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Post by skekSil on Nov 7, 2019 22:25:23 GMT
It took colonists 600 years to reach Andromeda galaxy which is around 2.5 million light years from our galaxy. Using simple math we can find out that Ark speed is about 13 light years per day. How fast is that? According to Codex: So two ideas we can get from this. 1) Ark speed is about the same as other citadel ships. My guess intergalactic drive is unique because it can deal with a charge build up in core not because of its speed. 2) Reapers could get to Andromeda in less than 300 years. They could then spend thousands of years wiping out all intellegent life there and then spend another 300 years to get back and would still have dozens of thousands years before the next clean up of Milky Way. Why wouldn't they go?
My theory is that Jardaan knew about impending Reaper invasion and were actively preparing for it. They found a remote area of galaxy with no mass relays there (or destroyed them) so that they were not caught by surprise and had time to finish their plans. Then they made sure that there are no intelligent races there to prevent any interest to the cluster from Reapers. Once invasion starts they hide on Meridian and wait it out. When Reapers finally leave, they activate vaults which quickly provide them with habitable worlds and then use their slave race, Angarans, to rebuild their little empire. What they didn't account for is that one Reaper was left behind, same as Sovereign. It knew about Jardaan plans and took measures of its own. It indoctrinated some of Jardaan people and when time comes they will help Reapers to find and destroy Jardaan. But the Reapers never came from Milky Way galaxy (for unkown reasons) and Sovereign #2 decided to act on its own. It used indoctrinated agents to start a civil war and then finally used Scourge to defeat Jardaan. Then it turns its eye to the rest of Andromeda. It saves Kett from destruction by providing them Reaper tech which Kett know as Exaltation and send them on a crusade against the rest of starfaring species in the galaxy. So in theoretical sequels our heroes finally go to explore the rest of Andromeda and quicky find mass relays there. Surprise! They make contact with locals and find out that Kett are trying to conquer everyone. The dig around and find out that Reaper is behind all of this. Boss battle. The end.
But wait. There is more. In Milky Way galaxy Reapers used mass relays to jump from intergalactic void directly to Citadel. No reason to believe they wouldn't do the same in Andromeda. So if they spend, say, 1000 years to clean up a galaxy, they could deal with Milky Way, then do Andromeda and would still have time to go to another 48 galaxies. And why stop there? Eventually they would amass so many ships that they wouldn't realy be useful in controlling these 50 galaxies. They would send these new Reapers to the next batch of galaxies. And the next. And the next. The more galaxies they conquer the faster they multiply, eventually spreading throughout entire visible universe. Now rewatch Sovereign's conversation with Shephard. Doesn't sound like empty boasting anymore?
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Post by Son of Dorn on Nov 7, 2019 23:30:22 GMT
Only one problem with this theory: the Reapers are only active in the Milky Way.
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Post by skekSil on Nov 7, 2019 23:55:40 GMT
We know that they operate in Milky Way. We do not know that they dont operate in other galaxies. And there is nothing out there that would stop them to spread out.
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Post by Son of Dorn on Nov 8, 2019 0:07:35 GMT
We know that they operate in Milky Way. We do not know that they dont operate in other galaxies. And there is nothing out there that would stop them to spread out. If they did operate in other galaxies, their would have been other races in MEA using Mass Effect tech. (the same tech they make sure is used due to its inferior effectiveness against Reapers).
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Post by skekSil on Nov 8, 2019 0:14:47 GMT
Seriously, this was addressed in my original post! Jardaal chose Heleus cluster specifically because there were no reaper tech (relays) and because there are no other species.
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Post by Son of Dorn on Nov 8, 2019 0:19:31 GMT
Seriously, this was addressed in my original post! Jardaal chose Heleus cluster specifically because there were no reaper tech (relays) and because there are no other species. But they are native to that galaxy. So why would they choose a cluster in a galaxy that hasn't been visited by them? And again, I'll point out that there's no evidence that the Reapers invade other galaxies. And if they did, that would violate lore that was set up in the MET.
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Post by skekSil on Nov 8, 2019 0:30:19 GMT
They chose that cluster to hide from Reapers. And they picked the one that is remote, hard to get to (no relays) and has no intelligent species that could attract Reapers
This is my speculation based on evidence we have so far. Its not a 100% truth.
What part of lore does this theory contradict?
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Post by Son of Dorn on Nov 8, 2019 0:38:53 GMT
They chose that cluster to hide from Reapers. And they picked the one that is remote, hard to get to (no relays) and has no intelligent species that could attract Reapers This is my speculation based on evidence we have so far. Its not a 100% truth. What part of lore does this theory contradict? The fact that Starkid, and its makers have lived only in the Milky Way. Then there's the fact that the universe is a vast, with billions of galaxies in it. So 50,000 years is impossible to cover all of those galaxies. Also, Starkid is a "dumb" AI, so it doesn't have the possessors to cover the whole universe.
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Post by skekSil on Nov 8, 2019 0:53:15 GMT
US president can send his army to any part of the world without leaving his country. Also he is not smarter than a combined intelligence of all soldiers neither does he need to control every body motion of every soldier, he merely needs to give them general orders. Far away Reapers could also be completly autonomous and Starchild be fine with that as long as they stick to his plan of harvesting organics. In my theory they have been expanding their territory for millions of years, since the very beginning of their rule.
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Post by Son of Dorn on Nov 8, 2019 1:07:13 GMT
US president can send his army to any part of the world without leaving his country. Also he is not smarter than a combined intelligence of all soldiers neither does he need to control every body motion of every soldier, he merely needs to give them general orders. Far away Reapers could also be completly autonomous and Starchild be fine with that as long as they stick to his plan of harvesting organics. In my theory they have been expanding their territory for millions of years, since the very beginning of their rule. *sigh* You clearly want Starkid and the Reapers to play a major role in all ME games, don't you?
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Post by Phantom on Nov 8, 2019 1:20:54 GMT
This is just me, I would have Starchild to be one of many Reaper traps that lures the people into many false choices
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Post by Son of Dorn on Nov 8, 2019 1:26:18 GMT
This is just me, I would have Starchild to be one of many Reaper traps that lures the people into many false choices Personally, I always found Starkid and its Reapers to be Discount Skynet and Discount Terminators. Using the same plot over and over again tends to get stale after awhile.
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Post by Phantom on Nov 8, 2019 1:48:39 GMT
This is just me, I would have Starchild to be one of many Reaper traps that lures the people into many false choices Personally, I always found Starkid and its Reapers to be Discount Skynet and Discount Terminators. Using the same plot over and over again tends to get stale after awhile. True. it is very stale. I Know that some of us would love to have a Player vs Harbinger boss battle. I am working on a idea for a Post ME3 Reaper War that involves Harbinger as the True Big Bad and a hidden Reaper Base that is connected to a Portal to an Eldritch Location that change the Leviathan into the Reapers. Yes I am going lovecraftian horror terrority here. Harbinger willingly accept the change in order to Rule his brethren. And over the centuries develops traps that trick the people into their plans. Remember the Super Weapon of ME2 Fame involves the Dead Reaper and IFF device, Well the Player Character gets to use an improved version of it and damages the Reaper Base and nearly kills Harbinger and Harbinger ejects his essence into a much smaller Reaper avatar(think on par of much Derided ME2 Terminator boss battle) and Player must face the Harbinger alone and close the portal.
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Post by skekSil on Nov 8, 2019 18:51:07 GMT
US president can send his army to any part of the world without leaving his country. Also he is not smarter than a combined intelligence of all soldiers neither does he need to control every body motion of every soldier, he merely needs to give them general orders. Far away Reapers could also be completly autonomous and Starchild be fine with that as long as they stick to his plan of harvesting organics. In my theory they have been expanding their territory for millions of years, since the very beginning of their rule. *sigh* You clearly want Starkid and the Reapers to play a major role in all ME games, don't you? No, Im just pointing out that ME lore, plot of Andromeda and common sense all alow for Reapers to be behind events in MEA. As for Starchild, I havent even mentioned him before you btought him up. Frankly, he was probably the worst idea Bioware ever came up with.
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Post by Son of Dorn on Nov 8, 2019 18:53:25 GMT
*sigh* You clearly want Starkid and the Reapers to play a major role in all ME games, don't you? No, Im just pointing out that ME lore, plot of Andromeda and common sense all alow for Reapers to be behind events in MEA. As for Starchild, I havent even mentioned him before you btought him up. Frankly, he was probably the worst idea Bioware ever came up with. I can agree on that with you. Piece of crap was a cheap knock off of Skynet.
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Post by skekSil on Nov 8, 2019 18:56:11 GMT
At least Skynet had reasonable motive.
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Post by Son of Dorn on Nov 8, 2019 19:03:02 GMT
At least Skynet had reasonable motive. That it did. I always wondered what would it would have done afterwards,if it had won. Would it have replaced humans with its terminators?
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Post by SirSourpuss on Nov 8, 2019 19:06:36 GMT
Seriously, this was addressed in my original post! Jardaal chose Heleus cluster specifically because there were no reaper tech (relays) and because there are no other species. So out of all the galaxies that the Reapers operate in, out of all the clusters that have Relays, we are in the one that was conveniently left out and it just so happened to be in the galaxy closest to the Milky Way? Son of Dorn is right, this is dumb. And it just further undermines the importance of Control and Synthesis, since at any time, any other number of Reapers, which will require a nearly infinite number of them to police the universe, can waltz into the Milky Way, decide 'ang on a minute, dis ain't roight and wipe us along with all the other Reapers, for sport. So none of Starkid's solutions solve anything and the cycle continues. At least we can remake the Crucible and better so as to kill Reapers only and every 50k years or so, fire it and kill each new wave of Reapers that decides to fuck with the MW.
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Post by skekSil on Nov 8, 2019 20:09:53 GMT
Seriously, this was addressed in my original post! Jardaal chose Heleus cluster specifically because there were no reaper tech (relays) and because there are no other species. So out of all the galaxies that the Reapers operate in, out of all the clusters that have Relays, we are in the one that was conveniently left out and it just so happened to be in the galaxy closest to the Milky Way? That is a good point, I havent considered it. Though I dont think this theory is usalvageable. Here are a couple of ways a hypothetical writer of hypothetical sequel might be able to tackle this plot hole. a) We see that Crucible uses Mass Relays to spread this signal, so it is possible that some Reapers were unaffected by it if they were far enough from it. Perhaps Andromeda Reaper was in Heleus, coordinating attack on Jardaan, when signal cam in. b)Or maybe Jardaan have disabled local Citadel, similarly to protheans in MW, as one of many steps in their plan to survive invasion. c)Or a slight change to my original idea: the signal did affect all Reapers in all Galaxies but it came only after Scourge was released , killing the Reaper. In this case Kett aren't Andromeda's collectors but an independent faction. And no Reaper Boss battle at the end.
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Iakus
N7
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
Posts: 20,875 Likes: 49,330
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Post by Iakus on Nov 11, 2019 18:00:27 GMT
Seriously, this was addressed in my original post! Jardaal chose Heleus cluster specifically because there were no reaper tech (relays) and because there are no other species. But they are native to that galaxy. So why would they choose a cluster in a galaxy that hasn't been visited by them? And again, I'll point out that there's no evidence that the Reapers invade other galaxies. And if they did, that would violate lore that was set up in the MET. If anything, it would make sense for Reapers to spread to other galaxies, given the inevitable "conflict" they are trying to prevent. If intergalactic travel is possible (and clearly it is) then sooner or later, synthetic life from other galaxies will come to the Milky Way and destroy the organic life the Reapers are "preserving" Therefore the logical answer is to go to other galaxies and harvest organic life before this can happen. Reapers are the epitome of Instrumental Convergence
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Post by skekSil on Nov 11, 2019 20:03:42 GMT
So out of all the galaxies that the Reapers operate in, out of all the clusters that have Relays, we are in the one that was conveniently left out and it just so happened to be in the galaxy closest to the Milky Way? One other solution is that it is possible that Crucible signal couldn't reach other galaxies and Reapers decided that controling entire Universe is too much for them and they should focus on those galaxies they can reach on their own (which is 50 galaxies in my example). That would mean that after ME3 ending there are only 49 Reapers left, which Starchild might have concluded would not be a serious threat to organics.
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Post by Pounce de León on Nov 12, 2019 13:30:49 GMT
Who is Jardaal?
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Post by skekSil on Nov 12, 2019 16:43:12 GMT
Nice, I've been writing these crazy theories for 5 days and didn't even notice I was misspelling their name. Its Jardaan of course. Creators of Remnant machines. Fixed it.
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Finished Dissertation long ago lol. Now happily employed :D
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Post by biggydx on Nov 12, 2019 18:07:42 GMT
Considering that the Reapers are well into the hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of years old (sense their conception) I don't see how it would be improbable for them to have thought to travel outside of the Milky Way. Based on franchise lore, a Reapers FTL drive is faster than that of even the best Milky Way species FTL drive. They can also survive in Deep Space for extended periods. Considering that it only took the Milky Way species 600 years to get to Andromeda, and the Reapers can exist for hundreds of thousands of years, it wouldn't be that big of an endeavor for them to venture out.
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Post by Antibaar on Nov 12, 2019 18:16:06 GMT
First,excuse my poor english,I will do my best. So...lets take it from the start.Species from MW observed Andromeda for pottential habitable planets(with geth tech help).Why whouldnt Jardaan(which is far more advanced race than MW species),observed MW in 2180's?Also,the Reaper war activated the Crucible which was a galaxy wide event.I think the Jardaan knew what happend in MW.They knew about the Reapers,and thats why they flew from Heleus.Maybe Jardaan saw Reapers as a threat for Andromeda,and maybe they released the Scourge to stop the Reapers.
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