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Post by colfoley on Aug 8, 2019 18:39:10 GMT
if anything viv fits that mold more. In what way? I only used Sera specifically as the other poster mentioned Sera. And I was a bit miffed that anyone would think Sera was self hating, as if it was an active decision that she stuck with. She's young and angry and is in a society that is telling her to be ashamed. Because she's young, it gets to her a little bit but it makes her angry and she wants to prove the world wrong. I relate to that and I didn't have to be a POC even though I guess I technically am. She's a great character. Viv doesn't really like mages. I suppose it's more self fear then self hate, but it's kinda there...at least more so then Sera. Hell you can also put Blackwall on that list.
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Post by phoray on Aug 8, 2019 18:45:15 GMT
Viv doesn't really like mages. I suppose it's more self fear then self hate, but it's kinda there...at least more so then Sera. Hell you can also put Blackwall on that list. Viv is very aware that she is dangerous because she is in a world where there is a veil, your thoughts and emotions can be reality, and dreams aren't just dreams. Yes, there are people in Thedas that actively fear mages and would wield pitchforks to murder them if something went astray, but that concern stops being one pretty much as soon as you're tower trained. She's modified her world through humungous efforts on her own behalf to make sure such concerns don't apply to her. She's advising queens-- people are not actively hating her and telling her to be ashamed. Blackwall hates the person he was that got him into kid killing. It has nothing to do with what he was born as, I recall he makes no mention of disliking orlesians or that he is one
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Post by Deleted on Aug 8, 2019 18:46:27 GMT
if anything viv fits that mold more. In what way? I only used Sera specifically as the other poster mentioned Sera. And I was a bit miffed that anyone would think Sera was self hating, as if it was an active decision that she stuck with. She's young and angry and is in a society that is telling her to be ashamed. Because she's young, it gets to her a little bit but it makes her angry and she wants to prove the world wrong. I relate to that and I didn't have to be a POC even though I guess I technically am. She's a great character. The article mentioned Sera and her storyline, specifically, not all elves. Just because you interpret it a different way does not mean that is not how it was meant to be written. It is an internalized racism storyline. Go on any other thread where people are talking about it and that is what it will be called. Society is telling her to be ashamed because of her race. The Dalish made her feel ashamed for not being her race "enough". You cannot just end it at "she is made to feel ashamed".
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Post by phoray on Aug 8, 2019 18:48:28 GMT
it was meant to be written. Tweet quote from Bioware that says Sera has internalized racism and hates herself because she's an elf? Also, I'm arguing she gets such a message and she rejects it.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 8, 2019 18:57:08 GMT
it was meant to be written. Tweet quote from Bioware that says Sera has internalized racism and hates herself because she's an elf? Also, I'm arguing she gets such a message and she rejects it. Sure she does reject it. She still struggles with it and the way it made her feel and how it is the reason she does not want to be seen as an elf, and she tells you as much.
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Post by phoray on Aug 8, 2019 19:07:45 GMT
Tweet quote from Bioware that says Sera has internalized racism and hates herself because she's an elf? Also, I'm arguing she gets such a message and she rejects it. Sure she does reject it. She still struggles with it and the way it made her feel and how it is the reason she does not want to be seen as an elf, and she tells you as much. Because she wants to be seen as a PEOPLE. The fact that people tell her to be ashamed of her race, she moves beyond that like a boss and decides to reject race as a motivating factor. Everyone should be see as a people, she's a people, and "you're an arsehole idiot for even bringing up she's an elf." Instead of something actually important. That's the message she's going with. Ya, she's still a little sore about folks being arseholes, but I'm not pidgeonholing her for her emotional reaction.
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Post by The Elder King on Aug 8, 2019 19:33:40 GMT
Hmm... I do agree that she (?) the-author-of-that-article is overdoing it bit, but generally speaking, perspective still helps. I'm personally often at a loss since DAI regarding Andrastianism, as I was raised without any religious background and mostly got negative impressions from Christianity and then we have what is essentially a fantasy knockoff (Andrastianism) getting the majority of the screentime and I wonder why writers tend to give that particular faith all this screentime and players apparently cutting it more slack when it comes to evaluating andrastian "deeds" vs. those of other groups. On the other hand, I cannot quite understand why some think that the majority of DA players roll human characters. Basic DA humans (i.e. mostly Andrastians) are rather boring in my view and I honestly cannot play them well, as I neither can play andrastian believers well, nor do I want to. My main issue with DAI is that one part of the game features a lot of chantry stuff cut for human charcters (Why should a non-human be concerned about uphold/restoring an organisation with big racial bias rooted in their teachings?), while the late game -WPHW/Trespasser- deals mostly with elven stuff that 95% of DA humans might not care about or want to burn because it is "heathen heretic infidel shit at fault for the Maker's absence". Or something like that. In their original idea, Inquisition was going to have Hawke as a protagonist, and even after they scrapped the idea, they planned a human only Inquisitor. That is something everyone that was in the legacy forum at the time (two years before release, a year before The Fires Above trailer and the later Game Informer coverage), as Laidlaw posted a blog where he talked about it. I think it was between September-November of 2012. The race selection for the protagonist was announced the summer of 2013. The decision was taken late in development, so there was no way to reshape the plot for not being so obvious human/Chantry-related. I think it’ll be bigger, but not that much bigger then what happened with Hawke. That news hit the forums hard. Literally nobody was expecting it. In regards of the recent tweets, I’d actually like if they decide to not reveal the LI in the game, but I don’t think they’ll actually do it.
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Post by SwobyJ on Aug 9, 2019 15:42:14 GMT
It's irrelevant. They are all humans with different skin tones. The things they have to overcome have nothing to do with their skin tones. Dorian didn't have to be written by an Indian Gay Man specifically with daddy issues to be a Tevinter Gay man with Daddy issues. Vivian didn't have to be written by a African Straight Woman Side Piece with heavy anxiety about losing their self control to be a Rivaini Straight woman Side piece with heavy anxiety about losing their self control. It's ridiculous to put all the requirements on who's allowed to be a writer of such and such character. If we carried this retroactively, literally every Great Novel would come under scrutiny. Huckleberry Finn didn't actually exist. Did his writer ever even strap together wood to make a raft himself? I mean, how dare he write about two poor white boys in a backward town when he's obviously a well off rich man? The woman who wrote "To kill a mockingbird." isn't even a male lawyer ! No one said they had to be written by people exactly like them. Just that people like them can provide needed perspective, nuance, and better writing. Dorian's personal quest would not have been as real and well written if it had been written by someone straight. I think it was one of the worse (not worst) written parts of the game and I'm gay. I think it had interesting and valuable aspects, but I wouldn't call it a particularly well written sequence, nor gay-themed cotent. I liked several other personal quests more than it. I do think it was one of the better gay-exclusive material from Bioware, but I actually don't think they're the best media with this (among the best gaming media, but not media). I've been more compelled by media written by straight people about gay topics than at least some media written by gay people. For example, some anime is downright heartmelting/breaking.
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Post by alanc9 on Aug 9, 2019 20:30:22 GMT
A more sensible version of this proposition would be about avoiding gaffes. Someone who isn't personally familiar with an experience may end up blundering into causing a reaction that he didn't want, like that DAI subplot which came across as kinda rapey. It's OK for the writer not to have personal experience, as long as there's someone in the room who can say " um... this is coming across a bit like rape. Is that where you were planning to go with this?"
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Post by pessimistpanda on Aug 10, 2019 6:08:14 GMT
No one said they had to be written by people exactly like them. Just that people like them can provide needed perspective, nuance, and better writing. Dorian's personal quest would not have been as real and well written if it had been written by someone straight. I think it was one of the worse (not worst) written parts of the game and I'm gay. I think it had interesting and valuable aspects, but I wouldn't call it a particularly well written sequence, nor gay-themed cotent. I liked several other personal quests more than it. I do think it was one of the better gay-exclusive material from Bioware, but I actually don't think they're the best media with this (among the best gaming media, but not media). I've been more compelled by media written by straight people about gay topics than at least some media written by gay people. For example, some anime is downright heartmelting/breaking. Speaking as a fellow GHEY, it's easy to be the 'best' when you're the only one competing, yet even so I find BioWare's depiction of gay characters and issues to be woefully narrow, lazy and hamfisted. The fact that it was a personal story for David Gaider is irrelevant. Journal on your own time. I'm not obligated to like everything that other gay men produce. In fact, all the other gay guys I know were offended. I only ever see straight people praising it, and I reckon it's because the game bends over backwards to drum up sympathy for Dorian's garbage father.
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Post by pessimistpanda on Aug 10, 2019 6:20:41 GMT
A more sensible version of this proposition would be about avoiding gaffes. Someone who isn't personally familiar with an experience may end up blundering into causing a reaction that he didn't want, like that DAI subplot which came across as kinda rapey. It's OK for the writer not to have personal experience, as long as there's someone in the room who can say " um... this is coming across a bit like rape. Is that where you were planning to go with this?" That's not a great example. All adults should be able to tell the difference between consensual and non-consensual situations. But regardless, the problem is not a lack of personal experience. David Gaider has personal experience being gay, and Dorian still sucked. The problem is they think they're pioneering champions, when what they're actually peddling are irrelevant single-issue mouthpieces that have been outdated since fucking Will and Grace.
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Post by pessimistpanda on Aug 10, 2019 7:02:56 GMT
Also, the article is calling for the game to thoroughly examine and engage with the reality of racism and oppression. That's not "sanitization".
Santization is what we have NOW, where Dragon Age and all other games conspicuously AVOID any genuine realistic depiction of consequences, because they wouldn't want to deprive their fragile white audience of the fun of "playing evil".
OP is not afraid that Dragon Age might cease to be confronting. He's worried it might start.
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Post by gervaise21 on Aug 10, 2019 10:56:37 GMT
Santization is what we have NOW, where Dragon Age and all other games conspicuously AVOID any genuine realistic depiction of consequences, because they wouldn't want to deprive their fragile white audience of the fun of "playing evil". This is what the writer of the article stated: "This is why when another Kotaku article reported that a Dragon Age project set in Tevinter—the slave trade capital of Thedas—was scrapped, I didn’t share in the disappointment that bubbled throughout fandom. Quite frankly, I was relieved. I unfortunately don’t see BioWare being able to craft a story taking place in Tevinter in a way that won’t be chock full of obliviousness, microaggressions, and straight up triggers for Black players." Now I was under the impression that the original plot-line of working as an uncover agent in Tevinter was the one which was abandoned, not the setting in Tevinter itself. So if the author of the article is correct, then apparently the Tevinter setting has been scrapped. However, I think they have must misunderstood the Kotaku article and we will still be travelling to Tevinter in DA4. The author seems to think that Bioware's handling of this nation and its culture is going to upset black players in particular because of the fact that slavery is an integral part of it. I would suggest that they just do not play Dragon Age if the mere existence of slavery is going to be a trigger. The author also seem to think that to write about such a setting and appreciate the sensitivities of players about the issues, you need to be from such background. From the beginning Tevinter is known to have a culture that allows slavery and in fact probably relies on it to function. Tevinter is based on Ancient Rome where the system worked somewhat differently to that of the American era. To write about it effectively really requires a study of Ancient Rome. To understand how such a system can be abused and why people who were once part of it (the elves) might be particularly sensitive to the issue, does actually just require empathy. People who do not feel this probably do not play elves. Back in DAO the issue of slavery came to the fore when we discovered that a Tevinter slave trader was being allowed to operate in the Ferelden alienage. I was appalled, particularly because I was playing an elf, but I was no different when I played another race. I always ended up refusing to let him have the elves and so having to kill him. There were issues there that did mirror the African slave trade; there were elves actually helping the slave trader who felt no guilt about doing so but ultimately it was a matter of whether your character was willing to sell out the alienage elves for a small benefit to themselves or not. That was the nature of the game back then and there were other similar choices where, beyond the disapproval of certain companions, you could make these without dire consequences for your character. That is because Thedas was a harsh, brutal world, where doing the "right thing" may not be rewarded and may actually not work out as you would like for a perfect ending. Now I don't like playing evil characters so when faced with such choices I am always likely to opt for what to me is the good path but if the option to do the evil one is removed, then that is sanitising the game. Now I felt that Dorian's apology for slavery did ring true to someone of his background. To my elven sensibilities, his words sounded patronising but where I felt the writing was lacking was in always giving him the final say on the matter and then never being able to raise it again. It also conveniently ignored the darker side of owning another person and having absolute power of them which you could have confronted him with. However, that was also true of the Chevaliers and their treatment of those of lower rank than themselves. That was something that was raised in DAO but never mentioned in DAI. Would this have been any different with a person with such a background in real life writing the conversations? That depends on whether you think it should have been made a major issue in DAI. To deal with the subject properly would have required far greater use of time than they wished to give to it. When it comes to DA4, if it is set in Tevinter, then I would hope they would give enough time to exploring the issues and not be afraid to show its darker aspects because that is the nature of the setting. Should that also extend to allowing players to condone the culture and exploit slaves if they wish? Well, if that is in the context of the story, then yes, because that is the universe in which the character is operating. Should that require a person with such a cultural background in the real world writing the plotline to give it greater nuance? Surely it just requires a good writer, with a thorough knowledge of the setting, and a robust peer review system? If Bioware starts selecting its writing team on the basis of their race, sexuality or cultural background, then that is not the same thing.
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Post by pessimistpanda on Aug 10, 2019 14:45:57 GMT
Santization is what we have NOW, where Dragon Age and all other games conspicuously AVOID any genuine realistic depiction of consequences, because they wouldn't want to deprive their fragile white audience of the fun of "playing evil". This is what the writer of the article stated: "This is why when another Kotaku article reported that a Dragon Age project set in Tevinter—the slave trade capital of Thedas—was scrapped, I didn’t share in the disappointment that bubbled throughout fandom. Quite frankly, I was relieved. I unfortunately don’t see BioWare being able to craft a story taking place in Tevinter in a way that won’t be chock full of obliviousness, microaggressions, and straight up triggers for Black players." Now I was under the impression that the original plot-line of working as an uncover agent in Tevinter was the one which was abandoned, not the setting in Tevinter itself. So if the author of the article is correct, then apparently the Tevinter setting has been scrapped. However, I think they have must misunderstood the Kotaku article and we will still be travelling to Tevinter in DA4. The author seems to think that Bioware's handling of this nation and its culture is going to upset black players in particular because of the fact that slavery is an integral part of it. I would suggest that they just do not play Dragon Age if the mere existence of slavery is going to be a trigger. The author also seem to think that to write about such a setting and appreciate the sensitivities of players about the issues, you need to be from such background. I'm going to show you the same courtesy you showed the author of the article and stop reading right here, in order to wildly extrapolate arguments based on what I assume your position is. I mean, if you're going to fundamentally misunderstand (or be flat-out dishonest about?) what someone is saying, it's probably best not to quote the article directly and show off how incredibly wrong you are. It's no surprise people are so upset about the mere suggestion that Dragon Age could add more nuance. Clearly none of you understand what nuance actually is, because you don't recognise it in the article. The author expressed relief that BioWare would not be handling the issue of slavery, because she thinks they would do a bad job. That does not mean she wants it to be avoided entirely. Ideally, she would like it to be handled well. She says as much, and the entire rest of the article is about how she thinks that can be achieved! Hell, it's in the title! Her suggestion is to add black writers to the staff, because they can bring a personal perspective of what it's like to be oppressed, and the different ways that affects people internally, and how they act in response. She cites Vivienne as a character who she feels comes across as shallow and one-note, theoretically because the writers are unable to adequately tap into her psychology, due to a lack of personal experience with the oppression and trauma they inflict on their mage characters. Whether or not that is a good suggestion, I cannot say. She seems to believe that having "multiple queer writers" helped BioWare write about queer issues well. I don't think it did. I think the way they handled queer issues is as bad as the way she fears they will handle slavery (ie; it was so fucking terrible that it would be better if they'd never done it). Frankly, I'm not currently interested in the question of whether or not minority writers are better equipped to write about minority issues. I'm preoccupied by the fact that so many people in this thread decided that the article was asking for future DA games to be 'sanitized'. At no point does it say that. If anything it says the exact opposite, clearly asserting that having black writers will add "a level of authenticity". So most of the posters in here either 1)fundamentally misunderstand the article, 2) are lying about it, or 3) took OP's word without bothering to actually read it.
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Post by Doominike on Aug 10, 2019 16:29:16 GMT
I just hope they don't take the dark out of a dark setting because a bunch of asshats are scared of it. Having slavery in your setting at all isn't condoning it, even allowing the player to participate in it is not condonement if it's clearly depicted as an evil act.
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Post by gervaise21 on Aug 10, 2019 17:15:03 GMT
The author expressed relief that BioWare would not be handling the issue of slavery, because she thinks they would do a bad job. That does not mean she wants it to be avoided entirely. Ideally, she would like it to be handled well. She says as much, and the entire rest of the article is about how she thinks that can be achieved! Hell, it's in the title! Strangely enough I do appreciate what the writer was saying; the fact she is glad they will be avoiding the issue because she thinks they will handle it badly. Then they go on to suggest that in order to deal with it sufficiently to understand the mind-set of someone affected by slavery or oppression they would need to employ a black writer. You also missed my point that slavery and oppression are already issues in the Thedas setting. We have already dealt with them as the issues have been raised in DAO, DA2 and DAI. The city elf background in DAO had us experiencing directly what it is like to be an oppressed minority in Thedas. Fenris was an escape slave from Tevinter whose worldview had been coloured by his experiences there. It has also been brought up in more than one comic series and the background story for one of the characters we meet in DAI, Calpernia. The author never mentions these beyond the reference to DAO and then specific individuals in DAI. However, in view of their opinion about Bioware's ability to handle the issue, I assume they felt that all these instances were handled poorly. What I fail to understand is why a black writer would necessarily handle the issues any better. Just because you are from a certain background does not necessary mean you care about the issues and even if you do, it is not the same as actually living through it personally. Also there are many other ethnic backgrounds where people have a history of being oppressed. Not everybody from such a background has personally had to deal with oppression. Also, how someone deals with it in the real world does not equate to Thedas. A good writer researches their subject, if necessary talking with people or reading personal accounts of people who have had experiences that they have not personally. If every story, drama, film, could only be considered authentic if the person dealing with the subject matter was actually from that background, then a lot of good writers would be out of a job.
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Post by pessimistpanda on Aug 11, 2019 1:41:57 GMT
And a lot of other good writers might finally get opportunities, what's your point?
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Post by garrusfan1 on Aug 11, 2019 1:44:46 GMT
See this is when it gets ridiculous. First of all bioware is as woke as they can be. And yet people are complaining about it. Elves being discriminated against is done ALOT in other media in much the same way. Look I am a progressive but people need to pick their fights. Complaining about companies and people that go too far and are actively racist is one thing and they should be called on it. But bioware is incredibly PC in their games. The only real exception to this was that elf in DA2 that looked and seemed like a pretty elven women then speaks with a deep male voice and everyone has a "WTF" moment and the guy with her is embaressed. That is the only time I can remember them doing something that could reasonably be described as offensive to a minority community. It's a video game company people stop picking fights with everyone and everything when it is just ridiculous. There is enough real stuff to get mad at.
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Post by pessimistpanda on Aug 11, 2019 2:05:56 GMT
See this is when it gets ridiculous. First of all bioware is as woke as they can be. And yet people are complaining about it. Elves being discriminated against is done ALOT in other media. Look I am a progressive but people need to pick their fights. Complaining about companies and people that go too far and are actively racist is one thing and they should be called on it. But bioware is incredibly PC in their games. The only real exception to this was that elf in DA2 that looked and seemed like a pretty elven women then speaks with a deep male voice and everyone has a "WTF" moment and the guy with her is embaressed. That is the only time I can remember them doing something that could reasonably be described as offensive to a minority community. It's a video game company people stop picking fights with everyone and everything when it is just ridiculous. There is enough real stuff to get mad at. "I can be offended when other people aren't, but other people can't be offended if I'm not."
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Post by gervaise21 on Aug 11, 2019 7:24:45 GMT
And a lot of other good writers might finally get opportunities, what's your point? That people should be judged on merit. If a good writer has been prevented from plying their trade because of discrimination, that is wrong, but that is not what the author of that piece was complaining about. They seem to feel that Bioware's handling of issues would be better if they had deliberately recruited a person from a certain background to handle it regardless of their other qualifications. They also seemed to feel that only one ethnic background was appropriate when in fact there are many who could bring a personal insight to the table and which would not be the same. Each individual deals with their history in different ways and so their personal view on the matter might not be appropriate to the character Bioware were trying to portray. It could also be incongruous to the Thedas setting if someone is trying to pursue a real world agenda within it that is not consistent with the setting. That is the problem some people had with the Dorian personal quest and in fact DG admitted that initially the rest of the writing team objected to introducing it because homosexuality had not previously been an issue in Thedas, so DG justified it from the PoV that Dorian was out and proud about it and that was disapproved of in Tevinter. Interestingly, it side-stepped the issue that previously we were told what was the rule in Tevinter: "It is considered selfish and deviant behaviour among nobles, but actively encouraged with favoured slaves." That had been hinted at in the dialogue of Denarius about Fenris but is something that my elf would dearly have liked to confront Dorian with in his defence of slavery regardless of his sexuality. However, that is not because I am from a certain ethnic background, just happened to have taken note of such codices when playing the game and used it to inform the character I am playing.
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Post by midnight tea on Aug 11, 2019 18:46:50 GMT
And a lot of other good writers might finally get opportunities, what's your point? That people should be judged on merit. If a good writer has been prevented from plying their trade because of discrimination, that is wrong, but that is not what the author of that piece was complaining about. They seem to feel that Bioware's handling of issues would be better if they had deliberately recruited a person from a certain background to handle it regardless of their other qualifications. They also seemed to feel that only one ethnic background was appropriate when in fact there are many who could bring a personal insight to the table and which would not be the same. Each individual deals with their history in different ways and so their personal view on the matter might not be appropriate to the character Bioware were trying to portray. It could also be incongruous to the Thedas setting if someone is trying to pursue a real world agenda within it that is not consistent with the setting. That is the problem some people had with the Dorian personal quest and in fact DG admitted that initially the rest of the writing team objected to introducing it because homosexuality had not previously been an issue in Thedas, so DG justified it from the PoV that Dorian was out and proud about it and that was disapproved of in Tevinter. Interestingly, it side-stepped the issue that previously we were told what was the rule in Tevinter: "It is considered selfish and deviant behaviour among nobles, but actively encouraged with favoured slaves." That had been hinted at in the dialogue of Denarius about Fenris but is something that my elf would dearly have liked to confront Dorian with in his defence of slavery regardless of his sexuality. However, that is not because I am from a certain ethnic background, just happened to have taken note of such codices when playing the game and used it to inform the character I am playing. But... the writer doesn't mention much about lore or setting, but proper and nuanced depiction of slavery and what it does to people. This is a separate issue from whether something is consistent with the world. From author's perspective engaging members of LGBT has left a positive mark in writing LGBTQ characters into the game - so, they argue, similar thing would likely help when trying to portray such a difficult topic as slavery and what it could do to people. And while I do agree that each individual will filter things they encounter in media in their own way and so on... the group that still has to live with heaviest consequences of past featuring slavery are (aside from current human trafficking victims) the Black folks. Like... slavery existed in many different places, it's true. Heck, my neck of the woods was where Ottomans oftentimes sought slaves. But I can't think of a group of people who are so defined by their past as slaves, not necessarily because they want to be. If one studies history of what happened after slavery was abolished in US, how people were treated over years and how they are treated even now... that's just effed up. I'm sorry, but it just is. Nobody here really reminisces about how some of us were enslaved by Ottomans - I mean, aside from not all of our community being kidnapped and enslaved, that sh*t was centuries ago and whatever descendants of slaves were there appear have been pretty thoroughly absorbed into modern Turkish society. I don't think the same process happened in US - in part because it was easier to distinguish people based on skin color (Blacks, together with other PoC, are therefore probably more likely to be sensitive to portrayal of discrimination based on distinct features, like in case of modern Thedosian discrimination of elves), but in large part because America still hasn't properly dealt with its past IMO and segregation/discrimination is still a reality to many folks. One can see that especially in days like today. I'm therefore entirely not surprised that this is a sensitive issue for many folks and that their experience could help those of us who don't have to live with trauma of this kind to understand what it does to people or their descendants.
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Post by pessimistpanda on Aug 12, 2019 7:02:15 GMT
It is ridiculous to be concerned about "real world issues" seeping into Dragon Age. They are already there, and always have been. The setting and plot have always been informed by real world issues, the writers aren't subtle about it at all.
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Post by xerrai on Aug 12, 2019 16:47:47 GMT
It is ridiculous to be concerned about "real world issues" seeping into Dragon Age. They are already there, and always have been. The setting and plot have always been informed by real world issues, the writers aren't subtle about it at all. Couldn't the same be said for any fictional setting? Kinda hard to have a believable setting without touching upon real-world issues somehow. All fictional settings do is give them a different angle, a new spin or a new coat of paint. With a few original tid-bits here or there. Aliens, humans, elves, energy beings---most of them are easily connected to rl situations simply on account of how 'human' they act by default. Personality, culture, emotions, etc. Pseudo-humans, if you will. The closest we ever got to getting something "completely original" in that department is when we focus on a species that doesn't even begin to think/act like humans. Usually in the form of hive-minds or those who lack sense of self. But these are almost always enemies or the big bad of a story. And why wouldn't they be? There's nothing pseudo-human about them so there is little to no way to make them compelling unless it is to show how monstrous they are. There are a few exceptions, i'm sure. But point is most fictional settings have an underlying "human" element to them. And as such parallels to real life situations are a given.
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Post by linksocarina on Aug 12, 2019 16:54:08 GMT
Dorian's personal quest would not have been as real and well written if it had been written by someone straight. There's really no way to prove that one way or another. There is also the fact that some people don't think it was well written at all. I mean the whole quest has less to do with being gay, more to do with conservative Tevene Culture and how prideful Dorian is. Any form of allegorical intent there is on purpose, but it serves the needs of the world just as easily, which moves it away from being stereotypical. It was actually pretty clever considering what we know (and don't know) about Tevinter and how easy it is for Dorian to fit into that culture. He is more typical to Tevinter than he would be willing to admit.
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Post by midnight tea on Aug 12, 2019 19:15:00 GMT
There's really no way to prove that one way or another. There is also the fact that some people don't think it was well written at all. I mean the whole quest has less to do with being gay, more to do with conservative Tevene Culture and how prideful Dorian is. Any form of allegorical intent there is on purpose, but it serves the needs of the world just as easily, which moves it away from being stereotypical. It was actually pretty clever considering what we know (and don't know) about Tevinter and how easy it is for Dorian to fit into that culture. He is more typical to Tevinter than he would be willing to admit. Well then there's the whole angle of 'parent doesn't accept child's life choices and tries to mold them them by force/deception, thus betraying their trust' angle that I think many people can sympathize with ease.
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