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Post by smilesja on Feb 26, 2019 16:55:00 GMT
Some people are review bombing metro games just because the publisher changed online store. A studio trying something new is a field day. uhm...to their defense....a dev reacted in such a dumb way that I saw this coming. Then again I can see how this exclusivity deal can piss off a lot of people due to the fact the epic store is way subpar as I understand it Still very petty to review bomb a game (which I heard was pretty good.) because a dev said something you didn’t like.
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Post by alanc9 on Feb 26, 2019 16:58:28 GMT
Do you remember whether that estimate included engine licensing? Frostbite is essentially in-house. DICE may have some costs associated with supporting BioWare's use of it, but I wouldn't expect BioWare to be dinged the full licensing fee that outside developers would be charged. Huh? Why wouldnt they pay the full price? EA would be better off licensing the engine for full price on the market if they made below fair market price inhouse . That doesn't follow. Licensing the engine to Bio doesn't preclude licensing it to non-EA studios. The limiting factor would be DICE support, but it sounds like whatever little there is of that is handled on a case-by-case basis. But whether Bio's paying the full price is irrelevant anyway. Moving money from Bio to DICE doesn't have any impact on the profitability of Anthem, which is the only reason we're talking about cost. It's just EA moving money from one pocket to another. Anthem would get any DICE man-hours expended during development charged to its account, but that's it. Edit: honestly, I'm not convinced that Frostbite is good enough to sell outside of the EA captive market.
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Post by dropzofcrimzon on Feb 26, 2019 17:05:05 GMT
uhm...to their defense....a dev reacted in such a dumb way that I saw this coming. Then again I can see how this exclusivity deal can piss off a lot of people due to the fact the epic store is way subpar as I understand it Still very petty to review bomb a game (which I heard was pretty good.) because a dev said something you didn’t like. to their defense when the backlash started a dev took to Twitter and said "if you don't like it tough, don't buy it"....not smart
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We destroy them or they destroy us.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Origin: MasterDassJennir
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Post by bshep on Feb 26, 2019 17:20:45 GMT
uhm...to their defense....a dev reacted in such a dumb way that I saw this coming. Then again I can see how this exclusivity deal can piss off a lot of people due to the fact the epic store is way subpar as I understand it Still very petty to review bomb a game (which I heard was pretty good.) because a dev said something you didn’t like. It wasn't just one game (as if that wasn't enough childish behaviour). Some people are review bombing the previous games too.
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Post by Terminator Force on Feb 26, 2019 18:37:11 GMT
Some people are review bombing metro games just because the publisher changed online store. A studio trying something new is a field day. You guys that are upset about the reviews need to stop lumping together the review bombers - Not so much upset, more that folks love jumping to conclusions and that this could even result in possible lost enjoyment out of the game. As for someone who's 85 hours into the game and still very excited playing, why not try to convince others that maybe (just maybe) they too are missing out by buying into all this negativity?
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Post by smilesja on Feb 26, 2019 18:47:45 GMT
Some people are review bombing metro games just because the publisher changed online store. A studio trying something new is a field day. You guys that are upset about the reviews need to stop lumping together the review bombers - i.e. silly little children puting 0/10 in the User Review on Metacritic - with everyone else, i.e. professional reviewers from websites and people who go into in depth analysis on Youtube. There is probably a little overlap between the 0/10 dumbasses and the Youtube reviewers, but not much. I guarantee you SkillUp did not go put a 0/10 down. Neither did AngryJoe, or Sam from Ars Technica, or Ethan from Kotaku, on and on. The little angry children crowd - those are the "review bombers", and those are meaningless. Literally no body gives a fuck about their opinion. It is less than worthless. Anthem has scored a 4 to a 7 from reputable, professional, in-depth reviewers. That's not a review bomb. That is the state of the game at launch.
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Post by midnight tea on Feb 27, 2019 14:35:42 GMT
Valenten @valentenxMike im mainly worried about what EA might do if the game doesnt meet their sales expectations Since they so quickly dropped andromeda for not meeting expectations... Robert Gough @silentwraith87Me too especially since they projected 6 million over the first six week and retail wise it's sold half as many as MEA did and that was reported to be 1.3 million so at best that's just over 650,000 that's a lot of digital sales to make up over the next 5 weeks Michael Gamble @gamblemikedon't sweat this guys. seriously.
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∯ Interjector in Chief
Staff Mini-Profile Theme: Heimdall
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by Heimdall on Feb 27, 2019 14:55:43 GMT
Valenten @valentenxMike im mainly worried about what EA might do if the game doesnt meet their sales expectations Since they so quickly dropped andromeda for not meeting expectations... Robert Gough @silentwraith87Me too especially since they projected 6 million over the first six week and retail wise it's sold half as many as MEA did and that was reported to be 1.3 million so at best that's just over 650,000 that's a lot of digital sales to make up over the next 5 weeks Michael Gamble @gamblemikedon't sweat this guys. seriously. I can’t remember BioWare ever responding to this type of concern before and I don’t know what to think. :/ I can’t imagine they would comment at all if the sales situation were dire though.
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Post by midnight tea on Feb 27, 2019 15:08:50 GMT
Valenten @valentenxMike im mainly worried about what EA might do if the game doesnt meet their sales expectations Since they so quickly dropped andromeda for not meeting expectations... Robert Gough @silentwraith87Me too especially since they projected 6 million over the first six week and retail wise it's sold half as many as MEA did and that was reported to be 1.3 million so at best that's just over 650,000 that's a lot of digital sales to make up over the next 5 weeks Michael Gamble @gamblemikedon't sweat this guys. seriously. I can’t remember BioWare ever responding to this type of concern before and I don’t know what to think. :/ I can’t imagine they would comment at all if the sales situation were dire though. People make too big a deal out of partial sales from one country in day and age in which physical sales become more and more irrelevant. But there's enough of the negative crowd ready to bring up BW Montreal or Visceral to have people worried. Doomsaying will recede a bit in coming months, but I don't think it will disappear until Anthem settles on the market in a year or so and then we'd have DA release and whatever future plans BW may have.
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Post by decafhigh on Feb 27, 2019 15:29:44 GMT
People make too big a deal out of partial sales from one country in day and age in which physical sales become more and more irrelevant. If we were talking 5, 10, even just 20 percent of a sales dip, sure that might be accounted for by people increasingly moving to digital platforms. When you are talking about half the sales of a game barely 2 years old, no there is more, a lot more, going on there than just the gradual slide of people away from physical boxes. Don't forget Westwood, Pandemic, Mythic, Bullfrog, Origin, Danger Close/Dreamworks, Black Box, and I'm sure a list of smaller studios I don't remember off the top of my head. I'd say history has enough examples to at least cause a bit of concern.
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Post by samhain444 on Feb 27, 2019 15:35:37 GMT
Just a quick look at Amazon:
Anthem: PS4 Digital - #1, PS4 LOD Digital #4, #2 on PC
I'm sure it is selling fine through Origin, Best Buy, GameStop, Target, WalMart, etc
It's a "teen rated" Iron Man game you can play with friends. My daughter was already playing it this past weekend with her classmates.
Based on the type of game it is, they are likely most concerned about continuing to build a steady steam of users and keeping the players they have hooked and engaged
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Post by samhain444 on Feb 27, 2019 15:38:32 GMT
People make too big a deal out of partial sales from one country in day and age in which physical sales become more and more irrelevant. If we were talking 5, 10, even just 20 percent of a sales dip, sure that might be accounted for by people increasingly moving to digital platforms. When you are talking about half the sales of a game barely 2 years old, no there is more, a lot more, going on there than just the gradual slide of people away from physical boxes. Again, "Mass Effect Andromeda" was released on a Tuesday while "Anthem" was released on a Friday...and it was still the top seller for that week. Given three extra days, are we surprised ME:A (which made money, by the way, and was highly anticipated) sold more it's "first week"?
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Post by apollexander on Feb 27, 2019 15:41:57 GMT
Valenten @valentenxMike im mainly worried about what EA might do if the game doesnt meet their sales expectations Since they so quickly dropped andromeda for not meeting expectations... Robert Gough @silentwraith87Me too especially since they projected 6 million over the first six week and retail wise it's sold half as many as MEA did and that was reported to be 1.3 million so at best that's just over 650,000 that's a lot of digital sales to make up over the next 5 weeks Michael Gamble @gamblemikedon't sweat this guys. seriously. I can’t remember BioWare ever responding to this type of concern before and I don’t know what to think. :/ I can’t imagine they would comment at all if the sales situation were dire though. If I remember correctly, they responded that kind of concern after DAI's launch. They said something like 'DAI is selling good and we are satisfied'.
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Post by cypherj on Feb 27, 2019 16:11:20 GMT
Valenten @valentenxMike im mainly worried about what EA might do if the game doesnt meet their sales expectations Since they so quickly dropped andromeda for not meeting expectations... Robert Gough @silentwraith87Me too especially since they projected 6 million over the first six week and retail wise it's sold half as many as MEA did and that was reported to be 1.3 million so at best that's just over 650,000 that's a lot of digital sales to make up over the next 5 weeks Michael Gamble @gamblemikedon't sweat this guys. seriously. I can’t remember BioWare ever responding to this type of concern before and I don’t know what to think. :/ I can’t imagine they would comment at all if the sales situation were dire though.
I'm shocked they responded as well. But people need to realize that Anthem and Andromeda are two totally different situations. Andromeda was never meant to be a source of recurring revenue for years, while Anthem is. Anthem could only sell three million of the initial six they anticipated and they wouldn't pull the plug on the game. They'd overhaul it before they pulled the plug if the cost benefit was there. Where in the case of Andromeda, sinking more money into it would have produced and entirely different cost benefit analysis.
But I don't think Andromeda was doomed by the initial sales, I think it was doomed by the ensuing months sales and the remaining player base when it came time to release additional content. That is going to be the issue for this Anthem as well. How many people will still be playing or will come back once they start rolling out the new content. Obviously they'll have more patience and be willing to put more resources into making changes or overhauling it completely in the case of Anthem.
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Post by degs29 on Feb 27, 2019 16:35:46 GMT
Valenten @valentenxMike im mainly worried about what EA might do if the game doesnt meet their sales expectations Since they so quickly dropped andromeda for not meeting expectations... Robert Gough @silentwraith87Me too especially since they projected 6 million over the first six week and retail wise it's sold half as many as MEA did and that was reported to be 1.3 million so at best that's just over 650,000 that's a lot of digital sales to make up over the next 5 weeks Michael Gamble @gamblemikedon't sweat this guys. seriously. Pretty sure Michael Gamble has been telling us not to sweat it for years. He just phrases it differently each time. In those years, I've never seen a reason NOT to sweat it.
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We destroy them or they destroy us.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Origin: MasterDassJennir
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Post by bshep on Feb 27, 2019 16:59:45 GMT
Now that is simply not true degs29. And that is how baseless rumors start. This guy seems to be pretty much supposing that UK disk sales correspond to the physical sales of the whole world.
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Post by majesticjazz on Feb 27, 2019 17:29:17 GMT
What people tend to forget is that we WEREN'T supposed to be having this conversation. The excuse with MEA was 3 things:
1) It had a rocky development 2) It was the B team 3) Bioware didnt have the passion for another ME, especially after ME3.
With Anthem:
1) It had a solid 6 years development 2) It was the A team 3) This was a game they wanted to make and had lots of passion behind it.
People, Anthem is the worse reviewed Bioware and will probably fail to make EA's INITIAL sales projections. You can move the goal post all you want but 2 years ago when everyone was dogging MEA, "Dylan" at the time was supposed to show that Bioware is still a quality developer and that "Dylan" was supposed to change the conversation. Two years later....we are YET again in the aftermath of CONSECUTIVE Bioware failures.
So what is the excuse now? Are we now talking about review bombing?
So you're saying major media outlets like IGN, Giant Bomb, Gamespot, Polygon etc all conluded together to review bomb Anthem? Is this the excuse we are going with now?
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Post by midnight tea on Feb 27, 2019 18:02:39 GMT
I can’t remember BioWare ever responding to this type of concern before and I don’t know what to think. :/ I can’t imagine they would comment at all if the sales situation were dire though. If I remember correctly, they responded that kind of concern after DAI's launch. They said something like 'DAI is selling good and we are satisfied'. And that was the most successful BW game to date. It only shows under what scrutiny Bioware is. Almost everything that can be used against their games will be used and - unsurprisingly, sadly - will be used with even more force against the title that is different from their usual fare.
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Post by alanc9 on Feb 27, 2019 18:03:38 GMT
But I don't think Andromeda was doomed by the initial sales, I think it was doomed by the ensuing months sales and the remaining player base when it came time to release additional content. That is going to be the issue for this Anthem as well. How many people will still be playing or will come back once they start rolling out the new content. Obviously they'll have more patience and be willing to put more resources into making changes or overhauling it completely in the case of Anthem. Agreed. Tracking data probably showed that ME:A players weren't sticking around while ME3 players, for all their whining, were. The real threat to Anthem are the guys who picked up Premier, played through Anthem, and decided to drop both Premier and Anthem since the game didn't offer them enough value to stick around, and the guys who paid full price but ended up in the same place. Are there a lot of them? Beats me. A bunch of them are around here, but this is all anecdotal since we don't have access to the real data.
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Post by Pounce de León on Feb 27, 2019 18:05:49 GMT
uhm...to their defense....a dev reacted in such a dumb way that I saw this coming. Then again I can see how this exclusivity deal can piss off a lot of people due to the fact the epic store is way subpar as I understand it Still very petty to review bomb a game (which I heard was pretty good.) because a dev said something you didn’t like. It's rather because of Epic store deal I think. Dont worry, I heard it got review-hyped on Steam instead.
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Post by smilesja on Feb 27, 2019 18:08:19 GMT
So you're saying major media outlets like IGN, Giant Bomb, Gamespot, Polygon etc all conluded together to review bomb Anthem? Is this the excuse we are going with now? Who is saying that? Who's using review bombing as an excuse to defend Anthem?
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Post by samhain444 on Feb 27, 2019 18:11:30 GMT
What people tend to forget is that we WEREN'T supposed to be having this conversation. The excuse with MEA was 3 things: 1) It had a rocky development 2) It was the B team 3) Bioware didnt have the passion for another ME, especially after ME3. With Anthem: 1) It had a solid 6 years development 2) It was the A team 3) This was a game they wanted to make and had lots of passion behind it. People, Anthem is the worse reviewed Bioware and will probably fail to make EA's INITIAL sales projections. You can move the goal post all you want but 2 years ago when everyone was dogging MEA, "Dylan" at the time was supposed to show that Bioware is still a quality developer and that "Dylan" was supposed to change the conversation. Two years later....we are YET again in the aftermath of CONSECUTIVE Bioware failures. So what is the excuse now? Are we now talking about review bombing? So you're saying major media outlets like IGN, Giant Bomb, Gamespot, Polygon etc all conluded together to review bomb Anthem? Is this the excuse we are going with now? You OK, buddy?
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Post by alanc9 on Feb 27, 2019 18:12:07 GMT
People, Anthem is the worse reviewed Bioware and will probably fail to make EA's INITIAL sales projections. You can move the goal post all you want but 2 years ago when everyone was dogging MEA, "Dylan" at the time was supposed to show that Bioware is still a quality developer and that "Dylan" was supposed to change the conversation. Two years later....we are YET again in the aftermath of CONSECUTIVE Bioware failures. Wait a second. I thought we were discussing where the goal posts really are, not trying to move them. Review scores are just something we use to make guesses about the fate of the game. Jurassic World: Fallen Kingdom had mediocre Metacritic scores, but when a picture makes $400 million nobody gives a damn. Edit: just to put my own marker down. I thought ME:A was merely OK, based on my ten hours. I'll play it again, someday. Maybe I'll wait for it to show up on Basic or a deep discount. But my personal score has more to do with my indifference to the genre rather than the particular implementation; for instance, my impression is that the loot isn't good, but I don't think that getting this right would have made me like the game all that much more. (Which doesn't mean that it isn't a serious design flaw for people who do like the genre.)
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Post by linksocarina on Feb 27, 2019 18:12:17 GMT
But I don't think Andromeda was doomed by the initial sales, I think it was doomed by the ensuing months sales and the remaining player base when it came time to release additional content. That is going to be the issue for this Anthem as well. How many people will still be playing or will come back once they start rolling out the new content. Obviously they'll have more patience and be willing to put more resources into making changes or overhauling it completely in the case of Anthem. Agreed. Tracking data probably showed that ME:A players weren't sticking around while ME3 players, for all their whining, were. The real threat to Anthem are the guys who picked up Premier, played through Anthem, and decided to drop both Premier and Anthem since the game didn't offer them enough value to stick around, and the guys who paid full price but ended up in the same place. Are there a lot of them? Beats me. A bunch of them are around here, but this is all anecdotal since we don't have access to the real data. And then 3 months from now after the first content act is completed we shall see if that's the case. For the short term the game will be fine at least. We will need overall numbers to maybe gauge any issues going forward.
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Post by cypherj on Feb 27, 2019 18:14:47 GMT
But I don't think Andromeda was doomed by the initial sales, I think it was doomed by the ensuing months sales and the remaining player base when it came time to release additional content. That is going to be the issue for this Anthem as well. How many people will still be playing or will come back once they start rolling out the new content. Obviously they'll have more patience and be willing to put more resources into making changes or overhauling it completely in the case of Anthem. Agreed. Tracking data probably showed that ME:A players weren't sticking around while ME3 players, for all their whining, were. The real threat to Anthem are the guys who picked up Premier, played through Anthem, and decided to drop both Premier and Anthem since the game didn't offer them enough value to stick around, and the guys who paid full price but ended up in the same place. Are there a lot of them? Beats me. A bunch of them are around here, but this is all anecdotal since we don't have access to the real data.
I'm curious as to how they track the premier revenue in regard to Anthem. I already had Premier, so they didn't get any additional revenue from me for this game. I'm sure a lot of people bought it for one month and then cancelled, or are going to cancel. On the other side of it though, if someone bought the subscription for Anthem and don't end up playing anything else they make money there. I'm curious as to how they forecast that.
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