasting) yet not that different than you feel disconected from the series. Saying this a lot of people (especially older fans) chewed me out for this opinion, but hey there are worse things. If you're still on the fence, perhaps watch a playthrough of the first few parts of the game. The game itself from start to finish kep me busy about 30 hours. (especially the treasure hunting, would be even longer if I tried to find everything.
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Post by Gwydden on Jul 19, 2018 21:43:58 GMT
Ieldra Sadly, I haven't gotten the chance to try SF3 yet. I asked because GOG has the three games neatly packaged and I've been thinking I might wait for a sale, grab them, and have a SF marathon. Should be fun!
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Nyralim
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Post by Nyralim on Dec 17, 2018 22:26:36 GMT
After the game's release in December 2017, a stand alone expansion has been announced for the game. Spellforce 3 Soul HarvestThe devs posted a thread that fans should look for a surprise in the game. There it was, when you start up the game they showed the trailer for the new expansion. Youtube video:
Most noteable new features in the game, 2 'new' factions that were in the original series. The Dwarves and the Dark Elves. And a first for the entire series, flying units.
Like always, this game has stunning environments, screenshots from gamestar article (german).
Though I have fondness for this one, looks like a painting. (In spoiler due to size)
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