anarchy65
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Post by anarchy65 on Dec 21, 2018 16:35:28 GMT
I don't agree that references to pop culture take away the "feeling of immersion" (for me, even the concept of immersion is wrong. Immersion doesn't exist). I love easter eggs. Playing The Witcher 3 and seeing references to Breaking Bad, Pulp Fiction, Adam Smith, Karl Marx, Friedrich Nietzsche, Monty Python, Tolstoy, Batman, etc, was awesome.
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Post by phoray on Dec 21, 2018 16:37:36 GMT
"I've got 99 problems, but a demon ain't one," hell yes I would be taken out of the setting. ROFL of my gosh. I would not dislike this, it would be awesome. I guess this thread complaint isn't my complaint. I find the idea of being scanned in real life annoying and uncomfortable. Instead of shoes, even the future, I'd probably be irritated enough to imply that maybe I could drop trow from them to check my anus for anything hidden just to share my irritation about the situation, not even because they couldn't already see in my butt with their sci fi magic scanner.
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cribbian
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Post by cribbian on Dec 21, 2018 17:32:57 GMT
Orange Egg Bad!
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Post by pessimistpanda on Dec 21, 2018 20:58:39 GMT
Well if I have to be obtuse, I'd prefer to do so in the name of being lenient to insignificant flaws, rather than in service to being a naggy fun-killer. Being overly lenient is a far bigger fun killer. But hey who cares about story in a rpg. Just us naggy fun-killers. If a single joke ruined the story enough for you to go out of your way to complain about it, then you weren't having fun anyway. And you haven't convinced me that the joke is inappropriate, either. Nothing about their scanning tech shows me that it's better or more accurate than what we have now, and in a previous Mass Effect game, Shepherd makes a joke about scanners NOT being able to detect weapons, so...?
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Post by gangrelbeckett on Dec 21, 2018 21:14:04 GMT
I don't agree that references to pop culture take away the "feeling of immersion" (for me, even the concept of immersion is wrong. Immersion doesn't exist). I love easter eggs. Playing The Witcher 3 and seeing references to Breaking Bad, Pulp Fiction, Adam Smith, Karl Marx, Friedrich Nietzsche, Monty Python, Tolstoy, Batman, etc, was awesome. I really love the The Witcher 3: Blood and Wine Quest about the A38 Permit.
By the way can we have some Asterix references/jokes in DA 4? I mean they write themselves. Tevinter is basically the Roman Empire and Orlais well is France/Gaul.
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boxofscreaming
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Post by boxofscreaming on Dec 21, 2018 23:22:47 GMT
I don't mind it as long as it's done well. If it's jokes about Youtubers or the latest TV talent show though, no thanks.
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Post by river82 on Dec 22, 2018 1:38:43 GMT
By the way can we have some Asterix references/jokes in DA 4? I mean they write themselves. Tevinter is basically the Roman Empire and Orlais well is France/Gaul.
As someone who loved Asterix comics growing up, and someone who watched the fabulous Asterix live action movies ... I really hope they don't.
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Post by phoray on Dec 22, 2018 4:36:02 GMT
I really love the The Witcher 3: Blood and Wine Quest about the A38 Permit Only part I liked about that quest was challengeing the dude on a bench to Gwent and kicking his card butt. It seemed such a Nerdy Con Goer thing to do, that two full grown adults would pull decks out of their pockets and spread out on the bench / floor to burn through their wait time.
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Post by Ieldra on Dec 22, 2018 10:16:50 GMT
With regard to some TW3 elements mentioned here, these illustrate the point quite nicely for me. The A38 permit quest had no grounding in the world, and thus, while possibly enjoyable for some, felt like a foreign object to me, and I only did it because I'm an obsessive completionist. Meanwhile, the quest with the Nietzsche reference made sense in-world - that there are people with that attitude is no surprise - but I think it would've been better had it not been so obviously referential, and there is also the problem of misrepresentation of the original.
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Post by PapaCharlie9 on Dec 22, 2018 16:52:56 GMT
I generally agree that topical humor that's too on-the-nose is just a cheap joke that won't age well.
But it's possible to do topical humor that's sufficiently obscured, by hemi-demi-indirect reference, allusion, and intertextuality. The latter in particular. For example, you don't directly make a joke about "taking off my shoes." You make a joke that references MEA obliquely, with enough context to hint at the "take off my shoes" scene. Shoes would never directly be mentioned. Maybe a sarcastic comment about how "animated" the Sentinel's faces get when you go through a security checkpoint.
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Post by ahglock on Dec 22, 2018 17:04:30 GMT
By the way can we have some Asterix references/jokes in DA 4? I mean they write themselves. Tevinter is basically the Roman Empire and Orlais well is France/Gaul.
As someone who loved Asterix comics growing up, and someone who watched the fabulous Asterix live action movies ... I really hope they don't. Liking this mainly because I had no idea there were live action movies that I need to now track down.
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gangrelbeckett
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Post by gangrelbeckett on Dec 22, 2018 20:09:04 GMT
As someone who loved Asterix comics growing up, and someone who watched the fabulous Asterix live action movies ... I really hope they don't. Why not? A small Asterix Easteregg or reference would be better than the umpteenth cheese joke.
The A38 permit quest had no grounding in the world, and thus, while possibly enjoyable for some, felt like a foreign object to me, and I only did it because I'm an obsessive completionist. Its a joke about bureaucracy. These have always worked worldwide or in the medieval settings like The Witcher 3.
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Post by phoray on Dec 22, 2018 22:27:17 GMT
I didn't feel like A38 was out of the world- I'd never tried to procure things like a house and inheritance from another country in the world of the Witcher, who am I to know better than the writers what that would look like?. It was just boring. I literally asked myself, "is this just a quest to see Geralt deal with the Mundane? I don't get what point they're trying to make."
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Post by gangrelbeckett on Dec 22, 2018 23:09:20 GMT
It was just boring. I literally asked myself, "is this just a quest to see Geralt deal with the Mundane? I don't get what point they're trying to make." Its fun. Have you never dealt with stupid bureaucracy in your country Also have you seen the movie?
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Post by phoray on Dec 22, 2018 23:11:55 GMT
It was just boring. I literally asked myself, "is this just a quest to see Geralt deal with the Mundane? I don't get what point they're trying to make." Its fun. Have you never dealt with stupid bureaucracy in your country Also have you seen the movie?
Too much reality in my fantasy I guess?
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Post by melbella on Dec 22, 2018 23:20:51 GMT
Its fun. Have you never dealt with stupid bureaucracy in your country Yes, I have, which is why it *wasn't* fun. The reward at the end (500 gold, maybe?) was totally not worth the run-around. By that point in the game I was swimming in coin and felt like I'd wasted my time for nothing.
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Post by phoray on Dec 22, 2018 23:24:43 GMT
Its fun. Have you never dealt with stupid bureaucracy in your country Yes, I have, which is why it *wasn't* fun. The reward at the end (500 gold, maybe?) was totally not worth the run-around. By that point in the game I was swimming in coin and felt like I'd wasted my time for nothing. That's true, I was thinking there was going to be some serious riches in there
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gangrelbeckett
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Post by gangrelbeckett on Dec 23, 2018 1:26:20 GMT
Yes, I have, which is why it *wasn't* fun. Thats the joke or don´t you never laugh about bureaucracy? I assume you can argue that this Asterix movie is dated but the joke will never gets old. Its timeless comedy. Sorry but its funny and a pop culture reference. At least for Europeans i guess.
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Post by river82 on Dec 23, 2018 2:03:47 GMT
As someone who loved Asterix comics growing up, and someone who watched the fabulous Asterix live action movies ... I really hope they don't. Why not? A small Asterix Easteregg or reference would be better than the umpteenth cheese joke. Because I don't see the point of these sorts of easter eggs, TBH. They never add anything to the story, and they're never really funny on their own. They're just a "HEY! It's an Asterix refernce, WAHEY! That's pretty neat, the developers must watch Asterix too! One of us! One of us!" Meanwhile, onward with the actual game ...
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Post by PapaCharlie9 on Dec 23, 2018 3:37:30 GMT
Why not? A small Asterix Easteregg or reference would be better than the umpteenth cheese joke. Because I don't see the point of these sorts of easter eggs, TBH. They never add anything to the story, and they're never really funny on their own. They're just a "HEY! It's an Asterix refernce, WAHEY! That's pretty neat, the developers must watch Asterix too! One of us! One of us!" Okay, there's some of that going on, no doubt, but I don't think it's as simple as that. I think it's also about not getting bored doing repetitive work. I'm talking about the devs and artists. What, after all, is the alternative? Take a purely visual easter egg/joke like the cheese in DAI. Let's say the new Chief Creative Director says, "NO EASTER EGGS! EIER SIND VERBOTEN!" Okay, great. Something still has to be put in those spots, they can't just be left as empty space. So yet more generic 3D clutter (which is what it's actually called in Skyrim's asset data -- best base category for a taxonomy ever!) has to be thought up and stuck in there. There will already be thematic clutter for the environs of the map, so more generic clutter gets cookie-cuttered into the spot and the Creative Director is happy. But no one who works for him is. Their lives just got that much more boring. So I'm willing to put up with the occasional inside jokes and references that go over my head, if it means the devs and artists get out from under a little bit of the tedium and drudgery involved in the work. As long as it doesn't get out of hand or become mandatory.
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Post by Reznore on Dec 23, 2018 6:09:38 GMT
I don't agree that references to pop culture take away the "feeling of immersion" (for me, even the concept of immersion is wrong. Immersion doesn't exist). I love easter eggs. Playing The Witcher 3 and seeing references to Breaking Bad, Pulp Fiction, Adam Smith, Karl Marx, Friedrich Nietzsche, Monty Python, Tolstoy, Batman, etc, was awesome. Depends on the situation. I often don't mind pop culture reference here and there but I think they went a bit too far with Cole. He (and Solas) have several banters where it seems they are talking seriously about some nebulous fade and history stuff, but no they are making references to movies with angels. I didn't like that one bit. He is a fairly serious/sad characters who can drop important lore info...I mean having one angel movie reference among some lore wouldn't have been bad. But there was several pop culture stuff, so much people noticed.
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Post by Ieldra on Dec 23, 2018 7:09:06 GMT
The A38 permit quest had no grounding in the world, and thus, while possibly enjoyable for some, felt like a foreign object to me, and I only did it because I'm an obsessive completionist. Its a joke about bureaucracy. I'm not blind
The thing is, it worked in, while we're at it, Asterix because the real Roman Empire's bureaucracy is a grounding and because it's more light-hearted storytelling to start with. In Toussaint it felt out of place. Also, for any easter eggs I prefer some subtlely. TW3 wasn't actually too bad in this overall, it wasn't usually annoying, but it did occasionally make me stop and realize it didn't feel like part of the world.
I also don't mind things I can easily ignore. They're not for me, others might enjoy them, I may have noticed but they don't hog my attetion, for instance by being a quest, and that's it. That's why I think some subtlety is important. The more "in your face" it is, the more annoying it can become.
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Post by phoray on Dec 23, 2018 7:22:17 GMT
He (and Solas) have several banters where it seems they are talking seriously about some nebulous fade and history stuff, but no they are making references to movies with angels. I didn't like that one bit What I don't like about it is I want to learn more about Thedas and I'm listening in for that, only to find out later that is was many lines of dialogue wasted on movie references.
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Post by river82 on Dec 23, 2018 7:59:09 GMT
He (and Solas) have several banters where it seems they are talking seriously about some nebulous fade and history stuff, but no they are making references to movies with angels. I didn't like that one bit What I don't like about it is I want to learn more about Thedas and I'm listening in for that, only to find out later that is was many lines of dialogue wasted on movie references. For me it jerks me out of the experience. So I read stories and play games to be swept away in the escapism, and pop culture references puts me right back in the real world.
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Post by Ieldra on Dec 23, 2018 12:25:55 GMT
He (and Solas) have several banters where it seems they are talking seriously about some nebulous fade and history stuff, but no they are making references to movies with angels. I didn't like that one bit What I don't like about it is I want to learn more about Thedas and I'm listening in for that, only to find out later that is was many lines of dialogue wasted on movie references. Fortunate that I don't watch many movies, so this completely passed me by, but yeah, thinking it's some lore only to find out it's a real-world reference, that is extremely annoying. Feel like deception on the part of the writers on top of everything else.
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