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Post by Dovahkiin N7 on Oct 12, 2016 16:29:44 GMT
We need this!
Fireworks!
Go!!!
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Post by Catilina on Oct 12, 2016 16:50:23 GMT
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Post by Dovahkiin N7 on Oct 12, 2016 17:31:05 GMT
That 'Atrocious' outfit, but in DAA he was such a likable character ( only character who was happy if you did not take him to the battle). In DA2, I hated the SOB and hated and loved the game how it forced me to take him to every challenging battle. Hated how he was a must in nightmare ( I am a scrub)
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Post by Catilina on Oct 12, 2016 17:50:28 GMT
That 'Atrocious' outfit, but in DAA he was such a likable character ( only character who was happy if you did not take him to the battle). In DA2, I hated the SOB and hated and loved the game how it forced me to take him to every challenging battle. Hated how he was a must in nightmare ( I am a scrub) Anders was just as angry and frustrated in the DAA, than DA2. He was sad and afraid and cynical (and he extremely hated the Templars). He did not want to fight, because the escape busy all his strength, and he was conflict-avoiding. Yes, he just wanted peace and love. But he was not free, and he knew: he never will living in peace, because theTemplars will continuously persecute him. Justice convinced him that he is right, and has given him the strength to do what he wanted to do. I think, DA2 Anders more complex, interesting and stronger. And he don't lost his humour, just use more rarely, sadly – this is why I like romance him with sarcatic Hawke. My Hawkes mostly wholeheartedly support his fight.
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Beerfish
N7
Little Pumpkin
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Post by Beerfish on Oct 12, 2016 21:28:09 GMT
He was a murdering apostate the moment you met him in the expansion and became a lightning rod for the persecution of mages costing hundreds of mages their lives because he was a selfish prig who thought he was doing all mages a big favor by making them public enemy #1.
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Post by Catilina on Oct 12, 2016 21:34:36 GMT
He was a murdering apostate the moment you met him in the expansion and became a lightning rod for the persecution of mages costing hundreds of mages their lives because he was a selfish prig who thought he was doing all mages a big favor by making them public enemy #1. Mages was public enemy also without Anders. Otherwise the Chantry would not have jailed them. Hawke: "You may have turned everyone against the mages now."Anders: "Was anyone ever with us?"
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Post by opuspace on Oct 13, 2016 17:30:45 GMT
I haven't had a chance to play DA2, but I've heard enough to feel for the Anders fans. Especially if Anders was fighting Vengeance and was taken over to set the explosives. That, makes things more muddled.
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Beerfish
N7
Little Pumpkin
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Post by Beerfish on Oct 13, 2016 17:41:18 GMT
I haven't had a chance to play DA2, but I've heard enough to feel for the Anders fans. Especially if Anders was fighting Vengeance and was taken over to set the explosives. That, makes things more muddled. It's the opposite way around, he turned the spirit into 'vengeance' not the other way around.
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Post by opuspace on Oct 13, 2016 17:47:02 GMT
I haven't had a chance to play DA2, but I've heard enough to feel for the Anders fans. Especially if Anders was fighting Vengeance and was taken over to set the explosives. That, makes things more muddled. It's the opposite way around, he turned the spirit into 'vengeance' not the other way around. Did the spirit take over Anders in a rivaled state? I need to check, make sure I haven't gotten that part wrong.
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N7
Little Pumpkin
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Post by Beerfish on Oct 13, 2016 17:49:24 GMT
Anders and the spirit of justice merged willingly. Anders turned justice into vengeance.
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Post by Catilina on Oct 13, 2016 17:50:30 GMT
I haven't had a chance to play DA2, but I've heard enough to feel for the Anders fans. Especially if Anders was fighting Vengeance and was taken over to set the explosives. That, makes things more muddled. It's the opposite way around, he turned the spirit into 'vengeance' not the other way around. That's why I always say that Anders never was that light-hearted, funny boy, as many people want to see him. He turned Justice into Vengeance, or not, I'm not sure, but Anders felt guilty himself, because he believe that he did it.
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Post by Catilina on Oct 13, 2016 18:00:52 GMT
It's the opposite way around, he turned the spirit into 'vengeance' not the other way around. Did the spirit take over Anders in a rivaled state? I need to check, make sure I haven't gotten that part wrong. Yes. On the rivalry path, Justice/Vengeance forced Anders to finish his purpose, because Anders became uncertain, and lost his faith in his goal. But before Anders' anger turned Justice into Vengeance, after that Justice merged with him. On the friendship path Hawke confirm him in his faith, and support him. (I think, you need to try DA2...)
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Post by opuspace on Oct 13, 2016 18:05:49 GMT
Anders and the spirit of justice merged willingly. Anders turned justice into vengeance. I'm not arguing that, I'm asking if the decision to load the explosives in a rivaled state was Anders' or Vengeance'. Catalina answered that so thank you.
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Dovahkiin N7
N3
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Post by Dovahkiin N7 on Oct 13, 2016 18:06:36 GMT
I haven't had a chance to play DA2, but I've heard enough to feel for the Anders fans. Especially if Anders was fighting Vengeance and was taken over to set the explosives. That, makes things more muddled. You either love him or hate him ( mostly hate him), but you can't ignore him. And if you are playing nightmare difficulty, without him, all battles become giant PITA. Like he is a must have ( for me at least) in deep roads.
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Post by opuspace on Oct 13, 2016 18:08:25 GMT
Did the spirit take over Anders in a rivaled state? I need to check, make sure I haven't gotten that part wrong. Yes. On the rivalry path, Justice/Vengeance forced Anders to finish his purpose, because Anders became uncertain, and lost his faith in his goal. But before Anders' anger turned Justice to Vengeance, after that Justice merged with him. On the friendship path Hawke confirm him in his faith, and support him. (I think, you need to try DA2...) Thank you Catilina, that does make things more complicated then if Anders was persuaded not to follow through. Kinda makes it creepy that a spirit violated Anders' decision then. I will give DA2 a try someday . Glad to hear someone recommends it!
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Post by opuspace on Oct 13, 2016 18:11:16 GMT
I haven't had a chance to play DA2, but I've heard enough to feel for the Anders fans. Especially if Anders was fighting Vengeance and was taken over to set the explosives. That, makes things more muddled. You either love him or hate him ( mostly hate him), but you can't ignore him. And if you are playing nightmare difficulty, without him, all battles become giant PITA. Like he is a must have ( for me at least) in deep roads. Yeeee, that would suck. How many people keep him alive because they don't want to deal with the combat?
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Post by Catilina on Oct 13, 2016 18:13:16 GMT
Yes. On the rivalry path, Justice/Vengeance forced Anders to finish his purpose, because Anders became uncertain, and lost his faith in his goal. But before Anders' anger turned Justice to Vengeance, after that Justice merged with him. On the friendship path Hawke confirm him in his faith, and support him. (I think, you need to try DA2...) Thank you Catilina, that does make things more complicated then if Anders was persuaded not to follow through. Kinda makes it creepy that a spirit violated Anders' decision then. I will give DA2 a try someday . Glad to hear someone recommends it! I'm biased (so: you don't need to listen to me...), my favorite story in DA series is Hawke's story, and my favorite protagonist is Hawke. My two favorite romance is Anders and Fenris.
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Post by Catilina on Oct 13, 2016 18:14:48 GMT
You either love him or hate him ( mostly hate him), but you can't ignore him. And if you are playing nightmare difficulty, without him, all battles become giant PITA. Like he is a must have ( for me at least) in deep roads. Yeeee, that would suck. How many people keep him alive because they don't want to deal with the combat? Because they are opportunist! (Mage Hawke can be Spirit helaer also) Ofc, Hawke don't need to kill Anders, because Hawke not an executioner, as I said so many times... (maybe pro-templar Hawke also not executioner, but I'm not sure... )
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N7
Little Pumpkin
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Post by Beerfish on Oct 13, 2016 18:17:24 GMT
Anders and the spirit of justice merged willingly. Anders turned justice into vengeance. I'm not arguing that, I'm asking if the decision to load the explosives in a rivaled state was Anders' or Vengeance'. Catalina answered that so thank you. They are not two entities that can be conventionality separated to lay blame or remove blame or give or remove credit. Anders merged with justice, Anders turned justice into Vengeance, that being, Anders/Vengeance blew up the chantry,
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Post by shechinah on Oct 13, 2016 18:26:21 GMT
He was a murdering apostate the moment you met him in the expansion and became a lightning rod for the persecution of mages costing hundreds of mages their lives because he was a selfish prig who thought he was doing all mages a big favor by making them public enemy #1. Mages was public enemy also without Anders. Otherwise the Chantry would not have jailed them. Hawke: "You may have turned everyone against the mages now."Anders: "Was anyone ever with us?"I guess Anders likes to ignore all of the non-mages that expresses sympathy towards mages, support more rights for mages and tries to help mages. I guess Selby and the other non-mages of the underground railroad for mages counts as nothing to him.
In Act 1, Cullen even notes how things have changed for Templars:
Hawke: "(The Order needs to change) You have to admit the templars have brought some of this hatred on themselves." Cullen: "That is the popular school of thought, no? It used to be that templars were welcomed wherever they went for defending people from dark magics. Now the townsfolk's as likely to slam their doors as offers us a bed. The image of the poor, chained apprentice is a powerful one and one the mages are more than willing to exploit"
Hawke: "(I support the templars) Well, once someone admits to consorting with demons, it's a little easier to take sides." Cullen: "That's a surprisingly unpopular view point. It used to be that templars were welcomed wherever they went for defending people from dark magics. Now the townsfolk's as likely to slam their doors as offers us a bed. The image of the poor, chained apprentice is a powerful one and one the mages are more than willing to exploit"
But then again, this is after Anders had decided to confirm the common fears about mages and that the way to go is to try and incite changes by basically throwing mages into a war that they are completely unprepared including in terms of resources and plans.
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Post by Catilina on Oct 13, 2016 18:37:02 GMT
Mages was public enemy also without Anders. Otherwise the Chantry would not have jailed them. Hawke: "You may have turned everyone against the mages now."Anders: "Was anyone ever with us?"I guess Anders likes to ignore all of the non-mages that expresses sympathy towards mages, support more rights for mages and tries to help mages. I guess Selby and the other non-mages of the underground railroad for mages counts as nothing to him.
In Act 1, Cullen even notes how things have changed for Templars:
Hawke: "(The Order needs to change) You have to admit the templars have brought some of this hatred on themselves." Cullen: "That is the popular school of thought, no? It used to be that templars were welcomed wherever they went for defending people from dark magics. Now the townsfolk's as likely to slam their doors as offers us a bed. The image of the poor, chained apprentice is a powerful one and one the mages are more than willing to exploit"
Hawke: "(I support the templars) Well, once someone admits to consorting with demons, it's a little easier to take sides." Cullen: "That's a surprisingly unpopular view point. It used to be that templars were welcomed wherever they went for defending people from dark magics. Now the townsfolk's as likely to slam their doors as offers us a bed. The image of the poor, chained apprentice is a powerful one and one the mages are more than willing to exploit" Those who have supported the mages, those will continue to. Most people believe, that the mages must be imprisoned, isolated, because they are dangerous, they are cursed. Of course, the people prefer the submissive slaves, so: a slave should not be rebel.
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Dovahkiin N7
N3
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Post by Dovahkiin N7 on Oct 13, 2016 18:37:28 GMT
Yeeee, that would suck. How many people keep him alive because they don't want to deal with the combat? Because they are opportunist! (Mage Hawke can be Spirit helaer also) Ofc, Hawke don't need to kill Anders, because Hawke not an executioner, as I said so many times... (maybe pro-templar Hawke also not executioner, but I'm not sure... ) I kill him. Execution style. Specially satisfactory after you romanced him. Sue me, but I don't want Sebastian to leave me. Yeah, you heard it right ", I like him. But hey guys,should be be spoiling so much for opuspace ? After all he is starting to play DA2 tonight?
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Post by Catilina on Oct 13, 2016 18:43:10 GMT
Because they are opportunist! (Mage Hawke can be Spirit helaer also) Ofc, Hawke don't need to kill Anders, because Hawke not an executioner, as I said so many times... (maybe pro-templar Hawke also not executioner, but I'm not sure... ) I kill him. Execution style. Specially satisfactory after you romanced him. Sue me, but I don't want Sebastian to leave me. Yeah, you heard it right ", I like him. But hey guys,should be be spoiling so much for opuspace ? After all he is starting to play DA2 tonight?
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Xebenkeck
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion
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Post by Dovahkiin N7 on Oct 13, 2016 18:44:11 GMT
You either love him or hate him ( mostly hate him), but you can't ignore him. And if you are playing nightmare difficulty, without him, all battles become giant PITA. Like he is a must have ( for me at least) in deep roads. Yeeee, that would suck. How many people keep him alive because they don't want to deal with the combat? By the time you can kill him, challenging combats are over. So he isn't needed. So yeah, like a true opportunist, use him and kill him. Serves him right though. He uses you.
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Post by Catilina on Oct 13, 2016 18:50:59 GMT
Yeeee, that would suck. How many people keep him alive because they don't want to deal with the combat? By the time you can kill him, challenging combats are over. So he isn't needed. So yeah, like a true opportunist, use him and kill him. Serves him right though. He uses you. If you really want to punish him, do not to kill him! Force him to fight at the Templar side, and he never will forgive himself, or/and force him to fight against Justice/Vengeance, and he slowly loses himself.
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