Toyish Batphone
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Post by Toyish Batphone on Aug 6, 2016 2:44:13 GMT
Greetings.
I wish to talk about something that has been bugging me about the early parts of Dragon Age Inquisition.
After you deal with the Pride Demon and close the large rift in the prologue, Cassandra later suggests that the Inquisition needs to seek the aid of the Mages because the Mark is magical and therefore what is needed is more magic poured into the Mark to close the Breach in the sky.
There's just one problem though - The last time the Herald tried to close the large Rift, the Mark nearly killed them. So isn't it counterproductive to want to put more magic into the Mark, simply because it might kill the Herald and then the Inquisition would lose the only way they have to close the Rifts and the Breach ?
Isn't Cullen's suggestion to find Templars to weaken the Breach and to have the Herald close it safer, at least for the Herald ?
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Post by opuspace on Aug 6, 2016 3:33:58 GMT
I know you're looking for a serious answer, but everything went downhill when I thought about Templars trying to suppress the Breach by reinforcing reality and then likening it to sponging up Fade energy. *Inquisitor grabs a Templar and tries to rub the poor guy on the Breach* "It's not working! Hand me another!" "We're running out, Inquisitor! And I don't think this is how you close a breach!" "Nonsense! Come on, our stalwart allies! Prove your powers of absorbancy and soak! Soak that Fade energy like the grease cutting detergent sponge you are!"
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linksocarina
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Post by linksocarina on Aug 6, 2016 3:34:43 GMT
Yes, it would be safer, it's probably why Cullen suggested it.
I think the issue there is they don't know what will happen, so both their ideas, pushing for more magic, or weakening the breach itself, are valid. As for killing the Herald, both ideas still carry risk of their death in the end id say, so regardless of the one chosen its still a risk that had to be taken.
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Toyish Batphone
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Post by Toyish Batphone on Aug 6, 2016 3:40:42 GMT
I know you're looking for a serious answer, but everything went downhill when I thought about Templars trying to suppress the Breach by reinforcing reality and then likening it to sponging up Fade energy. *Inquisitor grabs a Templar and tries to rub the poor guy on the Breach* "It's not working! Hand me another!" "We're running out, Inquisitor! And I don't think this is how you close a breach!" "Nonsense! Come on, our stalwart allies! Prove your powers of absorbancy and soak! Soak that Fade energy like the grease cutting detergent sponge you are!" Templars suppress magic. If you play through the Champions of the Just quest, the is a cut scene where the Templars plunge their swords into the ground (very much like they do at the Temple of Sacret Ashes to weaken the Breach) and weaken the barrier protecting the Envy Demon, eventually dispelling it.
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Post by opuspace on Aug 6, 2016 3:41:37 GMT
Ok, serious answer. Best guess I can give is if we liken the mark as a spinning wheel, magic as the raw cotton or wool material and the breach as the ginormous tear in grandma's sweater. Using magic to pour into the mark may be just a way to keep the mark fueled by another source than the Inquisitor's own life force. It's possible that people like Solas were the only ones capable of using the orb because they could draw on their own personal reserves of strength and magic back in the day whereas with the Inquisitor, it was like trying to run a game console on a battery made out of potatoes and pickle juice.
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Post by opuspace on Aug 6, 2016 3:44:23 GMT
I know you're looking for a serious answer, but everything went downhill when I thought about Templars trying to suppress the Breach by reinforcing reality and then likening it to sponging up Fade energy. *Inquisitor grabs a Templar and tries to rub the poor guy on the Breach* "It's not working! Hand me another!" "We're running out, Inquisitor! And I don't think this is how you close a breach!" "Nonsense! Come on, our stalwart allies! Prove your powers of absorbancy and soak! Soak that Fade energy like the grease cutting detergent sponge you are!" Templars suppress magic. If you play through the Champions of the Just quest, the is a cut scene where the Templars plunge their swords into the ground (very much like they do at the Temple of Sacret Ashes to weaken the Breach) and weaken the barrier protecting the Envy Demon, eventually dispelling it. I guess I was trying to find an analogy and failing. When they reinforce reality, are they dispersing energy? Forcing energy from the material world into the places where the Fade is leaking through? Is it simply scattering it, dissolving it like dish soap on greasy dishes?
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Sah291
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Post by Sah291 on Aug 6, 2016 4:10:53 GMT
Yeah Templars seems like the safer choice. But, I just watched the breach closing scene with the mages, and there Solas just tells the mages to focus past the Herald and allow him/her to draw willpower from them, and then they slam their staves onto the ground.... which is exactly the same thing he tells the Templars, and they also plunge their swords into the ground. So it seems like both groups are doing the same thing, helping Inquisitor to channel and focus his/her willpower onto the breach. Maybe that's what Cassandra means?
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Toyish Batphone
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Post by Toyish Batphone on Aug 6, 2016 4:40:43 GMT
Yeah Templars seems like the safer choice. But, I just watched the breach closing scene with the mages, and there Solas just tells the mages to focus past the Herald and allow him/her to draw willpower from them, and then they slam their staves onto the ground.... which is exactly the same thing he tells the Templars, and they also plunge their swords into the ground. So it seems like both groups are doing the same thing, helping Inquisitor to channel and focus his/her willpower onto the breach. Maybe that's what Cassandra means? The funny thing about the cutscene is that the sound the Mage staves make when they hit the ground is the exact same sound the Templar swords make when they strike the ground. You would have thought Bioware would at least change that. Just one thing - How does one draw willpower from someone ? If the Herald is a mage, we can justify that with magic but how does a mundane (that's the term World of Thedas uses to describe non-magical people) Herald draw willpower from someone ?
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Post by goishen on Aug 6, 2016 5:02:15 GMT
*Inquisitor grabs a Templar and tries to rub the poor guy on the Breach* How I'm imagining this, can't be how you really meant it. *imagines a Qunari and well... You can guess the rest...*
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Sah291
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Post by Sah291 on Aug 6, 2016 5:08:16 GMT
Yeah Templars seems like the safer choice. But, I just watched the breach closing scene with the mages, and there Solas just tells the mages to focus past the Herald and allow him/her to draw willpower from them, and then they slam their staves onto the ground.... which is exactly the same thing he tells the Templars, and they also plunge their swords into the ground. So it seems like both groups are doing the same thing, helping Inquisitor to channel and focus his/her willpower onto the breach. Maybe that's what Cassandra means? The funny thing about the cutscene is that the sound the Mage staves make when they hit the ground is the exact same sound the Templar swords make when they strike the ground. You would have thought Bioware would at least change that. Just one thing - How does one draw willpower from someone ? If the Herald is a mage, we can justify that with magic but how does a mundane (that's the term World of Thedas uses to describe non-magical people) Herald draw willpower from someone ? Good question, lol. I guess still magic? The Inquisitor is less mundane after their little fade trip and receiving the mark, which they just seem to get the hang of quickly. Or if the Inquisitor is receptive enough, the mages/Templars are projecting their willpower onto him/her.
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Post by opuspace on Aug 6, 2016 5:27:34 GMT
Yeah Templars seems like the safer choice. But, I just watched the breach closing scene with the mages, and there Solas just tells the mages to focus past the Herald and allow him/her to draw willpower from them, and then they slam their staves onto the ground.... which is exactly the same thing he tells the Templars, and they also plunge their swords into the ground. So it seems like both groups are doing the same thing, helping Inquisitor to channel and focus his/her willpower onto the breach. Maybe that's what Cassandra means? The funny thing about the cutscene is that the sound the Mage staves make when they hit the ground is the exact same sound the Templar swords make when they strike the ground. You would have thought Bioware would at least change that. Just one thing - How does one draw willpower from someone ? If the Herald is a mage, we can justify that with magic but how does a mundane (that's the term World of Thedas uses to describe non-magical people) Herald draw willpower from someone ? Mage staves are often tipped with metal so that's not hard to imagine. Helps prevent wood splitting up the shaft. As for drawing willpower from people, I think of hype men, musicians, politicians making dramatic speeches. They all draw upon a crowds' will to rise up and unite on an opinion. That could be one example of how an individual draws energy from a crowd. Since the Fade is affected by will, getting enough people together to wish for the same thing might be what's used to seal the Breach
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MissOuJ
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Post by MissOuJ on Aug 6, 2016 6:05:07 GMT
The Orb - and by extension, presumably the Mark, since it was created by using the Orb - require a vast amount of power to function: Solas says his plan was to get somebody to unlock the Orb for him, since he was too weak to do it himself. So at least my theory goes that the reason the Inquisitor almost dies when s/he tries to close the Breach for the first time is because there is nowhere near enough magical energy anywhere in the vicinity, and that's why the Herald almost kicks it.
So IMO, in that light, having mages give the Herald more juice to wrestle that thing into shape makes perfect sense to me, and at least sounds like an improvement on his/her safety. Then again Cullen also has a point, but although I have played IYHSB through with Templars, the logic of "suppressing the Breach" kinda escapes me.
Then again there's also the fact that absolutely nothing guarantees that whatever they do actually works and closes the Breach, not to mention there's always the chance the Breach starts spitting out majorly pissed off high-level demons the moment the Herald walks up to it which end up ripping him/her into shreds... and with all the other shit the Herald has been through (time travel / stuck to the Fade etc.) I'd think that at some point the Herald would accept that his/her life expectancy has dropped pretty dramatically since s/he got the Mark regardless to what happens to the Breach, so s/he might as well close it.
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Post by Nightscrawl on Aug 7, 2016 17:26:25 GMT
Greetings. I wish to talk about something that has been bugging me about the early parts of Dragon Age Inquisition. After you deal with the Pride Demon and close the large rift in the prologue, Cassandra later suggests that the Inquisition needs to seek the aid of the Mages because the Mark is magical and therefore what is needed is more magic poured into the Mark to close the Breach in the sky. There's just one problem though - The last time the Herald tried to close the large Rift, the Mark nearly killed them. So isn't it counterproductive to want to put more magic into the Mark, simply because it might kill the Herald and then the Inquisition would lose the only way they have to close the Rifts and the Breach ? Isn't Cullen's suggestion to find Templars to weaken the Breach and to have the Herald close it safer, at least for the Herald ? Inquisitor: So it'll be dangerous. I've been in danger since I walked out of the Fade. I've never felt they tried to gloss over the fact that the Herald, then later Inquisitor, could die at any moment while doing all this stuff. It has always seemed to me that there was the knowledge that closing the Breach could kill them. But then the Breach would be closed and the world would be saved. You gotta do what you gotta do, ya know? I know you're looking for a serious answer, but everything went downhill when I thought about Templars trying to suppress the Breach by reinforcing reality and then likening it to sponging up Fade energy. *Inquisitor grabs a Templar and tries to rub the poor guy on the Breach* "It's not working! Hand me another!" "We're running out, Inquisitor! And I don't think this is how you close a breach!" "Nonsense! Come on, our stalwart allies! Prove your powers of absorbancy and soak! Soak that Fade energy like the grease cutting detergent sponge you are!" This is ridiculous, but also hilarious. I love it. Yeah Templars seems like the safer choice. But, I just watched the breach closing scene with the mages, and there Solas just tells the mages to focus past the Herald and allow him/her to draw willpower from them, and then they slam their staves onto the ground.... which is exactly the same thing he tells the Templars, and they also plunge their swords into the ground. So it seems like both groups are doing the same thing, helping Inquisitor to channel and focus his/her willpower onto the breach. Maybe that's what Cassandra means? I've always been bothered by the fact that the cutscene is the exact same for each, same animations, same sounds, same everything. The funny thing about the cutscene is that the sound the Mage staves make when they hit the ground is the exact same sound the Templar swords make when they strike the ground. You would have thought Bioware would at least change that. Just one thing - How does one draw willpower from someone ? If the Herald is a mage, we can justify that with magic but how does a mundane (that's the term World of Thedas uses to describe non-magical people) Herald draw willpower from someone ? Mage staves are often tipped with metal so that's not hard to imagine. Helps prevent wood splitting up the shaft. As for drawing willpower from people, I think of hype men, musicians, politicians making dramatic speeches. They all draw upon a crowds' will to rise up and unite on an opinion. That could be one example of how an individual draws energy from a crowd. Since the Fade is affected by will, getting enough people together to wish for the same thing might be what's used to seal the Breach In the mage cutscene, they slam the heads of their staves into the ground, not the blade, so it looks extra... well... dumb is the only word for it.
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