Sanunes
N6
Just a flip of the coin.
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Post by Sanunes on Feb 12, 2019 2:27:07 GMT
Of course, if you don't let Shepard swing wildly, then many of the choices in the game aren't choices by the time you get to them. That's got more to do with the decreasing number of neutral options, though. ME:A's decisions are structured better, since you can't outsource your RP to the P/R meter. Oh there are plenty of flaws with the ME trilogy role playing, the Liara hug people reference, less choice by ME3, in earlier games needing a certain paragon or renegade point to say anything motivating extremes, and yeah MEA did some things better. But having a broad set of choices between paragon and renegade isn't one of the flaws. It gave Shepard a range allowing the player more control over who their Shepard would be. I think that was the goal due to how many people (I include myself) talking about how bi-polar the choices could be in the game and why they removed paragon/renegade because people were assuming "light side choice" "dark side choice" instead of what they talked about how they perceived them for Mass Effect 1 and I think that was a big flaw in Mass Effect 1 if that is true for the way they named them should have been "diplomatic" and "forceful" which is how they were talked about and felt in Mass Effect 1.
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Post by alanc9 on Feb 12, 2019 2:57:12 GMT
Of course, if you don't let Shepard swing wildly, then many of the choices in the game aren't choices by the time you get to them. That's got more to do with the decreasing number of neutral options, though. ME:A's decisions are structured better, since you can't outsource your RP to the P/R meter. Oh there are plenty of flaws with the ME trilogy role playing, the Liara hug people reference, less choice by ME3, in earlier games needing a certain paragon or renegade point to say anything motivating extremes, and yeah MEA did some things better. But having a broad set of choices between paragon and renegade isn't one of the flaws. It gave Shepard a range allowing the player more control over who their Shepard would be. Except that we don't actually get a range of options. We get a paragon/renegade binary, or a paragon/neutral/renegade trinary.
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Post by cloud9 on Feb 12, 2019 22:55:05 GMT
If by well-written you mean a PC that was so wooden and stiff he could have been swapped out for a log by CDPR and it would have been better design. The Witcher games are basically a poor man's version of Game of Thrones and not even good at that. Hell Skyrim has a pair of main quests that is far more engaging and with intriguing questions that are left up to the player to decide than "I'll pay you gold to kill this monster." which is all The Witcher 2 does and it's controls, combat, and gameplay was 100% trash. That game pretty much killed any hope that I had for The Witcher series as a whole and the piss poor marketing of Cyberpunk 2077 has killed any interest I might have had for CDPR.
They get by on extreme over-hype and releasing games with pretty graphics and not much else.
that's hilarious coming from someone with a shepard avatar btw. Shepard was easily one of the worst aspects of the ME trilogy. Bioware couldnt decide if they wanted an avatar character with no personality like Link, or an actual character with a set personality. Ignoring the fact that shepard is a complete idiot (which is proven by so many of the stupid things shepard says and does in the entire trilogy) his character makes no sense. You can literally be a saint one second and psychopath the next second. You can be the most evil person ever and then just completely do a 180 half way through the game and no one bats an eye (including shepard)Β and shepard doesnt act any differently than if he had been good the entire time. This is made even worse in ME3 when they start having these random stupid dreams about some random kid dying on Earth when your shepard could have been a sociopath that didnt even try to warn the batarians in Arrival. people talk a lot of shit about Ryder and he doesnt take anything seriously and jokes too much but at least Ryder has a personality that fluctuate every 5 seconds. Ryder is actually kind of a character unlike Shepard.Β Shepard doesnt change at all in the series except for when they tried to shoehorn in a personality in ME3 even if it contradicted the choices shepard made int he previous games. Well, I wouldn't go far that Shepard is the worst protagonist but not the best written character, neither. The foundation of Shepard is solid such as choosing different backstories, and Shepard's story arc as Ruthless, War Hero, or Survivor. But it was poorly excecuted that Origins got right, and I wished they could've done the same for playing Shepard to let players connect with the main character more. The one thing that I really don't like about Shepard that he/she's written as a Mary Sue/Space Jesus tropes that one person can save the entire galaxy. Which is so boring and generic. Which is why BioWare should remake the trilogy to revamp the story and the main character.
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Post by alanc9 on Feb 13, 2019 0:05:35 GMT
I get the feeling that Bio thought DA:O's start didn't have a good enough ROI to be worth repeating.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Feb 13, 2019 0:10:05 GMT
I get the feeling that Bio thought DA:O's start didn't have a good enough ROI to be worth repeating. They've pretty much stated this. David Gaider I believe mentioned how while they were interesting, it left most of the rest of the game lacking when it came to remarking on your origin so they figured it was better to not do origins so they could instead spread that race/class recognition more evenly across the entire game.
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Post by river82 on Feb 13, 2019 0:20:13 GMT
I get the feeling that Bio thought DA:O's start didn't have a good enough ROI to be worth repeating. They've pretty much stated this. David Gaider I believe mentioned how while they were interesting, it left most of the rest of the game lacking when it came to remarking on your origin so they figured it was better to not do origins so they could instead spread that race/class recognition more evenly across the entire game. I would legitimately buy multiple at launch if they gave us a Mass Effect game with the option to play as a quarian that had race recognition over the entire game. I bought 2 or 3 copies of Mass Effect 2 and 3, I would probably buy at least 4 copies of a quarian Mass Effect
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Sanunes
N6
Just a flip of the coin.
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Post by Sanunes on Feb 13, 2019 1:27:14 GMT
They've pretty much stated this. David Gaider I believe mentioned how while they were interesting, it left most of the rest of the game lacking when it came to remarking on your origin so they figured it was better to not do origins so they could instead spread that race/class recognition more evenly across the entire game. I would legitimately buy multiple at launch if they gave us a Mass Effect game with the option to play as a quarian that had race recognition over the entire game. I bought 2 or 3 copies of Mass Effect 2 and 3, I would probably buy at least 4 copies of a quarian Mass Effect That is the thing, I don't think they could do that. None of the BioWare games gives a good representation across the entire game of playing another race. Things like an Elven Warden being called knife ears or people saying they are going to get a Templar when they see a Mage Warden would have been a huge improvement. As mentioned in your quote they spent everything making the first small section of the game unique for the classes. Its why I was far more interested when they first announced they were only going to have humans in Dragon Age: Inquisition and then have origins for those, that would make more sense to me to have humans treated equally most of the time with a small handfuls of unique dialogue for them. Instead after that announcement they decided to add in Elves, Dwarves, and Qunari. Most of the time I felt like I was playing a human regardless of what race I picked there were unique moments, but most of the game just felt the same and it felt like there was more of an impact on how I wanted to be treated being called the Herald. If BioWare and I highly doubt they would make it so when you are playing a different race in the game there were more small things to indicate you are playing something else I would be fore it, but until they do I just rather they tighten up the story.
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Post by cloud9 on Feb 13, 2019 5:46:03 GMT
I get the feeling that Bio thought DA:O's start didn't have a good enough ROI to be worth repeating. Because of the combat system is atrocious.
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Sanunes
N6
Just a flip of the coin.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by Sanunes on Feb 13, 2019 12:49:54 GMT
I get the feeling that Bio thought DA:O's start didn't have a good enough ROI to be worth repeating. Because of the combat system is atrocious. I believe that if Mass Effect 1 or Dragon Age: Origins were released a year or two later they would have been ripped to shreds and people would be claiming the games before them were the better ones because EA ruined them. There are many flaws with both of those games, but when mentioned people seem to want to hand wave them away.
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Post by ShadowAngel on Feb 13, 2019 16:06:43 GMT
I get the feeling that Bio thought DA:O's start didn't have a good enough ROI to be worth repeating. Because of the combat system is atrocious. It has the best combat system π beats the obnoxious hacking and slashing in DA2 and Inquisition, it also properly used squad fighting when compared to the others and it let you do hybrid builds with the attributes, I can't recall how DA2 did it but Inquisition pissed that all away ten fold. π€· I'll take origins combat over just about any other fantasy game out there today when it comes to combat. It's not the best, but it does use an older style to it, a style that's been getting lost because people feel more involved mashing their controllers till they breakπ
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Post by ahglock on Feb 13, 2019 16:34:13 GMT
Because of the combat system is atrocious. It has the best combat system π beats the obnoxious hacking and slashing in DA2 and Inquisition, it also properly used squad fighting when compared to the others and it let you do hybrid builds with the attributes, I can't recall how DA2 did it but Inquisition pissed that all away ten fold. π€· I'll take origins combat over just about any other fantasy game out there today when it comes to combat. It's not the best, but it does use an older style to it, a style that's been getting lost because people feel more involved mashing their controllers till they breakπ For a tactical style I prefer a pure turn based but out of the DA franchise DAO has the best combat. I think because they didnβt halfass it. They went all in on a style. Iβm fine with action combat but it has to be responsive and intuitive. I want active parry, dodge, attacks. Not mostly stand there and either auto attack or super move.
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N7
Biotic Booty
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by dmc1001 on Feb 14, 2019 16:58:26 GMT
Because of the combat system is atrocious. I believe that if Mass Effect 1 or Dragon Age: Origins were released a year or two later they would have been ripped to shreds and people would be claiming the games before them were the better ones because EA ruined them. There are many flaws with both of those games, but when mentioned people seem to want to hand wave them away. I don't mind the combat system in ME1. If I had my way, we'd still use the Talent Tree and gain weapons, mods and armor per the style of that game. The only thing I would improve is the ability to leap over crates. I have to readjust for that in ME1 as well as the use of "E" for actions.
DAO was always difficult for me. I'd take ME1's style any day.
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Post by KaiserShep on Feb 14, 2019 17:41:29 GMT
I believe that if Mass Effect 1 or Dragon Age: Origins were released a year or two later they would have been ripped to shreds and people would be claiming the games before them were the better ones because EA ruined them. There are many flaws with both of those games, but when mentioned people seem to want to hand wave them away. I don't mind the combat system in ME1. If I had my way, we'd still use the Talent Tree and gain weapons, mods and armor per the style of that game. The only thing I would improve is the ability to leap over crates. I have to readjust for that in ME1 as well as the use of "E" for actions.
DAO was always difficult for me. I'd take ME1's style any day.
Looking back, I thought the weapons portion of the skill tree was obnoxious and pointless. Like, the fact that we can't even so much as LOOK through the scope of a sniper rifle on certain classes was ridiculous, and honestly any specialized soldier, no matter the class, should have weapon limitations as scaled back as just friggin pistols (never again, Adept). It was made all the more aggravating that the game couldn't be bothered to leave these weapons out of our loadouts, so you had a bunch of stuff strapped to you that you might never be able to use. The skill tree itself didn't really have as much depth as it appeared either. It was just lots and lots of minor ticks just to improve damage or duration, but gave no meaningful options about how each ability would behave. Just about the only part that truly mattered was the stat that determined whether or not you passed dialogue checks, but was unfortunately tied to the [thankfully] now defunct Paragon/Renegade system. DA:O's progression system was better in that respect.
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Sanunes
N6
Just a flip of the coin.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by Sanunes on Feb 14, 2019 18:10:27 GMT
I don't mind the combat system in ME1. If I had my way, we'd still use the Talent Tree and gain weapons, mods and armor per the style of that game. The only thing I would improve is the ability to leap over crates. I have to readjust for that in ME1 as well as the use of "E" for actions.
DAO was always difficult for me. I'd take ME1's style any day.
Looking back, I thought the weapons portion of the skill tree was obnoxious and pointless. Like, the fact that we can't even so much as LOOK through the scope of a sniper rifle on certain classes was ridiculous, and honestly any specialized soldier, no matter the class, should have weapon limitations as scaled back as just friggin pistols (never again, Adept). It was made all the more aggravating that the game couldn't be bothered to leave these weapons out of our loadouts, so you had a bunch of stuff strapped to you that you might never be able to use. The skill tree itself didn't really have as much depth as it appeared either. It was just lots and lots of minor ticks just to improve damage or duration, but gave no meaningful options about how each ability would behave. Just about the only part that truly mattered was the stat that determined whether or not you passed dialogue checks, but was unfortunately tied to the [thankfully] now defunct Paragon/Renegade system. DA:O's progression system was better in that respect. There is also the skill ranks that would unlock another skill, but I think they finally got it to a point I liked with Mass Effect 3 with six ranks and three of those ranks had choices how to evolve the skill.
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Basquemercat117
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Post by Basquemercat117 on Mar 5, 2019 8:42:19 GMT
AN UPDATE ON THIS POST:
So my thoughts on the current state of bioware: i thought that bioware wouldnt be in any trouble unless Anthem really didnt do well. WELL to be completely honest i was not expecting what happened with anthem. i dont think anyone could have predicted that anthem would be this much of a shit show. like people were predicting the game wasnt going to do good but i dont think anyone was thinking it was breaking PS4's levels of bad.
Now to be honest i think its alot harder to predict the fate of bioware. many point to the physical sales of the UK as an indicator the game isnt selling well. WHile this may be an indicator of the sales of the game lets be aware of the fact this is only one type of sales in one countries market. This does not reflect the digital sales or how many played it through EA access or how other markets did or how many of the copies of the legion of dawn versions of the game were sold. and because EA likes to keep these numbers under lock and key unless they can brag about it in a sales call, we arent likely to know how the sales of Anthem were. not to mention the fact it was projected to sell less than MEA, so seeing low sale numbers may have been more predicted than expected. Anthem does have microtransations, which one could help keep anthem profitable (ew i know i dont like them either). MEA made a profit with its microtransations and the fact over 50% of the copies sold were the deluxe edition and above, which could mean that Anthem could have have the same type of sales. But the big take away is that there is alot of information we simply dont know and its hard to actually figure out how well Anthem did on a financial level.
My personal opinion is that im hoping Anthem does well enough to at least make even so it doesnt blacken their finical reputation even more (though i know biowares rep with fans is at an all time low and stock holders may not have as much faith in EA or bioware to come out with a game that isnt full of controversy) but with the amount of money and time invested into the game im not sure how likely that will be. I do not think it will be enough to sink bioware. bioware is going to be very wounded from this blunder of a launch, but i think its fate shall be determined on the how well DA4 is going to do. I think bioware is going to have to have another record selling game of year thats better than DAI in every way shape and form. and after that maybe we will get the next ME game but now im not as sure if we will get the game or not.
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Post by armass81 on Mar 5, 2019 15:47:00 GMT
Yeah. sadly I dont think theres going to be a future to the Mass Effect, or even if there were I probably wouldnt want to see it with this team, considering they wasted 6 fucking years on this burning pile of rubbish and sacrificed Andromeda. They were walking on thin ice which now has started to break. I said it before, when Anthem fails, Bioware will likely be gone, but even I nor probably anyone could predict a disaster that it has become, Jesus Christ. 6 years, the supposed "A-team", and Andromeda turns out BETTER? WTF happened!?
If they truly cant do better than this anymore, perhaps a mercy killing is in order.
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Post by alanc9 on Mar 5, 2019 16:06:41 GMT
There is also the skill ranks that would unlock another skill, but I think they finally got it to a point I liked with Mass Effect 3 with six ranks and three of those ranks had choices how to evolve the skill. Yeah, early ME1 gives you some interesting choices; with individual cooldowns you obviously want to unlock abilities as fast as you can, but the order can matter. The problem with the system is that this wears off by the midgame.
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Post by alanc9 on Mar 5, 2019 16:08:50 GMT
It has the best combat system π beats the obnoxious hacking and slashing in DA2 and Inquisition, it also properly used squad fighting when compared to the others and it let you do hybrid builds with the attributes, I can't recall how DA2 did it but Inquisition pissed that all away ten fold. Isn't the hacking and slashing bit just cosmetic? I'm not quite sure what you mean by "properly used squad fighting."
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Post by ShadowAngel on Mar 5, 2019 16:39:03 GMT
It has the best combat system π beats the obnoxious hacking and slashing in DA2 and Inquisition, it also properly used squad fighting when compared to the others and it let you do hybrid builds with the attributes, I can't recall how DA2 did it but Inquisition pissed that all away ten fold. Isn't the hacking and slashing bit just cosmetic? I'm not quite sure what you mean by "properly used squad fighting." It's hardly "cosmetic" when I have to push a button 10,000 times. Auto combat>asanine button mashing every single time. As for squad fighting: what I mean is the game gives them more if a use rather than them just being AI that are "just there". You can solo DA2 easier than the other DA games if you wanted, I find group efforts more satisfying however as it gives you reason to design the group to handle various or certain situations. DA2 mainstreamed that hardcore (and Inquisition sadly kept it going).
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Post by alanc9 on Mar 6, 2019 1:02:28 GMT
Oh, right, that. Didn't occur to me because I don't really notice it. I'm sitting there with my hand on the controls anyway; whether my index finger's doing something or not doesn't really penetrate my consciousness since I'm shunting that to muscle memory.
Seriously, I can't remember sitting here how DA2 worked in this regard. I thought auto-attack was patched in.
I'm surprised you found DA2 easy to solo. It always struck me as the hardest of the lot, and it's got the same threat and defence mechanics DA:O did plus the cross-class combo mechanic. Why was it easier.?
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Basquemercat117
N2
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Mass Effect Andromeda, Anthem
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Post by Basquemercat117 on Mar 6, 2019 2:37:57 GMT
Yeah. sadly I dont think theres going to be a future to the Mass Effect, or even if there were I probably wouldnt want to see it with this team, considering they wasted 6 fucking years on this burning pile of rubbish and sacrificed Andromeda. They were walking on thin ice which now has started to break. I said it before, when Anthem fails, Bioware will likely be gone, but even I nor probably anyone could predict a disaster that it has become, Jesus Christ. 6 years, the supposed "A-team", and Andromeda turns out BETTER? WTF happened!?
If they truly cant do better than this anymore, perhaps a mercy killing is in order.
i totally get that frustrations with biowares "A-team" performance. but i dont know how likely it is that the studio will be shut down. EA isnt going to have alot of games coming out in the recent future and they only have a small handle of developers left. shutting down bioware could mean a huge decrease in revenue for EA. so far anthem seems to be the only game that wont make EA money in the bioware line up. unless they really start draining EA bank accounts with no return on investment bioware wont get shut down for now. But to perhaps answer the question how how can you develop a game for 6 years and get anthem, i have one word "frostbite." DAI, MEA, and anthem all suffer from the same exact problem: during development the teams at bioware working on the project spent a good portion of the time just modifying the frostbite engine to be able to make a game in the first place. so 2 to 3 years of that could have been dedicated to just that, and who knows about redos or reworked content in the game. which obviously wasnt enough to make the game work.
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dmc1001
N7
Biotic Booty
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by dmc1001 on Mar 7, 2019 1:26:38 GMT
Yeah. sadly I dont think theres going to be a future to the Mass Effect, or even if there were I probably wouldnt want to see it with this team, considering they wasted 6 fucking years on this burning pile of rubbish and sacrificed Andromeda. They were walking on thin ice which now has started to break. I said it before, when Anthem fails, Bioware will likely be gone, but even I nor probably anyone could predict a disaster that it has become, Jesus Christ. 6 years, the supposed "A-team", and Andromeda turns out BETTER? WTF happened!?
Was this the "A team"? All indications are that their prior experience was in making one of the DLC for ME3. Besides, that studio was shut down and folded into another EA property. If the next ME game were made by a different BW studio there might be very different results.
I also don't think Anthem will make or break BW. To my mind, it was an experiment, and one that was already in the works prior to MEA. Anthem was never meant to be a deciding factor for BW.
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Post by cloud9 on Mar 7, 2019 2:35:50 GMT
Because of the combat system is atrocious. It has the best combat system π beats the obnoxious hacking and slashing in DA2 and Inquisition, it also properly used squad fighting when compared to the others and it let you do hybrid builds with the attributes, I can't recall how DA2 did it but Inquisition pissed that all away ten fold. π€· I'll take origins combat over just about any other fantasy game out there today when it comes to combat. It's not the best, but it does use an older style to it, a style that's been getting lost because people feel more involved mashing their controllers till they breakπ Devil May Cry (2001), God of War (2005), Shinobi, Mark of Kri, Nightshade, *rashberry*
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Post by griffith82 on Mar 7, 2019 2:44:10 GMT
Yeah. sadly I dont think theres going to be a future to the Mass Effect, or even if there were I probably wouldnt want to see it with this team, considering they wasted 6 fucking years on this burning pile of rubbish and sacrificed Andromeda. They were walking on thin ice which now has started to break. I said it before, when Anthem fails, Bioware will likely be gone, but even I nor probably anyone could predict a disaster that it has become, Jesus Christ. 6 years, the supposed "A-team", and Andromeda turns out BETTER? WTF happened!?
Was this the "A team"?Β All indications are that their prior experience was in making one of the DLC for ME3.Β Besides, that studio was shut down and folded into another EA property.Β If the next ME game were made by a different BW studio there might be very different results.
I also don't think Anthem will make or break BW.Β To my mind, it was an experiment, and one that was already in the works prior to MEA.Β Anthem was never meant to be a deciding factor for BW.
And they aren't giving up on Anthem either. It still is doing ok.
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Post by burningcherry on May 30, 2019 11:19:28 GMT
quole smilesja Basquemercat117 griffith82 About the discussion we had in November: I asked a group of commited Witcher fans about what major things from Sapkowski's prose the Witcher games deleted or radically changed. So: deleted arcs/characters: β the fake Ciri β Galahad things radically changed: β the Wild Hunt had huge problems moving between worlds, something hinted on in W1 but totally abandoned in W3 β Kaer Morhen was hidden and no one knew where it is (!) β Eredin did never plan to kill Auberon β the White Frost was not some mysthical force but an ice age caused by planet orbits changing... β ...and Ciri wasn't needed by Aen Elle to stop it (it was unstoppable, according to Avallac'h) but to open doors between worlds β timeline got wrong β vampirees worked completely different characters significantly changed: β Dandelion (something about losing a big part of his appeal) β Geralt (his character changed much plus he hated having a beard and hat a slashed ear) β Triss (she had burned tits) β Demawend (he was not a weak ruler) β Yennefer (she wasn't a bitch) ...plus many minor changes. I did not read the books but from what I recognize, some of the above are HUGE divergences from the original and there's a concensus among the commited fans that the games established their own, separate continuity and the books always precede them in lore discussions. Sapkowski himself is more angry at CDPR as Martin is at HBO now, though he has additional reasons. If CDPR is to make a new Mass Effect game should Bioware fall, it is needed to be made sure that they do not do what they did with Witcher. btw. the comment I liked most: Plus Regis, and so his vampiree friend, regenerate lightning fast, even if someone makes them a hole in the chest or cuts them in half. 20 seconds max and it's done. This change is even more absurd because REDs did say in Regis' description the journal about his 50-year regeneration after an adventure with peasants xD Another stupid change (spurring probably from REDs' ignorance/mistake) is making Regis a post-conjunction maroon while he was born hundreds of years after it, he said himself in the book that he's a descendant of maroons. There are also another changes, like those elders, the vampiree codex (an idea like from TVP's series oh Melitele) and making high vampirees such OP entities that they could be called gods aswell. Wonder why humanity still exists in the games' worldsic because if some vamp wanted to exterminate all the humans, he would not have big problems apparently xD
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