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Sifr
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sifr
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire
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Post by Sifr on Dec 25, 2018 9:20:05 GMT
It would be interesting to see another Petrice-like character in DA4. 🤔 A shady little instigator who uses the Chantry as a thin excuse to go after the Qunari. I love to hate Petrice, she's one of my favourite recurring villains in DA2.
I'd have had her always survive Act 2, only to switch her focus towards riling up the mages in Act 3, while plotting to usurp Elthina as Grand Cleric. This would again potentially bring her into conflict with Hawke, as well as put her at odds with Sebastian and (surprisingly) Meredith, who despite agreeing with her views on mages, nevertheless respected Elthina.
The grand result of her machinations is a pyrrhic victory, as she succeeds in helping to push tensions between Mages and Templars to breaking point, but also ensures her own death when Anders destroys the Chantry with her inside it.
There's a reason I keep pushing for a hardcore Tal-Vashoth to balance out all these Qunari! My pitch for a Tal-Vashoth character would be... imagine Isabela or Sera, but with horns and magic. Someone who may have been trained as a Ben-Hassrath agent, but ended up having to flee the Qun after she developed magic. Mechanically, she'd fight as a rogue, but she'd have some magical abilities available. Her unique specialisation could be described as Swashbuckler-meets-Tempest, letting her cast flaming/frozen/telekinetic weapons or buff her defenses by surrounding herself in elemental "armour". Or perhaps instead she'd have some type of "teleport" ability, that's a mix between Fade Step, Back to Back and Vendetta from DA2, with the focus ability being similar to Thousand Cuts or All Hands on Deck? Par Vollen I have my doubts about actually seeing by the next game, but Qunandar sounds incredible and I would love to visit it. "Beehive" architecture! Pyramids in the jungle! Qunari EVERYWHERE, so finally the humans feel small and out-of-place. (jk but really tho) As someone who adores archaeology and history, being able to explore the pyramids and discover more about the mysterious ancient civilisation that built them, would be something I'm totally down for.
Forget saving the world, lemme explore those ancient ruins and tombs already! Qunari are so rad. Well, raddest of the four races. I'm hoping at least the male qunari will look more like DA2/concept art qunari. I want to look like a monster. If I can't be a monster, let me at least look vaguely like one please please. That's part of what I most loved about being able to play as a Qunari in Inquisition, in how it subverts the original conception of Qunari as more of a bog-standard, fantasy, villain/barbarian race, by putting one of them in the position of being the big damn hero who saves the world.
(Okay, so Sten was technically one of the good guys in Origins, but he wasn't the hero of the story and recruiting him was entirely optional. Plus, he did kinda murder an entire farm of innocent people, including children. And his unwavering loyalty to the Qun put his alignment more at Lawful Neutral than straight up Good.)
Zevran does absolutely nothing, NOTHING for me. I don't think he is particularly attractive and I don't think his romance is particularly good. But I do enjoy getting to do some dwarf x elf homoeroticism. That's the only plus side none of the other games have. Non-human gay pairings are GREAT! It took until recently for me to finally finish my Zevmance and come to fully appreciate his character. But I do agree that I don't really see Zevran as a fit for any of my male Wardens, at least not my Dwarven guys. I kinda see my male Brosca as being more attracted to someone like Sten, Blackwall or Skywatcher (even though I'm pretty sure they're all incompatible orientation-wise for him anyway).
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Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Neverwinter Nights, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by witchcocktor on Dec 25, 2018 11:13:34 GMT
Par Vollen I have my doubts about actually seeing by the next game, but Qunandar sounds incredible and I would love to visit it. "Beehive" architecture! Pyramids in the jungle! Qunari EVERYWHERE, so finally the humans feel small and out-of-place. (jk but really tho) As someone who adores archaeology and history, being able to explore the pyramids and discover more about the mysterious ancient civilisation that built them, would be something I'm totally down for.
Forget saving the world, lemme explore those ancient ruins and tombs already! Qunari are so rad. Well, raddest of the four races. I'm hoping at least the male qunari will look more like DA2/concept art qunari. I want to look like a monster. If I can't be a monster, let me at least look vaguely like one please please. That's part of what I most loved about being able to play as a Qunari in Inquisition, in how it subverts the original conception of Qunari as more of a bog-standard, fantasy, villain/barbarian race, by putting one of them in the position of being the big damn hero who saves the world.
(Okay, so Sten was technically one of the good guys in Origins, but he wasn't the hero of the story and recruiting him was entirely optional. Plus, he did kinda murder an entire farm of innocent people, including children. And his unwavering loyalty to the Qun put his alignment more at Lawful Neutral than straight up Good.)
Zevran does absolutely nothing, NOTHING for me. I don't think he is particularly attractive and I don't think his romance is particularly good. But I do enjoy getting to do some dwarf x elf homoeroticism. That's the only plus side none of the other games have. Non-human gay pairings are GREAT! It took until recently for me to finally finish my Zevmance and come to fully appreciate his character. But I do agree that I don't really see Zevran as a fit for any of my male Wardens, at least not my Dwarven guys. I kinda see my male Brosca as being more attracted to someone like Sten, Blackwall or Skywatcher (even though I'm pretty sure they're all incompatible orientation-wise for him anyway).
Honestly learning about ancient civilizations and raiding tombs sounds much more appealing than dealing with Solas right now. Something I dislike about Dragon Age is that the scope is way too big. I didn't really care for how the Inquisitor becomes the savior of the world even though they are literally just a random grunt. I can't really get invested in a hero story, I don't like playing the hero. And I doubt DA4 will be any different, though I hope our new protagonist kind of works like a new companion to the Inquisitor. So that the Inquisitor is the hero of the game but we are just doing a lot of their dirty work, but a lot of our time is spent on our own personal quests instead of save the world, save the world, save the world, be the hero, be the hero, be the hero! Skywatcher likes dudes until proven otherwise, mate! I'd sacrifice all of our current gay and bi (except Jaal) Bioware men for Sten and Blackwall. Don't come at me. Okay you may come at me. My canon male Inquisitor Adaar had a big thing for Blackwall, but alas, he remains single as fuk. Shame, because he turned out so fine. I also liked Barris, Samson, Ketojan (RIP :c) and honestly I wouldn't mind enjoying a sexually and emotionally charged political relationship with Gaspard.
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gervaise21
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights
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Post by gervaise21 on Dec 25, 2018 11:57:11 GMT
I'd have had her always survive Act 2, only to switch her focus towards riling up the mages in Act 3, while plotting to usurp Elthina as Grand Cleric. This would again potentially bring her into conflict with Hawke, as well as put her at odds with Sebastian and (surprisingly) Meredith, who despite agreeing with her views on mages, nevertheless respected Elthina. Actually by Act 3 Sebastian tells Averline that Meredith is no longer listening to Elthina's advice, so it would seem by then she no longer respects her or anyone else. This would make sense considering the red lyrium is beginning to overcome her mind. It also sort of absolves Elthina somewhat of the situation at that stage since Meredith is now beyond her control. Calling for the Annulment really had nothing to do with Meredith's respect for Elthina and everything to do with her paranoia and obsession with controlling mages. This presumably is why the writers didn't need anyone else pushing matters to breaking point since Meredith was always going to force the issue at some point.
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leadintea
N3
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, Baldur's Gate
Posts: 265 Likes: 379
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leadintea
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, Baldur's Gate
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Post by leadintea on Dec 26, 2018 17:26:00 GMT
I'd have had her always survive Act 2, only to switch her focus towards riling up the mages in Act 3, while plotting to usurp Elthina as Grand Cleric. This would again potentially bring her into conflict with Hawke, as well as put her at odds with Sebastian and (surprisingly) Meredith, who despite agreeing with her views on mages, nevertheless respected Elthina. Actually by Act 3 Sebastian tells Averline that Meredith is no longer listening to Elthina's advice, so it would seem by then she no longer respects her or anyone else. This would make sense considering the red lyrium is beginning to overcome her mind. It also sort of absolves Elthina somewhat of the situation at that stage since Meredith is now beyond her control. Calling for the Annulment really had nothing to do with Meredith's respect for Elthina and everything to do with her paranoia and obsession with controlling mages. This presumably is why the writers didn't need anyone else pushing matters to breaking point since Meredith was always going to force the issue at some point. I'm surprised a certain someone hasn't caught whiff of this. Then again, I don't want this thread to be derailed into yet another mage/templar debate.
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Post by vertigomez on Dec 29, 2018 22:49:41 GMT
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Dec 27, 2018 19:58:47 GMT
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Post by taarsidathanhalsaam on Dec 30, 2018 0:46:30 GMT
If we go to Rivain we can finally interact with the Qunari in a truly peaceful manner. The accords that ended the Qunari wars were signed there, and there's a qunari settlement that trades and talks with non-qunari!
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Andraste_Reborn
N4
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
Posts: 1,460 Likes: 6,306
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andrastereborn
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by Andraste_Reborn on Dec 30, 2018 6:58:05 GMT
This reminds me that some of the most heartbreaking banter in the game (which I had never heard until my most recent run) is between Cole and Iron Bull:
Cole: "Tama, how will I follow the Qun?" Her hands, strong but gentle, ruffles stubs where the horns will be."You are strong, and your mind is sharp. You will solve problems others cannot." She smiles, but sadly.
Iron Bull: Looks like my old Tamassran was wrong. Bet she's pissed one of her kids went Tal-Vashoth
Cole: Agents with hushed tones. Eyes stinging, forms to fill out, course corrections, reduce risk of similar losses.I remember the little boy, too wise, eager to help. Words break in small secret spaces. He got away. He got away.
Iron Bull: How could you know that? You've never even met her.
Cole: Your hurt touches hers.
Iron Bull: Well, that's, uh, creepy. But... thanks.
So we know that 1) Bull's Tama is secretly happy he left the Qun and 2) if he hangs out with Cole he finds this out and 3) HE'S NEVER EVER GOING TO BE ABLE TO SEE HER AGAIN AND TELL HER HE KNOWS .
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Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Jade Empire
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Post by arvaarad on Dec 30, 2018 15:28:41 GMT
reduce risk of similar losses I know Cole can only access the thoughts of Qunari through their connection to Bull, but it still bums me out that we don’t get to hear from any friends of the ship’s crew. We only get to see the crew through the lens of Bull’s tama, who’s mostly thinking about Bull, rather than the 100 people who died. So they’re simply “losses”, and it’s not even clear if they’re the losses or if she’s referring to Bull going Tal-Vashoth.
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Post by vertigomez on Dec 30, 2018 15:43:20 GMT
I always assumed "similar losses" was a reference to other Qunari going Tal-Vashoth.
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Post by arvaarad on Dec 30, 2018 16:14:59 GMT
I always assumed "similar losses" was a reference to other Qunari going Tal-Vashoth. Yeah, I suspect it’s that too. Which means the dreadnought deaths never even get a passing mention until Trespasser. It’s not like Qunari don’t have friends. They have very deep friendships. So there are definitely people who care about their passing. Probably more people than those who’d mourn the Chargers. IDK, I wish Inquisition had drawn more of a distinction between opposing the Qunari system and actively treating its people as non-persons. Especially when “treating people as resources” is the very thing most players dislike about the Qun. But no one in-game calls that out, except, ironically, Solas. And it’s a very subtle callout.
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Post by vertigomez on Dec 30, 2018 16:29:04 GMT
I always assumed "similar losses" was a reference to other Qunari going Tal-Vashoth. Yeah, I suspect it’s that too. Which means the dreadnought deaths never even get a passing mention until Trespasser. It’s not like Qunari don’t have friends. They have very deep friendships. So there are definitely people who care about their passing. Probably more people than those who’d mourn the Chargers. IDK, I wish Inquisition had drawn more of a distinction between opposing the Qunari system and actively treating its people as non-persons. Especially when “treating people as resources” is the very thing most players dislike about the Qun. But no one in-game calls that out, except, ironically, Solas. And it’s a very subtle callout. I get it, but I think it's more that we're seeing it from "our" perspective... the same way that most Venatori show up in mage-y mobs only to be mowed down by the Inquisitor. No one stops to ask if Viator #327 had friends or family that would miss him (except Sera, who doesn't like thinking too hard about killing people, or Solas who notes, "these were men and women with families and loved ones, all that they are, all that they could be is gone forever"). But for the South, the soldiers on that ship weren't different from Orlesian soldiers to a Fereldan soldier, or Venatori/Red Templars to the Inquisition.
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arvaarad
Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Jade Empire
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Post by arvaarad on Dec 30, 2018 16:48:38 GMT
Yeah, I suspect it’s that too. Which means the dreadnought deaths never even get a passing mention until Trespasser. It’s not like Qunari don’t have friends. They have very deep friendships. So there are definitely people who care about their passing. Probably more people than those who’d mourn the Chargers. IDK, I wish Inquisition had drawn more of a distinction between opposing the Qunari system and actively treating its people as non-persons. Especially when “treating people as resources” is the very thing most players dislike about the Qun. But no one in-game calls that out, except, ironically, Solas. And it’s a very subtle callout. I get it, but I think it's more that we're seeing it from "our" perspective... the same way that most Venatori show up in mage-y mobs only to be mowed down by the Inquisitor. No one stops to ask if Viator #327 had friends or family that would miss him (except Sera, who doesn't like thinking too hard about killing people, or Solas who notes, "these were men and women with families and loved ones, all that they are, all that they could be is gone forever"). But for the South, the soldiers on that ship weren't different from Orlesian soldiers to a Fereldan soldier, or Venatori/Red Templars to the Inquisition. Except that they’re helping the Inquisition. Attacking people who are actively hostile is different than sacrificing allies, even if the alliance is temporary.
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Post by taarsidathanhalsaam on Dec 30, 2018 16:52:19 GMT
I always assumed "similar losses" was a reference to other Qunari going Tal-Vashoth. Yeah, I suspect it’s that too. Which means the dreadnought deaths never even get a passing mention until Trespasser. It’s not like Qunari don’t have friends. They have very deep friendships. So there are definitely people who care about their passing. Probably more people than those who’d mourn the Chargers. IDK, I wish Inquisition had drawn more of a distinction between opposing the Qunari system and actively treating its people as non-persons. Especially when “treating people as resources” is the very thing most players dislike about the Qun. But no one in-game calls that out, except, ironically, Solas. And it’s a very subtle callout. I’m curious where Sola called this out: I must have missed it!
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Post by vertigomez on Dec 30, 2018 17:07:43 GMT
I get it, but I think it's more that we're seeing it from "our" perspective... the same way that most Venatori show up in mage-y mobs only to be mowed down by the Inquisitor. No one stops to ask if Viator #327 had friends or family that would miss him (except Sera, who doesn't like thinking too hard about killing people, or Solas who notes, "these were men and women with families and loved ones, all that they are, all that they could be is gone forever"). But for the South, the soldiers on that ship weren't different from Orlesian soldiers to a Fereldan soldier, or Venatori/Red Templars to the Inquisition. Except that they’re helping the Inquisition. Attacking people who are actively hostile is different than sacrificing allies, even if the alliance is temporary. Unless you see the alliance as a ploy of an enemy force. In-game, my Vashoth Inquisitor has few qualms with "sacrificing" the dreadnought and everyone on it on those grounds. (Of course, out-of-character, in the real world, I myself could never make a choice like that. It's why I could never be a soldier irl. The thought of snuffing out anyone's life is fairly horrific to me. But my Inquisitor has lived a different life.)
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Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Jade Empire
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Post by arvaarad on Dec 30, 2018 17:45:12 GMT
Yeah, I suspect it’s that too. Which means the dreadnought deaths never even get a passing mention until Trespasser. It’s not like Qunari don’t have friends. They have very deep friendships. So there are definitely people who care about their passing. Probably more people than those who’d mourn the Chargers. IDK, I wish Inquisition had drawn more of a distinction between opposing the Qunari system and actively treating its people as non-persons. Especially when “treating people as resources” is the very thing most players dislike about the Qun. But no one in-game calls that out, except, ironically, Solas. And it’s a very subtle callout. I’m curious where Sola called this out: I must have missed it! In Trespasser. “You’d murder countless people?” “Wouldn’t you, to save your own?” It’s a very subtle callout, because of course Solas makes the same calculation. But his retort lands much harder on Inquisitors who sacrificed the dreadnought — they’ve already made the exact choice they’re accusing Solas of making.
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August 2016
gervaise21
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights
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Post by gervaise21 on Dec 30, 2018 20:01:30 GMT
It’s a very subtle callout, because of course Solas makes the same calculation. But his retort lands much harder on Inquisitors who sacrificed the dreadnought — they’ve already made the exact choice they’re accusing Solas of making You know, I hadn't thought of that before, but what you are saying is quite true, even if Solas wasn't specifically alluding to the Dreadnought decision, it is still pertinent to our adopting the moral high ground on the issue. There is also another instance when Solas is talking with Iron Bull, that at least shows that his regret is genuine: • Iron Bull: Nice job in that last fight, Solas. You really kicked the crap outta that guy. • Solas: I suppose. • Iron Bull: What, you don't think so? You ripped him a new one. It was great! • Solas: Unless the fight is personal, violence is a means to an end. It isn't appropriate to celebrate. • Iron Bull: I don't know. Gotta wonder about anyone who fights as much as we do and doesn't have some fun with it. • Solas: We have fought living men, with loves and families, and all that they might have been is gone. • Iron Bull: Yeah, but they were assholes! It was speeches like this that had me admiring Solas. Although in Trespasser when he talks to a hostile Inquisitor about his reasons for acting against the Qun, it would seem they are personal: "The Qun offend me". Which is why I don't think he was referencing the Dreadnought decision when he makes the speech you quote. I think that to Solas anyone who willingly follows the Qun is a non person.
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Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Jade Empire
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Post by arvaarad on Dec 30, 2018 20:23:41 GMT
Although in Trespasser when he talks to a hostile Inquisitor about his reasons for acting against the Qun, it would seem they are personal: "The Qun offend me". Which is why I don't think he was referencing the Dreadnought decision when he makes the speech you quote. I think that to Solas anyone who willingly follows the Qun is a non person. Agree. It’s less a callout from Solas than a callout through Solas. Solas himself likely considers sacrificing the ship to be moral, but it’s (unintentionally, on his part) the closest match to what he’s describing. Right down to “Qunari are emotionless robots, so it’s better to save the Chargers, who are real” being a parallel to “Veil-severed people are basically tranquil, so it’s better to save the ancient elves, who are real” (leaving aside the possibility that the world is already doomed, of course). I don’t think it’s a coincidence that a Qunari plot runs parallel to learning Solas’ full plan, they’re thematically intertwined. When Viddasala thinks the Inquisitor is an agent of Fen’Harel, she’s wrong in the same way that she’s wrong about Solas being an agent of Fen’Harel. Against the Qunari, the Inquisitor is (metaphorically) Fen’Harel.
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Post by vertigomez on Dec 31, 2018 4:15:26 GMT
I've never seen this version of this scene (female Hawke + Fenris in the party), AND I LOVE IT.
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TheEmptyRoad
N2
Honor is a fool's prize, glory is no use to the dead.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Origin: The3mptyRoad
PSN: TheEmptyRoad
Posts: 168 Likes: 300
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Apr 16, 2024 11:17:34 GMT
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TheEmptyRoad
Honor is a fool's prize, glory is no use to the dead.
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theemptyroad
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by TheEmptyRoad on Dec 31, 2018 6:52:11 GMT
Well I, for one am a huge fan of Qunari and Tal-Vashoth. The Qun is an interesting departure from your 'typical' medieval fantasy-land. All my Inquisitors are canon Qunari. After playing Inquisition through the first time on my usual self-insert human mage and finding out what really went down at the Conclave, well the chances of someone other than the hired security guards just 'happening' upon the ritual (in what I could only assume is taking place far from prying eyes, or even that someone raised the alarm the Divine was missing.) to me just made my canon Quizzy's race that much easier to decide.
It TOTALLY has NOTHING whatsoever to do with being able to finally play a Vashoth...nope, none at ALL...
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gervaise21
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights
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Post by gervaise21 on Dec 31, 2018 11:03:14 GMT
I've never seen this version of this scene (female Hawke + Fenris in the party), AND I LOVE IT. I got this my very first play through with a female mage Hawke. I have to admit when Fenris suggested single combat to the Arishok, I was thinking "I know you walked out on me and you don't like mages but this is taking it a bit far. Are you trying to get me killed?" However, not wanting to lose face I agreed to the dual. What followed was very much in the vein of the comedy version to music you can find on You Tube. Essentially my Hawke spending a lot of time running around the battlefield, casting the odd spell, whilst my mabari did his best to distract him. It definitely wasn't a heroic spectacle but we got there in the end. The Arishok had the humiliation of not only losing to a woman but someone who wasn't so much a good fighter as a good runner. And they didn't get their Tome back either since Isabella never returned.
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights
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Post by gervaise21 on Dec 31, 2018 11:10:02 GMT
It is interesting to note in that conversation with Hawke the Arishok says: “You will answer for the crime of those who serve you. Their offence is yours."
Now if you applied this general principle to the actions of the Arishok, then the Qun could not absolve itself of responsibility because he served the Qun.
The same is true of the Viddasala. She served the Qun so by virtue of this principle, the Qun were responsible for her actions (I think they were anyway but this is about a principle that the Arishok held to).
Thus, unless this is a principle that the Qun only apply to Bas and not themselves when judging a situation, by the Arishok's words it is clear that they twice violated the terms of the Llomerryn Accord, however much they tried to absolve themselves of responsibility by claiming the individual acted alone. Probably academic considering there is not much anyone in the south can do about it without breaking the treaty themselves but interesting none the less.
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Beerfish
N7
Little Pumpkin
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Mass Effect Andromeda, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Origin: Beerfish
XBL Gamertag: Beerfish77
Posts: 15,015 Likes: 35,799
inherit
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Apr 18, 2024 23:59:40 GMT
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August 2016
beerfish
https://bsn.boards.net/user/314/personal
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Mass Effect Andromeda, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by Beerfish on Dec 31, 2018 18:14:20 GMT
The Qunari are aggressive invading dumb asses with snarky attitudes. Also not too bright (the arishok in da2 certainly wasn't).
Petrice, like many of the 'villains' in this series really was trying to do the right thing. In the vast majority of the games I played i supported her and her cause.
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Post by vertigomez on Dec 31, 2018 20:37:22 GMT
I've never seen this version of this scene (female Hawke + Fenris in the party), AND I LOVE IT. I got this my very first play through with a female mage Hawke. I have to admit when Fenris suggested single combat to the Arishok, I was thinking "I know you walked out on me and you don't like mages but this is taking it a bit far. Are you trying to get me killed?" However, not wanting to lose face I agreed to the dual. What followed was very much in the vein of the comedy version to music you can find on You Tube. Essentially my Hawke spending a lot of time running around the battlefield, casting the odd spell, whilst my mabari did his best to distract him. It definitely wasn't a heroic spectacle but we got there in the end. The Arishok had the humiliation of not only losing to a woman but someone who wasn't so much a good fighter as a good runner. And they didn't get their Tome back either since Isabella never returned. Ha! Isabela didn't come back the first time I played either, and I remember Fenris "volunteering" Hawke (excuse u boi??!) which I really enjoyed. But I was playing male Hawke at the time, so I never saw this very interesting exchange until I watched that video clip: Arishok: If you truly knew the Qun, elf, you would not suggest I battle a female. Fenris: But she is no female. She is a respected outsider, by your own words. So anyone claiming DAI retconned Qunari ideas of gender ought to take another look at DA2.
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights
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Post by gervaise21 on Dec 31, 2018 22:13:35 GMT
Arishok: If you truly knew the Qun, elf, you would not suggest I battle a female. Fenris: But she is no female. She is a respected outsider, by your own words. So anyone claiming DAI retconned Qunari ideas of gender ought to take another look at DA2. Well it still suggests that you cannot be a "respected outsider" and a female. My Hawke's reaction to Fenris' words was more a case of "I'm a woman and proud of it." Which is what she was thinking after defeating the Arishok. That is why I'd agree they didn't retcon the Qunari ideas of gender because they are essentially saying you cannot be both a woman and a fighter. Therefore if you are a fighter you must live as a man, if you insist you wish to be seen as a woman then you cannot be a fighter. Krem would have found acceptance because Krem both wanted to be seen as a man and was able to fight as well as any man. It doesn't actually make the Qun any more accepting of transgender if the person identifies as one gender but wants to perform the role that they attribute to the other.
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Post by vertigomez on Dec 31, 2018 22:20:58 GMT
Arishok: If you truly knew the Qun, elf, you would not suggest I battle a female. Fenris: But she is no female. She is a respected outsider, by your own words. So anyone claiming DAI retconned Qunari ideas of gender ought to take another look at DA2. Well it still suggests that you cannot be a "respected outsider" and a female. My Hawke's reaction to Fenris' words was more a case of "I'm a woman and proud of it." Which is what she was thinking after defeating the Arishok. That is why I'd agree they didn't retcon the Qunari ideas of gender because they are essentially saying you cannot be both a woman and a fighter. Therefore if you are a fighter you must live as a man, if you insist you wish to be seen as a woman then you cannot be a fighter. Krem would have found acceptance because Krem both wanted to be seen as a man and was able to fight as well as any man. It doesn't actually make the Qun any more accepting of transgender if the person identifies as one gender but wants to perform the role that they attribute to the other. Right. I didn't say it was a good system - it's very rigid in its own way and dismissive of people who identify as women and warriors - just that it's interesting that Fenris tries to reason with the Arishok by saying Hawke's not female, but basalit-an, and thus an acceptable adversary.
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