I started a thread like this on the old boards, and wanted to carry on with it here.
The next Dragon Age is still years away with both Sony and Microsoft having their next gen consoles out long before then. Even as a PC player, this is great news, as a rising tide lifts all ships, etc., etc...
E3 showed off a lot of cool new games, and it really got me thinking about what game engine/gameplay features would be nice to see in the next game.
First up... Photogrammetry.
EA used this extensively in their Star Wars: Battlefront game. For those who don't know, it involves taking a lot of pictures of a real-world locations/props and using software to create 3D meshes from them. The benefit is that you can create these ultra-realistic in-game locations. Real world locations having a lot of subtlety and nuances that are almost impossible to replicate by hand.
Prior to this, I remember following the development of The Vanishing of Ethan Carter by a tiny 8 person studio called The Astronauts. That was the first time I'd heard the term photogrammetry, and after playing the game, I knew this would be the Next Big Thing™ for creating realistic environments.
I've always wondered if Ethan Carter inspired EA to go that route for SW Battlefront. Whether it did or not, they clearly took that technology and ran with it. It is pure, unadulterated, landscape porn. But after wiping the drool off my chin for the umpteenth time, I thought to myself... these locations in SW:BF aren't even that interesting. But still... utterly gorgeous. (/Zevran)
And this is no slight on the game, I thought it was inspired to go back to the locations where they originally filmed the movies. And the results are clearly there. But I kept thinking, what if they used this tech and incorporated... more interesting locales?
And another great video showcasing the technology...
This is a big one - I hope BioWare runs with it in future RPGs. I think the pieces are in place, given the experience DICE has with it (in the Frostbite Engine no less), the new generation of consoles coming out, and because you know other RPG developers will taking a long, hard look at this.
At the Sony Press Conference, they revealed a new zombie game called Days Gone. Their crowd technology is amazing, especially given the high detail, open-world surroundings. It's like it incorporates fluid dynamics or something...
Now just imagine if this was a Darkspawn Horde... or spiders. It would be great to see BioWare employ crowd tech along these lines.
In this Gears of War 4 demo, we see some cool, extreme weather effects and destructible environments. We had a taste of it in DAI, but it would be nice see more dynamic weather - just don't go to the extent Witcher 3 went with it and have it miserable out nearly every hour of every day... And I'd like to see more destructible environments, especially in set-piece battles where you can gain some tactical advantage in doing so.
And I think it's good thing to shake a place up (once in a while) with a little inclement weather...
One thing they teased in the run-up to DAI were sandstorms that would force you to seek shelter and these cool, little dustdevils rolling around the landscape...
The one distinct improvement I noticed in our own Frostbite Engine coming with ME:A were the much improved facial animations (and details around the eyes). This will really help sell those cinematic conversation scenes.
I'm not sure if they're incorporating more mocap, or just improved tools, or both... but whatever they're doing - they're doing it right.
And speaking of motion capture, I hope to see it incorporated even more into their future games. It's expensive, true... but the results can't be denied. And EA Burnaby has one of the, if not the, best mocap studios in the world.
We had cinematic finishers in Origins (and they were awesome), but not in the subsequent games (and no, the exploding bodies don't count! ). And I was fine with that... right up until I started playing DOOM.
We need those Glory Kills back. Glory Kills in Frostbite-driven awesomeness.
Another one is... Day/Night Cycles & Changing Seasons.
With DA games often spanning years, it would be great if we could revisit regions and jump into key plot points during different times of the year.
Imagine a huge battle or laying siege to a castle and the difference between attacking during the day in the middle of summer vs the middle of the night... in a snowstorm. Watching cities change with seasons, rivers freezing over or drought opening up new areas to explore, etc., etc..
In the E3 video for the Secret IP, we were teased with Frostbite-driven Day/Night/Season changes - which looked promising! Hopefully, that'll also get incorporated into their future games...
We had cinematic finishers in Origins (and there were awesome), but not in the subsequent games (and no, the exploding bodies don't count! ??? ). And I was fine with that... right up until I started playing DOOM.
We need those Glory Kills back. Glory Kills in Frostbite-driven awesomeness.
YES!!!!!!!!!!
As long as they are coded not to appear for 'named' characters who won't necessarily be faced in battle, depending on the players choices.
Example: say you have a companion, let's call her...Luliana. And say you do something that makes her angry and she attacks you and you defeat her. I wouldn't want to see her be decapitated and then have her appear in a subsequent game saying "I got better". Actually, I'm fine with it, I just don't need to see the aggro from people who think a randomly generated finisher is the same as established canon.
"Kneel before the Lord Dragon, or you will be knelt." 21 Feb 2019 at 6:59am - It has not been forgotten. It will not be forgiven. We've now met seven times... Revenge is ice cream - Serza, April 2020 Also known as Mike, David, Scott or Bruce
Post by Obsidian Gryphon on Aug 4, 2016 1:24:57 GMT
Grab mechanics ala Dragon's Dogma when fighting big critters. Cause and effect damage to the part being attacked; say crippling dmg to wings, disabling ability to fly. Or the legs, reducing the critter's ability to jump about, etc.
Cross class skills ala DD. I really don't like the restrictions in DAI.
Home/B5BM/B5 SIL Faith manages-Delenn "Throw it and you're bedroom shoes!" - Honor Harrington to Nimitz Dester'edre shena Tale'sedrin
Uh Hrungr I feel like you're showing me a menu of how to upgrade my house LOL I WANT IT ALLL GIMMEEEE!
I don't know enough about the technology behind all of those things but I can definitely see the impact on games- that Battlefront game- I picked up the demo on my XB1- it was gorgeous but boring.
Which reminds me of films with consideration for CGI and nothing else. Plot is very important to me- I just want to care about why I'm running though a beautiful environment and making glory kills.
"Doubt thou that the stars are fire; Doubt that the sun doth move; Doubt truth to be a liar; But never doubt I love."- Shakespeare/Hamlet
Grab mechanics ala Dragon's Dogma when fighting big critters. Cause and effect damage to the part being attacked; say crippling dmg to wings, disabling ability to fly. Or the legs, reducing the critter's ability to jump about, etc.
Cross class skills ala DD. I really don't like the restrictions in DAI.
Yeah, I've never been on board with the restrictions that began in DA2 (and got worse in Inquisition). I understood their reasoning, I just didn't like it.
"Kneel before the Lord Dragon, or you will be knelt." 21 Feb 2019 at 6:59am - It has not been forgotten. It will not be forgiven. We've now met seven times... Revenge is ice cream - Serza, April 2020 Also known as Mike, David, Scott or Bruce
Uh Hrungr I feel like you're showing me a menu of how to upgrade my house LOL I WANT IT ALLL GIMMEEEE!
I don't know enough about the technology behind all of those things but I can definitely see the impact on games- that Battlefront game- I picked up the demo on my XB1- it was gorgeous but boring.
Which reminds me of films with consideration for CGI and nothing else. Plot is very important to me- I just want to care about why I'm running though a beautiful environment and making glory kills.
In a nutshell, why I play these games.
"Kneel before the Lord Dragon, or you will be knelt." 21 Feb 2019 at 6:59am - It has not been forgotten. It will not be forgiven. We've now met seven times... Revenge is ice cream - Serza, April 2020 Also known as Mike, David, Scott or Bruce
We had cinematic finishers in Origins (and there were awesome), but not in the subsequent games (and no, the exploding bodies don't count! ??? ). And I was fine with that... right up until I started playing DOOM.
We need those Glory Kills back. Glory Kills in Frostbite-driven awesomeness.
YES!!!!!!!!!!
As long as they are coded not to appear for 'named' characters who won't necessarily be faced in battle, depending on the players choices.
Example: say you have a companion, let's call her...Luliana. And say you do something that makes her angry and she attacks you and you defeat her. I wouldn't want to see her be decapitated and then have her appear in a subsequent game saying "I got better". Actually, I'm fine with it, I just don't need to see the aggro from people who think a randomly generated finisher is the same as established canon.
Yeah, I'd hope they'd at least... strongly consider turning off the "remove spine from torso" feature for NPCs they're even vaguely considering appearing in future games...
Grab mechanics ala Dragon's Dogma when fighting big critters. Cause and effect damage to the part being attacked; say crippling dmg to wings, disabling ability to fly. Or the legs, reducing the critter's ability to jump about, etc.
Cross class skills ala DD. I really don't like the restrictions in DAI.
Haven't played DD, but I've seen some gameplay. DAI incorporated a few crippling effects for Dragons (limbs, but not wings) apart from the other stun/stagger/sleep effects. I'd definitely like to see that expanded upon too.
But I haven't seen how the cross-class skills work in DD. I didn't mind the way DAI handled it, though I'd love to see the 8-ability-on-bar limit lifted in the next game as well as more hybrid classes.
Uh Hrungr I feel like you're showing me a menu of how to upgrade my house LOL I WANT IT ALLL GIMMEEEE!
I don't know enough about the technology behind all of those things but I can definitely see the impact on games- that Battlefront game- I picked up the demo on my XB1- it was gorgeous but boring.
Which reminds me of films with consideration for CGI and nothing else. Plot is very important to me- I just want to care about why I'm running though a beautiful environment and making glory kills.
Indeed! On the writing side though, I feel it's in good hands with Patrick at the helm. But as a lot of the DA writing team has moved onto the Secret IP, so I hope he gets the support he needs (if they don't come back to DA).
I confess to missing a lot of aspects in Kingdoms of Amalur:the Reckoning. Combat, running and crafting was soooo buttery smooth. If I have to pick one thing I wish for, it's chakrams for mages. I felt badass for hurling them like a wannabe Xena!
"I am neither an early bird or a night owl. I am some form of permanently exhausted pigeon."
I confess to missing a lot of aspects in Kingdoms of Amalur:the Reckoning. Combat, running and crafting was soooo buttery smooth. If I have to pick one thing I wish for, it's chakrams for mages. I felt badass for hurling them like a wannabe Xena!
Ooo, those are really cool. Could use some in DA!
Home/B5BM/B5 SIL Faith manages-Delenn "Throw it and you're bedroom shoes!" - Honor Harrington to Nimitz Dester'edre shena Tale'sedrin
I confess to missing a lot of aspects in Kingdoms of Amalur:the Reckoning. Combat, running and crafting was soooo buttery smooth. If I have to pick one thing I wish for, it's chakrams for mages. I felt badass for hurling them like a wannabe Xena!
Ooo, those are really cool. Could use some in DA!
Best part was how you could charge the weapons to prevent flanking! And if they had elemental damage? Mwahahaha!
"I am neither an early bird or a night owl. I am some form of permanently exhausted pigeon."
Grab mechanics ala Dragon's Dogma when fighting big critters. Cause and effect damage to the part being attacked; say crippling dmg to wings, disabling ability to fly. Or the legs, reducing the critter's ability to jump about, etc.
Cross class skills ala DD. I really don't like the restrictions in DAI.
Haven't played DD, but I've seen some gameplay. DAI incorporated a few crippling effects for Dragons (limbs, but not wings) apart from the other stun/stagger/sleep effects. I'd definitely like to see that expanded upon too.
But I haven't seen how the cross-class skills work in DD. I didn't mind the way DAI handled it, though I'd love to see the 8-ability-on-bar limit lifted in the next game as well as more hybrid classes.
The level cap for DD is really high which is why cross-class skills can be done. Because the cap is 200, players find themselves on the treadmill which I do not recommend for DA. Also, players can switch class as and when they like. This cannot be done for DA.
Back on skills. For DD, from level 1 - 100, the core stats (str, dex, magic, resistance to magic, etc, etc) can be augmented by the three basic vocations; mage, fighter, strider. Once each vocation hit the max, specializations come into play; warrior, assassin, ranger, magic archer, sorcerer, mystic knight.
For the world of DD, might and magic can be mixed for a hybrid class. For DA, it's not possible except for one vocation; templars / seekers. These would be the mystic knights.
Still, going by DD vocations, DA mages should be able to use the staff, knife and magic archery. The arrows would be magic, not real arrows. Magic archers in DD can shoot off a number of magic bolts, target-seeking-missile-bolts , or ricochet magic bolts that gather strength each time it rebounds. Very useful in a room.
DA rogues would use archery and knives, with special abilities like lassoing mobs off their feet or pulling them near to give them a cut or even strangling them.
DA warriors would have extra abilities with their shields; other than to ram, catapult an ally over the heads of the mobs (rogues!) so they could attack them from behind. They should also know archery and staff.
I've been playing warriors for DAI and the ability to crack the earth with the two handed sword and create fires made no sense to me. That should go to the mage; planting a knife or something and creating fires in the ground.
I confess to missing a lot of aspects in Kingdoms of Amalur:the Reckoning. Combat, running and crafting was soooo buttery smooth. If I have to pick one thing I wish for, it's chakrams for mages. I felt badass for hurling them like a wannabe Xena!
Haven't played KoA either (it's on the list, I swear!) but Xena-like chakrams - definitely.
I like some of the imaginative gameplay elements they showed off in this Dishonored 2 video. Especially the "Timepiece" they use near the end. Hopefully we'll see some clever ideas in the next game...
I've just played Dishonoured and the Boyle soiree was done fantastically. Lovely fashion, intriguing options, multiple paths. It was everything Halamshiral should have been and wasn't.
Haven't played DD, but I've seen some gameplay. DAI incorporated a few crippling effects for Dragons (limbs, but not wings) apart from the other stun/stagger/sleep effects. I'd definitely like to see that expanded upon too.
But I haven't seen how the cross-class skills work in DD. I didn't mind the way DAI handled it, though I'd love to see the 8-ability-on-bar limit lifted in the next game as well as more hybrid classes.
If it were up to me the ability bar would have even less slots but with greater customization. There are a few a reasons for limited slots: 1) to get you to make gameplay choices about which abilities are best loaded for a certain area (I recognize not everyone puts that much effort in to combat but that's fine) 2) promote variation for interesting 'builds' 3) most people aren't really able to think about using that many abilities at all times and frequently just repeat the same 3 or 4. Typically, games that allow as many abilities on the bar as you want have a lot of fire and forget abilities such as long duration buffs or modals.
I wouldn't mind a limited ability bar, I just REALLY want to be able to change it on the fly or even have presets which you can switch in between combat without going through the menu screens.
If a lot more alternatives are offered such as customising individual skills with a variety of different effects, I'd be cool with that.
Though you should've seen me in DA2 I think I threw out a MASSIVE barrage of different spells in the different stages in combat XD
Haven't played DD, but I've seen some gameplay. DAI incorporated a few crippling effects for Dragons (limbs, but not wings) apart from the other stun/stagger/sleep effects. I'd definitely like to see that expanded upon too.
But I haven't seen how the cross-class skills work in DD. I didn't mind the way DAI handled it, though I'd love to see the 8-ability-on-bar limit lifted in the next game as well as more hybrid classes.
If it were up to me the ability bar would have even less slots but with greater customization. There are a few a reasons for limited slots: 1) to get you to make gameplay choices about which abilities are best loaded for a certain area (I recognize not everyone puts that much effort in to combat but that's fine) 2) promote variation for interesting 'builds' 3) most people aren't really able to think about using that many abilities at all times and frequently just repeat the same 3 or 4. Typically, games that allow as many abilities on the bar as you want have a lot of fire and forget abilities such as long duration buffs or modals.
That said, I love hybrid classes
Hi Luke! Thanks for chiming in this.
You raise some good points, and I understand some of the reasoning behind it. But it has some downsides as well...
1. I find with the 8 slot limitation, I don't experiment with ability combinations very much. Having go back to the menus and reshuffle the abilities each time I want to try something new... I'm not so keen on. If I have all the abilities on my bar, it's much more convenient to try different strategies, even in the same fight. 2. I find that having to go back into menus to reshuffle the abilities it also breaks the flow of the game (which is big one for me), which is why I tend to stick to just one set of abilities unless I absolutely need to swap one/some out - eg. a boss battle where I might want a specific focus ability and ones that target a specific weakness. 3. And with limited slot space, I'm far less tempted to even look at things like Walls of Ice, Ice Traps, or anything I know I'm not likely to fill those precious slots with.
So I think each approach has it strengths, but I still prefer the smorgasbord approach.
If a lot more alternatives are offered such as customising individual skills with a variety of different effects, I'd be cool with that.
This is more of what comes to my mind when I think of really fun ability customization. I think a lot of it comes down to the types of abilities the game has and how easy it is to switch on the fly. I had some complaints about specific abilities but I thought the way Diablo 3 did it felt really fluid and enjoyable.
In Hrungr's example, it would be my job, for example, to ensure that those abilities you would have never used are good enough that you feel a little torn when deciding not to take them for a deployment. While it never happens perfectly, the ideal is that each ability is just as useful as any other, it just depends on your playstyle.
Ultimately, everything we end up with has pros and cons which we typically discuss before adding them to the game. The goal is that it is the best fit for the game as a whole.
Last Edit: Aug 4, 2016 19:21:22 GMT by LukeBarrett