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Post by Catilina on Feb 26, 2017 0:37:34 GMT
And this gambling very interesting... especially for a mage! Who Solas? Who is, for example, my Surana. He went to find out, through the Eluvian. This is a very nice story.
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Post by dayze on Feb 26, 2017 0:54:30 GMT
Dark Ritual; possible chance of having an OG to use as a resource.
Having a child that's healthy and strong.
Not wanting to die.
Here's a question; now that it's been shown that various entities can possess bodies that have other souls in them or what have you. Is the random GW coming back from the dead or perhaps never truly having "died" from killing the Archdemon actually the more canonically consistent possibility following the "ultimate sacrifice" now?
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Post by doflamingodonquijote on Feb 26, 2017 2:07:27 GMT
Dark Ritual; possible chance of having an OG to use as a resource. Having a child that's healthy and strong. Not wanting to die. 1)The AD soul is in the hands of Flemeth it is not a resource of yours. 2)The child is messed up when it is born as an OGB and altered by Flemeth once again. 3)The GW will be killed regardless by the calling but before of that they will become ghouls.
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Post by dayze on Feb 26, 2017 2:15:39 GMT
Dark Ritual; possible chance of having an OG to use as a resource. Having a child that's healthy and strong. Not wanting to die. 1)The AD soul is in the hands of Flemeth it is not a resource of yours. 2)The child is messed up when it is born as an OGB and altered by Flemeth once again. 3)The GW will be killed regardless by the calling but before of that they will become ghouls. 1.) Well; it's in the hands of Morrigan. And long as you can make a claim to being it's father, always a possibility of manipulation. Either way; it's a distant future when your about to go to battle in the next day against a horde of blighted creatures and a god-dragon with no chance of survival if you don't do it. Biological clock's going to be ticking like crazy either way. 2.) From what your given for information it will be basically healthy, which it is, strong and healthy far as kids go. Some uncomfortable dreams but aside from that; pretty well off. 3.) Everybody dies; nice not to have to die tomorrow, especially if you took the potion and there's some chance of living another couple hundred years. Also nice to have a kid when you don't basically have that option otherwise. Don't want your family line to die with you potentially and now it's part god.
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Post by akiza on Feb 26, 2017 2:16:34 GMT
Dark Ritual; possible chance of having an OG to use as a resource. Having a child that's healthy and strong. Not wanting to die. 1)The AD soul is in the hands of Flemeth it is not a resource of yours. 2)The child is messed up when it is born as an OGB and altered by Flemeth once again. 3)The GW will be killed regardless by the calling but before of that they will become ghouls. Checkmate! Checkmate! Checkmate!
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Post by dayze on Feb 26, 2017 2:20:49 GMT
1)The AD soul is in the hands of Flemeth it is not a resource of yours. 2)The child is messed up when it is born as an OGB and altered by Flemeth once again. 3)The GW will be killed regardless by the calling but before of that they will become ghouls. Checkmate! Checkmate! Checkmate! Not really. like said in my post. 1.) Long as something exists it's a potential resource and it's in the hands of a woman who has some level of emotional connection to you. It's also nice to have a kid that's a god just for the ego. 2.) From what your told, it will turn out fine. Never know what happens in the future even then. What happened was a perfectly fine and healthy kid that gets to hang out in high royalty. 3.) Getting another twenty or thirty years of life at a minimum versus one more day filled with battle and brutalities a pretty sweet deal. Especially with taking a potion that can put off the calling for a long, long time. Even without, couple decades, is a couple decades, is a couple decades.
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Post by doflamingodonquijote on Feb 26, 2017 2:29:22 GMT
And long as you can make a claim to being it's father, always a possibility of manipulation. Either way; it's a distant future when your about to go to battle in the next day against a horde of blighted creatures and a god-dragon with no chance of survival if you don't do it. Biological clock's going to be ticking like crazy either way. 2.) From what your given for information it will be basically healthy, which it is, strong and healthy far as kids go. Some uncomfortable dreams but aside from that; pretty well off. 3.) Everybody dies; nice not to have to die tomorrow, especially if you took the potion and there's some chance of living another couple hundred years. Also nice to have a kid when you don't basically have that option otherwise. Don't want your family line to die with you potentially and now it's part god. 1)I told you that Morrigan lost it, now Flemeth and Solas have it. Who needs Morrigan to survive? And why spare a God of slavery by gambling the whole world just to save one person?That's reckless and selfish. 2)I just expect the OGB to be mentally deficient now, not developing properly for 10 years from birth. Now he's just expected to be like a normal kid? He's screwed. 3)Which potion are you talking about that which does not exist?The concotion doesn't prolong the warden's life in any way. Their destiny is to become Ghouls in 10 years max after Trespasser.
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Post by dayze on Feb 26, 2017 2:42:21 GMT
1.) True I suppose you could let someone else take the sacrifice but there's not a given by any means that others will make it there and it's always nice to have something keeping you alive if it comes down to the wire..
If you don't well, you probably won't live very long with a archdemon on your tail.
The guy was reckless and selfish..
2.) Well; from what she said it would come out normal. Which it did. Bummer dreams is pretty low end on the scale for mental deficiencies. He's healthy, alive and has potential to be used and continue the family line. Better than the alternative if your not exactly a moral paragon.
3.) The concotion is what unlocks the further amount of power and is the end result of all the years of that wizards study and what kept him alive. There's also whatever potential you might get from sacrificing all those elves in the alienage.
Isn't it usually 15-30 years? Either way; still beats just one blood filled day and you can always take the calling or kill yourself later. Plenty of time to live life and do stuff. 10 years is limited but doable.
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Post by oyabun on Feb 26, 2017 2:56:21 GMT
1.) True I suppose you could let someone else take the sacrifice but there's not a given by any means that others will make it there and it's always nice to have something keeping you alive if it comes down to the wire.. If you don't well, you probably won't live very long with a archdemon on your tail. The guy was reckless and selfish.. 2.) Well; from what she said it would come out normal. Which it did. Bummer dreams is pretty low end on the scale for mental deficiencies. He's healthy, alive and has potential to be used and continue the family line. Better than the alternative if your not exactly a moral paragon. 3.) The concotion is what unlocks the further amount of power and is the end result of all the years of that wizards study and what kept him alive. There's also whatever potential you might get from sacrificing all those elves in the alienage. Isn't it usually 15-30 years? Either way; still beats just one blood filled day and you can always take the calling or kill yourself later. Plenty of time to live life and do stuff. 10 years is limited but doable. Morrigan apparently offers the chance to guarantee life if the other Wardens are dead and this particular Warden survives long enough to kill a dragon single-handedly. It's stupid because of how implausible the one specific outcome where it applies is versus the potential risk.What I am saying is simple: Alistair and Loghain have no more of a risk to die than the Warden. If the risk for them dying is enormous, it is the same for the Warden. So the dark ritual in that case is nothing but for the special scenario where the Warden lives and Alistair or Loghain dies, which is incredibly unlikely beacuse all signs point to both dying. And if the odds of the Warden living are high, then the chance of the other warden doing the same is higher. -The sacrifice of the elves in the alienage does not prolong the Wardens life and neither does the potion of Avernus. Avernus delayed the calling with different means that involved using blood magic which he never told to the GW in the game.
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Post by Aren on Feb 26, 2017 3:15:15 GMT
Question is, can you? Are you able to provide evidence about the Old God dragons being just dangerous, and not important for the survival of Thedas as it is? Because I`m not at all convinced about their role, but you are sureThere are some settings where killing "divine" beings truly is dangerous because they're tied to the world in some way that makes whatever they're the god of weaker or non-existent if you kill them. The argument that the Old Gods can't be safely disposed of seems to assume that the Old Gods are such beings, which would justify sparing them to avoid screwing things up for large numbers of people. But I don't think they works that way, and I don't think we have any reason to believe it does. And if there is such an effect, I'm curious how the world is still standing after they were all sealed, five of them were corrupted, and from all we can tell most of them were killed.The state of divinity seems like a non-sequitur, at least to me. Even if the Old Gods were "legitimately" divine, it wouldn't grant any intrinsic worth to their continued existence; that characteristic is irrelevant in my mind.
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Post by adrianbc on Feb 26, 2017 9:11:02 GMT
Your viewpoint is intriguing. Sadly, Bioware made a bit of a mess with their Dragon Age lore. Such a thing happens when there are many writers instead of one, and it`s even worse when the lead writer supposedly responsible for the world-building is replaced between games. Not to mention some constant interference from Bioware management and especially EA. All this makes the Dragon Age lore and main story arc more of an opportunistic type than a consistent one, following a plan. Based on the dismissive way the Old God soul plot was treated in DA:I it`s likely that the darkspawn - old god plotline was sidelined by BW, and the Evanuris - Solas - Fade - mages one was given a center stage for now. Which probably makes the magical creatures as dragons or titans irrelevant in the greater scheme of things for DA4 and any possible future DA game. But this can change easily because players just love dragons. Not to mention that the series is called DRAGON AGE. Not darkspawn age or elven age. So I`ll not be at all surprised that the old god dragons will be reintroduced in the next game(s) as relevant and vital characters. To which end, I honestly have no idea.
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Post by dayze on Feb 26, 2017 23:36:21 GMT
1.) True I suppose you could let someone else take the sacrifice but there's not a given by any means that others will make it there and it's always nice to have something keeping you alive if it comes down to the wire.. If you don't well, you probably won't live very long with a archdemon on your tail. The guy was reckless and selfish.. 2.) Well; from what she said it would come out normal. Which it did. Bummer dreams is pretty low end on the scale for mental deficiencies. He's healthy, alive and has potential to be used and continue the family line. Better than the alternative if your not exactly a moral paragon. 3.) The concotion is what unlocks the further amount of power and is the end result of all the years of that wizards study and what kept him alive. There's also whatever potential you might get from sacrificing all those elves in the alienage. Isn't it usually 15-30 years? Either way; still beats just one blood filled day and you can always take the calling or kill yourself later. Plenty of time to live life and do stuff. 10 years is limited but doable. Morrigan apparently offers the chance to guarantee life if the other Wardens are dead and this particular Warden survives long enough to kill a dragon single-handedly. It's stupid because of how implausible the one specific outcome where it applies is versus the potential risk.What I am saying is simple: Alistair and Loghain have no more of a risk to die than the Warden. If the risk for them dying is enormous, it is the same for the Warden. So the dark ritual in that case is nothing but for the special scenario where the Warden lives and Alistair or Loghain dies, which is incredibly unlikely beacuse all signs point to both dying. And if the odds of the Warden living are high, then the chance of the other warden doing the same is higher. -The sacrifice of the elves in the alienage does not prolong the Wardens life and neither does the potion of Avernus. Avernus delayed the calling with different means that involved using blood magic which he never told to the GW in the game. Well the Warden wasn't particularly concerned about Alistair or Loghain surviving more than himself. He wanted to have an increased odds of coming out alive and having progeny. This is the only real option for that. Though thinking about it; what with Flemeth and Morrigan's knowledge of the future, them tapping you would seem to imply you have the highest odds of facing off against the dragon. We have no idea really what the sacrifice at the alienage can or can not do; all we know is that a blood magic ritual done which involved killing multiple elves to make you stronger in some way. Presumably; if your stronger you can live longer by being healthier. Great odds of surviving heart attacks, disease etc.....stay active, that kind of stuff. As for Avernus there is no point where it is referenced that it was blood magic that made him live longer. We know the potion was a result of his study and knowledge to increase warden's power and put off the taint and becoming a ghoul. Living longer and "not" becoming a ghoul was the whole point of what he was doing there. Seems likely that it was the potion that made him that way. And if it was this unnamed or specified blood magic; well there's the blood magic ritual that got done using multiple sacrifices. So that angle covers it as well.
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Liadan
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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http://bsn.boards.net/board/10/dragon-inquisition-quests-general-discussion
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Post by Liadan on Feb 27, 2017 21:57:58 GMT
I always chose the Dark Ritual except in two playthroughs: in one my warden made the ultimate sacrifice and in the other Loghain sacrificed himself.
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Gilsa
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Post by Gilsa on Feb 28, 2017 23:21:26 GMT
tl;dr Loghain died killing the Archdemon.
How I got there:
By the time Landsmeet rolled around, I honestly and truly thought that Loghain had his own army (re: Ostagar) that would join the cause in addition to the three treaties the Warden recruited. I had no idea that I was simply trading one man for another. I also thought Anora would back out and weaken our forces if I killed her father. I played a dwarf. I didn't care about human politics or who actually ruled. Anora seemed capable. Alistair didn't want it. Problem solved, no? I had no axe to grind with Howe either. My own people were dying underground fighting the darkspawn. I wasn't going to turn away help on the surface. Plus Loghain was a general. I felt we could use his expertise in the upcoming battle. It wasn't the time to nurse grudges. He could always be executed later. The archdemon was the most pressing matter at the time.
So I lost Alistair, who was also my romance interest. That was not fun.
Eventually Morrigan revealed her ulterior motives for tagging along. Et tu? Just went through this betrayal with Bhelen and here she was, not giving me any straight answers. My people were dying to darkspawn because they were looking for archdemons and she wanted to extended the life cycle of this particular one for secret reasons of her own. I noped all of that. All of the Old Gods had to die. Her last ditch attempt was to tell me that Loghain would be heralded a hero if he took the dying blow. I remember scoffing at that. Aeducan was returning to Orzammar when it was over. Why would she care about glory among humans she would not even remain with?
So I let Loghain take the blow when he asked for it. I hadn't decided at that point, but he presented his case well enough. Maybe it would be small consolation for Alistair when word got to him. Maybe not.
I had been best friends with Morrigan up until the dark ritual where things really soured. I ended up attacking her in Witch Hunt because she was still not giving answers and manipulated things so she could personally escape. I wanted to break the mirror so she couldn't use it, but since that wasn't an option, stabbing was result. Was not prepared for that kicked puppy look and that dramatic slow motion. Hated her plot armor, hated her status as the darling of the franchise, hated that I was being made the bad person for viewing her otherwise.
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Post by doflamingodonquijote on Mar 1, 2017 16:36:35 GMT
Was not prepared for that kicked puppy look and that dramatic slow motion. Hated her plot armor, hated her status as the darling of the franchise, hated that I was being made the bad person for viewing her otherwise. I agree especially with your final considerations about Gaider's attempt to try to portray the GW who attacked Morrigan as the villains of the story in addiction of ensuring a plot armor to her. Look at the Dog,when you talk about the need to eliminate Morrigan he makes a sad expression,which didn't made any sense to me considering that I've recruited the Dog in the Dlc Return to Ostagar and I've had dismissed Morrigan long before he was even recruited,so the Dog didn't even knew her.Why he was sad or happy when he approached her on the mirror for that matter?
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Post by phoray on Mar 1, 2017 16:53:32 GMT
I have 6 Wardens planned or done.
1. 1st PT: City Elf -Dark Ritual, Loghain executed 2. 2nd PT: Cousland- Dark Ritual, Loghain Executed 3. Surana- Loghain did US 4. Brosca- Dark Ritual, Loghain Executed 5. Mahariel- Ultimate Sacrifice, Loghain Executed. 6. Amell- Ultimate Sacrifice, Loghain sent on to be Fear Demon bait.
Sounds like a strong natural preference for Dark Ritual
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Post by adrianbc on Mar 1, 2017 16:54:59 GMT
I agree especially with your final considerations about Gaider's attempt to try to portray the GW who attacked Morrigan as the villains of the story in addiction of ensuring a plot armor to her. Look at the Dog,when you talk about the need to eliminate Morrigan he makes a sad expression,which didn't made any sense to me considering that I've recruited the Dog in the Dlc Return to Ostagar and I've had dismissed Morrigan long before he was even recruited,so the Dog didn't even knew her.Why he was sad or happy when he approached her on the mirror for that matter? It`s all your fault! Always your fault, and never Gaider`s! You fail to understand that the mabari is not just a dog, but also your Warden`s animal conscience, linked to him by some sort of Gaiderian nevermindwhatbullshit conduit, fuelled by Fade, blood, Abracadabra or other useful or useless energies or fictions. My point is, dear doflamingodonquijote that your Warden should ALWAYS listen to her/his dog!!! In fact, it would be better to let him to take your Warden`s place. This way you will finally play DA:O as it was meant to be played, as Gaider wanted to be played! But we misunderstood him and put the Warden in charge... Poor misunderstood Gaider ... :sob:
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Post by Prince on Mar 1, 2017 17:35:57 GMT
Was not prepared for that kicked puppy look and that dramatic slow motion. Hated her plot armor, hated her status as the darling of the franchise, hated that I was being made the bad person for viewing her otherwise. I agree especially with your final considerations about Gaider's attempt to try to portray the GW who attacked Morrigan as the villains of the story in addiction of ensuring a plot armor to her. Look at the Dog,when you talk about the need to eliminate Morrigan he makes a sad expression,which didn't made any sense to me considering that I've recruited the Dog in the Dlc Return to Ostagar and I've had dismissed Morrigan long before he was even recruited,so the Dog didn't even knew her.Why he was sad or happy when he approached her on the mirror for that matter? Sometimes Witch Hunt cannot really work correctly as far as the game recognizing what choices the warden made.This creates a wide open dialog tree with no narrowing based on the particular story arc, confusing to say the least. My only conclusion is that WH is really only relevant if the player chose to utalize the dark ritual.If the player as i normally do chooses to minimize Morrigan's participation in Origins by most importantly refusal of the dark ritual, or as i do total removal of her character by cutting her loose in Lotharin, WH is irrelevant,in short a waste of money.
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Post by doflamingodonquijote on Mar 1, 2017 18:22:12 GMT
It`s all your fault! Always your fault, and never Gaider`s! You fail to understand that the mabari is not just a dog, but also your Warden`s animal conscience, linked to him by some sort of Gaiderian nevermindwhatbullshit conduit, fuelled by Fade, blood, Abracadabra or other useful or useless energies or fictions. My point is, dear doflamingodonquijote that your Warden should ALWAYS listen to her/his dog!!! In fact, it would be better to let him to take your Warden`s place. This way you will finally play DA:O as it was meant to be played, as Gaider wanted to be played! But we misunderstood him and put the Warden in charge... Poor misunderstood Gaider ... :sob: I should remind myself to name the dog David Gaider before starting to play WH that way his behaviour will make sense.He will make his own feasts and wag his tail at her near the mirror,when writer and writer's pet will finally meet with each other. Perhaps that was the whole purpose of WH after all.
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Post by Gilsa on Mar 1, 2017 18:22:17 GMT
I agree. I remember when Witch Hunt was being promoted before it was released. The ads said "All your questions answered!" Of course, the big question was why Morrigan wanted to do the dark ritual, what couldn't she tell us at the time? I also remember Gaider getting irritated at the promotion and he had them change it because, of course, that wasn't going to happen.
It was a waste of money for my canon state. No doubt about that. I did have a Brosca that romanced Morrigan (just to see the extra dialogue that a female character couldn't access and to see what would become of a dwarf godbaby) so it wasn't a complete wash.
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Post by adrianbc on Mar 1, 2017 18:38:33 GMT
I should remind myself to name the dog David Gaider before starting to play WH that way his behaviour will make sense.He will make his own feasts and wag his tail at her near the mirror,when writer and writer's pet will finally meet with each other. Perhaps that was the whole purpose of WH after all. Man, this is sooo good that I still cannot stop laughing! Witch Hunt is so buggy about the Warden - Morrigan relationship that the only sane reaction is to LOL! I will use your idea of naming the dog David Gaider in my next DA:O playthrough. I currently have a Dalish Mahariel parked at Ostagar, still waiting to be made a GW. A perfect setup for David Gaider to make his DA:O appearance. The only sad thing is that I`ll have to renounce to my traditional "Warp" name for the Warden`s mabari. Well, loses and gains, as always. Loses and gains ...
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Post by Kei on Mar 5, 2017 22:53:52 GMT
hated that I was being made the bad person for viewing her otherwise. Perhaps they are the "bad person" in Gaider's own view .To me all the wardens that destroyed that thing for the sake of the people and that even attacked the apostate witch who was raving on about "how everything should change and how everyone should bow to change because is what they truly need"(kinda like that lunatic of Solas) are not heroes and neither they're villains,they are double heroes.She is the one who should change not the whole world for her.
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Post by heliosdisciple on Mar 6, 2017 15:44:00 GMT
My Prince Aeducan saw being a Warden as a continuation of, not an escape from, his sentence for kinslaying, "fight the enemies of Orzammar until your death". Accepting Morrigan's deal would've been dishonorable, even above all the other issues about wanting to save an Old God and such.
He wound up letting Loghain take the final blow after he asked to make things right (and partly cause I was gonna continue into Awakening)...but since a BioWare Warden (BioWareden?)later goes off to end the Calling, aka get out of his sentence, I'm gonna go back and do it as an Sacrifice ending.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 8, 2017 0:06:33 GMT
Non-Canon
Female Amell, Warden Alistair romance, let Alistair did the DR
Male Cousland, Morrigan Romance, Married Anora (became Prince-Consort), did the DR himself
Male Aeducan, Morrigan Romance, Refused to do the DR, let Loghain kill the Archdemon
Male Cousland, Leliana Romance, Did the DR himself
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Yep, I never made one my warden's commit to the US...
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Mar 10, 2024 18:44:44 GMT
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Iddy
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August 2016
iddy
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Post by Iddy on Mar 8, 2017 19:41:16 GMT
1)The AD soul is in the hands of Flemeth it is not a resource of yours. 2)The child is messed up when it is born as an OGB and altered by Flemeth once again. 3)The GW will be killed regardless by the calling but before of that they will become ghouls. 1.) Well; it's in the hands of Morrigan. And long as you can make a claim to being it's father, always a possibility of manipulation. Either way; it's a distant future when your about to go to battle in the next day against a horde of blighted creatures and a god-dragon with no chance of survival if you don't do it. Biological clock's going to be ticking like crazy either way. 2.) From what your given for information it will be basically healthy, which it is, strong and healthy far as kids go. Some uncomfortable dreams but aside from that; pretty well off. 3.) Everybody dies; nice not to have to die tomorrow, especially if you took the potion and there's some chance of living another couple hundred years. Also nice to have a kid when you don't basically have that option otherwise. Don't want your family line to die with you potentially and now it's part god. It's so refreshing to see someone actually mention Kieran's well being in a debate about the DR. Most players don't care.
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