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185
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Apr 22, 2024 21:10:56 GMT
30,246
Hanako Ikezawa
22,353
August 2016
hanakoikezawa
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Jan 12, 2020 17:44:29 GMT
Just because the Dalish as a whole (each clan is so different it really isn’t wise to clump them all together) are isolationist, it doesn’t mean they don’t pay attention to what the rest of the world is doing since that could affect them too Also a possibility. With explanation. What further explanation does it need?
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Jan 25, 2020 19:06:39 GMT
1,712
Sonya
1,332
December 2019
jackmorte
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Neverwinter Nights
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Post by Sonya on Jan 12, 2020 17:50:59 GMT
What further explanation does it need? What made you think it even needs any expanation? For me everything is clear as day. Can't say about others - I don't read minds. And, yes, I still have my own opinion.
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Apr 22, 2024 21:10:56 GMT
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22,353
August 2016
hanakoikezawa
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Jan 12, 2020 18:01:13 GMT
What further explanation does it need? What made you think it even needs any expanation? For me everything is clear as day. Can't say about others - I don't read minds. And, yes, I still have my own opinion. I thought you were saying it needed more of an explanation so was asking what more you needed.
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11368
0
Jan 25, 2020 19:06:39 GMT
1,712
Sonya
1,332
December 2019
jackmorte
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Neverwinter Nights
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Post by Sonya on Jan 12, 2020 18:11:37 GMT
I thought you were saying it needed more of an explanation so was asking what more you needed. No. I said you expressed your opinion WITH explanation already. And I understand what you mean.
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11368
0
Jan 25, 2020 19:06:39 GMT
1,712
Sonya
1,332
December 2019
jackmorte
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Neverwinter Nights
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Post by Sonya on Jan 12, 2020 20:50:56 GMT
There's no any benefit to the Dalish to send their mages to the Circle. Sorry? What does this phrase have to do with the discussion "Whom to send to the gethering"? There are NO circles anymore, there is NO templar order. There is only war. the inforation about the knowledge interesting combination of words. but don't worth the risk. Is it your opinion or what? And about what exactly since your first phrase is very strange. If an opinion, it is written in a very strange form, unclear, worth-crarifying form.
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Wanted Apostate
127
0
Apr 22, 2024 10:49:42 GMT
18,241
Catilina
11,030
August 2016
catilina
Top
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by Catilina on Jan 12, 2020 21:00:37 GMT
There's no any benefit to the Dalish to send their mages to the Circle. Sorry? What does this phrase have to do with the discussion "Whom to send to the gethering"? There are NO circles anymore, there is NO templar order. There is only war. the inforation about the knowledge interesting combination of words. but don't worth the risk. Is it your opinion or what? And about what exactly since your first phrase is very strange. If an opinion, it is written in a very strange form, unclear, worth-crarifying form. 1. Misunderstanding. It's a DA2 thread. I thought, it was about there is any reason to Dalish clans to send their mages to the Circle. In DA2 the Circle exists. 2. Information about knowledge? What is weird in those words? To gather information about the magical knowledge and training. True, there was a mistyping.
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11368
0
Jan 25, 2020 19:06:39 GMT
1,712
Sonya
1,332
December 2019
jackmorte
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Neverwinter Nights
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Post by Sonya on Jan 12, 2020 21:05:28 GMT
1. Misunderstanding. It's a DA2 thread. I thought, it was about there is any reason to Dalish clans to send their mages to the Circle. In DA2 the Circle exists. 2. Information about knowledge? What is weird in those words? To gather information about the magical knowledge and training. True, there was a mistyping. Great. Grand merci for clarification. Would have been nice to have other answers for very impotant questions in another thread, but your choice, understand if nothing to say.
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Apr 22, 2024 21:10:56 GMT
30,246
Hanako Ikezawa
22,353
August 2016
hanakoikezawa
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Jan 12, 2020 21:20:06 GMT
There's no any benefit to the Dalish to send their mages to the Circle. Sorry? What does this phrase have to do with the discussion "Whom to send to the gethering"? There are NO circles anymore, there is NO templar order. There is only war. Thats not quite accurate. The Templar Order still exists, it just broke the alliance it had with the Chantry after the Circles voted for independence and the war started.
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0
Jan 25, 2020 19:06:39 GMT
1,712
Sonya
1,332
December 2019
jackmorte
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Neverwinter Nights
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Post by Sonya on Jan 12, 2020 21:31:12 GMT
The Templar Order still exists red templars exist. But the Templar Order that used to exist - there is no more of that. There are only corrupted/blind/stupid/ etc warriors who call themselves "Templars". They failed, just like mages. Only in the end a player choose what to do with those people who used to be part of the Templar order.
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Apr 22, 2024 21:10:56 GMT
30,246
Hanako Ikezawa
22,353
August 2016
hanakoikezawa
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Jan 12, 2020 23:56:36 GMT
The Templar Order still exists red templars exist. But the Templar Order that used to exist - there is no more of that. There are only corrupted/blind/stupid/ etc warriors who call themselves "Templars". They failed, just like mages. Only in the end a player choose what to do with those people who used to be part of the Templar order. At the beginning of the game the Templar Order still exists. Then depending on your choices they either remain and become an ally of the Inquisition, are dissolved and become a part of the Inquisition, or become the Red Templars.
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inherit
11368
0
Jan 25, 2020 19:06:39 GMT
1,712
Sonya
1,332
December 2019
jackmorte
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Neverwinter Nights
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Post by Sonya on Jan 13, 2020 9:31:28 GMT
At the beginning of the game the Templar Order still exists. Then depending on your choices they either remain and become an ally of the Inquisition, are dissolved and become a part of the Inquisition, or become the Red Templars. Red Templars already extist when you arrive there. Not corrupted (fortunate for them Inq has arrived) knew something was fishy about lyrium, the red ones already behaved strange. Barris tells some things about that all. They knew and did nothing. Their own inaction was part of what had happened and the rest paid the price. They failed. Calling a large groupe of failed blind wariors "a Templar Order" doesn't make it true. They failed. Like many others.
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Apr 22, 2024 21:10:56 GMT
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Hanako Ikezawa
22,353
August 2016
hanakoikezawa
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Jan 13, 2020 14:02:56 GMT
At the beginning of the game the Templar Order still exists. Then depending on your choices they either remain and become an ally of the Inquisition, are dissolved and become a part of the Inquisition, or become the Red Templars. Red Templars already extist when you arrive there. Not corrupted (fortunate for them Inq has arrived) knew something was fishy about lyrium, the red ones already behaved strange. Barris tells some things about that all. They knew and did nothing. Their own inaction was part of what had happened and the rest paid the price. They failed. Calling a large groupe of failed blind wariors "a Templar Order" doesn't make it true. They failed. Like many others. And those Red Templars try to turn the other Templars and kill those who resist. The non-RTs are still the Templar Order. The lore and game outright state that so saying they aren’t is wrong.
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11368
0
Jan 25, 2020 19:06:39 GMT
1,712
Sonya
1,332
December 2019
jackmorte
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Neverwinter Nights
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Post by Sonya on Jan 13, 2020 14:21:05 GMT
And those Red Templars try to turn the other Templars and kill those who resist yes. So saying Inq later decide the fate of the warriors who call themselves Templars is wrong in the part that concerns RTs. Then depending on your choices they either remain and become an ally of the Inquisition, are dissolved and become a part of the Inquisition, or become the Red Templars. RT are already there. The lore and the game outright state that so saying otherwise is wrong. The lore and game outright state that so saying they aren’t is wrong. I see no templar order in the game. Only idiots/cowads/blind morons + only some reasonable warriors in the place where a templar order used to be. The lore and the game state there are templars there, there is no Templar Order. It is gone. Blind templars still can say what they want, as they failed gravely anyway, but the order exist no longer.
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Apr 22, 2024 21:10:56 GMT
30,246
Hanako Ikezawa
22,353
August 2016
hanakoikezawa
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Jan 13, 2020 14:30:47 GMT
And those Red Templars try to turn the other Templars and kill those who resist yes. So saying Inq later decide the fate of the warriors who call themselves Templars is wrong in the part that concerns RTs. Then depending on your choices they either remain and become an ally of the Inquisition, are dissolved and become a part of the Inquisition, or become the Red Templars. RT are already there. The lore and the game outright state that so saying otherwise is wrong. The lore and game outright state that so saying they aren’t is wrong. I see no templar order in the game. Only idiots/cowads/blind morons + only some reasonable warriors in the place where a templar order used to be. The lore and the game state there are templars there, there is no Templar Order. It is gone. Blind templars still can say what they want, as they failed gravely anyway, but the order exist no longer. If you are going to ignore literally what the game and lore tells you, then there’s no point continuing this discussion with you. Goodbye.
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inherit
11368
0
Jan 25, 2020 19:06:39 GMT
1,712
Sonya
1,332
December 2019
jackmorte
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Neverwinter Nights
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Post by Sonya on Jan 13, 2020 14:55:43 GMT
If you are going to ignore literally what the game and lore tells you, then there’s no point continuing this discussion with you it is not what you said. It is my vision of the situation, different from....well, in this situation....everything, including you. And I tried and tried again and again to explain it. If you unable to understand that obvious thing - too bad, Hanako IkezawaDiscussions with you were always interesting. Hope you'll change your mind.
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Champion of Kirkwall
1212
0
8,023
Sifr
3,737
Aug 25, 2016 20:05:11 GMT
August 2016
sifr
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire
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Post by Sifr on Jan 14, 2020 7:59:51 GMT
If I might interject, Sonya is correct here.
The Templar Order is technically gone during Inquisition and those we meet in the game are merely the remnants of it, as templars as a unified order ceased following their decision to break the Nevarran Accord and go rogue from the Chantry.
The Templars further fractured when Cole assassinated Lord Seeker Lambert, so that those who had followed him now were left without leadership, leading some to turn brigand (like those in the Hinterlands), while others chose to follow Lucius and attempt to reunify at Therinfall, only to fall victim to Envy and the Red Templars.
The Templars that ended up joining the Inquisition were made up from Templars who were at the Conclave and chose to join at the start of the game, those who were saved at Therinfall, as well as any branches that hadn't gone rogue or had remained protecting Loyalist Circles.
By recruiting the Templars into the Inquisition, you are effectively reunifying the Templar Order under your leadership.
If you sided with the Mages, the Templars likely ended up reunifying following the defeat of Corypheus, rejoining the Chantry and re-establishing their role overseeing the reformed Circle.
(The Circle continues to exist in some form in all worldstates. It's either restored by Divine Cassandra or Vivienne, or else set up by Vivienne to rival the independent College of Enchanters set up by a Divine Leliana).
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Apr 22, 2024 21:10:56 GMT
30,246
Hanako Ikezawa
22,353
August 2016
hanakoikezawa
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Jan 14, 2020 8:16:08 GMT
If I might interject, Sonya is correct here. The Templar Order is technically gone during Inquisition and those we meet in the game are merely the remnants of it, as templars as a unified order ceased following their decision to break the Nevarran Accord and go rogue from the Chantry. The Templars further fractured when Cole assassinated Lord Seeker Lambert, so that those who had followed him now were left without leadership, leading some to turn brigand (like those in the Hinterlands), while others chose to follow Lucius and attempt to reunify at Therinfall, only to fall victim to Envy and the Red Templars. The Templars that ended up joining the Inquisition were made up from Templars who were at the Conclave and chose to join at the start of the game, those who were saved at Therinfall, as well as any branches that hadn't gone rogue or had remained protecting Loyalist Circles. By recruiting the Templars into the Inquisition, you are effectively reunifying the Templar Order under your leadership. If you sided with the Mages, the Templars likely ended up reunifying following the defeat of Corypheus, rejoining the Chantry and re-establishing their role overseeing the reformed Circle. (The Circle continues to exist in some form in all worldstates. It's either restored by Divine Cassandra or Vivienne, or else set up by Vivienne to rival the independent College of Enchanters set up by a Divine Leliana). You are incorrect. The Order is not gone during Inquisition, technically or otherwise. The Templar Order and Seekers became independent of the Chantry after Lambert dissolved the Accords. This didn't break the Orders. Yes some left, either to stay with the Chantry or become brigands, but that doesn't mean the Order is gone. It just means those members defected from them. After Lambert was assassinated, the Order elected Lucius to be their new leader same as they would any time in the centuries of their existence. This was all before the Conclave, hence why they were invited to it since they were still an order similar to the mages still being the Circles, just independent of the Chantry. If they were just a bunch of individuals, things would have been handled differently since those kinds of talks would be pointless. And yes as events went more and more fractured, but the order was still in place at the moment the Inquisition either offered them a position as allies or demanded they dissolve the order and become part of the Inquisition. The choice wouldn't be "Preserve the Order" or "Disband the Order" if there was no Order.
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inherit
Champion of Kirkwall
1212
0
8,023
Sifr
3,737
Aug 25, 2016 20:05:11 GMT
August 2016
sifr
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire
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Post by Sifr on Jan 14, 2020 9:20:36 GMT
You are incorrect. The Order is not gone during Inquisition, technically or otherwise. The Templar Order and Seekers became independent of the Chantry after Lambert dissolved the Accords. This didn't break the Orders. Yes some left, either to stay with the Chantry or become brigands, but that doesn't mean the Order is gone. It just means those members defected from them. After Lambert was assassinated, the Order elected Lucius to be their new leader same as they would any time in the centuries of their existence. This was all before the Conclave, hence why they were invited to it since they were still an order similar to the mages still being the Circles, just independent of the Chantry. If they were just a bunch of individuals, things would have been handled differently since those kinds of talks would be pointless. And yes as events went more and more fractured, but the order was still in place at the moment the Inquisition either offered them a position as allies or demanded they dissolve the order and become part of the Inquisition. The choice wouldn't be "Preserve the Order" or "Disband the Order" if there was no Order. Not really, as it would be a massive stretch to call the Templars in Inquisition "the Order".
They had broken from the Chantry, fragmented into multiple groups with differing ideas and goals about what they should do going forward, their leadership under both Lambert and Lucius was questionable when you remember that the Seekers and Templars were separate branches of the Chantry. Does the leader of the Seekers of Truth even have the authority to lead the Templars as his own personal fiefdom?
While Templars representing what remained of the Order under Lucius were present at the Conclave, I suspect the bulk of the Templars in attendance were no different than the Mages, individual Templars or groups that were rudderless and hoping for unity and that Justinia could manage to sort out a peaceful end to the conflict.
The question that's begged is if the Templar "Order" was present at the Conclave in any meaningful way, wouldn't their first act have been to regroup their survivors at Haven, monitor the Breach and figure out some plan to seal it... y'know, rather than running off to Val Royeaux to push some priests around, then heading to Therinfal to sit on their hands, while the "heretical" Inquisition was left to solve their mess?
Just because we got the option to "Preserve the Order" or "Disband the Order", doesn't mean that the Order existed in any meaningful way. If so, wouldn't all the Templars have been united at Therinfal, rather than us having to bring those from other Circles into the fold? Same is true of recruiting the Mage Rebellion, it doesn't mean that we recruited all the rebel mages, but only those that were gathered in Redcliffe. We still had to convince in the rebels that were in hiding to join us, but it's doubtful that all the rebels did.
My point is that the Templar Order as an instituition does not really exist in Inquisition, at least not in the same way that it did in Origins or DA2.
What does exist are a group of rogue ex-Templars waging a pointless crusade against magic, while making various attempts to grab political power, all the while styling themselves as "The Templar Order". No-one is denying that they were once Templars and part of the Order, but... well, if an ex-cop dons their old uniforms and walks around with a gun, that doesn't mean they're still part of the police force, does it?
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inherit
11368
0
Jan 25, 2020 19:06:39 GMT
1,712
Sonya
1,332
December 2019
jackmorte
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Neverwinter Nights
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Post by Sonya on Jan 15, 2020 19:22:10 GMT
if an ex-cop dons their old uniforms and walks around with a gun, that doesn't mean they're still part of the police force, actually this example suits imo nicely to describe ex-templars. What is the purpose of the Templar Order? Fight abominations/rogue mages/blood mages/such things. But what do we see in DAI? They do nothing that concerns their direct duties. At all. We just see people, who see abominations and demons nearby, doing nothing, or went rogue, who just HAPPEN to wear a templar uniform. Technically , those are warriors who drink lyrium (blue or red). And one more thing. I on purpose created another character to figure out what I already knew, but still wanted to check again: listened (even reloaded to listen again just in case) everything with the words "Tempar". If the phrase " Termplar Order" was used somewhere, it was used with the meaning "used to be". Spent several hours to do that thanks to Hanako Ikezawa (it is not an accusation, the choice is mine). Though I like her style of communacation (it is part of her charm, as with Morrigan), you'll hear only "I am right, you are wrong". Also part of her charm, but there should be limits (who knows, maybe Hanako Ikezawa already tagged me as" ignore" as had said her "adiues"). Well, too bad. I still would like to communicate with her, like her charm (Hope I was not wrong with sex-determination, as it is not indcated. If wrong - I am sorry). At least some good things went out from those "check-for-small-reason" hours": 1) I like my 2h reaver female cute dwarf; 2) I romance Sera; 3) I anyway like to play 2h reaver. Well, again, from the game I saw no comfirmation that technically Templar Order exists (even checked spending several hours).
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Scribbles
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0
Apr 22, 2024 21:10:56 GMT
30,246
Hanako Ikezawa
22,353
August 2016
hanakoikezawa
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Jan 15, 2020 20:17:15 GMT
You are incorrect. The Order is not gone during Inquisition, technically or otherwise. The Templar Order and Seekers became independent of the Chantry after Lambert dissolved the Accords. This didn't break the Orders. Yes some left, either to stay with the Chantry or become brigands, but that doesn't mean the Order is gone. It just means those members defected from them. After Lambert was assassinated, the Order elected Lucius to be their new leader same as they would any time in the centuries of their existence. This was all before the Conclave, hence why they were invited to it since they were still an order similar to the mages still being the Circles, just independent of the Chantry. If they were just a bunch of individuals, things would have been handled differently since those kinds of talks would be pointless. And yes as events went more and more fractured, but the order was still in place at the moment the Inquisition either offered them a position as allies or demanded they dissolve the order and become part of the Inquisition. The choice wouldn't be "Preserve the Order" or "Disband the Order" if there was no Order. Not really, as it would be a massive stretch to call the Templars in Inquisition "the Order".
They had broken from the Chantry, fragmented into multiple groups with differing ideas and goals about what they should do going forward, their leadership under both Lambert and Lucius was questionable when you remember that the Seekers and Templars were separate branches of the Chantry. Does the leader of the Seekers of Truth even have the authority to lead the Templars as his own personal fiefdom?
While Templars representing what remained of the Order under Lucius were present at the Conclave, I suspect the bulk of the Templars in attendance were no different than the Mages, individual Templars or groups that were rudderless and hoping for unity and that Justinia could manage to sort out a peaceful end to the conflict.
The question that's begged is if the Templar "Order" was present at the Conclave in any meaningful way, wouldn't their first act have been to regroup their survivors at Haven, monitor the Breach and figure out some plan to seal it... y'know, rather than running off to Val Royeaux to push some priests around, then heading to Therinfal to sit on their hands, while the "heretical" Inquisition was left to solve their mess?
Just because we got the option to "Preserve the Order" or "Disband the Order", doesn't mean that the Order existed in any meaningful way. If so, wouldn't all the Templars have been united at Therinfal, rather than us having to bring those from other Circles into the fold? Same is true of recruiting the Mage Rebellion, it doesn't mean that we recruited all the rebel mages, but only those that were gathered in Redcliffe. We still had to convince in the rebels that were in hiding to join us, but it's doubtful that all the rebels did.
My point is that the Templar Order as an instituition does not really exist in Inquisition, at least not in the same way that it did in Origins or DA2.
What does exist are a group of rogue ex-Templars waging a pointless crusade against magic, while making various attempts to grab political power, all the while styling themselves as "The Templar Order". No-one is denying that they were once Templars and part of the Order, but... well, if an ex-cop dons their old uniforms and walks around with a gun, that doesn't mean they're still part of the police force, does it? Not a stretch at all really, since that's what they are. Even in this post of yours you change position from they aren't the Templar Order to they aren't the same as what they were before DAI, which is completely different thing. As for your example, that isn't applicable because they aren't ex-cops pretending to be cops. The Templar Order wasn't a part of the Chantry the same way the police force is a part of a government, they were an independent organization that joined in an alliance with the Chantry. A better example would be if say a state broke away from the United States, the government officials in that state aren't ex-government but are still the governor, mayor, etc of that now independent state. Now as for them not doing what they should have done such as keep an eye on the Breach, sure I agree with that. But then again their bosses we learned weren't really their bosses, but instead an Envy Demon leading a bunch of secret Red Templars thus people who wanted the Breach.
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Scribbles
185
0
Apr 22, 2024 21:10:56 GMT
30,246
Hanako Ikezawa
22,353
August 2016
hanakoikezawa
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Jan 15, 2020 20:20:28 GMT
if an ex-cop dons their old uniforms and walks around with a gun, that doesn't mean they're still part of the police force, actually this example suits imo nicely to describe ex-templars. What is the purpose of the Templar Order? Fight abominations/rogue mages/blood mages/such things. But what do we see in DAI? They do nothing that concerns their direct duties. At all. We just see people, who see abominations and demons nearby, doing nothing, or went rogue, who just HAPPEN to wear a templar uniform. Technically , those are warriors who drink lyrium (blue or red). And one more thing. I on purpose created another character to figure out what I already knew, but still wanted to check again: listened (even reloaded to listen again just in case) everything with the words "Tempar". If the phrase " Termplar Order" was used somewhere, it was used with the meaning "used to be". Spent several hours to do that thanks to Hanako Ikezawa (it is not an accusation, the choice is mine). Though I like her style of communacation (it is part of her charm, as with Morrigan), you'll hear only "I am right, you are wrong". Also part of her charm, but there should be limits (who knows, maybe Hanako Ikezawa already tagged me as" ignore" as had said her "adiues"). Well, too bad. I still would like to communicate with her, like her charm (Hope I was not wrong with sex-determination, as it is not indcated. If wrong - I am sorry). At least some good things went out from those "check-for-small-reason" hours": 1) I like my 2h reaver female cute dwarf; 2) I romance Sera; 3) I anyway like to play 2h reaver. Well, again, from the game I saw no comfirmation that technically Templar Order exists (even checked spending several hours). You aren't on my Ignore list yet. Even if you were, you'd probably be in the "Ignore but still look at the post and reply sometimes" category like Sifr is. What do you mean when you say I'm like Morrigan? Also we should all probably drop this conversation since it doersn't have anything to do with the topic of the thread.
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inherit
11368
0
Jan 25, 2020 19:06:39 GMT
1,712
Sonya
1,332
December 2019
jackmorte
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Neverwinter Nights
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Post by Sonya on Jan 15, 2020 22:43:12 GMT
What do you mean when you say I'm like Morrigan? now I'll describe Morrigan, not you. You know that Morrigan is different from your other DAO companions, her choices, dialogues etc etc. Most people think they are evil. Imo DAO choices are not evil, they are grey anyway. Thus, I don't think that Morrigan is evil because of this or that, I think of that as part of her charm, she is just different from other companions (in fact they are all different, but Morrigan in nombre 1 amoung them for obvious reasons. But I still stab her in DLC WH as she has been lying to me the whole time + the stabbing scene is nicely made, I really enjoy it). The same with you: your style of communication is different, so people argue with you, ignore and hate etc etc. Imo it is just part of your style of communication and I like it (maybe cauze I myself hear it often from people while talking to them in real life, they say I am really rude, though I don't understand why). I like your short comments, sometimes your posts seem rude as other people think, but I actually don't care, it is part of your charm I would say. BUT, as I wrote there should be limits and your posts could be really rude in this way: "If you don't agree with me, you are wrong", EVEN (it is important!!!) if others give their own arguments. You just ignore them. And that part is really rude and annoying. If peope don't agree about something, it doesn't mean the end of the world. I never understood why people behave like you in those cases. Mystery for the ages. Don't agree? Fine. Let's go drink café. But, as I said, I had only 1 such annoying thing with you. Anyway, I still like your style of communication and would like to continue discussions about some other topics if they are somewhere. Now, the last thing I've heard from you "Bye". Nevertheless you all of a sudden comment my post You aren't on my Ignore list yet. Even if you were, you'd probably be in the "Ignore but still look at the post and reply sometimes" category like Sifr is. aha, what a relief. Now I can sleep at last. Thank you so much for not ignoring me totalement. I expressed my opinion. Do as you want: in our world there are still countries with freedoms. For now at least. Also we should all probably drop this conversation since it doersn't have anything to do with the topic of the thread. Yes.
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Post by Sifr on Jan 17, 2020 18:03:27 GMT
Not a stretch at all really, since that's what they are. Even in this post of yours you change position from they aren't the Templar Order to they aren't the same as what they were before DAI, which is completely different thing. Not at all, because the Templar Order as it stood prior to Inquisition would now be considered a defunct entity, meaning that those who have gone rogue would best be described as either former members of the Templar Order or members of the former Templar Order.
As for your example, that isn't applicable because they aren't ex-cops pretending to be cops. The Templar Order wasn't a part of the Chantry the same way the police force is a part of a government, they were an independent organization that joined in an alliance with the Chantry. From the bits of historical information we're given in Inquisition, the Nevarran Accord was signed between the Chantry and the First Inquisition, the latter being eventually restructured into the Seekers of Truth and the Templar Order. The Templar Order was formed in 1:20 Divine, meaning that it has always existed as part of the Chantry, rather than having ever been an independent group.
Jaws of Hakkon also states that in Ameridan's time, the practice of ingesting lyrium to combat magic was relatively uncommon and only something that had recently begun. That Ameridan is heralded as the last Inquisitor of the first Inquisition and prior to his disappearance was a contemporary of Drakon I, this suggests that Templars (as we know them today) did not exist prior to the formation of the Order.
A better example would be if say a state broke away from the United States, the government officials in that state aren't ex-government but are still the governor, mayor, etc of that now independent state. Just because these ex-government members might refer to themselves by the same titles they formerly held, doesn't mean that from the perspective of the nation they seceded from (along with other nations who don't support them) they aren't rebels acting as the illegitimate government of a rogue nation.
Having left their control, the Chantry wouldn't be inclined to recognise the now rogue-Templars as members of a legitimate organisation, much in the way that they didn't (initially) recognise the Inquisition's legitimacy as an organisation either.
You aren't on my Ignore list yet. Even if you were, you'd probably be in the "Ignore but still look at the post and reply sometimes" category like Sifr is. Well, that's... charming. But I suppose a token bit of acknowledgement is something, I guess? So I'm going to take that as a win, ta!
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire
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Post by Sifr on Jan 17, 2020 18:50:49 GMT
In the interests of getting back on topic; With regards to Jowan, his use of blood magic does make sense in a way - I heard several times now that templars cannot block blood- or blight-based magic, though I cannot for the heck of it find an in-game source. Of course, no Chantry or Tevinter source would give any trustworthy info on this question if it means harming their power base in some way or the other. I might have an answer for this;
Templar and Seeker abilities are able to disrupt mana, thereby negating a mage's ability to cast.
As Blood Magic does not rely on mana as a power source to fuel spells, this means that Templars cannot prevent them from casting. Seekers however could prevent blood mages from casting by using their ability to manipulate/ignite lyrium in the blood in order to paralyse/incapacitate them.
We still don't know much about Blight Magic, only that it's different from blood magic and (according to Avernus) completely alien to demons. Despite being derived from Dwarven broodmothers, there are Genlock Emissaries capable of using magic, Red Lyrium might have some connection to Blight Magic (due to some of the powers demonstrated by Red Templars) and Corypheus and the Architect both seem to employ it in some manner.
There's also an implication that the Ancient Elves (possibly Andruil) might have discovered/employed Blight Magic at some point, which might be the reason that Solas takes such a dim view on the Wardens for messing around with it, because he knows it's not a toy.
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR
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Post by Noxluxe on Jan 17, 2020 20:51:25 GMT
I might have an answer for this; Templar and Seeker abilities are able to disrupt mana, thereby negating a mage's ability to cast. As Blood Magic does not rely on mana as a power source to fuel spells, this means that Templars cannot prevent them from casting. Seekers however could prevent blood mages from casting by using their ability to manipulate/ignite lyrium in the blood in order to paralyse/incapacitate them. We still don't know much about Blight Magic, only that it's different from blood magic and (according to Avernus) completely alien to demons. Despite being derived from Dwarven broodmothers, there are Genlock Emissaries capable of using magic, Red Lyrium might have some connection to Blight Magic (due to some of the powers demonstrated by Red Templars) and Corypheus and the Architect both seem to employ it in some manner. There's also an implication that the Ancient Elves (possibly Andruil) might have discovered/employed Blight Magic at some point, which might be the reason that Solas takes such a dim view on the Wardens for messing around with it, because he knows it's not a toy. I find it pretty interesting that Blight Magic also seems significantly weaker than the regular kind. Emissaries can be dangerous, but most of them don't use any particularly advanced or impressive spells and even the most powerful ones don't seem to have access to what a really strong mage can put out. My money would be on it being artificial somehow, created either by the Elvhenan or another - and probably equally destructive - magical civilization before them. Gurh. You just inspired me to read up on the lore about Andruil and yeah, it was probably her. That's some horrifying images. It would also lend a bit of poetic irony to Dalish Wardens who favored her as their pratron. Which is to say, almost every Dalish Warden ever made. Praising her virtues while fighting her legacy tooth and nail. You aren't on my Ignore list yet. Even if you were, you'd probably be in the "Ignore but still look at the post and reply sometimes" category like Sifr is. What do you mean when you say I'm like Morrigan? Pretty mean thing to just throw out there. I can sort of see it. Morrigan has that dignity and rigid certainty in her opinions which also makes it easy for people to offend her sensibilities, such as they are, and after a certain point she just stops caring about framing her thoughts diplomatically because to her they're clearly objective statements that stupid or delusional or weak-willed fools are trying to worm their way out of having to face. Then again, that could describe almost anyone who ever engaged in a debate on the internet to some extent. Myself absolutely not excluded. Maybe there's a reason we all get along so well. You're the polar opposite of her in terms of your actual worldview though, at least from my impression of you. Still, it's an interesting comparison. And not as unflattering as it maybe sounds. Lots of people adore Morrigan, either in spite of or because of how uncompromising she seems.
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