Logain Mac Tir Thread - "The traitor Teyrn. Yes. I've heard all the names"

Jun 20, 2017 6:02:49 GMT tacsear said:

Jun 20, 2017 2:12:11 GMT @goldengail said:

I DISAGREE

but anyhow I've left loghian alive. He was a better chap for my Aeducan than Alistair was.

Strout doesn't really have a backstory and Alistair is just bad and is not canon in comics

Meh I love Alistair, but I keep Loghian alive every once in awhile when I'm not romancing him.

Jun 22, 2017 15:45:49 GMT tacsear said:

Jun 22, 2017 15:39:29 GMT Iddy said:

Well, there is his defense of cooperating with Tevinter slavers. He tells you it was strategically good as it would bring money for the war effort and morally good because it would save the elves from the darkspawn. Whether the latter actually was part of his motivation is anyone's guess.

I was particularly taken aback when he asked "What is a worse fate, I wonder? To live as a slave or die without hope in the alienage?". You'd think the man whose life was defined by the struggle to become free from Orlesian rule would know the answer to that.

Well it was a move to bring in money for the war, that was the reason he did it btw I'm not defending slavery or anything what he did was horrible but he states his reason behind his actions
Where does he say that line, I cannot remember it. It's completely out of his character

I don't think it's out of character at all. That he applies his beliefs inconsistently, is, IMHO, not a sign of bad writing or characterization - quite the opposite, in fact.  We don't have to look very hard to find plenty of real world examples - both historic and contemporary - of "I absolutely believe in freedom!  But not for those people, of course!"  People tend to act that way, unfortunately.  "Slavery or alienage" is probably all the choice that he imagines elves to have.  That's not his fault, exactly; what we've seen of Thedas over the course of the series suggests that that's the attitude of most humans, and a significant proportion of elves.

Anyway, this thread has inspired me to create a Warden who is destined to spare him both at the Landsmeet and in the final battle.  My canon Warden let him live at the Landsmeet, but had him slay the Archdemon (it was a matter of politics), and other Wardens have executed him, so I've not yet seen him in DAI.

Jun 22, 2017 19:27:28 GMT @carefull said:

I can't even entertain a thought of sparing him. Cailan and Duncan, I just won't be able to "get over it".

I'm intrigued by the thought processes of Wardens who spare him.  It's obvious why a Warden would want to kill him.  But why stay your hand instead?  What would drive a person to make that choice?

My canon Warden, as I mentioned earlier, spared him for political reasons:  she'd arranged for Alistair to marry Anora and take the throne, and thought that keeping Loghain alive (but removed from the political scene) would be better for everyone.  She still hated what Loghain had done and had no love for the man himself, but felt that the good of the country took precedence over her personal feelings; the two of them had that much in common.

I started an elf Warden, thinking that she (who hated Alistair) might also spare him.  I never finished that particular playthrough, but looking ahead to the end I could see that this character would never be able to overlook the alienage situation, no matter how much she might want to spite Al.

Now I've rolled up a human noble, intended future king, and he'll spare Loghain primarily to keep Anora happy and to get rid of a potential threat to his rule (i.e., Alistair).  So, again, politics, but of a rather more selfish kind.

Jun 23, 2017 12:19:05 GMT @dustyelf said:

Jun 23, 2017 10:00:54 GMT tacsear said:

I cannot understand the hatred for Anora. She doesn't crossbow you anywhere, she doesn't approve of her fathers' actions, she is really smart and a capable ruler
Why would anyone hate her

I don't think it is  a matter of hating her rather that she is a powerful political opponent. Its a smart move to eliminate her before she has a chance to recover from her fathers death and start to manipulate behind the scene and undermine Alistairs rule as king if you choose that option for Alistiair to be King. 

Marry Anora and Alistair and she will run the Ferelden and relegate Alistair to the sidelines hardened Alistair or not. If your warden is fine with that it will work fine for Ferelden. She is political savvy and does care about her country much like her father.

And this is precisely why my politically motivated canon Warden wished to cultivate her as an ally.  She could make a powerful partner for Alistair, who is, at the time of the Landsmeet, a political neophyte and complete unknown.  His glaring weaknesses could only lead to more instability - in that Warden's opinion; in-game I know that there aren't major repercussions to having Al rule on his own.  She can shore up Al precisely where he's weakest; if they work together, they have the capacity to become a real power couple.  But this relies on Loghain being alive.  And that is why that Warden of mine spared him.

But, yeah, if a Warden's determined to be her opponent, it's safer just to remove her entirely.