Heimdall
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Post by Heimdall on Apr 18, 2018 8:44:07 GMT
I'm very curious and somewhat wary of that bit about "must be designed to continue delivering new stories and experience." Back in my day that meant post-game DLC, what does it mean now? Is it like what Shadow of War did? Is it like Sims with a slow drip of piecemeal DLC with the most recent thing being DLC for DLC? I don't know what designing a game for continued storytelling is gonna look like and it makes me nervous. Still post-game DLC I think. The general aim of these games-as-a-service things is to save costs by reducing the number of full games they output, instead adding on to existing games for longer.
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Post by river82 on Apr 18, 2018 8:56:28 GMT
Pretty much nothing. Paragraph 1 - Outlining scope of future entries Paragraph 2 - Small piece of history most people already know interspersed with excessively positive language Paragraph 3 - Small piece of history most people already know interspersed with the right sounds and words to appease the frustrated Paragraph 4 - Many buzzwords and a restatement of Bioware's core values Paragraph 5 - A statement detailing the current scenario of which most people already know with the promise that it feels distinctly "Bioware" (whatever that means, considering "Bioware games" have gone through many changes since Baldur's Gate. KOTOR didn't feel like their previous games in some ways, and DA2 feels almost nothing like their old games, so ...) Paragraph 6 - Outlining scope of future entry Paragraph 7 - His name
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Heimdall
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Post by Heimdall on Apr 18, 2018 9:30:36 GMT
Also, his emphasis on story and characters seems to indicate that he wants games-as-a-service to take the form of story DLC of the sort Bioware has traditionally produced, which I find encouraging.
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Post by dropzofcrimzon on Apr 18, 2018 12:34:38 GMT
this game has a huge uphill battle. People actively WANT Bioware to fail, WANT Bioware to shut down, simply to piss on their graves. Most places it's the same thing, 'inquisiton sucks DA4 will be shit' 'ME3/MEA sucked andromeda will be shit.' over and over and over. Me, i'm willing to see. People pretend, even right here on this thread, they can't have a narrative + multiplayer, which is simply foolish stance to take because SW:TOR does it without much issue. SW:TOR. You can play it single player, you can play it grouped, it has a strong narrative and makes a good case for being KOTOR3. it's main problem is that gameplay wise it's a wimpy WoW knockoff. But the story, particularly the 1-50 class stories, are some of the best bioware has written.The fact that some of you don't want to give them a chance is a bad joke. They've shown it can be done. It wasn't perfect, but they learned a lot - and their next showing, in their own IP that they lovingly crafted like they lovingly crafted all their IPs, might show some of what they learned. you do know there is a difference between a mission based game in which each mission can be soloed or co oped like TOR and a shared world like Destiny/the division right? Some of the mechanics, interaction and classic Bioware trappings people want might be sorely incompatible with it.
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Heimdall
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Staff Mini-Profile Theme: Heimdall
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by Heimdall on Apr 18, 2018 12:49:22 GMT
this game has a huge uphill battle. People actively WANT Bioware to fail, WANT Bioware to shut down, simply to piss on their graves. Most places it's the same thing, 'inquisiton sucks DA4 will be shit' 'ME3/MEA sucked andromeda will be shit.' over and over and over. Me, i'm willing to see. People pretend, even right here on this thread, they can't have a narrative + multiplayer, which is simply foolish stance to take because SW:TOR does it without much issue. SW:TOR. You can play it single player, you can play it grouped, it has a strong narrative and makes a good case for being KOTOR3. it's main problem is that gameplay wise it's a wimpy WoW knockoff. But the story, particularly the 1-50 class stories, are some of the best bioware has written.The fact that some of you don't want to give them a chance is a bad joke. They've shown it can be done. It wasn't perfect, but they learned a lot - and their next showing, in their own IP that they lovingly crafted like they lovingly crafted all their IPs, might show some of what they learned. you do know there is a difference between a mission based game in which each mission can be soloed or co oped like TOR and a shared world like Destiny/the division right? Some of the mechanics, interaction and classic Bioware trappings people want might be sorely incompatible with it. Destiny is the very definition of a mission based game, so I can only assume you’ve never played it. Yes, there is a shared area, but virtually all the content is behind instanced missions of one sort of another. There’s very little about shared-world game design that is any more incompatible with Bioware’s trappings than SWTOR.
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Post by MediocreOgre on Apr 18, 2018 14:36:16 GMT
I do not envy BW for having to navigate their “return” after MEA. Fans are upset BW mishandled MEA and now is moving away from its single player RPG roots. The extremist gamer bro world went into hysteria after MEA that BW is “sjw trash.” And the neutral consumer is swimming in a sea of shooters of varying levels of online connectivity wondering what anthem has to offer them. Plus EA shat in The bed a couple times.
Uphill battle definitely and at least BioWare is starting to measure the depth of the hole they fell in after MEA. But they need to start figuring how to crawl out of it soon, and i really hope they do because i like BW. But blog posts don’t do much besides draw attention to how little we know about anthem.
That said i feel rather useless as i am not going to buy anthem no matter what. Even if it was the best of its genre i can’t play it (no time. No interest) and thus wont buy it. So its pretty frustrating as a fan of BW’s other ips who would buy DA4 in a heartbeat (unless it was like MEA) to have to wait through this storm.
BW is sitting right on the pot. Now they gotta perform or get off. And we as fans can’t do much but assess what they produce for their effort. Good luck guys!
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Post by Warrick on Apr 18, 2018 15:25:39 GMT
I like that he mentioned innovation. Historically, Bioware is an innovative company, but it became derivative because of the success of Mass Effect and Dragon Age. I'm itching for something new, surprising. New stories and experiences; worlds that evolve. Sounds great. Unfortunately it also sounds corporate.
Can we call Anthem "new and surprising"? It's tempting to derisively call it Destiny Of Halo 7. What I want the most is for it to stand out unique, like Mass Effect did.
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Post by Sartoz on Apr 18, 2018 16:48:48 GMT
Hm... Innovation can turn a game into a huge success or to a meh response.
Also, a game that percolates for seven years before launch can turn into a flop because other studios spit out quality games much faster that Bio is doing. In the case of Anthem, we had Destiny and its type launched and played.... which may make Anthem seem "old" / "similar". Bio's innovation becomes lost in a sea of already launched and familiar games.
This is a concern. This "innovation" better be "new" and "unique". More important, it better be "captivating" and "sustainable".
This is why corp speak (Casey's blog) is all about the visual and game description bait, something to be wary of. It really revealed nothing new.
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Post by snowleopard25 on Apr 18, 2018 18:58:39 GMT
This was a standard "reassurance" message, designed to let fans, Bioware devs, and especially EA parent corp execs know that everything is going great.
Nothing new here, just regular old Bioware game development, move along folks...
It sure is hard to find something interesting to write about when we know so little. They sure aren't telling us much, considering the game is expected to launch within a year.
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Post by Iakus on Apr 18, 2018 20:48:32 GMT
This was a standard "reassurance" message, designed to let fans, Bioware devs, and especially EA parent corp execs know that everything is going great. Nothing new here, just regular old Bioware game development, move along folks... It sure is hard to find something interesting to write about when we know so little. They sure aren't telling us much, considering the game is expected to launch within a year.
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Post by Iakus on Apr 18, 2018 20:53:52 GMT
I do not envy BW for having to navigate their “return” after MEA. Fans are upset BW mishandled MEA and now is moving away from its single player RPG roots. The extremist gamer bro world went into hysteria after MEA that BW is “sjw trash.” And the neutral consumer is swimming in a sea of shooters of varying levels of online connectivity wondering what anthem has to offer them. Plus EA shat in The bed a couple times. Uphill battle definitely and at least BioWare is starting to measure the depth of the hole they fell in after MEA. But they need to start figuring how to crawl out of it soon, and i really hope they do because i like BW. But blog posts don’t do much besides draw attention to how little we know about anthem. That said i feel rather useless as i am not going to buy anthem no matter what. Even if it was the best of its genre i can’t play it (no time. No interest) and thus wont buy it. So its pretty frustrating as a fan of BW’s other ips who would buy DA4 in a heartbeat (unless it was like MEA) to have to wait through this storm. BW is sitting right on the pot. Now they gotta perform or get off. And we as fans can’t do much but assess what they produce for their effort. Good luck guys! Especially since MEA was supposed to be their "return" after mishandling ME3... But yeah, there's a number of RPGs coming out in the next year by indie studios who still actually have an interest in making RPGs rather than crib off of Bungie.
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Post by river82 on Apr 18, 2018 21:30:53 GMT
Especially since MEA was supposed to be their "return" after mishandling ME3... But yeah, there's a number of RPGs coming out in the next year by indie studios who still actually have an interest in making RPGs rather than crib off of Bungie. Pillars of Eternity 2 less than a month away!
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Post by Iakus on Apr 18, 2018 21:45:38 GMT
Especially since MEA was supposed to be their "return" after mishandling ME3... But yeah, there's a number of RPGs coming out in the next year by indie studios who still actually have an interest in making RPGs rather than crib off of Bungie. Pillars of Eternity 2 less than a month away! Deadfire next month Vampyr in June Banner Saga 3 in July Greedfall and Call of Cthulhu later this year Wasteland 3 and Kingmaker next year. This doesn't even include the Telltale Games titles.
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Post by dropzofcrimzon on Apr 18, 2018 22:15:32 GMT
you do know there is a difference between a mission based game in which each mission can be soloed or co oped like TOR and a shared world like Destiny/the division right? Some of the mechanics, interaction and classic Bioware trappings people want might be sorely incompatible with it. Destiny is the very definition of a mission based game, so I can only assume you’ve never played it. Yes, there is a shared area, but virtually all the content is behind instanced missions of one sort of another. There’s very little about shared-world game design that is any more incompatible with Bioware’s trappings than SWTOR. uhm...look up my gamertag to see if I played it? Yeah I have. What I am saying is that things like crew interaction unless the game is structured differently than destiny and /or requires huge suspension of disbelief might not work
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by Heimdall on Apr 18, 2018 22:22:34 GMT
Destiny is the very definition of a mission based game, so I can only assume you’ve never played it. Yes, there is a shared area, but virtually all the content is behind instanced missions of one sort of another. There’s very little about shared-world game design that is any more incompatible with Bioware’s trappings than SWTOR. uhm...look up my gamertag to see if I played it? Yeah I have. What I am saying is that things like crew interaction unless the game is structured differently than destiny and /or requires huge suspension of disbelief might not work I don’t really see why it couldn’t be structured differently. Even just an instanced section of Fort Tarsis would suffice for that.
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Post by Sartoz on Apr 19, 2018 0:38:48 GMT
Too bad casey made no mention about this giant exo suit. link: Giant From the image, our free lancer fits in the torso. I wonder why it sports human hands instead of more specialized appendages. I mean, that robot in the original Robo Cop had some serious weapons and it needed no human like arms or legs for locomotion or for weapon fire.. Would this be a "cosmetic" of choice with weapon upgrade capabilities? Not suited for exploration but why not have specialized suits? Maybe we'll have giant mechs to battle the enemies. Edit: Actually this tidbit from EA Anthem Official site ".. your choices will irrevocably change you—and the world around you...." I feel Casey ought to have explained further since he alluded to "traditional stories".
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Post by Iakus on Apr 19, 2018 1:05:12 GMT
Edit: Actually this tidbit from EA Anthem Official site "..your choices will irrevocably change you—and the world around you...." I feel Casey ought to have explained further since he alluded to "traditional stories".
How the hell can choices change the world around you when you have to share it with every other bro out there who may have chosen differently?
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Post by simit on Apr 19, 2018 2:07:55 GMT
Since wee dont know i can only guess and guess by looking at world of warcraft and there "phasing" but in all honesty that was more annoying than anything when i played, especially in wotlk, no idea if it been improved though.
I hope at E3 some clarification on the shared world is forthcoming ie do they mean shared if you group up like the division or is it permanently shared as in you always see ppl, more info definitely for the better at this point
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Post by clips7 on Apr 19, 2018 3:24:19 GMT
Hm... Innovation can turn a game into a huge success or to a meh response.
Also, a game that percolates for seven years before launch can turn into a flop because other studios spit out quality games much faster that Bio is doing. In the case of Anthem, we had Destiny and its type launched and played.... which may make Anthem seem "old" / "similar". Bio's innovation becomes lost in a sea of already launched and familiar games.
This is a concern. This "innovation" better be "new" and "unique". More important, it better be "captivating" and "sustainable".
This is why corp speak (Casey's blog) is all about the visual and game description bait, something to be wary of. It really revealed nothing new.
This always concerned me with such games that are in production for awhile. And it makes me wonder if changes are made to previous aspects of the game if the developer sees other innovations being implemented in other games...Anthem has been in production for a looong time and i wonder if it will benefit or falter from it....
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Post by simit on Apr 19, 2018 4:31:15 GMT
Its no really though especially with it being a new ip, I'd honestly say it had about right amount of dev time, but only a release will tell
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Post by Kedan on Apr 19, 2018 6:00:59 GMT
Any time I read something by Casey, I just remember the interviews leading up to the release of ME3 and assume that the opposite of whatever he’s saying is true.
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Post by Pearl on Apr 19, 2018 8:16:02 GMT
Especially since MEA was supposed to be their "return" after mishandling ME3... I don't think I'll ever get over the fact that I only played through ME3 four or five times and then spent over 1500 hours on the multiplayer. I must have done 50+ playthroughs of ME2 and another 30ish of ME1 over the years, and while 3 wasn't abysmal it just didn't have the same charm that 1 and 2 had. Gameplay was pretty fun though, hence why I spent so much time on the MP.
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Post by hivemind on Apr 19, 2018 12:07:06 GMT
I think with BioWare's approach to DLC, they risk stepping on the same Rake as MEA. They risk end up creating a good stories, that was left unfinished, so that they could be concluded in DLC's. One of the things that killed MEA was that the only interesting bits of story that it had was left for DLC's.
If there is anything "Quarian ark" can teach BioWare, it's that you should make a good game first and worry about DLC later.
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Post by SofaJockey on Apr 19, 2018 13:30:00 GMT
spent over 1500 hours on the multiplayer. I think I was around 1,200 hours in MP. That's why I have anticipation for Anthem. IF they can find the 'secret sauce' that made MEMP work, that could be good.
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Post by SofaJockey on Apr 19, 2018 13:56:18 GMT
Maybe part of it is that many people just wanted a co-op game with a Sci-fi theme, and at the time there was no better alternative? I think it was more than that. Not getting repeat items was good, not having a re-skin apocalypse was good. The weekly events were better handled that with DAI and MEAMP even if the latter games were more automated. The maps were excellent and iconic. Even the details - Krogan roar and headbutt in ME3, but not in MEA.
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