abedsbrother
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Post by abedsbrother on Jan 4, 2019 4:57:45 GMT
Currently doing another DAI playthrough with an imported Keep.
- Alistair let Anora rule in DAO and rejoined the Wardens (not romanced).
- Hawke killed the Arishok sided with the Mages. Bethany survived DA2 as a Warden. Isabela romance. (EDIT: I should add that Hawke sided with Larius in the Legacy DLC.)
I have no idea which one I'm going to leave in the Fade. Alistair would be good for rebuilding the Wardens, but I can't crush Varric like that. Though technically Hawke DID "unleash the beast." Curious what people think.
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Post by Catilina on Jan 4, 2019 12:11:55 GMT
Alistair. If the Wardens only depends on one man, they deserve to be forgotten, they aren't able to save the world anymore. The Order has many officers, who able to lead the rebuild. "In death, sacrifice".
Save Hawke! He deserves some happiness, just like Isabela. (Okay, I'm biased, I never let my Hawke die.) Not Hawke is the responsible for Corypheus.
But depends on the Inquisitor's view: what the Inquisitor thinks about the Wardens (probably doesn't know, why the Wardens only capable to kill the Archdemon exactly), and heard about Hawke or not, blames Hawke for the mage rebellion or for Corypheus, or both, or doesn't think, he is the responsible for Corypheus, and agrees with him to protect the mages... Or blames the Wardens for Corypheus and the whole mess with blood magic, demon-summoning, human sacrifice... And what thinks about Alistair? He knows his story with the Hero of Ferelden?
So... It helps?
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abedsbrother
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Post by abedsbrother on Jan 4, 2019 14:48:19 GMT
Alistair. If the Wardens only depends on one man, they deserve to be forgotten, they aren't able to save the world anymore. The Order has many officers, who able to lead the rebuild. "In death, sacrifice". Save Hawke! He deserves some happiness, just like Isabela. (Okay, I'm biased, I never let my Hawke die.) Not Hawke is the responsible for Corypheus. But depends on the Inquisitor's view: what the Inquisitor thinks about the Wardens (probably doesn't know, why the Wardens only capable to kill the Archdemon exactly), and heard about Hawke or not, blames Hawke for the mage rebellion or for Corypheus, or both, or don't think, he is the responsible for Corypheus, and agree with him to protect the mages... Or blame the Wardens for Corypheus and the whole mess with blood magic, demon-summoning, human sacrifice... And what thinks about Alistair? Know his story with the Hero of Ferelden? So... It helps? Interesting. Have to think about this (Yes, it helps, ty) Role-playing my Inquisitor as a pissed-off elf rogue who isn't happy with the whole thing, but is "rolling with it." siding with mages. Probably would leave Hawke, but Varric is one of her best friends so far.
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Post by Catilina on Jan 4, 2019 15:24:43 GMT
Alistair. If the Wardens only depends on one man, they deserve to be forgotten, they aren't able to save the world anymore. The Order has many officers, who able to lead the rebuild. "In death, sacrifice".
Save Hawke! He deserves some happiness, just like Isabela. (Okay, I'm biased, I never let my Hawke die.) Not Hawke is the responsible for Corypheus.
But depends on the Inquisitor's view: what the Inquisitor thinks about the Wardens (probably doesn't know, why the Wardens only capable to kill the Archdemon exactly), and heard about Hawke or not, blames Hawke for the mage rebellion or for Corypheus, or both, or don't think, he is the responsible for Corypheus, and agree with him to protect the mages... Or blame the Wardens for Corypheus and the whole mess with blood magic, demon-summoning, human sacrifice... And what thinks about Alistair? Know his story with the Hero of Ferelden?
So... It helps? Interesting. Have to think about this (Yes, it helps, ty) Role-playing my Inquisitor as a pissed-off elf rogue who isn't happy with the whole thing, but is "rolling with it." siding with mages. Probably would leave Hawke, but Varric is one of her best friends so far. So you have to figure, your elf rogue tends to make rather slightly pragmatical decisions, or rather emotional. Both are a valid view. Many explanations exist, and still can be in-character. A pragmatical one can bring an emotional decision and vice-versa – if you can find a good reason. A logical person can bring seemingly illogical decisions – what explainable with his/her past. My red!Hawke, for example, can be surprisingly merciful and soft – if he wants. And this is a part of his personality, not against that.
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Post by Iddy on Jan 4, 2019 17:09:45 GMT
Alistair. Only a Grey Warden should pay for Grey Warden mistakes.
Besides, he never was going to have a long life anyway.
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Post by Catilina on Jan 4, 2019 17:14:06 GMT
Alistair. Only a Grey Warden should pay for Grey Warden mistakes.
Besides, he never was going to have a long life anyway. It's not that simple. Why would Alistair pay for anyone else's mistakes... And depends, how the Inquisitor thinks, this is the Warden's mistake, or Corypheus' influence?
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Post by mikaelnovasun on Jan 4, 2019 17:42:51 GMT
Alistair. Only a Grey Warden should pay for Grey Warden mistakes.
Besides, he never was going to have a long life anyway.It's not that simple. Why would Alistair pay for anyone else's mistakes... And depends, how the Inquisitor thinks, this is the Warden's mistake, or Corypheus' influence? Also given that Alistair's bloodline has dragon/magic infused blood and body fluids, he may be immune to the calling. His father's "magic" sperm somehow removed the darkspawn taint from Fiona.
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Post by Augustei on Jan 4, 2019 17:59:50 GMT
Alistair. If the Wardens only depends on one man, they deserve to be forgotten, they aren't able to save the world anymore. The Order has many officers, who able to lead the rebuild. "In death, sacrifice". They actually don't, if you leave Hawke behind in the fade, one of the wardens comes up and informs Alistair/Stroud/Loghain that they are the only surviving senior Grey Warden left. And I wouldn't expect any others to come support rebuilding the order since we get strong indications there is a schism between Weisshaupt and the southern Grey Wardens. I always leave Hawke behind for this reason
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Post by Catilina on Jan 4, 2019 18:07:12 GMT
Alistair. If the Wardens only depends on one man, they deserve to be forgotten, they aren't able to save the world anymore. The Order has many officers, who able to lead the rebuild. "In death, sacrifice". They actually don't, if you leave Hawke behind in the fade, one of the wardens comes up and informs Alistair/Stroud/Loghain that they are the only surviving senior Grey Warden left. And I wouldn't expect any others to come support rebuilding the order since we get strong indications there is a schism between Weisshaupt and the southern Grey Wardens. I always leave Hawke behind for this reason Yes. I know. This is why I said, if they can't pick a leader, they can't do anything anymore, so: they deserve to be forgotten. One officer can't be so important: just a person. Not a Chosen One. Virtually every soldier can be officer. Or every Warden so useless? It can't be true. You remember Alistair? He wasn't that leader-material...
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Post by Augustei on Jan 4, 2019 22:05:19 GMT
They actually don't, if you leave Hawke behind in the fade, one of the wardens comes up and informs Alistair/Stroud/Loghain that they are the only surviving senior Grey Warden left. And I wouldn't expect any others to come support rebuilding the order since we get strong indications there is a schism between Weisshaupt and the southern Grey Wardens. I always leave Hawke behind for this reason Yes. I know. This is why I said, if they can't pick a leader, they can't do anything anymore, so: they deserve to be forgotten. One officer can't be so important: just a person. Not a Chosen One. Virtually every soldier can be officer. Or every Warden so useless? It can't be true. You remember Alistair? He wasn't that leader-material... True, luckily for me he wasn't the guy I was leaving in charge. But not any old Warden can be an officer, the order is so secretive that only the senior wardens would know most of the important information such as how to prepare the joining to induct new Wardens, the locations of the remaining Archdemons (The Orlesian Warden-Commanders knew this in the novel The Calling), and all their secret projects (stuff like Corypheus and his prison, Avernus and his experiments, The potential Alliance with The Architect) its probable they have a bunch of other stuff along those lines, all the Darkspawn seals and their durability like the ones breached at the start of The Descent and in Emprise du Lion.
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Post by Catilina on Jan 4, 2019 22:18:29 GMT
Yes. I know. This is why I said, if they can't pick a leader, they can't do anything anymore, so: they deserve to be forgotten. One officer can't be so important: just a person. Not a Chosen One. Virtually every soldier can be officer. Or every Warden so useless? It can't be true. You remember Alistair? He wasn't that leader-material... True, luckily for me he wasn't the guy I was leaving in charge. But not any old Warden can be an officer, the order is so secretive that only the senior wardens would know most of the important information such as how to prepare the joining to induct new Wardens, the locations of the remaining Archdemons (The Orlesian Warden-Commanders knew this in the novel The Calling), and all their secret projects (stuff like Corypheus and his prison, Avernus and his experiments, The potential Alliance with The Architect) its probable they have a bunch of other stuff along those lines, all the Darkspawn seals and their durability like the ones breached at the start of The Descent and in Emprise du Lion. In Weishaupt still there are officers, senior Wardens, who know about the Joining. Do you speak about one man. Really Alistair/Stroud/Loghain the only who have the secret? Then the Order whould be absolutely idiot. The whole Order. (I don't have Warden Alistair, just king or drunk.)
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Post by Augustei on Jan 4, 2019 22:20:56 GMT
True, luckily for me he wasn't the guy I was leaving in charge. But not any old Warden can be an officer, the order is so secretive that only the senior wardens would know most of the important information such as how to prepare the joining to induct new Wardens, the locations of the remaining Archdemons (The Orlesian Warden-Commanders knew this in the novel The Calling), and all their secret projects (stuff like Corypheus and his prison, Avernus and his experiments, The potential Alliance with The Architect) its probable they have a bunch of other stuff along those lines, all the Darkspawn seals and their durability like the ones breached at the start of The Descent and in Emprise du Lion. In Weishaupt still there are officers, senior Wardens, who know about the Joining. Do you speak about one man. Really Alistair/Stroud/Loghain the only who have the secret? Then the Order whould be absolutely idiot. The whole Order. (I don't have Warden Alistair, just king or drunk.) The only ones in the south who know the secret, since the rest are all dead, and the rest of the order up in Weisshaupt have a schism with the southern wardens, it may even break out into civil war, they aren't going to help the southern wardens with anything any time soon.
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Post by Catilina on Jan 4, 2019 22:34:17 GMT
In Weishaupt still there are officers, senior Wardens, who know about the Joining. Do you speak about one man. Really Alistair/Stroud/Loghain the only who have the secret? Then the Order whould be absolutely idiot. The whole Order. (I don't have Warden Alistair, just king or drunk.) The only ones in the south who know the secret, since the rest are all dead, and the rest of the order up in Weisshaupt have a schism with the southern wardens, it may even break out into civil war, they aren't going to help the southern wardens with anything any time soon. I'm sure, the Inquisitor at the moment when s/he chooses, absolutely clearly knows, that the Wardens have special secrets, and the Wardens want to kill each other in Weisshaupt, ONLY Alistair/Loghain/Stroud able to save the day... Even the player doesn't know – the epilogue says... And at the moment even in the Fort, stay many Wardens. One of them capable.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 5, 2019 15:51:15 GMT
I don't care about practical reasons. I just can't kill anyone I romance. Since as Hawke I can't romance myself, it's obvious who kicks the bucket. Though, so far I had options between Loghain and Stroud vs Hawke and each time I sacrificed different for interest. Didn't load Alistair warden template yet.
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Post by boxofscreaming on Jan 5, 2019 18:35:13 GMT
Should have been able to sacrifice Solas - two birds with one stone!
I wouldn't sacrifice Hawke though - don't want them to die as a footnote to someone else's story.
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Post by Catilina on Jan 5, 2019 19:51:25 GMT
Should have been able to sacrifice Solas - two birds with one stone! I wouldn't sacrifice Hawke though - don't want them to die as a footnote to someone else's story. Indeed. Hawke deserves better!
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Post by Iddy on Jan 6, 2019 1:30:35 GMT
Catilina took over the thread, I see.
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Post by thats1evildude on Jan 6, 2019 1:41:08 GMT
Myself, I'd let Nightmare eat unromanced Alistair. Luckily, I never had to make that choice, because Alistair is king of Ferelden in my canon. I had Stroud and his glorious mustache to feed the beast instead.
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Post by Andraste_Reborn on Jan 6, 2019 2:29:26 GMT
Hawke, because leaving Hawke behind is more narratively satisfying.
It makes more sense for Alistair to go to Weisshaupt, and at least Hawke has Varric to mourn him. Nobody really reacts to Alistair's death beyond a single line from Leliana and Varric being generically sorry about it, which seems a pretty unfair ending for one of the heroes of the Fifth Blight.
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Post by gaycaravaggio on Jan 6, 2019 7:31:11 GMT
I'm not very fond of Alistair, but I'll say sacrifice Hawke.
You'll need an ally to help shape rebuilding the Grey Wardens aligned to the Inquisition's (and possibly Thedas's) interests. Besides that, there's something that goes down in Weisshaupt according to the epilogue slides. If you saved The Warden character instead of Hawke, then you'll have a survivor who could potentially hold some sway due to what he witnessed or alternatively due to Alistair/Loghain's past with helping the Hero of Ferelden. Hawke just wouldn't hold the same sway politically (see: Kirkwall), in addition to her/his not being a warden.
Also, if they decide to make it possible (or retcon) for the sacrifice to survive the events of Here Lies the Abyss, then it's more likely to be Hawke than The Warden because of being a player character.
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Post by Blaze on Jan 7, 2019 16:45:12 GMT
it's a tough one, at least for someone like me who like alistair. that dilema happened in my seocond playtrough, but i guess for me that was easy. julia (my second hawke) is the type of person who would jump in without waiting the inquisitor to decide, so in my head it wasn't a decision made by my inquisitor but by my hawke. first playthrough it was stroud and hawke and it still took 10 minutes of me staring at the screen (thank god it wasn't alistair or loghain* the first time, cause it likely would have taken me more than 10 minutes). at the end i chose stroud because my inquisitor couldn't do it to varric by choosing hawke.
so i guess my advice is, leave the decision to your own character.
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Post by phoray on Jan 7, 2019 17:35:12 GMT
Any Hawke that didn't romance Fenris will perish before Alistair.
IF they romanced Fenris, Alistair would die.
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Post by Ieldra on Jan 8, 2019 19:22:34 GMT
I'll be honest: I have a preference for saving Hawke simply because Alistair has never been a character I played. Also, fate has dealt harshly with Hawke, and I feel they deserve something more than to die in the Fade fighting the invincible personification of all nightmares.
Having said that, barring certain value preferences I tend to make "personal canon" decisions only after I know the whole story, and so if it turns out Hawke gets the better deal if you leave them in the Fade with little philosophical cost anywhere else, then I will replay my preferred worldstate and make a different decision - and I mean actually replay, not just set things differently in the Keep. My preferred world-state has to be something I played through from start to end.
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Post by themikefest on Jan 8, 2019 19:34:15 GMT
The one time I left Hawke in the fade was because Hawke was male. I tried playing male Hawke in DA2, but didn't get far because I wasn't a fan of the voice. I deleted that character to start a female Hawke playthrough. So, if it was me, I would leave Hawke in the fade if male, if not, leave Alistair.
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abedsbrother
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Post by abedsbrother on Jan 9, 2019 16:48:06 GMT
I'll be honest: I have a preference for saving Hawke simply because Alistair has never been a character I played. Also, fate has dealt harshly with Hawke, and I feel they deserve something more than to die in the Fade fighting the invincible personification of all nightmares. Having said that, barring certain value preferences I tend to make "personal canon" decisions only after I know the whole story, and so if it turns out Hawke gets the better deal if you leave them in the Fade with little philosophical cost anywhere else, then I will replay my preferred worldstate and make a different decision - and I mean actually replay, not just set things differently in the Keep. My preferred world-state has to be something I played through from start to end. This decision is actually for a recorded YouTube playthrough. The decisions made in DAO and DA2 that I entered into the Keep are the decisions made in my YouTube playthroughs of those games. So I feel like this decision weighs more heavily on me than if it were just another playthrough, taking a different path for fun. I'm just at choosing Mages or Templars, so the point of no return is still a ways away. Right now inclining towards leaving Hawke - not because of consideration for Alistair, but because I think Hawke would feel, after the events of Legacy, that it would be his duty to remain.
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