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Post by necrowaif on Feb 26, 2022 20:46:23 GMT
Yes and no. The Disciples were no longer driven to serve the Old Gods, but they remained as violent as ever, just slightly more articulate. Maybe I am misremembering, but I could have sworn that in my play-through the Architect's messenger (if allowed to live) decided to help people traveling on the roads. As others have said, you are correct, in as much as Awakening’s epilogue screens matter anymore. Isn’t that right, Anders-who-stayed-with-the-Wardens-for-many-years?
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Post by QuizzyBunny on Feb 26, 2022 22:11:45 GMT
Hah true I guess. Although the fact it was even conceived should show something of how the devs thought about the Darkspawn at the time.
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Post by The Elder King on Feb 26, 2022 23:14:24 GMT
Maybe I am misremembering, but I could have sworn that in my play-through the Architect's messenger (if allowed to live) decided to help people traveling on the roads. As others have said, you are correct, in as much as Awakening’s epilogue screens matter anymore. Isn’t that right, Anders-who-stayed-with-the-Wardens-for-many-years? Epilogue sliders can indeed change (and I figured it's entirely possible one from DAO could quite well be retconned, if they decide to make Sten the Arishok even if you didn't free him), but until we have proof of said change, as with Anders, they should stand as canon. I think, in any case, that some of you aren't considering the fact that Gaider was in charge of the writing team of all DA games so far, and he, Laidlaw and Darrah all seem to share the same mindset of Epler, Weekes and Busche (not to mention that all three seem to approve and be happy about Epler's promotion). So I don't see why exactly we should expect some big shift as some have theorized. I have concerns about the game (which, at least in regards of the type of game I want DA to be, are eased by Epler being one of the big leads), but I don't think overall the dark/gritty nature of the series is going to change that much, or in the way you suggested before. Let's also keep in mind that Epler and Weekes were in charge of the narrative of Trespasser, which, hinted at Solas' plan possibly ending in the death of thousands of people, the reveal of the Evanuris being a stronger version of the magisters at their peak and equally as sadistic (seemingly shattering the idea of the benevolent elven gods), and havin Bull's personal quest in Inquisition, depending on the your choice, ending up with him going against the Inquisitor.
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Post by Absafraginlootly on Feb 26, 2022 23:21:52 GMT
Absolutely, although this is why I'm really looking forward to getting some sort of definite information in the not too distant future. I also wonder how we should view that teaser trailer narrated by Varric. The fact that we would be dealing with "demons, dragons, darkspawn, even the Dread Wolf" was not too revelatory since we have been dealing with the first 3 since DAO and the Dread Wolf was always a sort of given after Trespasser. Also, the "time for a new hero" was only reiterating what had been said before, that Trespasser was meant to have tied off the Inquisitor's story. Should we regard "no magic hand, no ancient prophesy" as a definite confirmation we will be getting back to the regular person just caught up in events with nothing but their own innate abilities to aid them? (as suggested in the earlier behind the scenes video). At the time it was hinted that the people shown were indicative of factions we would be associating with in the next game but if the blueprint had yet to be signed off, is this still the case? Could they even have been characters associated with multi-player that will no longer be appearing at all? I hope not. That teaser trailer is a puzzle though. Why bring it out at all at the point they did if those aspects showcased were not fairly definite for the main game? Was it simply to reassure fans at a time when two major figures were departing the studio? Let's hope they don't leave it too much longer before we get some answers to this. Lot of different stuff to unpack here. 1. The whole thing about factions is speculation on our part. Now I think there is a non zero chance that we are right and I would be thrilled by that...but the Varric trailer or the BTS trailer made no such promises on them. Other then showing off that Wardens, Crows, Mages, and a few other organizations will be involved...which is pretty much a given with what we know about DA. This is not true, the description on the 2020 game awards trailer that been uploaded to the official dragon age channel sais "The world of dragon age needs a new hero - someone who can take on the evil forces threatening Thedas. Get a first look at some of the new locations you'll discover and the factions fighting by your side in the next chapter of dragon age" - Now things may still have changed since then, but at the time the varric trailer was posted it was meant to contain factions who'll fight with us (or individual members there of). Edit: I try to post a link to the video so people can easily check the description and it turns my link into an embedded video which doesn't have a description :/
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Post by dadithinkimgay on Feb 26, 2022 23:55:12 GMT
Sometimes I wonder if said factions are not only allies but potential origins. I know it's been theorized we would play as a LoF but I haven't seen anything about them since that 2020 BTS video, and there was such a focus on showing off these factions last year.
And not even necessarily joining as a Crow or a Grey Warden per se, but maybe being picked up by them and be used as an "agent." Though I guess the protagonist could be a LoF and still do that.
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Post by colfoley on Feb 27, 2022 0:25:58 GMT
Lot of different stuff to unpack here. 1. The whole thing about factions is speculation on our part. Now I think there is a non zero chance that we are right and I would be thrilled by that...but the Varric trailer or the BTS trailer made no such promises on them. Other then showing off that Wardens, Crows, Mages, and a few other organizations will be involved...which is pretty much a given with what we know about DA. This is not true, the description on the 2020 game awards trailer that been uploaded to the official dragon age channel sais "The world of dragon age needs a new hero - someone who can take on the evil forces threatening Thedas. Get a first look at some of the new locations you'll discover and the factions fighting by your side in the next chapter of dragon age" - Now things may still have changed since then, but at the time the varric trailer was posted it was meant to contain factions who'll fight with us (or individual members there of). Edit: I try to post a link to the video so people can easily check the description and it turns my link into an embedded video which doesn't have a description :/ Sometimes I wonder if said factions are not only allies but potential origins. I know it's been theorized we would play as a LoF but I haven't seen anything about them since that 2020 BTS video, and there was such a focus on showing off these factions last year. And not even necessarily joining as a Crow or a Grey Warden per se, but maybe being picked up by them and be used as an "agent." Though I guess the protagonist could be a LoF and still do that. Absafraginlootly I agree with and was talking about what the above mentions. Factions of some sort and some level has ben involved in pretty much every Dragon Age game but the speculation has revolved around the player character being a part of one of them as an origin and that has not been confirmed yet.
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Post by gervaise21 on Feb 27, 2022 9:31:21 GMT
I think not having broodmothers in DA4 would be acceptable, but I would certainly hope that the broodmother lore would not be changed just because of an emphasized agenda.
There is no requirement to actually show brood-mothers but they can still exist in the lore. However, to my mind, the grotesque appearance of the brood-mothers is not what makes them horrific but the knowledge, revealed in DAO, of how they are created. That confrontation with Hespith and her creepy chant following us through the Deep Roads was spine chilling and my imagination did the rest. If that strange corrupted beating heart is anything to go by, I don't think they are moving away from the evil aspect of the taint and the creatures created from it. As others have said, you are correct, in as much as Awakening’s epilogue screens matter anymore. Isn’t that right, Anders-who-stayed-with-the-Wardens-for-many-years?So far as the Awakened darkspawn are concerned, it may well be they quietly forget about them as a possibility or if we find a way to eradicate the taint then, like the Geth in MET, they may end up unfortunate victims of the procedure to cleanse the world. I think the main thing to take from DAA and the Messenger is that whilst he could have his humanity restored, he was still a danger because of the taint within him. Also, we only ever saw darkspawn that had been converted a short time later. Since Grey Wardens eventually succumb to the taint within them, it might be reasonable to assume that ultimately the taint within the awakened darkspawn would reassert its hold over them as time passed. That would certainly be the easiest way for the writers to explain why we no longer encounter them. There were various outcomes for Anders including him leaving for a time but ultimately returning to the fold of the Grey Wardens. Now that ending would have tied in perfectly with the original planned Exalted March DLC for DA2 because that would have had the option the outcome for Anders as a redeemed Grey Warden. However, because that DLC was cancelled, there was no way of officially tying back the ending for Anders in DA2 with the epilogue of DAA, although you could still imagine it for yourself if you left him alive at the end of DA2. The main problem for me is that they did pretty much ignore DAA when it came to the plot lines of later games. I've mentioned before how it irked me that Leliana had us searching out Blackwall for answers about the Grey Wardens in Ferelden when the obvious place to acquire information would be Vigil's Keep. Why was Clarel writing to Teagan seeking permission to enter Ferelden, and referring back to unfortunate incidents in the past concerning Grey Wardens for why she needed to do this, when there was an official Warden outpost in northern Ferelden with the blessing of the monarch? If she was coming to replace the missing Warden Commander, this would have been sanctioned by Warden HQ so why did she need to involve the ruling authority at all? As a side issue, if Warden HQ had authorised her taking command of the Ferelden Grey Wardens as well as those of Orlais, why in Last Flight was no one aware of this? Why was Clarel given command instead of Stroud? Wasn't Stroud Commander of the Grey Wardens in the Freemarches? Why was Clarel able to turn all Grey Wardens against him across the south? In DAA we were told how important Warden HQ seemed to think that Vigil's Keep was going to be to the Order and how they were determined to make a success of the venture, so you would think they would keep lines of communication going between the two places (in Last Flight they do) and so would be aware that something wasn't right down south (in Last Flight they weren't because only Clarel, in Orlais, had failed to report). Why didn't the Wardens of Vigil's Keep immediately notify them of the False Calling? The number of plot holes go on and on with regard to the Grey Warden narrative in DAI but particularly because of the plot of DAA.
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Post by gervaise21 on Feb 27, 2022 9:43:53 GMT
I have concerns about the game (which, at least in regards of the type of game I want DA to be, are eased by Epler being one of the big leads), but I don't think overall the dark/gritty nature of the series is going to change that much, or in the way you suggested before. John Epler wrote Horror of Hormack so I think we can be confident that the Creative Director is still on board with the darker side of Thedas. There were definitely shades of DAO/Hespith with that story. As you say, Trespasser introduced the narrative about the Evanuris and further reinforced with this story, which is very dark. However, he also wrote Half Up Front which, together with Three Trees to Midnight (PW Lead Writer), introduced the idea there is a split in Qun, which I do find somewhat of a contradiction with the way in which the Qun is said to have operated both from in game descriptions and the source books. Nevertheless, given the Creative Director and Lead Writer seem to have developed this idea, I think this is one lore development that we can expect to see in the next game. This will, of course, make it easy for them to distinguish between the brutal Antaam, who we can cheerfully oppose, and the more reasonable leadership on Par Vollen that we may end up having to ally with, by choice or necessity.
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Post by gervaise21 on Feb 27, 2022 9:52:16 GMT
This is not true, the description on the 2020 game awards trailer that been uploaded to the official dragon age channel sais "The world of dragon age needs a new hero - someone who can take on the evil forces threatening Thedas. Get a first look at some of the new locations you'll discover and the factions fighting by your side in the next chapter of dragon age" - I remember seeing this official posting too. This is why I questioned whether it has been negated by the fact that multi-player was subsequently dropped and the information that the blueprint wasn't signed off until 2021. I hope that this original declaration from the writers still stands and we can expect to see both the factions and the locations shown in that trailer. Absafraginlootly I agree with and was talking about what the above mentions. Factions of some sort and some level has ben involved in pretty much every Dragon Age game but the speculation has revolved around the player character being a part of one of them as an origin and that has not been confirmed yet. I agree that factions have always been part of the DA universe but it did seem as though they were showcasing some that were definitely going to feature in the next game. My concern is that they may have been intended to be part of multi-player rather than the single-player game, particularly if we were, perhaps, meant to be playing as a member of those factions for the multi-player element, which I think was always far more likely than our single-player PC was going to be from one of those factions.
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Post by gervaise21 on Feb 27, 2022 10:06:06 GMT
Sometimes I wonder if said factions are not only allies but potential origins. I know it's been theorized we would play as a LoF but I haven't seen anything about them since that 2020 BTS video, and there was such a focus on showing off these factions last year. The Lord of Fortune idea only really was a thing because of the number of references to them in Tevinter Nights and that one piece of concept art in the BTS video. Also the fact that a Lord of Fortune could really be very much a blank slate sort of background that would fit any race or class. My personal preference has always been to start off as a slave or other low status person and then as part of our progression we could choose a faction to which we wish to belong. I suppose a lot depends on how serious they were about exploring what it is like to begin with no power because membership of any faction automatically grants you a degree of power by virtue of being part of an organisation rather than simply an autonomous individual.
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Post by Solas on Feb 28, 2022 16:34:43 GMT
Nick Thornborrow @nthornborrow What he’s TRYING to say is that he’s the creative director on Dragon Age, and that’s a good thing.
Crystal McCord @mrscmccord He is so humble, but I will say it for him folks- your new Creative Director for Dragon Age! 👏👏👏 Absolutely have loved working with John on this project!
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Post by Hrungr on Feb 28, 2022 18:56:06 GMT
Sanshee @teamsansheeTraverse the Wilds in style with the newest additions to our official #DragonAge lineup! Featuring the Grey Warden Letterman, Inquisition socks, and a few familiars brought back as stickers. ⚔️ tinyurl.com/4z5vurr9
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Post by Beerfish on Feb 28, 2022 20:09:01 GMT
Those are nice socks.
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Post by colfoley on Mar 1, 2022 0:52:01 GMT
Sometimes I wonder if said factions are not only allies but potential origins. I know it's been theorized we would play as a LoF but I haven't seen anything about them since that 2020 BTS video, and there was such a focus on showing off these factions last year. The Lord of Fortune idea only really was a thing because of the number of references to them in Tevinter Nights and that one piece of concept art in the BTS video. Also the fact that a Lord of Fortune could really be very much a blank slate sort of background that would fit any race or class. My personal preference has always been to start off as a slave or other low status person and then as part of our progression we could choose a faction to which we wish to belong. I suppose a lot depends on how serious they were about exploring what it is like to begin with no power because membership of any faction automatically grants you a degree of power by virtue of being part of an organisation rather than simply an autonomous individual. Unless BioWare intends to entirely change their formulae up I do not think we should take that one hundred percent literal. IE we will still be someone with some power, like in command of a squad someone respected by our group in order to give us control over opening party members which is a part of all BioWare games. Even with Inquisition, despite being someone without any real power even if briefly Cassandra still handed us the keys to forming a party...which gave us power. And I think Dorian's conversation is relevant in this issue to given he said that even mages in Tevinter, all mages, don't have power...some of them just light lamps when they are first discovered. So if we organizations and organization based origin stories it is likely we will be a mid tier operative of that organization, someone who can have the party to assemble a party, speak on their behalf, and conduct operations out in the field...which brings up two possible scenarios. 1. Scenario 1 where the organization we represent becomes aware of the Dread Wolf during the opening prologue Origin Story. This could be because of something we do or entirely seperate from what we do. And with that they then send us off specific to go investigate and that kicks starts our involvement in the game. 2. Scenario 2 Something happens to us which is a direct involvement of Solas and his minions. He might kill someone important to us or prevent us from completing a job. We go back to our superiors incenses, they say we have bigger fish to fry, but then we go off and hunt the Wolf down against orders. Scenario 3: Our involvement into the 'plot of the game' has a different motivator in the first place other then The Dread Wolf. We could have a different beginning introduction which will then eventually lead to us stumbling upon Solas. This is also to point out that some orgs in Thedas have more knowledge about Solas/ The Dread Wolf then others which could make it interesting.
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Post by QuizzyBunny on Mar 1, 2022 8:45:39 GMT
I suspect they hesitate a bit on the "no power thing" simply because of people whining a lot about Hawke being a "nobody". After all, it was the very criticism of the story of Hawke being "small" and "insignificant" that likely made the stakes in DAI so high and your PC rising to become such a huge figure of authority so fast.
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Post by gervaise21 on Mar 1, 2022 9:02:39 GMT
Unless BioWare intends to entirely change their formulae up I do not think we should take that one hundred percent literal. IE we will still be someone with some power, like in command of a squad someone respected by our group in order to give us control over opening party members which is a part of all BioWare games. When I talk about power, I do not mean natural gifts such as strength or charisma. Naturally we would need to have these as pretty much a given or no one would follow us. What I mean is having the backing of a group at the outset. With DAO we are taken away from whatever community we start with and co-opted into the Grey Wardens. We don't get any choice about this but by virtue of the Warden Treaties we do have something tangible that mean some factions will listen to us. By contrast in DA2 what we have is our family as our allegiance. Whilst on the face of it this doesn't give us much in the way of power, in fact our mother's connection with Kirkwall does give us a way in there and then later on, in Act 2 onwards we are operating out of our original family estate and our noble background does give us a status that other Ferelden refugees do not have. In DAI, by virtue of the mark and our rift closing ability, we immediately have something tangible to give us power and then the backing of a major organisation as a result, where Cassandra and Leliana have already done the difficult bit of getting it started. What I find appealing would be literally starting from nothing. Why do we have to have control of a group at the beginning? For example, we could be simply part of a community that is attacked by the Qunari. May be the first people we work with are just other members of that community, who follow us because we take the initiative in fighting back or organising the evacuation. Perhaps we are captured and we manage to escape (a bit like in Three Trees to Midnight) and the person or persons we escape with are members of one of those factions but may now be operating independently because their leaders were not dealing with the greater threat they had discovered. Once they start to trust us, they divulge what they were doing in that location in the first place. This could in fact be connected with the search for Solas or the idol. The main thing would be that this other person would show us that there are bigger things at stake than simply our own personal concerns and if they aren't dealt with then nothing else is going to matter. That is the hook that gets us involved but essentially we are still an individual who has been altered to the danger and gradually forms a group of like minded individuals to help them in their efforts to do something about it. However, we are not actually a member of any recognised faction at the outset. Alternatively, if we were, then we severe our ties at the beginning for the same reason as the individual I have outlined above; because we discover something that our leadership chooses to ignore as not relevant to their own petty schemes. The problem with being part of a faction at the outset is the fact that we would need to know about the organisation we are part of. They got around this with the Grey Wardens by making us a new recruit and the fact that the organisation was shrouded in secrecy. With the Inquisition it was something wholly new, so we couldn't be expected to know. With Hawke it was easier to bring us up to speed with our family background through conversation and explain any lack of knowledge of the Amell side because of the fact that our Mother had eloped and left that part of her life behind. On the whole though it is far simpler to have our companions be members of factions and enlighten us about them, so our ignorance is believable.
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Post by colfoley on Mar 1, 2022 9:06:25 GMT
Honestly I think the 'no power' line, while significant, also has more to do sometimes with the fellow up line...that no one in power will listen to us and that is why we may be powerless. Because I just don't think BioWare will, or even can, go on and make someone entirely powerless. I mean games are a power fantasy, BioWare is especially so, so it just wouldn't make sense...and in the context of a video game or Dragon Age what would that even look like? Gervaise's idea on 'being a slave' works but just...enitrely powerless? I do not know how that would work for DA...and keeping in mind the above we can even be an noble and still be 'powerless'...for awhile at least.
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Post by colfoley on Mar 1, 2022 9:17:07 GMT
Unless BioWare intends to entirely change their formulae up I do not think we should take that one hundred percent literal. IE we will still be someone with some power, like in command of a squad someone respected by our group in order to give us control over opening party members which is a part of all BioWare games. When I talk about power, I do not mean natural gifts such as strength or charisma. Naturally we would need to have these as pretty much a given or no one would follow us. What I mean is having the backing of a group at the outset. With DAO we are taken away from whatever community we start with and co-opted into the Grey Wardens. We don't get any choice about this but by virtue of the Warden Treaties we do have something tangible that mean some factions will listen to us. By contrast in DA2 what we have is our family as our allegiance. Whilst on the face of it this doesn't give us much in the way of power, in fact our mother's connection with Kirkwall does give us a way in there and then later on, in Act 2 onwards we are operating out of our original family estate and our noble background does give us a status that other Ferelden refugees do not have. In DAI, by virtue of the mark and our rift closing ability, we immediately have something tangible to give us power and then the backing of a major organisation as a result, where Cassandra and Leliana have already done the difficult bit of getting it started. What I find appealing would be literally starting from nothing. Why do we have to have control of a group at the beginning? For example, we could be simply part of a community that is attacked by the Qunari. May be the first people we work with are just other members of that community, who follow us because we take the initiative in fighting back or organising the evacuation. Perhaps we are captured and we manage to escape (a bit like in Three Trees to Midnight) and the person or persons we escape with are members of one of those factions but may now be operating independently because their leaders were not dealing with the greater threat they had discovered. Once they start to trust us, they divulge what they were doing in that location in the first place. This could in fact be connected with the search for Solas or the idol. The main thing would be that this other person would show us that there are bigger things at stake than simply our own personal concerns and if they aren't dealt with then nothing else is going to matter. That is the hook that gets us involved but essentially we are still an individual who has been altered to the danger and gradually forms a group of like minded individuals to help them in their efforts to do something about it. However, we are not actually a member of any recognised faction at the outset. Alternatively, if we were, then we severe our ties at the beginning for the same reason as the individual I have outlined above; because we discover something that our leadership chooses to ignore as not relevant to their own petty schemes. The problem with being part of a faction at the outset is the fact that we would need to know about the organisation we are part of. They got around this with the Grey Wardens by making us a new recruit and the fact that the organisation was shrouded in secrecy. With the Inquisition it was something wholly new, so we couldn't be expected to know. With Hawke it was easier to bring us up to speed with our family background through conversation and explain any lack of knowledge of the Amell side because of the fact that our Mother had eloped and left that part of her life behind. On the whole though it is far simpler to have our companions be members of factions and enlighten us about them, so our ignorance is believable. That is the level of power I was talking about initially. Power is a relative concept and I tend to find it lies where people believes it lies in. For instance in DAO we as the Wardens didn't have a lot of power to start with considering no one believed us at the time and no one believed the Wardens and Loghain, who had the most power for awhile, was doing everything he could to downplay the threat and establish his own power base. Indeed the line, while indicitive, honestly seems a bit disengenious considering that was kind of the plot to every DA game in one way or another. Sure we had tremendous power as a Warden, physical prowess, the treaties, out ability to detect Darkspawn...but then no one believed us and the treaties eventually proved to be effectively worthless given we had to solve everyone else's issues. DA 2 as well considering that was the whole point of it. And Inquisition while you got 'power' maybe a tad quickly...the game was still about gathering power and solving the issues of the authorities so you could ally with them and they would work wth you. And well this too has some easy work arounds and really we could start off as a recruit...but even barring that even if the character is a veteran or relatively new but still knowledgable they could design a lot of encounters to introduce information to the player. Cleverly written investigative dialogue or random codexes we could find about that the player could read...or even ignore if they were playing a 'knowledgable' character. Or a character who just needed to brush up on his Grey Warden history.
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Hrungr
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Post by Hrungr on Mar 1, 2022 18:05:23 GMT
Blair Thorburn @oiblairThe Dragon Age team is looking for a Game Economy Designer to help drive our RPG progression and economy. The position is remote-optional (PST<>EST) and a great opportunity to be a part of an amazing team. Diverse candidates encouraged to apply! 🐉🐺 ea.gr8people.com/jobs/171855/game-economy-designer
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Solas
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Post by Solas on Mar 1, 2022 19:52:10 GMT
Blair Thorburn @oiblair Important note on the team's commitments to diversity, equity, and inclusion.
This is a real, genuine, and close to our hearts push.
Come join us and help to make the next Dragon Age one that reflects these values inside and out.
💜
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Solas
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Post by Solas on Mar 1, 2022 20:50:12 GMT
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Post by Solas on Mar 1, 2022 22:37:08 GMT
Dragon Age dev team shirts from Corinne Busche's Twitter
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Post by DragonKingReborn on Mar 1, 2022 23:11:16 GMT
Alright Edmonton BSNers...you're going on another T-shirt hunt.
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Post by colfoley on Mar 1, 2022 23:16:05 GMT
Dragon Age dev team shirts from Corinne Busche's Twitter hard to see but could be nice to wear.
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Post by ladyiolanthe on Mar 2, 2022 1:04:40 GMT
Nice portrait of Solas a wolf-dragon hybrid.
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