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Post by dutchsghost7 on Feb 28, 2017 1:38:08 GMT
Middle-Earth: Shadow of War has not one but two black Gondorians. Gondorians were clearly based off a European group but fuck what Tolkien wrote. WE black now.
Sjw shills can stuff it.
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Post by dutchsghost7 on Feb 28, 2017 1:39:49 GMT
Ib4 they are haradrim. Haradrim were wrote as swarthy, same with black numerorians. Far-Harad were literally half-orcs/troll breed people.
There's supposed to be no black people in middle-earth. Tolkien didn't write them in.
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Post by Treacherous J Slither on Feb 28, 2017 16:47:40 GMT
What European group were they based off of?
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Post by masterwarderz on Feb 28, 2017 16:56:24 GMT
What European group were they based off of? Byzantium if I recall correctly. |
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Heimdall
N6
∯ Interjector in Chief
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Post by Heimdall on Feb 28, 2017 17:22:40 GMT
What European group were they based off of? Byzantium if I recall correctly. Does that mean Rohan is based on Germanic peoples (makes sense given they seem to be the only ones with blondes.) and the old kingdom of Arnor in the North is some kind of Roman Britain parallel complete with fending off savage invaders from the north? (Connecting the Numenorian origins of both kingdoms to Rome?) |
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Post by Treacherous J Slither on Feb 28, 2017 17:31:48 GMT
I Googled them.
Nothing distinctive about their appearance or manner of dress.
Guess it's just pushy, out of place inclusiveness.
Like with that show Merlin that had blacks everywhere for no reason. I don't personally have an issue with inclusiveness in a dark ages setting (i prefer it actually) as long as it's explained in some way. There was no explanation.
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Post by Treacherous J Slither on Feb 28, 2017 17:33:43 GMT
What European group were they based off of? Byzantium if I recall correctly. I was just looking at Google image and saw a bunch of white guys in full body armor. Looked boring. The designs i mean. Not very imaginative. |
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Iakus
N7
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Post by Iakus on Feb 28, 2017 17:37:10 GMT
If I recall correctly, Gondor is practically the only human nation in the West of Middle Earth where it's not implausible to find various races of humans.
Gondor was not colonized only by the Dunedain, but by a number of peoples over the years, the Numenorean exiles being just the latest.
Take a look a the muster at Minas Tirith in Return of the King, and the soldier who arrived from around the nation. The people from the southern provinces are I believe described as being "swarthier" than others.
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Post by Iakus on Feb 28, 2017 17:37:35 GMT
Byzantium if I recall correctly. Does that mean Rohan is based on Germanic peoples (makes sense given they seem to be the only ones with blondes.) and the old kingdom of Arnor in the North is some kind of Roman Britain parallel complete with fending off savage invaders from the north? (Connecting the Numenorian origins of both kingdoms to Rome?) Rohan is pretty much Vikings on horseback |
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Post by Iakus on Feb 28, 2017 17:39:02 GMT
What European group were they based off of? Byzantium if I recall correctly. A mix of Italy and (ancient) Egypt, apparently. |
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Post by Treacherous J Slither on Feb 28, 2017 17:52:32 GMT
Byzantium if I recall correctly. A mix of Italy and (ancient) Egypt, apparently. Well if ancient Egypt was part of the inspiration for the Gondorian people then it would make sense to have blacks among them including arabs and whites. So unless Iakus is wrong, maybe you should rethink your stance TC. |
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Post by dutchsghost7 on Feb 28, 2017 22:56:43 GMT
Byzantium if I recall correctly. A mix of Italy and (ancient) Egypt, apparently. Gondor is based off the Roman Empire. Everythint south of gondor was swarthy land in other worlds people that looked like Arabs or Persians. There were no blacks in middle-earth. Just more bs sjw crap for cheap inclusiveness of minorities just cuz... |
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Post by Iakus on Feb 28, 2017 23:47:06 GMT
A mix of Italy and (ancient) Egypt, apparently. Gondor is based off the Roman Empire. Everythint south of gondor was swarthy land in other worlds people that looked like Arabs or Persians. There were no blacks in middle-earth. Just more bs sjw crap for cheap inclusiveness of minorities just cuz... Return of the King, when Pippen saw Forlong of Lossmarch and his men coming to aid Minas Tirith. Edit: There are also the Druedain, the "Wild Men of the Forest" but they lived apart from other men and were unlikely to be in service to Gondor. |
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Post by Melra on Mar 1, 2017 3:24:16 GMT
Well since it's not canon and the story seems kinda random to begin with, not sure if wrong skin color is the first thing that should catch one's eye.
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Post by dutchsghost7 on Mar 1, 2017 4:29:41 GMT
Gondor is based off the Roman Empire. Everythint south of gondor was swarthy land in other worlds people that looked like Arabs or Persians. There were no blacks in middle-earth. Just more bs sjw crap for cheap inclusiveness of minorities just cuz... Return of the King, when Pippen saw Forlong of Lossmarch and his men coming to aid Minas Tirith. Edit: There are also the Druedain, the "Wild Men of the Forest" but they lived apart from other men and were unlikely to be in service to Gondor. How does this imply their were black people in gondor though? |
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Post by slimgrin on Mar 1, 2017 6:39:37 GMT
Here's the thing. These people are making money off the presumption there's a certain race in the lore. I don't fucking care care if there aren't turtles in middle earth - if it's not in your IP, then don't invent them.
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Post by Serza on Mar 1, 2017 9:36:03 GMT
Hi Dutch!
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Post by The Dashing Rogue on Mar 1, 2017 11:18:30 GMT
It feels like pandering and it just seems really out of place, almost like how Peter Jackson had like two random token minorities appear in the Hobbit movies. As a huge Tolkien fan I really don't want to see his legacy tainted by sjw bullshit.
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Post by Babar Guy on Mar 1, 2017 11:25:17 GMT
muh evil sjw agenda
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Post by Deleted on Mar 1, 2017 11:47:45 GMT
Don't really care too much about the game but it does seem kind of out of place considering that black people in LOTR are supposed to be the people who sided with the big bad. tolkiengateway.net/wiki/Haradrim |
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Post by Treacherous J Slither on Mar 1, 2017 12:55:55 GMT
Ancient Egypt had plenty of blacks. You can't include a nation based off of a great north African empire and then turn around and get mad when some black people show up.
If you do then you're probably a racist POS.
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Post by dutchsghost7 on Mar 1, 2017 17:08:03 GMT
Ancient Egypt had plenty of blacks. You can't include a nation based off of a great north African empire and then turn around and get mad when some black people show up. If you do then you're probably a racist POS. Gondor isnt based off Egypt.... and blacks in ancient Egypt were Nubian slaves. |
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N7
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Post by Iakus on Mar 1, 2017 17:46:49 GMT
Ancient Egypt had plenty of blacks. You can't include a nation based off of a great north African empire and then turn around and get mad when some black people show up. If you do then you're probably a racist POS. Gondor isnt based off Egypt.... and blacks in ancient Egypt were Nubian slaves. In part, though, it is. Tolkien even said in one of his letters that the crown of the kings of Gondor resembled the double crown of the pharaohs of ancient Egypt. Look, I'm as much a purist as anyone, particularly when it comes to Tolkien. To this day I'm p*ssed that the Scouring of the Shire wasn't filmed for the movies. And it was a mistake to remove Glorfindal for Arwen. But this is one aspect that's really a minor detail. It's at least theoretically possible, especially in Gondor's southern provinces, which had more contact with Easterlings (heck Umbar used to be ruled by Gondor!) |
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Post by Treacherous J Slither on Mar 1, 2017 18:43:38 GMT
Ancient Egypt had plenty of blacks. You can't include a nation based off of a great north African empire and then turn around and get mad when some black people show up. If you do then you're probably a racist POS. Gondor isnt based off Egypt.... and blacks in ancient Egypt were Nubian slaves. If ancient Egypt was part of the inspiration for the Gondorian people then it makes sense for there to be blacks among them. The same is true of ancient Rome. The empire stretched over much of the Old World which included large parts of Africa. Also, what kind of sense does it make for every black person in ancient Egypt to be a slave? Do you seriously believe that a prosperous civilization wouldn't attract people from various surrounding lands to live, work, raise families, ply their trades, and sell their goods there? An argument can even be made that the ancient Egyptians were black themselves. |
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Heimdall
N6
∯ Interjector in Chief
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Post by Heimdall on Mar 1, 2017 19:56:51 GMT
Gondor isnt based off Egypt.... and blacks in ancient Egypt were Nubian slaves. If ancient Egypt was part of the inspiration for the Gondorian people then it makes sense for there to be blacks among them. The same is true of ancient Rome. The empire stretched over much of the Old World which included large parts of Africa. Also, what kind of sense does it make for every black person in ancient Egypt to be a slave? Do you seriously believe that a prosperous civilization wouldn't attract people from various surrounding lands to live, work, raise families, ply their trades, and sell their goods there? An argument can even be made that the ancient Egyptians were black themselves. Well, the massive desert and generally hazardous environment surrounding said civilization to the west and southwest was a bit of a deterrent. In all seriousness, from what little I know the early Egyptians traded with Nubians, being one of the few neighbors close enough, they probably were plenty there. As to whether they were black themselves, hard to say. I'm hesitant to define "blackness". Their ancestors came from Africa, apparently from the western desert, but I can't say how closely they resembled sub-Saharan Africans in appearance. Certainly there may have been a demographic shift as the civilization grew closer to the Mediterranean and interacted with the emerging Mesopotamian civilizations. Though I suppose I don't like talking about Egypt as an "African" civilization because that suggests a sort of pan-African identity or culture that is ahistorical and ignores that one of the most striking things about Ancient Egypt is that it sprung up independently. |
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