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Post by river82 on Feb 25, 2019 1:33:38 GMT
“I love the way The Witcher 3 put more cinematic, more heavy story quests into those open worlds in order to even out the pacing and do it in a way players responded to super positively. Whereas in our case, it felt like there were two phases of the game: there was the stuff in the open world which, again, the writers did a great job of theming each zone so it had like, oh, this is the one where there was an expedition that went missing and it’s all full of notes, but it was never quite the same as the level of intensity you got when you went back in time and rescued Leliana from Redcliffe. Those were heavily cinematic. So, I think it was a bit jarring due to being inconsistent.
"If I could go back I’m sure we’d look closer to The Witcher 3 – in the hindsight that I’ve seen The Witcher 3. Even we knew it was living where it was and we hadn’t balanced our budget in our deployment of stuff properly in the same way hindsight would have led me to do."comicbook.com/gaming/2018/05/27/dragon-age-inquisition-bioware-witcher-3/Mike Laidlaw obviously cares. Anyway his comments are in line with Bioware's recent behaviour of following trends (Skyrim, No Man's Sky, Destiny) rather than trendsetting. Where did Nightscrawl say that Witcher 3 did NOTHING of value at all? The first question Nightscrawl quoted from your post was "Who cares what GoT has anyway", to which Nightscrawl replied to add Witcher 3 to that sentiment. Because he quoted two sentences from you, he's adding Witcher 3 to both sentiments. My reply was that obviously Mike Laidlaw cares. There's a logical continuity to that.
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Post by pessimistpanda on Feb 25, 2019 1:38:28 GMT
Where did Nightscrawl say that Witcher 3 did NOTHING of value at all? The first question Nightscrawl quoted from your post was "Who cares what GoT has anyway", to which Nightscrawl replied to add Witcher 3 to that sentiment. Because he quoted two sentences from you, he's adding Witcher 3 to both sentiments. My reply was that obviously Mike Laidlaw cares. There's a logical continuity to that. Yes, but Nightscrawl and I are only saying that "because GoT/Witcher 3 did it" is not a good enough reason on its own. Aside from the fact that neither of these IPs are without flaws, where is the fun in every game being exactly the goddamn same?
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Post by river82 on Feb 25, 2019 1:45:04 GMT
The first question Nightscrawl quoted from your post was "Who cares what GoT has anyway", to which Nightscrawl replied to add Witcher 3 to that sentiment. Because he quoted two sentences from you, he's adding Witcher 3 to both sentiments. My reply was that obviously Mike Laidlaw cares. There's a logical continuity to that. Yes, but Nightscrawl and I are only saying that "because GoT/Witcher 3 did it" is not a good enough reason on its own. Aside from the fact that neither of these IPs are without flaws, where is the fun in every game being exactly the goddamn same? I'm kinda implying that Bioware will copy popular franchises just because the franchise is popular and they did it, but I don't have the evidence to back it up. But Inquisition headed toward Skyrim, and then Andromeda went No Man Sky, and Anthem went Destiny, and I can't see any reason they did it apart from chasing sales. But I guess we'll see what they do with DA:4
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Post by Nightscrawl on Feb 25, 2019 1:57:35 GMT
The first question Nightscrawl quoted from your post was "Who cares what GoT has anyway", to which Nightscrawl replied to add Witcher 3 to that sentiment. Because he quoted two sentences from you, he's adding Witcher 3 to both sentiments. My reply was that obviously Mike Laidlaw cares. There's a logical continuity to that. It was more about the whole "jumping off a cliff" aspect. I think it's fine for Bioware, and all companies, to look at other companies and other games, see what they did/do well, and take inspiration from that. The quote from Laidlaw acknowledges that. In addition, he approaches it in a moderate way. I'm referring more to some of those overblown fan attitudes that Dragon Age should throw out its own personality in favor of what GoT or Witcher has to offer, particularly as relates to more grimdark violence and sex. The numerous DA vs. Witcher threads attest to my exact point: that there are plenty of fans who would like to see DA follow Witcher's path.
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Post by thats1evildude on Feb 25, 2019 2:01:20 GMT
I think it’s more accurate to say that Electronic Arts’ higher-ups are bandwagon-chasers, and their lackeys have to follow their direction.
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Post by colfoley on Feb 25, 2019 2:01:41 GMT
Yes, but Nightscrawl and I are only saying that "because GoT/Witcher 3 did it" is not a good enough reason on its own. Aside from the fact that neither of these IPs are without flaws, where is the fun in every game being exactly the goddamn same? I'm kinda implying that Bioware will copy popular franchises just because the franchise is popular and they did it, but I don't have the evidence to back it up. But Inquisition headed toward Skyrim, and then Andromeda went No Man Sky, and Anthem went Destiny, and I can't see any reason they did it apart from chasing sales. But I guess we'll see what they do with DA:4 Gaming is all about chasing trends. Its annoying but it is what it is...and the annoying thing too the game industry feels painfully out of date in terms of game design sometimes. Any new revolutionary gaming idea that someone has people will say 'that was a great idea!' and then we won't see that idea for the next five years because that is how long games tend to take to develop....or 3 years. Whatever I think you get the point? That being said: DAI was only skeletally related to Skyrim. I mean anyone who makes that claim probably hasn't actually played one game or the other. Andromeda is certainly no No Mans Sky. I mean granted BioWare was considering doing that but changed their mind which led them to starting development over from scratch which ultimatley led to a rushed game. Etc. As for Anthem. Probably. Haven't played Destiny so I have no idea. I mean yes that was obviously the trend they were chasing but I'm skeptical of people who say they are that similar...especially when they say DAI and Skyrim was similar.
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Post by river82 on Feb 25, 2019 2:04:47 GMT
I'm kinda implying that Bioware will copy popular franchises just because the franchise is popular and they did it, but I don't have the evidence to back it up. But Inquisition headed toward Skyrim, and then Andromeda went No Man Sky, and Anthem went Destiny, and I can't see any reason they did it apart from chasing sales. But I guess we'll see what they do with DA:4 Gaming is all about chasing trends. Its annoying but it is what it is...and the annoying thing too the game industry feels painfully out of date in terms of game design sometimes. Any new revolutionary gaming idea that someone has people will say 'that was a great idea!' and then we won't see that idea for the next five years because that is how long games tend to take to develop....or 3 years. Whatever I think you get the point? That being said: DAI was only skeletally related to Skyrim. I mean anyone who makes that claim probably hasn't actually played one game or the other. Andromeda is certainly no No Mans Sky. I mean granted BioWare was considering doing that but changed their mind which led them to starting development over from scratch which ultimatley led to a rushed game. Etc. As for Anthem. Probably. Haven't played Destiny so I have no idea. I mean yes that was obviously the trend they were chasing but I'm skeptical of people who say they are that similar...especially when they say DAI and Skyrim was similar. According to Schreier it was only because they couldn't get procedurally generated planets working that Andromeda wasn't a No Man's Sky clone.
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Post by Nightscrawl on Feb 25, 2019 2:16:37 GMT
DAI was only skeletally related to Skyrim. I mean anyone who makes that claim probably hasn't actually played one game or the other. I wish I had been able to get into Fallout 4 to be able to see and appreciate Bethesda's attempts at greater follower depth. I've seen one video (Danse's romance), but generally videos don't do it for me because I feel so detached from the experience. That is where Skyrim falls apart for me, and it's quite jarring to play through the game without that deeper companionship the DA games offer. Serana was an experiment of sorts; she has more involved coding than any other follower in the game and in fact modders use her as a base because of it. But she's just one character attached to one limited story. Sometimes, playing Skyrim feels more like playing DAI post-game; the life is sucked out of the game at that point because the followers have changed. I play very little of DAI in the post-game and try to get most of it done before fighting Corypheus.
(But don't get me wrong. I really enjoy Skyrim and have a play going even now. But it's not Dragon Age and followers are a big part of what makes DA my favorite series and heavily influence replayability for me.)
I think that's an example of Bethesda taking inspiration from Bioware, which isn't a bad thing. Only time will tell if they think it's worthwhile to develop further, or they're fine with the amount of character development (and similarly romance content) present with FO4. Each company will have their own priorities and goals with their game(s), and that's fine too.
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Post by colfoley on Feb 25, 2019 2:31:24 GMT
Gaming is all about chasing trends. Its annoying but it is what it is...and the annoying thing too the game industry feels painfully out of date in terms of game design sometimes. Any new revolutionary gaming idea that someone has people will say 'that was a great idea!' and then we won't see that idea for the next five years because that is how long games tend to take to develop....or 3 years. Whatever I think you get the point? That being said: DAI was only skeletally related to Skyrim. I mean anyone who makes that claim probably hasn't actually played one game or the other. Andromeda is certainly no No Mans Sky. I mean granted BioWare was considering doing that but changed their mind which led them to starting development over from scratch which ultimatley led to a rushed game. Etc. As for Anthem. Probably. Haven't played Destiny so I have no idea. I mean yes that was obviously the trend they were chasing but I'm skeptical of people who say they are that similar...especially when they say DAI and Skyrim was similar. According to Schreier it was only because they couldn't get procedurally generated planets working that Andromeda wasn't a No Man's Sky clone. Exactly? I think they realized it wasn't going to work with their style of gameplay so they didn't decide to pursue it.
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Post by pessimistpanda on Feb 25, 2019 4:48:38 GMT
The people in this thread who still have two brain cells to rub together should go back through this thread and pay attention to the trend.
The people saying Dragon Age needs sexual violence and abuse of women to be a 'good game', are the SAME people who just pages earlier were saying they were afraid that Weekes would make the game 'too lefty' (ie, too diverse, too tolerant, too friendly to minorities), and ranting deliriously about how gays were trying to kick straight boys out of the game.
Those things WERE NOT in DA:O to any greater degree than they were in DA2 or DAI. It's an outrageous, bald-faced lie. The people expressing this opinion DO NOT CARE about quality writing, artistic integrity, accurate portrayal of history, maturity, or any of the other utterly meaningless terms they spout over and over again.
They are not any more politically neutral than I am. They want to push women out of gaming. That's it. That's the goal of all of this posturing.
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Post by Nightscrawl on Feb 25, 2019 6:43:26 GMT
I'm not even sure why this thread exists when the "Tone and feel of the world" thread already existed except to be paranoid that Weekes's "leftiness" or whatever would taint the game leading to a... wait for it... change in tone. That other thread seems to be having more of an honest discussion about the issue.
As for the Dragon Age franchise, they have long maintained that they don't care about bigot dollars, long before Patrick Weekes got involved with the series. With each successive game, Dragon Age has become more inclusive, with DAI being the most inclusive to date. Weekes was not in a leadership position on any of those games. David Gaider, Mike Laidlaw, and Mark Darrah don't exactly strike me as "conservative" darlings. No one in this thread has been able to fully explain why this one man will have such a dramatic impact as to drastically change Dragon Age from the trajectory it was on before Weekes even became involved with it.
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Post by pessimistpanda on Feb 25, 2019 6:56:14 GMT
I'm not even sure why this thread exists when the "Tone and feel of the world" thread already existed except to be paranoid that Weekes's "leftiness" or whatever would taint the game leading to a... wait for it... change in tone. That other thread seems to be having more of an honest discussion about the issue. As for the Dragon Age franchise, they have long maintained that they don't care about bigot dollars, long before Patrick Weekes got involved with the series. With each successive game, Dragon Age has become more inclusive, with DAI being the most inclusive to date. Weekes was not in a leadership position on any of those games. David Gaider, Mike Laidlaw, and Mark Darrah don't exactly strike me as "conservative" darlings. No one in this thread has been able to fully explain why this one man will have such a dramatic impact as to drastically change Dragon Age from the trajectory it was on before Weekes even became involved with it. Well I just learned from a friend today that GRR Martin campaigned for Hillary in New Mexico, and has been vocal about his dislike for Trump. But he's apparently somehow a right-wing hero because tittays.
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Post by Ieldra on Feb 25, 2019 7:03:21 GMT
The first question Nightscrawl quoted from your post was "Who cares what GoT has anyway", to which Nightscrawl replied to add Witcher 3 to that sentiment. Because he quoted two sentences from you, he's adding Witcher 3 to both sentiments. My reply was that obviously Mike Laidlaw cares. There's a logical continuity to that. It was more about the whole "jumping off a cliff" aspect. I think it's fine for Bioware, and all companies, to look at other companies and other games, see what they did/do well, and take inspiration from that. The quote from Laidlaw acknowledges that. In addition, he approaches it in a moderate way. I'm referring more to some of those overblown fan attitudes that Dragon Age should throw out its own personality in favor of what GoT or Witcher has to offer, particularly as relates to more grimdark violence and sex. The numerous DA vs. Witcher threads attest to my exact point: that there are plenty of fans who would like to see DA follow Witcher's path. TW3 wasn't any more or less grimdark than DAI. Heck, DAI's main plot arguably had *more* horror in it than TW3's. TW3 just didn't self-censor its presentation with regard to the fictional world's everyday violence and other bad stuff. A part of it might've been chasing after Skyrim rather than TW3, where you'd want people to feel comfortable enough in your world to stay and do your own stuff, but there wasn't any "your own stuff" to do so that backfired. Meanwhile, the places where you could feel comfortable in TW3 are few and far between. Thedas isn't any less dangerous, but the game didn't make you feel it as much.
As for the sex, that's just good old American prudishness. One notices, and I liked TW3's scenes, but it isn't all that important. If I want to see realistic sex scenes, I go somewhere else than a fantasy-themed video game anyway.
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Post by thats1evildude on Feb 25, 2019 7:10:34 GMT
Well, I certainly wouldn’t want DA to follow The Witcher’s lead, as I utterly despise The Witcher.
I simply don’t want DA to get *less* dark than it already is, or completely forget that some of its fans are straight men.
Of course, I have been told I’m being paranoid. I dearly hope that’s the case, but we’ll see.
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Post by pessimistpanda on Feb 25, 2019 7:16:18 GMT
Oh my god you guys, I just had another terrible nightmare. I dreamt that Patrick Weekes woke up and was suddenly gay. He abandoned his wife and children and marched into BioWare Edmonton with a Pride flag that he used to beat the rest of the writing team to death. Then he took every single copy of DA4, and put them through a gay-fication machine, so that every dude who tries to play it will turn gay.
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Post by thats1evildude on Feb 25, 2019 7:17:28 GMT
Oh my god you guys, I just had another terrible nightmare. I dreamt that Patrick Weekes woke up and was suddenly gay. He’s actually pansexual. Not sure if you knew that.
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Post by pessimistpanda on Feb 25, 2019 7:20:04 GMT
Oh my god you guys, I just had another terrible nightmare. I dreamt that Patrick Weekes woke up and was suddenly gay. He abandoned his wife and children and marched into BioWare Edmonton with a Pride flag that he used to beat the rest of the writing team to death. Then he took every single copy of DA4, and put them through a gay-fication machine, so that every dude who tries to play it will turn gay. He’s actually pansexual. Well since he has such a FAIR and BALANCED orientation I guess I have nothing to be afraid of. Gosh, what a relief.
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Post by thats1evildude on Feb 25, 2019 7:24:11 GMT
It’s not really his sexuality that’s a problem. It’s his politics, along with that of the rest of the BioWare team.
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Post by pessimistpanda on Feb 25, 2019 7:30:02 GMT
It’s not really his sexuality that’s a problem. It’s his politics, along with that of the rest of the BioWare team. Yeah, I heard that when you interview to work for BioWare, they make you suck a hundred dicks. And if you try to say no, Mark Laidlaw will say "Don't talk when your mouth is full of dicks, dick-mouth!" And then everyone laughs at you.
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Post by thats1evildude on Feb 25, 2019 7:35:27 GMT
Do you mean MIKE Laidlaw? He doesn’t work there anymore.
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Post by DragonKingReborn on Feb 25, 2019 7:39:25 GMT
I think we've reached the end of this thread's useful life.
If you wish to continue to discuss the tone of the Dragon Age games, please take it to the existing thread for that topic.
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