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Post by o Ventus on Oct 10, 2018 5:40:56 GMT
Or, why non-Marvel Studios companies should stay the fuck away from Marvel properties and just let go of the IP because all of their ideas are terrible.
If Sony wanted to make a Spider-Man shared continuity, they shouldn’t have signed the deal with Marvel. They fucked themselves with a jackhammer with this deal. Why? Because as long as Marvel is contracted to make movies with Spider-Man, Sony can’t put him in their movies. This is a good thing if you ask me, because their superhero movies are awful, but I digress. Anyway, my point is, they’re trying to make a shared movie universe surrounding Spider-Man, without Spider-Man. They started it with the Venom film, and that was... precisely as awful as I anticipated it to be, and they plan on following it up with films for Morbius the Living Vampire, Kraven the Hunter, Silver Sable and Black Cat, Jackpot, Silk, and Nightwatch.
Now, the big problem here is that half of this roster is made up of characters who have little to no supporting cast of their own, and who are more or less defined by their relationship with Spider-Man. They had the opportunity to explore Venom’s Lethal Protector phase, but they fucked the pooch by making the movie an origin story, which in the real world where the character isn’t completely pooped on for profit, is supposed to involve Spider-Man. There’s a lot of Venom stories that have nothing to do with Spider-Man, they just chose not to tell one for some unholy reason and chose the 1 story that absolutely requires Spider-Man, and just didn’t include Spider-Man. The resultant re-writing of the character results in a story that is a weird bastardization of the normal origin, and some Sony goon’s fan fiction. When you change the character that much, what is even the point of using a licensed property that you don’t actually have creative control over? Just make something original so you can retain all of the profit and all of the creative rights, and not tarnish your reputation in the process.
It’s going to be worse for someone like Kraven, who requires Spider-Man arguably even more than Venom does. Seriously, literally, before encountering Spider-Man, Kraven was a big game hunter turned poacher. A Kraven movie without Spider-Man would be, what, 2 hours of him killing endangered animals? The entire reason Kraven becomes involved in anything related to superhumans is because he decides one day to hunt a superhero, and he chooses Spider-Man because he thinks that Peter is a literal spider creature and not a human (Kraven is also mildly fucking insane in the book). The one notable story featuring Kraven is specifically about him trying to be a superior hunter to Spider-Man. Take away the Spider-Man element, and you take away all motivation for Kraven to do... anything. He also has dick for a supporting cast, since he himself is a supporting character.
The rest of the proposed movies just confuse me. Jackpot? Nightwatch? Without consulting Google, who the hell actually knows who these characters even are? Jackpot is probably the worst offender, she’s appeared in literally 15 issues of a series totaling more than 60 times that amount, and she was last seen in like 2008. Where she died. And like Kraven, she was never any kind of main character, she has no supporting cast.
Morbius and Black Cat/Silver Sable are the only ones with even a chance at working, but the very premise of Sony’s shared universe idea makes me doubt that they have even the minimum level of competency required to pull those off.
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Post by Lavochkin on Oct 10, 2018 6:12:32 GMT
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Post by mybudgee on Oct 10, 2018 17:32:06 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Oct 10, 2018 23:45:48 GMT
Venom was unfortunately trash. The symbiote itself was the only positive. Other than that its a cheesy, discombobulated mess of illogical fallacies. It's like the went full on rule of cool without attention to detail; a common problem among these borrowed properties. As much as I hated Ho'Coming and MCU's use of the webhead, I at least liked Keaton and the nuance of the character. Both have robbed strong, huge comic moments of their importance and weight (Peter lifting a 60,000+lb structure while nearly drowning due to sheer determination and anger to save May and Eddie's embracing of the black symbiote and their mutual hatred of Spider-Man).
For now, the definitive new canon Spider-Man is PS4 Parker.
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Post by smilesja on Oct 10, 2018 23:48:52 GMT
I heard it was pretty good and it smashed some box office records.
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Post by Hier0phant on Oct 11, 2018 2:03:19 GMT
Venom was unfortunately trash. The symbiote itself was the only positive. Other than that its a cheesy, discombobulated mess of illogical fallacies. It's like the went full on rule of cool without attention to detail; a common problem among these borrowed properties. As much as I hated Ho'Coming and MCU's use of the webhead, I at least liked Keaton and the nuance of the character. Both have robbed strong, huge comic moments of their importance and weight (Peter lifting a 60,000+lb structure while nearly drowning due to sheer determination and anger to save May and Eddie's embracing of the black symbiote and their mutual hatred of Spider-Man). For now, the definitive new canon Spider-Man is PS4 Parker. Agreed and especially with PS4 Parker. MCU Parker is stripped of his genius and was demoted to Tony's errand boy.
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Post by Son of Dorn on Oct 11, 2018 2:06:52 GMT
Venom was unfortunately trash. The symbiote itself was the only positive. Other than that its a cheesy, discombobulated mess of illogical fallacies. It's like the went full on rule of cool without attention to detail; a common problem among these borrowed properties. As much as I hated Ho'Coming and MCU's use of the webhead, I at least liked Keaton and the nuance of the character. Both have robbed strong, huge comic moments of their importance and weight (Peter lifting a 60,000+lb structure while nearly drowning due to sheer determination and anger to save May and Eddie's embracing of the black symbiote and their mutual hatred of Spider-Man). For now, the definitive new canon Spider-Man is PS4 Parker. Agreed and especially with PS4 Parker. MCU Parker is stripped of his genius and reduced him to being Tony's errand boy. 👆this. PS4 Parker is the best.
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Post by Hier0phant on Oct 11, 2018 2:26:13 GMT
Agreed and especially with PS4 Parker. MCU Parker is stripped of his genius and reduced him to being Tony's errand boy. 👆this. PS4 Parker is the best. MFW the aunt May scene at the end happened.
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Post by Son of Dorn on Oct 11, 2018 2:28:01 GMT
👆this. PS4 Parker is the best. MFW the aunt May scene at the end happened. One of the best and sad endings in a video-game.
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Post by Hier0phant on Oct 11, 2018 2:47:59 GMT
MFW the aunt May scene at the end happened. One of the best and sad endings in a video-game. The earlier reveal about Otto knowing Peter was Spider-Man, and is the reason why the S6 spared him on the raft. Combine that with Peter's resolve to save May even though incarceration would leave Otto an invalid, after adopting him as a surrogate father figure while the latter viewed him like a son on top of May's scene really hit me in the feels.
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Post by Son of Dorn on Oct 11, 2018 2:53:27 GMT
One of the best and sad endings in a video-game. The earlier reveal about Otto knowing Peter was Spider-Man, and is the reason why the S6 spared him on the raft. Combine that with Peter's resolve to save May even though incarceration would leave Otto an invalid, after adopting him as a surrogate father figure while the latter viewed him like a son on top of May's scene really hit me in the feels. Aye. Wonder if it will have any more impacts in later Spider-Man games. (given how he was indirectly involved in her death).
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Post by Hier0phant on Oct 11, 2018 3:09:20 GMT
The earlier reveal about Otto knowing Peter was Spider-Man, and is the reason why the S6 spared him on the raft. Combine that with Peter's resolve to save May even though incarceration would leave Otto an invalid, after adopting him as a surrogate father figure while the latter viewed him like a son on top of May's scene really hit me in the feels. Aye. Wonder if it will have any more impacts in later Spider-Man games. (given how he was indirectly involved in her death). If the writers maintain consistency the relationship should devolve into the one they have in the books (Superior Spider-Man) with Otto becoming more like his 616 counterpart in his drive to one up Norman and probably Pete too after he see's him letting his scientific skills go to waste.
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Post by Son of Dorn on Oct 11, 2018 3:23:32 GMT
Aye. Wonder if it will have any more impacts in later Spider-Man games. (given how he was indirectly involved in her death). If the writers maintain consistency the relationship should devolve into the one they have in the books (Superior Spider-Man) with Otto becoming more like his 616 counterpart in his drive to one up Norman and probably Pete too after he see's him letting his scientific skills go to waste. Given the post credit scene at the end (and I really hope they do that storyline). They may use a rematch between those two as a way for Pete to get rid of it (that is, if they go down that route).
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Post by Hier0phant on Oct 11, 2018 3:38:55 GMT
If the writers maintain consistency the relationship should devolve into the one they have in the books (Superior Spider-Man) with Otto becoming more like his 616 counterpart in his drive to one up Norman and probably Pete too after he see's him letting his scientific skills go to waste. Given the post credit scene at the end (and I really hope they do that storyline). They may use a rematch between those two as a way for Pete to get rid of it (that is, if they go down that route). The AI made Oct go Bilbo Baggins on Pete after he accused him of trying to steal his research so there should be a grudge match later on down the road, and there's a Spidey crossover event called Spider-Geddon where this Spider-Man is recruited by 616 Superior Spider-Man to fight entities targeting Spider-Men across the multiverse. Depending on how this event turns out Miles might become the MC of the sequel even though Harry's situation being resolved without Peter won't be right.
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Post by Son of Dorn on Oct 11, 2018 3:47:53 GMT
Given the post credit scene at the end (and I really hope they do that storyline). They may use a rematch between those two as a way for Pete to get rid of it (that is, if they go down that route). The AI made Oct go Bilbo Baggins on Pete after he accused him of trying to steal his research so there should be a grudge match later on down the road, and there's a Spidey crossover event called Spider-Geddon where this Spider-Man recruited by 616 Superior Spider-Man to fight entities targeting Spider-Men across the multiverse. Depending on how this event turns out Miles might become the MC of the sequel even though Harry's situation being resolved without Peter won't be right. Will have to look out for that when they release it in a collected novel. Speaking of Miles, I wonder (if they do it) that when you play as him he will end up busting Cletus Kasady as one of his main missions or a side mission.
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Post by Hier0phant on Oct 11, 2018 3:56:49 GMT
The AI made Oct go Bilbo Baggins on Pete after he accused him of trying to steal his research so there should be a grudge match later on down the road, and there's a Spidey crossover event called Spider-Geddon where this Spider-Man recruited by 616 Superior Spider-Man to fight entities targeting Spider-Men across the multiverse. Depending on how this event turns out Miles might become the MC of the sequel even though Harry's situation being resolved without Peter won't be right. Will have to look out for that when they release it in a collected novel. Speaking of Miles, I wonder (if they do it) that when you play as him he will end up busting Cletus Kasady as one of his main missions or a side mission. Kasady* (lol @ Cassidy) being side mission only would be a crime but i'm still miffed at the possibility that Brock might not become Venom. Miles taser ability if it's included might be overpowered like the Spider Bro suit skill.
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Post by Son of Dorn on Oct 11, 2018 4:05:45 GMT
Will have to look out for that when they release it in a collected novel. Speaking of Miles, I wonder (if they do it) that when you play as him he will end up busting Cletus Kasady as one of his main missions or a side mission. Cassidy being side mission only would be a crime but i'm still miffed at the possibility that Brock might not become Venom. Miles taser ability if it's included might be overpowered like the Spider Bro suit skill. Brock could still become Venom if the symbiote leaves Harry after curing him, bonds to Peter and then the game follows the rest of the storyline of the Black Suit to Venom. (with the Doc Ock rematch as the turning point where Peter gets rid of the symbiote).
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Post by Hier0phant on Oct 11, 2018 4:20:30 GMT
Cassidy being side mission only would be a crime but i'm still miffed at the possibility that Brock might not become Venom. Miles taser ability if it's included might be overpowered like the Spider Bro suit skill. Brock could still become Venom if the symbiote leaves Harry after curing him, bonds to Peter and then the game follows the rest of the storyline of the Black Suit to Venom. (with the Doc Ock rematch as the turning point where Peter gets rid of the symbiote). Hopefully they'll build up Peter's relationship/rivalry with Eddie before he gets the symbiote while him merging with it is a must, i want that black suit. Since they are using a similar version of Ultimate Spider-Man's Venom's origin (Created by Peter's and Eddie's dads) it makes me wonder how they'll handle Norman going gobbo. I pray they leave the Gwen plot twist out because that was nasty, and destroyed her character.
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Post by Son of Dorn on Oct 11, 2018 4:33:57 GMT
Brock could still become Venom if the symbiote leaves Harry after curing him, bonds to Peter and then the game follows the rest of the storyline of the Black Suit to Venom. (with the Doc Ock rematch as the turning point where Peter gets rid of the symbiote). Hopefully they'll build up Peter's relationship/rivalry with Eddie before he gets the symbiote while him merging with it is a must, i want that black suit. Since they are using a similar version of Ultimate Spider-Man's Venom's origin (Created by Peter's and Eddie's dads) it makes me wonder how they'll handle Norman going gobbo. I pray they leave the Gwen plot twist out because that was nasty, and destroyed her character. Hope so too, with the backpack item you get in the game, it seems like they were at lest friendly coworkers. With Norman going Green Gobby, they may have him going mad due to being fired from his company after the whole Devils Breath thing. (wonder if that GR32 thing is the Goblin Scrum?). As for Gwen, yeah, that was totally fucked up.
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Post by Hier0phant on Oct 11, 2018 4:51:32 GMT
Also despite the reviews i will still watch Venom. Tom Hardy is muh boy.
Have to stay on topic, just a bit.
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Post by o Ventus on Oct 11, 2018 13:30:39 GMT
Also despite the reviews i will still watch Venom. Tom Hardy is muh boy. Have to stay on topic, just a bit. Nah, it’s cool, I don’t care. I mainly just made this thread to vent on Sony’s lack of intelligent thought, talking about the game is fine by me. It’s Spider-Man, but not awful.
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Post by Hier0phant on Oct 11, 2018 14:03:15 GMT
Also despite the reviews i will still watch Venom. Tom Hardy is muh boy. Have to stay on topic, just a bit. Nah, it’s cool, I don’t care. I mainly just made this thread to vent on Sony’s lack of intelligent thought, talking about the game is fine by me. It’s Spider-Man, but not awful. Sony only sees the green when it comes to producing a super flick despite them currently lacking the rights to Spider-Man the character, and the sad part is that they'll probably make a shit load of money because of the names of some of the characters involved regardless of film quality. This is the same studio that churned out Ghostbusters 2016 for a quick, so the potential for their films to bomb harder than Hiroshima and Nagasaki is very likely. With Venom i'm watching it but for free.
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Post by CrutchCricket on Oct 11, 2018 14:34:23 GMT
Yeah, this is a terrible fucking idea, and Venom could've been a good movie... but simply wasn't.
I'm really not a fan of Disney growing any more but... fuck it, just buy them like you did Fox and be done with it. These divisions are beyond retarded.
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Post by o Ventus on Oct 11, 2018 15:35:00 GMT
Nah, it’s cool, I don’t care. I mainly just made this thread to vent on Sony’s lack of intelligent thought, talking about the game is fine by me. It’s Spider-Man, but not awful. Sony only sees the green when it comes to producing a super flick despite them currently lacking the rights to Spider-Man the character, and the sad part is that they'll probably make a shit load of money because of the names of some of the characters involved regardless of film quality. This is the same studio that churned out Ghostbusters 2016 for a quick, so the potential for their films to bomb harder than Hiroshima and Nagasaki is very likely. With Venom i'm watching it but for free. Venom was the only other character with any mainstream popularity. Nobody who doesn’t read the comics will know who Morbius and Kraven and Black Cat are. Hell, even people who DO read the comics probably don’t know who Nightwatch and Jackpot are, they’re that obscure.
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Post by Son of Dorn on Oct 11, 2018 15:43:18 GMT
Sony only sees the green when it comes to producing a super flick despite them currently lacking the rights to Spider-Man the character, and the sad part is that they'll probably make a shit load of money because of the names of some of the characters involved regardless of film quality. This is the same studio that churned out Ghostbusters 2016 for a quick, so the potential for their films to bomb harder than Hiroshima and Nagasaki is very likely. With Venom i'm watching it but for free. Venom was the only other characterbwith any mainstream popularity. Nobody who doesn’t read the comics will know who Morbius and Kraven and Black Cat are. Hell, even people who DO read the comics probably don’t know who Nightwatch and Jackpot are, they’re that obscure. I'm surprised that Sony hasn't announced that they are planning on doing movies on Frog Man and White Rabbit.
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