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dragonkingreborn
http://bsn.boards.net/threads/recent/143
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DragonKingReborn
Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Mass Effect Andromeda, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by DragonKingReborn on Apr 19, 2024 22:45:02 GMT
1. No. I will only judge development time by its actual development time for this version of the game. IMO it would be ridiculous to hold the devs to a "you had ten years to develop this game" when they actually didn't due to corporate shenanigans. The only thing I guess I want reflected by the time is the lore/basic story, since hopefully the writers had a lot of time to brainstorm and discuss before they had to start the "on paper" work. Oh, it’s definitely ridiculous. But the subconscious is like that sometimes.
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dis_Op2399
N2
Games: Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition
Posts: 54 Likes: 201
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February 2017
tripgodblossom
Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition
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Post by dis_Op2399 on Apr 22, 2024 19:38:07 GMT
1) Will you be judging the final product of Dragon Age Dreadwolf against the time that specific version of the game has had for development? Or the entirety of the time between the release of Trespasser and the release of Dreadwolf?
I don't know the concrete details of the development history, so it'll be judged on the time since Trespasser. And how could it not be when it was such a narrative cliffhanger ending? A ten year wait both amplifies expectations and induces pessimism. What vague info I do know about the shuffling around of the game points to a core problem, and one I will return to in answer to question 2: The game's identity. That it's seemingly in such a shaky state belies such little confidence in the property. Either because of some repugnant corporate mandated trend chasing, or that the devs simply don't cherish the Dragon Age series for what it is.
2) Assuming Dreadwolf is the most action oriented entry in the series, is that automatically "points deducted"?
Absolutely. I mean in some alternate dimension if they had Itsuno or Miyazaki directing then I'd be somewhat reassured, but it still returns to the core game identity problem. I have never heard a single good argument for why the game HAS to deviate from being a party based CRPG. By all means evolve - find a new combat pace, get some flashy spell animations and weighty sword chain attacks going on. Have a skill tree screen with all the sparkles and glitter you can muster. It doesn't need to feel exactly like the previous games, but it needs to be in the same genre at the very least. Especially so when your jumping off point in a long running series was such a cliffhanger of a previous game.
Character building through stats and specializations is as integral to an RPG for me as anything narrative or choice based. They could easily just do what the previous games did, and have an "Auto Allocate" button for people who don't care. Dragon Age's tactics for companions was such a fantastic mechanism to build your squad into a well oiled machine, and again just have automate button for anyone not interested. The status combos were a good evolution of the system, and can provide immensely satisfying gameplay. Quite why they'd ditch all of that juicy goodness for the combat of, not just a different game, but a whole other genre of game is astonishing to me. It's like throwing away a perfectly good home cooked roast dinner to get McDonald's instead. And hey, I like the occasional Big Mac, but that is not what I go to Dragon Age for. Once you've crowbarred that burger into a vaguely Dragon Age shaped wrapper I have serious doubts it would be especially appealing to anyone.
The success of Baldur's Gate 3 perfectly vindicates that party based CRPGs with deep systems are what millions of people want, and that game is fully turn based. RTwP already presents a happy medium for more adrenaline fuelled gameplay. If people want a full ARPG they'll go to FromSoftware or any of its knockoffs, not Bioware.
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phoray
Dreadnaw Rising
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August 2016
phoray
Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition
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Post by phoray on Apr 22, 2024 21:32:44 GMT
I expect the story to be amazing because the stones of that have had plenty of polishing time. I presumed writers worked nearly the whole time with breaks here and there.
I expect the battle mechanics to be garbage. I didn't like Inquisition, Andromeda, or Anthem. Ass Creed Odyssey was meh. Never played Game of War and don't know how they could even make a team of 3 anything like the Witcher. If that's the direction they're going for this sequel then fighting will be the annoying thing it's always been.
I am annoyed at the prospect of a reduced team size (4 to 3) because I'm here for the story and I rarely switch out the team that makes sense for that protagonist flavor I'm playing.
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colfoley
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Aug 17, 2016 10:19:37 GMT
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Post by colfoley on Apr 23, 2024 2:13:30 GMT
1) Will you be judging the final product of Dragon Age Dreadwolf against the time that specific version of the game has had for development? Or the entirety of the time between the release of Trespasser and the release of Dreadwolf?I don't know the concrete details of the development history, so it'll be judged on the time since Trespasser. And how could it not be when it was such a narrative cliffhanger ending? A ten year wait both amplifies expectations and induces pessimism. What vague info I do know about the shuffling around of the game points to a core problem, and one I will return to in answer to question 2: The game's identity. That it's seemingly in such a shaky state belies such little confidence in the property. Either because of some repugnant corporate mandated trend chasing, or that the devs simply don't cherish the Dragon Age series for what it is. 2) Assuming Dreadwolf is the most action oriented entry in the series, is that automatically "points deducted"?
Absolutely. I mean in some alternate dimension if they had Itsuno or Miyazaki directing then I'd be somewhat reassured, but it still returns to the core game identity problem. I have never heard a single good argument for why the game HAS to deviate from being a party based CRPG. By all means evolve - find a new combat pace, get some flashy spell animations and weighty sword chain attacks going on. Have a skill tree screen with all the sparkles and glitter you can muster. It doesn't need to feel exactly like the previous games, but it needs to be in the same genre at the very least. Especially so when your jumping off point in a long running series was such a cliffhanger of a previous game. Character building through stats and specializations is as integral to an RPG for me as anything narrative or choice based. They could easily just do what the previous games did, and have an "Auto Allocate" button for people who don't care. Dragon Age's tactics for companions was such a fantastic mechanism to build your squad into a well oiled machine, and again just have automate button for anyone not interested. The status combos were a good evolution of the system, and can provide immensely satisfying gameplay. Quite why they'd ditch all of that juicy goodness for the combat of, not just a different game, but a whole other genre of game is astonishing to me. It's like throwing away a perfectly good home cooked roast dinner to get McDonald's instead. And hey, I like the occasional Big Mac, but that is not what I go to Dragon Age for. Once you've crowbarred that burger into a vaguely Dragon Age shaped wrapper I have serious doubts it would be especially appealing to anyone. The success of Baldur's Gate 3 perfectly vindicates that party based CRPGs with deep systems are what millions of people want, and that game is fully turn based. RTwP already presents a happy medium for more adrenaline fuelled gameplay. If people want a full ARPG they'll go to FromSoftware or any of its knockoffs, not Bioware. Trouble with this logic is the game has always been an ARPG from the very first days of Origins to the latest iteration with Inquisition. Plus I don't really see anything to indicate that this is changing. We've seen skill tree screens and even if you are going to take the leaks into account then we're still going to have parties and almost certainly have RTwP. Just because they have moved the formulae around and tried out different things, which they have done with each iteration does not mean that A. the game has not ever been an ARPG and B. has not evolved, grown, and changed. And the conversation on stats, which I assume you are talking about Con, Dex, and Strength, is the perfect microcasm for this. Where have you seen that they are going to move away from this kind of thing? I haven't seen anything in the leaks or official marketing. Now granted I do like them to, they are one of the three core gameplay elements of what makes an RPG an RPG but at the end of the day many RPGs, party based and otherwise, don't do them and are perfectly enjoyable experiences. And they are an element of gameplay I don't really think any game has gotten right, maybe even including and especially BioWare. They are usually either inconsistent (this tends to be a problem between games in a series), highly nonsensicle and illogical (like Baldur's Gate and Origins having defense being dex based), or don't have a large enough impact on build and gameplay. So while I am reasonably sure they aren't going away I'm not sure I'd mind either given that this probably has been the RPG area where BioWare has struggled the most and Mass Effect was a perfectly good RPG even without them.
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Tekehu's booty
Someday a cat will give me magical powers and I'll be married to a werewolf #goals #WerewolfLIforDA4
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Oct 19, 2016 19:24:39 GMT
October 2016
nickclark89
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR
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Post by Tekehu's booty on Apr 23, 2024 8:31:29 GMT
The only big expectation I have is romances, I want them equally distributed (quantity and quality) and of course a human gay male KISA. Apart from that, I'm gonna enjoy the game like a little kid and let myself having a blast, I cant wait to return to Thedas. This doesnt mean I'm not going to be critical about it but I only need a CC, gay romances and a single player story driven game to make me happy, that this game is the fourth installment of one my favorite franchises is just the icing on the cake.
oh I forgot, give me water spells (no ice, WATER)
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TabithaTH
N3
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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July 2018
teatabitha
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by TabithaTH on Apr 23, 2024 16:22:54 GMT
1: Will judge it as the game it is. I will keep in mind how rocky development was, but it’ll most likely influence how much energy I’ll put into complaining and not the complaints themselves. I also think what price I pay will be important. If I buy it on sale or get gifted a copy, I’ll probably feel less cheated if the experience isn’t what I was hoping for.
That being said, it might have the opposite effect and make me more annoyed with details, since I’ll see the game it could have been without all the reboots.
2: As long as I can figure out the mechanics, I’m fine with whatever style of combat they end up making. I would prefer some sort of pause feature for using potions and stuff like that, but it’s not a deal breaker if I can ‘just get by’.
Honestly, I think I’ve just sort of given up on getting a perfect game. It’s gone from being the game I’m waiting for, to just another game I’m waiting for.
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November 2016
gwydden
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire
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Post by Gwydden on Apr 23, 2024 22:06:32 GMT
I haven't exactly been waiting with bated breath. Between how long it's been since the last entry in the series, liking each game less than the last, and all the staff changes throughout development, I have no expectations and will be treating this as I would any other AAA RPG release; I am at least a little curious due to leftover DA:O nostalgia, but that's it. I enjoy different types of combat and never expected this game to be much like DA:O anyway, so that's alright. If it's looking really good and my PC can run it, I'll get it on release. If it looks like I might enjoy it, I may get it at a discount later. Otherwise, I'll pass.
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Sandetiger
N3
beez nuts
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Mass Effect Andromeda, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Posts: 380 Likes: 1,166
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Sandetiger
beez nuts
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March 2023
sandetiger
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Mass Effect Andromeda, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by Sandetiger on Apr 24, 2024 22:43:47 GMT
1) Will you be judging the final product of Dragon Age Dreadwolf against the time that specific version of the game has had for development? Or the entirety of the time between the release of Trespasser and the release of Dreadwolf?
I think for me, I want to go in giving it the benefit of the doubt. It is effectively another chapter of a story I've been following since 2010; I've waited pretty lengthy chunks of time for book sequels to come out, and as a writer I know that the final version usually isn't what went into the writing process throughout its writing period. If it's not perfect: that's okay. It doesn't have to be perfect for me to enjoy it. I've been dreaming about this for the better part of a decade, and I am really excited: for myself, for my friends, for the community, and for the devs who have been working on this story -- including some of them for their whole careers, and others since the inception of the franchise. It's a big milestone, regardless. But FWIW, having context for why things may not be super smooth in release/gameplay/narrative construction tends to engender in me a slant toward grace. Knowing that this is, essentially, version 3.0 of the game, where I imagine devs have essentially had to do a major regroup at least three separate times, spells to me that it's frankly a miracle that it got made at all. I think it would be incredibly discourteous to the devs themselves to decry the game with, "They had a decade to make this game, and this is what they give us?" Like, c'mon. The game was cancelled at one point, switched to a live service in the reboot, and then upended to a single-player format. I expect that they had to completely redesign the game -- and they were doing this in the context of COVID and its disruptions and now a lengthy run of massive layoffs and widespread industry instability, which from testimony is taking a hefty toll on the mental health and sense of security the people making these games have. Not to mention that BioWare was cleaved with the Aug 2023 layoffs. Maybe I won't be able to resist, anyway, given how long I've been waiting. But I've also been telling myself that I want to be intentional in how I engage with the length of time I've waited and the emotions that engenders; so I have been having a dialogue with myself and with the context of the game. We'll see how that pans out I think the only real expectation I have going in is that I want to enjoy it. Whatever 'it' ultimately is. The game will be what it is, and not what people expect it to be. (I also think it is important to keep in mind that fandom hype and wank over new installations of games can be incredibly dissonant with the actual game that has been released. I remember when DA2 was panned by the fandom, and have watched it's renaissance as people revisit or discover it for the first time, and see it a little more clearly for what the devs were trying to do. The same is happening, I think, for MEA. I enjoyed both games when I played them for the first time, and never understood the widespread ire over them.) And related to all this is the fact that, ultimately, at the end of the day, it's a story experience that is being shared with me by other people who are creative, and there's something very collaborative about that. However it's been commodified, there's just something so special about being able to share and receive stories. At the risk of sounding a little parasocial, what I have always maintained is that these fantastical stories we tell each other are about human experiences and human existence, and how we engage with that is rooted in our own humanity. So, I always try to find things to like, things to appreciate, and things that speak to me. If I can't connect in some way, then yeah, something has probably gone horrifically wrong with the game's development. But I don't expect that to be the case. What will also be really fun for me, I think, is dissecting how they've constructed the game. I really like media analysis and I've been soaking up how games are made and how that process varies from other forms of media that I am more experientially steeped in -- book publishing, and making movies and television. And that's something you can do with ANY game that's been constructed in ANY fashion -- it just happens to be attractive to me because I love the Dragon Age franchise and it's one of the very few video game storyworlds that I actively spend a lot of time thinking about. If I am critical of the game, really critical -- it's generally not because I hate it, but because there's a lot I like. If it's wholly awfu and there's nothing I enjoy or appreciate, then why bother, yeah? So I guess I also expect that I will have critiques on the assumption that I will largely enjoy the game. And that's okay, too. 2) Assuming Dreadwolf is the most action oriented entry in the series, is that automatically "points deducted"?Nah. Every Dragon Age game has had slightly different combat (and for that matter Mass Effect has, too.) It's been more than 15 years since BioWare first started working on DA:O. Creatively, I would expect them to experiment with different gameplay styles and that includes systems of combat. Maybe I'll dislike whatever they have more than I do the more isometric form of DA:O (and I do miss that) and maybe I'll enjoy it. I won't know until I try it, and I'm not going to be churlish by going in and deciding that it has to meet some arbitrary bar or else it's trash. In any case, it can't be worse than The Witcher 3's combat (I hated that lol; but still enjoyed the game) or [shudder] Kingdom Come: Deliverance's combat. I really, really, really liked being able to toggle the overhead view in the Dragon Age games, and it was a little bit of a curve for me to be stuck firmly in the over-the-shoulder perspective of Mass Effect, but I figured it out, I adapted, it was fine. As long as the way combat is constructed is balanced and makes sense for how they design the enemies and environments, it'll be fine. Mark Darrah has already stated on his channel that he thinks the overhead view is unlikely to come back, so I am tempering my expectations on that, at the very least. I think one of the leakers indicated that we might get a combat 'pause mechanic' similar to the power wheel for the Mass Effect trilogy, and if that is indeed the case, I'll cope just fine. I just need to be able to pause during combat -- I get anxious! With that said, I really hope it doesn't require a lot of button mashing in combat, just from an accessibility standpoint. I largely enjoyed playing Assassin's Creed: Odyssey but sometimes the fights with the bounty hunters would get so intense and take so long that I would have to let myself die in order to stop; my joints are hypermobile and I would be in physical pain. I remember reading re: the cancelled BioWare game AGENT that they did intend to have really intense button-mashing combat, so it's certainly not something the studio has been above experimenting with before, and it wouldn't exactly be coming out of left field. I just hope they... don't... But, being real here: I don't play Dragon Age (or Mass Effect) for the combat. Combat is such a secondary consideration for me, where I am primarily interested in the story and the characters. I chronically play on easy mode, and I've never played any game at a harder difficulty setting. So long as it's not prohibitively painful, I'll tolerate just about any combat for the sake of soaking up the narrative. The bonus points are if I actually enjoy the combat.
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