helios969
N4
Kamisama
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR
Origin: helios969
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR
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Post by helios969 on May 1, 2019 10:34:16 GMT
~20 hours critical path/focused narrative that truly provides me the ability to RP in multiple meaningful ways with different tones/crafted personalities, choices and consequences that impact the resolution in some meaningful way along with solid combat mechanics and enemy encounters. They can keep the 80 hours of boring filler. That formula would give Bioware a much needed win. I no longer have faith they're capable of producing such a product though.
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Post by AnDromedary on May 2, 2019 18:30:14 GMT
I usually play crit path stuff distributed throughout the entire game (hate having side quests left when finishing the crit path), so I'll say that the entire thing should be around 40 hours. Most games, the story of which I like take about that time for me (I am a fairly slow player though). In shorter campaigns, I often don't quite feel like I got to know the characters as well as I'd have liked.
If it's longer, than it usually is because there is so much fluff in the game that it just takes longer to grind through fairly useless stuff, so it's better to cut that out, maybe make a smaller world, and instead spend dev time and resources on quality story-heavy content. When devs do this, they usually end up with 30 to 40 hour games.
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Post by colfoley on May 2, 2019 22:38:34 GMT
So to avoid any confusion I figure I might need to have a little clarification.
While the actual times may vary on what is what I think ideally the base game for DA 4 should be around 80 hours. This seems to be a good middle ground because games longer then this tends to become a bit too filler.
I'm defining the critical path for a bioware game as:
The main story. All the companion content.
This will make up roughly half of the game.
The other half will be EVERYTHING else. The side questing, exploring, crafting, mini games, puzzles, random filler. The proviso of course that most of this is still high quality and can be used to actually flesh things out or have interesting moral conundrums of their own.
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Polka Dot
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by Polka Dot on May 4, 2019 18:01:20 GMT
^^ I consider critical path to be only the things required to advance the main storyline - which can be done pretty well in ~ 10-20 hours.
Companion content is certainly an important part of BioWare's games, but most of it is not critical path. Some followers are entirely optional, as are their associated loyalty missions, conversations, and any relationship-building or romance.
Aside from companion content, I also really appreciate side content that: -- Fleshes out the world and demonstrates the current world state -- Acknowledges previous choices (in that game or an imported world state) -- Provides unique role-playing opportunities
I enjoy open world (up to a point) and can be pretty creative in coming up with reasons for my character to be out doing some of these things - but there's a limit, and DAI went a little too far for my tastes. I can justify the Inquisitor taking out potential threats, closing rifts, even acquiring some crafting materials to better equip the team, but... platforming to collect items of unknown value or purpose, not so much. It's especially difficult when the storyline places some degree of urgency on the PC's mission (ala ME1's race against time).
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Energizer Bunny 211
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Mass Effect Andromeda, Anthem
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Post by Energizer Bunny 211 on May 5, 2019 20:15:50 GMT
My personal preference for the Main Story (aka 'critical path') would be anywhere from 40 to 60 (like KOTOR I and II) and adding anywhere from 15 to an additional 25 hours in truly engaging, important and meaningful side-quests that actually have an impact (I hate grinding in these ridiculously huge open worlds, traversing empty expanses for over an hour....just to pick up some trinket for some poor schmuck whose wife died. And what is my reward for my time and effort....? 20 Gold, or something equally worthless and wasteful depending on the genre).
No, I much prefer the linear path of the ME OT; each world map, each 'sandbox' area was fairly large with room to navigate, but the destination was clear and the goal was certain: To get *here* do A, B and C.....then cross the *Finish Line* (I'm thinking of Purgatory where we found Jack in ME 2 as a good example, or even Liam's Loyaty Mission in Andromeda. I always enjoyed that one.). And sure, you could make the individual map area large and inviting enough to be moderately "explore-able"....., but I like to be able to see the path to my clear objective, instead and wandering around for seemingly endless hours wondering if I have enough of *object x* to go back and retrace my steps across the great void only to resume the path that I should have been on (Inquisition, Andromeda). Please use whatever space you create wisely and effectively.
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Finished Dissertation long ago lol. Now happily employed :D
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by biggydx on May 6, 2019 1:14:51 GMT
My personal preference for the Main Story (aka 'critical path') would be anywhere from 40 to 60 (like KOTOR I and II) and adding anywhere from 15 to an additional 25 hours in truly engaging, important and meaningful side-quests that actually have an impact (I hate grinding in these ridiculously huge open worlds, traversing empty expanses for over an hour....just to pick up some trinket for some poor schmuck whose wife died. And what is my reward for my time and effort....? 20 Gold, or something equally worthless and wasteful depending on the genre). No, I much prefer the linear path of the ME OT; each world map, each 'sandbox' area was fairly large with room to navigate, but the destination was clear and the goal was certain: To get *here* do A, B and C.....then cross the *Finish Line* (I'm thinking of Purgatory where we found Jack in ME 2 as a good example, or even Liam's Loyaty Mission in Andromeda. I always enjoyed that one.). And sure, you could make the individual map area large and inviting enough to be moderately "explore-able"....., but I like to be able to see the path to my clear objective, instead and wandering around for seemingly endless hours wondering if I have enough of *object x* to go back and retrace my steps across the great void only to resume the path that I should have been on (Inquisition, Andromeda). Please use whatever space you create wisely and effectively. I could definitely get down with having more confined, hub-like areas, so long as the impacts you can have on them are much more stark. I'd also imagine that they'd to ensure there's multiple places for you to go. I'm sure there would be complaints about the world not feeling seamless (i.e. a contiguous open-world), but if the game can hide the loading screens, and making these confined areas bolsters the narrative, I don't believe it would be that strong of an issue.
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Felya87
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by Felya87 on May 7, 2019 9:47:34 GMT
I'm somewhat undecided. I guess between 30-40 hours for the main game, that can became more with sidequests and exploration, would be my favourite lenght. But I would be more than ok with more, surely not with less.
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Pounce de León
Praise the Justicat!
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Post by Pounce de León on May 7, 2019 12:22:54 GMT
I'd be more concerned about the qualitynof the credible path.
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https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Ftse1.mm.bing.net%2Fth%3Fid%3DOIP.hVm-5wNStlyTEXjhwDoa_wHaEK%26pid%3DApi&f=1&ipt=8f745a5f30b08f8231ddb64664df7375d23cc10878aa50d66fec54e9d570c7e2&ipo=images
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by Sartoz on May 7, 2019 13:49:46 GMT
For a completionist 80+ hours. For the critical path about 20-25 hrs.
On the other hand, this being a MP + live-service game I expect a much lower story length. Crit path at 10hrs if we are lucky and no romance. I base this on my feeling that the RPG element is an add-on and not a core design.
I will be a very happy person if I'm wrong.
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michaeln7
N3
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by michaeln7 on May 7, 2019 15:05:27 GMT
I did a speedrun of DA:I in 22 hours, to see the "Solasmancer" arc everyone was gushing about.
It's worth noting that I had to get enough "Power" (by floofing around) to unlock the next main quest, but it didn't feel like empty filler.
But KOTOR II took me a good 40+ hours... I did EVERYTHING, and I was engaged the whole time.
Whereas a speedrun of ME3 took me less than 5 hours, but a "full" run took about 40 hours.
To make a long story short, I need to be engaged in the story for it to matter.
The biggest frack-up is arbitrary-gated progress, which makes trying a new path in DA:I so painful. I can't just rush through to see the parts I "missed".
I suppose I'm being too picky, so I'll say my vote is 50+ hours ideally, but 30-40 hours looks more feasible to me.
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michaeln7
N3
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by michaeln7 on May 7, 2019 15:17:45 GMT
As cool as a 100+ hour main campaign would be, that's a tall order to expect the developers to handle, and I run the risk of burnout.
If it takes me THAT long to finish the main game, trying a different run is a daunting task.
I would also add that my favorite sidequests are ones that have their own plotlines, i.e. Bloody Baron from Witcher 3. It plays out like it's own game.
But even stuff like collectables can be engaging for me if it's stuff like "Collect 20 X-Power Cells" which leads to my shield-dome over my base holding rather than breaking in the cutscene.
Basically if the collect-a-thons and kill-generic-bear-a-thons have a payoff in the "endgame" beyond basic loot, it's a win for me.
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