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Post by gervaise21 on Dec 2, 2020 21:22:43 GMT
I found that on You Tube as well and thought the concept art for "redeemed warden" Anders was interesting. I must admit I'd still rather have the Exalted March even if it did mean Varric going out in a blaze of glory considering the alternative is Hawke without their LI in DAI, possibly being left in the Fade or disappearing into the Anderfels with no further explanation and then back in Kirkwall as Varric's sidekick doing all the boring stuff he can't be bothered with. I would have liked Hawke's story tied off properly on screen, reunited with their LI and if they do return to Kirkwall then let them be Viscount or alternatively ride off into the sunset, preferably back in Ferelden. To my mind Hawke was very much short changed when the DLC was cancelled. Varric is okay but I've never quite felt the same about him after that comment about not approving of us "letting dangerous people amok" when we side with the mages. Considering either Hawke is a mage or Bethany is at that point, essentially he says he doesn't think we should be running around free and that it is okay to slaughter people who are innocent of the crime for which they are being killed simply because they are mages. I'm also waiting for my favourite PCs to be given the opportunity to actually marry their LI on screen because I've never romanced Sera or Cullen. Still on a brighter note, I found this picture of Anders which could be an alternative for the "redeemed warden" look.
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Post by gervaise21 on Dec 2, 2020 21:57:01 GMT
Here's another piece of artwork I found entitled "Return from Skyhold: Hideout near Weishauppt". Actually I realised how lucky a female Hawke would be to have Anders as a husband because of his extensive experience delivering babies whilst in Kirkwall. If childbirth is as dangerous for the mother in Thedas as it was historically in the real world, he must have saved countless mothers by being the one to act as midwife. No wonder the poor people were so protective of him.
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Post by Sonya on Dec 3, 2020 12:54:19 GMT
One confusing question if anyone kowns for sure.
You decide to make Carver/Beth a GW. So you follow Anders. And at some point Anders says to stop. As I understand he thought that there were GWs nearby, BUT turned out there were darkspawn. Both - GWs and darkspawn - have tainted blood. So I do not understand: either GWs just can't understand either they sense other GWs or they sense darkspawn? Or just a theory: without practice so to say, any GW just loses abillity to distinguish one from another and that is why Anders could not understand who had tained blood?
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Dec 3, 2020 15:00:21 GMT
I'm also waiting for my favourite PCs to be given the opportunity to actually marry their LI on screen because I've never romanced Sera or Cullen. I’m still salty about not even being Abe to talk about it or propose to Josephine. I get not having a wedding since her family isn’t there, but really you can talk to The Iron Bull about it but not her when it fits no romance better? Also agree on concluding a character, but BioWare seems like it’ll just be throwing them away again.
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Post by gervaise21 on Dec 3, 2020 18:16:42 GMT
Or just a theory: without practice so to say, any GW just loses abillity to distinguish one from another and that is why Anders could not understand who had tained blood? I would assume it is difficult to tell the difference if you are simply going by the presence of the taint. If you are travelling with your fellow wardens then you would rule out the signals you are getting from them when trying to sense darkspawn. I think Anders was assuming he was sensing grey wardens because he knew they should be in that location and then he realised the numbers were too large just before they arrived and that he had made a mistake.
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Post by gervaise21 on Dec 18, 2020 19:04:44 GMT
Anybody notice how Varric changed his tune about Meredith in the latest trailer? Apparently now he is willing to acknowledge that he has fought tyrants when the camera is on Meredith. Well the red lyrium didn't make her into a tyrant, she was that already, it merely enhanced her paranoia. Yet Varric favoured supporting her over the mages because it was "defending our way of life", so at the time it seemed he thought it quite in order to be ruled over by a tyrant. It was also a bit disturbing that he said he has seen friends lose life and limb. Well the latter was a reference to the Inquisitor but the former? It sounds like in their canon version Hawke was left in the Fade. After all what other friend could he be referring to? Isn't it funny that originally Varric was going to be the one who was killed off, yet now he is indespensible.
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Post by Catilina on Dec 18, 2020 21:27:40 GMT
Anybody notice how Varric changed his tune about Meredith in the latest trailer? Apparently now he is willing to acknowledge that he has fought tyrants when the camera is on Meredith. Well the red lyrium didn't make her into a tyrant, she was that already, it merely enhanced her paranoia. Yet Varric favoured supporting her over the mages because it was "defending our way of life", so at the time it seemed he thought it quite in order to be ruled over by a tyrant. It was also a bit disturbing that he said he has seen friends lose life and limb. Well the latter was a reference to the Inquisitor but the former? It sounds like in their canon version Hawke was left in the Fade. After all what other friend could he be referring to? Isn't it funny that originally Varric was going to be the one who was killed off, yet now he is indespensible. Varric's dialogue at the Gallows, before the last battle contradicts with the epilogue he wrote. At the Gallows, seems he prefers the Templars, but later, in the epilogue, he speaks about Hawke as a freedom fighter, the HOPE, if Hawke stood by the mages, but at Templar side he speaks about Hawke like someone who's name becoming a reminder of the mages' oppression at the templars' hands. But in the Inquisition: (Wiki, after In Hushed whispers): Varric Approves/Disapproves (only if he's in the active party.) Approves if Hawke sided with mages in Dragon Age II, Disapproves if Hawke sided with Templars. So: now Varric has opinion already?
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N5
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by LadyofNemesis on Dec 18, 2020 23:02:36 GMT
Anybody notice how Varric changed his tune about Meredith in the latest trailer? Apparently now he is willing to acknowledge that he has fought tyrants when the camera is on Meredith. Well the red lyrium didn't make her into a tyrant, she was that already, it merely enhanced her paranoia. Yet Varric favoured supporting her over the mages because it was "defending our way of life", so at the time it seemed he thought it quite in order to be ruled over by a tyrant. It was also a bit disturbing that he said he has seen friends lose life and limb. Well the latter was a reference to the Inquisitor but the former? It sounds like in their canon version Hawke was left in the Fade. After all what other friend could he be referring to?Isn't it funny that originally Varric was going to be the one who was killed off, yet now he is indespensible. considering Hawke is left in the Fade by default in the Keep, which they mostly use for the new games I believe because there's not a lot of ties that need to be introduced for new players. Though have to say their Inquisitor is very bland none of the protagonists have a romance option, however unlike Hawke and the Warden the Bioware Quizzy only had the initial 3 companions (Cass, Varric and Solas) befriended none of them, didn't do any of their quests as a result...in fact only did the main quests.
I do think that his words in the trailer refer to the fact that canonically (at least in Bioware default) Hawke did die, though that's probably not true for most of the player base. However it doesn't need to refer to Hawke at all, maybe he saw different friends die? Maybe even referring to Anders (despite being rather salty about him during Inquisition) who 'canonically' is also dead.
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Post by Catilina on Dec 19, 2020 1:05:57 GMT
Anders is not dead canonically, this is just the first position in the Keep, some "default", like blue Hawke, who doesn't romance anyone.
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Post by Buckeldemon on Dec 19, 2020 1:47:06 GMT
Anybody notice how Varric changed his tune about Meredith in the latest trailer? Apparently now he is willing to acknowledge that he has fought tyrants when the camera is on Meredith. Well the red lyrium didn't make her into a tyrant, she was that already, it merely enhanced her paranoia. Yet Varric favoured supporting her over the mages because it was "defending our way of life", so at the time it seemed he thought it quite in order to be ruled over by a tyrant. It was also a bit disturbing that he said he has seen friends lose life and limb. Well the latter was a reference to the Inquisitor but the former? It sounds like in their canon version Hawke was left in the Fade. After all what other friend could he be referring to? Isn't it funny that originally Varric was going to be the one who was killed off, yet now he is indespensible. Heh... I bitched about Varric in my very first post on the teaser thread. Gotta have a reputation to uphold... Some taking Varric as turning into a sort of writer mouthpiece at times, that or an obsessive centrist prone to defer to authoritarians when these tend to bash what they view as evil extremists.
He surely seems to become some sort of heel-face revolving door. Seems to be a popular concept for the "loveable rogue" stereotype, so I wonder if it is intended? Afterall, Isabela covered that pretty well in DA2. Varric's dialogue at the Gallows, before the last battle contradicts with the epilogue he wrote. At the Gallows, seems he prefers the Templars, but later, in the epilogue, he speaks about Hawke as a freedom fighter, the HOPE, if Hawke stood by the mages, but at Templar side he speaks about Hawke like someone who's name becoming a reminder of the mages' oppression at the templars' hands. But in the Inquisition: (Wiki, after In Hushed whispers): Varric Approves/Disapproves (only if he's in the active party.) Approves if Hawke sided with mages in Dragon Age II, Disapproves if Hawke sided with Templars. So: now Varric has opinion already? Didn't he also say that "the circles rose and set the world on fire"? Honestly, sometimes I just stop paying attention to his choice of words.
Though have to say their Inquisitor is very bland none of the protagonists have a romance option, however unlike Hawke and the Warden the Bioware Quizzy only had the initial 3 companions (Cass, Varric and Solas) befriended none of them, didn't do any of their quests as a result...in fact only did the main quests. I do think that his words in the trailer refer to the fact that canonically (at least in Bioware default) Hawke did die, though that's probably not true for most of the player base. However it doesn't need to refer to Hawke at all, maybe he saw different friends die? Maybe even referring to Anders (despite being rather salty about him during Inquisition) who 'canonically' is also dead. Yeah, that exceedingly dull Trevelyan does seem to lack any sort of focus. I mean, the default DAI Warden is some heroic martyr looking out for "good" choices ("despite being Dalish", as some would say ), while default Hawke has a rather consistent "pro-mage" record. Trevelyan is all over the place, bonus points for a human muggle with the most boring backround in DA. I'd rather have had some andrastian zealot than a low-key, but still Chantry-supporting mainstream andrastian. DAI is fond of the latter and suffers for it I think. The zealots are at least kinda interesting, even if not always likeable. But the Chantry-related views of Josephine/Blackwall/Sera/Cullen/Dorian/Varric? Meh.
Sometimes I guess their "default" goes along with some popluar fan views? People like to hate on Anders, so set him as dead. A very loud group hated DA2 and Hawke, so kill them. A small group of fans is reaaaaally fond of Loghain, so give him a second and as I think, less meaningful way to die a "heroic death". I mean, if I'm going to sacrifice this guy, it is to the Archdemon, as this is more "for Ferelden!!!". Also, the Chantry must be restored to status quo, so pick the most conservative zealot available (Vivienne is out, as her recruitment is optional, and she's kinda heavily villain-coded) and wrap up the Inquisition as the new private army. Oh, and Solas is an evul traitor, besides being bald, shifty, a mage and an elf, so stop him at all costs!!!!1 (okay, that last one escalated...)
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Post by Catilina on Dec 19, 2020 2:14:07 GMT
Anybody notice how Varric changed his tune about Meredith in the latest trailer? Apparently now he is willing to acknowledge that he has fought tyrants when the camera is on Meredith. Well the red lyrium didn't make her into a tyrant, she was that already, it merely enhanced her paranoia. Yet Varric favoured supporting her over the mages because it was "defending our way of life", so at the time it seemed he thought it quite in order to be ruled over by a tyrant. It was also a bit disturbing that he said he has seen friends lose life and limb. Well the latter was a reference to the Inquisitor but the former? It sounds like in their canon version Hawke was left in the Fade. After all what other friend could he be referring to? Isn't it funny that originally Varric was going to be the one who was killed off, yet now he is indespensible. Heh... I bitched about Varric in my very first post on the teaser thread. Gotta have a reputation to uphold... Some taking Varric as turning into a sort of writer mouthpiece at times, that or an obsessive centrist prone to defer to authoritarians when these tend to bash what they view as evil extremists.
He surely seems to become some sort of heel-face revolving door. Seems to be a popular concept for the "loveable rogue" stereotype, so I wonder if it is intended? Afterall, Isabela covered that pretty well in DA2. Varric's dialogue at the Gallows, before the last battle contradicts with the epilogue he wrote. At the Gallows, seems he prefers the Templars, but later, in the epilogue, he speaks about Hawke as a freedom fighter, the HOPE, if Hawke stood by the mages, but at Templar side he speaks about Hawke like someone who's name becoming a reminder of the mages' oppression at the templars' hands. But in the Inquisition: (Wiki, after In Hushed whispers): Varric Approves/Disapproves (only if he's in the active party.) Approves if Hawke sided with mages in Dragon Age II, Disapproves if Hawke sided with Templars. So: now Varric has opinion already? Didn't he also say that "the circles rose and set the world on fire"? Honestly, sometimes I just stop paying attention to his choice of words.
Though have to say their Inquisitor is very bland none of the protagonists have a romance option, however unlike Hawke and the Warden the Bioware Quizzy only had the initial 3 companions (Cass, Varric and Solas) befriended none of them, didn't do any of their quests as a result...in fact only did the main quests. I do think that his words in the trailer refer to the fact that canonically (at least in Bioware default) Hawke did die, though that's probably not true for most of the player base. However it doesn't need to refer to Hawke at all, maybe he saw different friends die? Maybe even referring to Anders (despite being rather salty about him during Inquisition) who 'canonically' is also dead. Yeah, that exceedingly dull Trevelyan does seem to lack any sort of focus. I mean, the default DAI Warden is some heroic martyr looking out for "good" choices ("despite being Dalish", as some would say ), while default Hawke has a rather consistent "pro-mage" record. Trevelyan is all over the place, bonus points for a human muggle with the most boring backround in DA. I'd rather have had some andrastian zealot than a low-key, but still Chantry-supporting mainstream andrastian. DAI is fond of the latter and suffers for it I think. The zealots are at least kinda interesting, even if not always likeable. But the Chantry-related views of Josephine/Blackwall/Sera/Cullen/Dorian/Varric? Meh.
Sometimes I guess their "default" goes along with some popluar fan views? People like to hate on Anders, so set him as dead. A very loud group hated DA2 and Hawke, so kill them. A small group of fans is reaaaaally fond of Loghain, so give him a second and as I think, less meaningful way to die a "heroic death". I mean, if I'm going to sacrifice this guy, it is to the Archdemon, as this is more "for Ferelden!!!". Also, the Chantry must be restored to status quo, so pick the most conservative zealot available (Vivienne is out, as her recruitment is optional, and she's kinda heavily villain-coded) and wrap up the Inquisition as the new private army. Oh, and Solas is an evul traitor, besides being bald, shifty, a mage and an elf, so stop him at all costs!!!!1 (okay, that last one escalated...) Yes, he said, the Circles rose and set the world in fire, but I liked it... and he also said: "The Champion's name become a rallying cry a reminder: that the mighty Templars could be defied: s/he had defend the mages against a brutal injustice, and many lived to tell the tale." (This is also refutes the fans of Templar end, and say: in that way Hawke can save MORE mages than in mage side – what is obviously a big fat bullshit.)
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Post by Rascoth on Dec 19, 2020 11:03:41 GMT
Anders is not dead canonically, this is just the first position in the Keep, some "default", like blue Hawke, who doesn't romance anyone. For games, I agree there's no canon, only default. But seeing how Kirkwall and Starkhaven are on good terms in comics, I'd say it is canon for outside media that Anders is dead. If he was alive, Sebastian would continue his stupid crusade against Kirkwall.
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LadyofNemesis
N5
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by LadyofNemesis on Dec 19, 2020 11:53:06 GMT
Anders is not dead canonically, this is just the first position in the Keep, some "default", like blue Hawke, who doesn't romance anyone. which is why I put it in quotation marks
I've had Anders die several times in the past, but these days I find it more interesting to keep him alive, even if it's just to piss of Sebastian mostly because I love to imagine Aveline staring him down from Kirkwall battlements with Inquisition support behind her
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LadyofNemesis
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by LadyofNemesis on Dec 19, 2020 12:00:26 GMT
Yeah, that exceedingly dull Trevelyan does seem to lack any sort of focus. I mean, the default DAI Warden is some heroic martyr looking out for "good" choices ("despite being Dalish", as some would say ), while default Hawke has a rather consistent "pro-mage" record. Trevelyan is all over the place, bonus points for a human muggle with the most boring backround in DA. I'd rather have had some andrastian zealot than a low-key, but still Chantry-supporting mainstream andrastian. DAI is fond of the latter and suffers for it I think. The zealots are at least kinda interesting, even if not always likeable. But the Chantry-related views of Josephine/Blackwall/Sera/Cullen/Dorian/Varric? Meh.
Sometimes I guess their "default" goes along with some popluar fan views? People like to hate on Anders, so set him as dead. A very loud group hated DA2 and Hawke, so kill them. A small group of fans is reaaaaally fond of Loghain, so give him a second and as I think, less meaningful way to die a "heroic death". I mean, if I'm going to sacrifice this guy, it is to the Archdemon, as this is more "for Ferelden!!!". Also, the Chantry must be restored to status quo, so pick the most conservative zealot available (Vivienne is out, as her recruitment is optional, and she's kinda heavily villain-coded) and wrap up the Inquisition as the new private army. Oh, and Solas is an evul traitor, besides being bald, shifty, a mage and an elf, so stop him at all costs!!!!1 (okay, that last one escalated...)
I started out with Trevelyan first time I played, but quickly changed to Lavellan instead. Tried again for my male playthrough, but quickly replaced him with Adaar
Also, I'm not sure how Bioware picks their default, though as I said...I suspect they do it in order to have less ties going forward so as to introduce the new game to new players (who haven't played the previous installments). But like I said in a different thread, I tend to go with my own favorites...even if that doesn't go over-well 'canonically'
for example, by default Alistair marries Anora because apparently this is 'best for Ferelden', in Inquisition you can also find out Anora is a better diplomat concerning Orlais if Celene is alive (what an interesting meeting that must've been )
however, loads of fans enjoy being Alistair's Queen which rules that out, I tend to put Alistair alone these days (especially in my main canon) and head-canon he eventually meets a nice woman on his own terms
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Post by gervaise21 on Dec 19, 2020 13:18:26 GMT
It was the one real downside to that trailer for me. I didn't mind him being the narrator so much as suddenly it's "I've fought tyrants and would be gods", not "we", making him sound like the iconic hero of the series. As I say, if we're not going to have a continuing protagonist as iconic hero, then nobody should fill that role. Also "I've got your back" implying his is going to be popping up again next game as our "best friend" even if it is only as a contact/advisor. Josephine/Blackwall/Sera/Cullen/Dorian/Varric At least with Varric I don't want to pummel sense into him. Sera is the one that really annoyed me after the Temple of Mythal. She rightly concludes that the Chantry story of the Maker and the elven gods don't fit, so her reaction is to reject the reality of the elven gods even though we have concrete proof that some of what the Dalish claim is true, whereas we have damn all concerning the Maker, particularly since the whole Herald thing was not true. Apparently the Temple of Mythal was just full of demons telling lies. Then she uses that to further ridicule the Dalish for "living in the woods". Doesn't she realise we live in the woods because that is the only way we can stay free to live the lives we choose? Which incidentally is not to go around playing stupid pranks and living out petty revenge fantasies. It still bugs me that Sera was the spokesperson for the "little people". Why couldn't they give us someone who didn't have such race hatred and was really little more than a petty criminal? I'm hoping our new protagonist is now going to fulfill the role of "Robin Hood" standing up for the little guys next game, hopefully without the enforced dodgy underworld background. However it doesn't need to refer to Hawke at all, maybe he saw different friends die? Maybe even referring to Anders (despite being rather salty about him during Inquisition) who 'canonically' is also dead. I ruled out Anders on the basis of all the stuff he says about him in DAI which suggests that he has disowned him as a friend, even if he ever saw him that way. It also seems odd that he should be referring to Anders when his other reference is to the Inquisitor, who was Varric's new "best friend" after Hawke. I'm still hoping that "we've got your back" refers to the shadow Inquisition and its associated allies, that can include Hawke and the Warden, although I saw an analysis that suggested perhaps it referred to the characters and the factions they represent that we see in the trailer.
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Post by Catilina on Dec 19, 2020 13:45:27 GMT
Anders is not dead canonically, this is just the first position in the Keep, some "default", like blue Hawke, who doesn't romance anyone. For games, I agree there's no canon, only default. But seeing how Kirkwall and Starkhaven are on good terms in comics, I'd say it is canon for outside media that Anders is dead. If he was alive, Sebastian would continue his stupid crusade against Kirkwall. Varric in fact not in the best relationship with Sebastian... according to the Inquisition's epilogue. I didn't read the comics, and only book I read is the Asunder (I think, I should read more, but I'm angry, that something doesn't make sense, or you can't follow, if you didn't read the books, but the books ignore the possible decisions of the game...)
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N5
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Posts: 4,824 Likes: 11,923
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Post by LadyofNemesis on Dec 19, 2020 16:28:20 GMT
However it doesn't need to refer to Hawke at all, maybe he saw different friends die? Maybe even referring to Anders (despite being rather salty about him during Inquisition) who 'canonically' is also dead. I ruled out Anders on the basis of all the stuff he says about him in DAI which suggests that he has disowned him as a friend, even if he ever saw him that way. It also seems odd that he should be referring to Anders when his other reference is to the Inquisitor, who was Varric's new "best friend" after Hawke. I'm still hoping that "we've got your back" refers to the shadow Inquisition and its associated allies, that can include Hawke and the Warden, although I saw an analysis that suggested perhaps it referred to the characters and the factions they represent that we see in the trailer. I wouldn't mind seeing Varric back, but I'd prefer if he stayed over in Kirkwall...looking out for his people. Ya know...like he's supposed to?
I'm thinking your referring to Jackdaw's analysis? (it's the only trailer analysis I've seen myself and I enjoy the way he deciphers things) I too hope the three characters we saw (the crow, the stalking character in the frosty woods and the sneaky Tevinter character) are origins we can choose if so...I'm making my main girl a member of the Siccari (I mean, apparently it's the closest we'll get to a slave origin...I'll take anything over nobility human)
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Post by gervaise21 on Dec 19, 2020 17:35:34 GMT
Varric in fact not in the best relationship with Sebastian... according to the Inquisition's epilogue. I didn't read the comics, and only book I read is the Asunder There was definitely an inconsistency there. At the end of Trespasser Viscount Varric is steadfastly ignoring all the communications from Starkhaven, whether Sebastian attacked Kirkwall or aided it, yet in the comics he invites Sebastian to his official swearing in as Viscount and then is accompanying the Ser Aaron and Vaea to Starkhaven where they are invited to a party thrown by Prince Sebastian. Also in the comics Varric claims to be no longer officially part of the Inquisition but helping them out when needed, whereas in Tevinter Nights he does seem to be playing a pivotal role from his base in Kirkwall. Clearly his involvement in the trailer ties in with Tevinter Nights rather than his portrayal in the comics. The time frame has to be after the events of Trespasser because Vaea and Ser Aaron head straight to Tevinter after Knight Errant and are at the fall of Ventus in Deception, which occurs after Trespasser.
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Post by Rascoth on Dec 20, 2020 20:55:45 GMT
Varric in fact not in the best relationship with Sebastian... according to the Inquisition's epilogue. I didn't read the comics, and only book I read is the Asunder There was definitely an inconsistency there. At the end of Trespasser Viscount Varric is steadfastly ignoring all the communications from Starkhaven, whether Sebastian attacked Kirkwall or aided it, yet in the comics he invites Sebastian to his official swearing in as Viscount and then is accompanying the Ser Aaron and Vaea to Starkhaven where they are invited to a party thrown by Prince Sebastian. Not to mention Varric outright says in Knight Errand that Sebastian is an ally of the Inquisition. The time frame has to be after the events of Trespasser because Vaea and Ser Aaron head straight to Tevinter after Knight Errant and are at the fall of Ventus in Deception, which occurs after Trespasser. I actually think Knight Errand is right before Trespasser, considering Ser Aaron and Vaea arrive for Varric's appointment as Viscount, and he seems to have officialy taken this position during Trespasser.
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Post by gervaise21 on Dec 20, 2020 21:26:14 GMT
Not to mention Varric outright says in Knight Errand that Sebastian is an ally of the Inquisition. I actually think Knight Errand is right before Trespasser Which makes Varric ignoring the correspondence from Sebastian even more odd. I know the comics follow their own canon but you'd think someone would have mentioned to the writers that actually stating he was an ally didn't chime with the epilogue to Trespasser. Why would you ignore communications from someone you know is an ally, particularly after the revelation about the Dread Wolf would mean every bit of information could be vital? Mind you it is noticeable in The Dread Wolf Take You when Solas is recounting who is at the auction in Llomerryn, Sebastian is mentioned as being one. Now whilst I take the tale with a pinch of salt, I would imagine the reason Solas lists the people he does is to let Charter know he is well aware of her allies. The people mentioned were Amund Skywatcher; Isabella; Sebastian; Tallis; Divine Victoria and a Warden-Commander (the last is ambiguous: could it be the Hero of Ferelden, the Orlesian replacement, Stroud or someone else?) Just think, if they'd gone with the cancelled Exalted March DLC it could even have been Anders.
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Post by Buckeldemon on Dec 22, 2020 15:29:19 GMT
Heh... I bitched about Varric in my very first post on the teaser thread. Gotta have a reputation to uphold... Some taking Varric as turning into a sort of writer mouthpiece at times, that or an obsessive centrist prone to defer to authoritarians when these tend to bash what they view as evil extremists.
He surely seems to become some sort of heel-face revolving door. Seems to be a popular concept for the "loveable rogue" stereotype, so I wonder if it is intended? Afterall, Isabela covered that pretty well in DA2. Didn't he also say that "the circles rose and set the world on fire"? Honestly, sometimes I just stop paying attention to his choice of words.
Yeah, that exceedingly dull Trevelyan does seem to lack any sort of focus. I mean, the default DAI Warden is some heroic martyr looking out for "good" choices ("despite being Dalish", as some would say ), while default Hawke has a rather consistent "pro-mage" record. Trevelyan is all over the place, bonus points for a human muggle with the most boring backround in DA. I'd rather have had some andrastian zealot than a low-key, but still Chantry-supporting mainstream andrastian. DAI is fond of the latter and suffers for it I think. The zealots are at least kinda interesting, even if not always likeable. But the Chantry-related views of Josephine/Blackwall/Sera/Cullen/Dorian/Varric? Meh. Sometimes I guess their "default" goes along with some popluar fan views? People like to hate on Anders, so set him as dead. A very loud group hated DA2 and Hawke, so kill them. A small group of fans is reaaaaally fond of Loghain, so give him a second and as I think, less meaningful way to die a "heroic death". I mean, if I'm going to sacrifice this guy, it is to the Archdemon, as this is more "for Ferelden!!!". Also, the Chantry must be restored to status quo, so pick the most conservative zealot available (Vivienne is out, as her recruitment is optional, and she's kinda heavily villain-coded) and wrap up the Inquisition as the new private army. Oh, and Solas is an evul traitor, besides being bald, shifty, a mage and an elf, so stop him at all costs!!!!1 (okay, that last one escalated...) Yes, he said, the Circles rose and set the world in fire, but I liked it... and he also said: "The Champion's name become a rallying cry a reminder: that the mighty Templars could be defied: s/he had defend the mages against a brutal injustice, and many lived to tell the tale." (This is also refutes the fans of Templar end, and say: in that way Hawke can save MORE mages than in mage side – what is obviously a big fat bullshit.) Eh, the fact Hawke doesn't participate in the Annulment and has to put down attacking templars so these aren't free to "kill some robes" any longer is proof enough for me. More than the scene with the three mages being so graciously not killed. Why? Scene doesn't make sense. Why does Meredith not pull rank and orders them to be executed anyway? "Circles setting world on fire" could of course be seen metaphorically. I just often have to think of "robes fucking stuff up again, should all be concentration camped by the virtuous holy knights of the Maker". Or something like that.
Yeah, that exceedingly dull Trevelyan does seem to lack any sort of focus. I mean, the default DAI Warden is some heroic martyr looking out for "good" choices ("despite being Dalish", as some would say ), while default Hawke has a rather consistent "pro-mage" record. Trevelyan is all over the place, bonus points for a human muggle with the most boring backround in DA. I'd rather have had some andrastian zealot than a low-key, but still Chantry-supporting mainstream andrastian. DAI is fond of the latter and suffers for it I think. The zealots are at least kinda interesting, even if not always likeable. But the Chantry-related views of Josephine/Blackwall/Sera/Cullen/Dorian/Varric? Meh. Sometimes I guess their "default" goes along with some popluar fan views? People like to hate on Anders, so set him as dead. A very loud group hated DA2 and Hawke, so kill them. A small group of fans is reaaaaally fond of Loghain, so give him a second and as I think, less meaningful way to die a "heroic death". I mean, if I'm going to sacrifice this guy, it is to the Archdemon, as this is more "for Ferelden!!!". Also, the Chantry must be restored to status quo, so pick the most conservative zealot available (Vivienne is out, as her recruitment is optional, and she's kinda heavily villain-coded) and wrap up the Inquisition as the new private army. Oh, and Solas is an evul traitor, besides being bald, shifty, a mage and an elf, so stop him at all costs!!!!1 (okay, that last one escalated...)
I started out with Trevelyan first time I played, but quickly changed to Lavellan instead. Tried again for my male playthrough, but quickly replaced him with Adaar Also, I'm not sure how Bioware picks their default, though as I said...I suspect they do it in order to have less ties going forward so as to introduce the new game to new players (who haven't played the previous installments). But like I said in a different thread, I tend to go with my own favorites...even if that doesn't go over-well 'canonically' for example, by default Alistair marries Anora because apparently this is 'best for Ferelden', in Inquisition you can also find out Anora is a better diplomat concerning Orlais if Celene is alive (what an interesting meeting that must've been ) however, loads of fans enjoy being Alistair's Queen which rules that out, I tend to put Alistair alone these days (especially in my main canon) and head-canon he eventually meets a nice woman on his own terms Well, I was mostly doing my usual pessimist spitballing. Of course, it could also be a kind of "least amount of baggage"... or just consequences. You know, I'm rather impassinionate about Alistair (as opposed to other topics... ) but I'm not that much of a fan of making him look bumbly or incompetent. If we take hardened Alistair as an example... he's still young and able to grow in DAO, so I don't buy the "bumbling fool who did not acquire any diplomatic experience in 10 years" excuse. Though to be fair, I've never chosen Celene as sole ruler, and I'm pretty much in favour of the Gaspard-Briala connection, with Celene being somewhat... dead. 1) It was the one real downside to that trailer for me. I didn't mind him being the narrator so much as suddenly it's "I've fought tyrants and would be gods", not "we", making him sound like the iconic hero of the series. As I say, if we're not going to have a continuing protagonist as iconic hero, then nobody should fill that role. Also "I've got your back" implying his is going to be popping up again next game as our "best friend" even if it is only as a contact/advisor. Josephine/Blackwall/Sera/Cullen/Dorian/Varric 2) At least with Varric I don't want to pummel sense into him. Sera is the one that really annoyed me after the Temple of Mythal. She rightly concludes that the Chantry story of the Maker and the elven gods don't fit, so her reaction is to reject the reality of the elven gods even though we have concrete proof that some of what the Dalish claim is true, whereas we have damn all concerning the Maker, particularly since the whole Herald thing was not true. Apparently the Temple of Mythal was just full of demons telling lies. Then she uses that to further ridicule the Dalish for "living in the woods". Doesn't she realise we live in the woods because that is the only way we can stay free to live the lives we choose? Which incidentally is not to go around playing stupid pranks and living out petty revenge fantasies. It still bugs me that Sera was the spokesperson for the "little people". Why couldn't they give us someone who didn't have such race hatred and was really little more than a petty criminal? I'm hoping our new protagonist is now going to fulfill the role of "Robin Hood" standing up for the little guys next game, hopefully without the enforced dodgy underworld background. 1) Yes, I think that's getting too much. If Varric is the protagonist, I'm out. Me no playing go-to andrastians. I'd also like to have my characters choose their friends themslves. DA2 has some good and some bad (mostly Aveline, whom we only have limited options to... disagree with, despite her frequent mess-ups), but I feel that DAI tells us whom we are supposed to like more often... Imma make a list:
neutral: - Leliana (might depend on her alignment) - Josi - Bull
- Blackwall (even post-Revelation)
- Solas (except for Trespasser) - Cole (might veer a tad bit towards mild dislike, because of the whole "Spirit? No, its a demon!!!1"-business)
supposed to like - Dorian - Varric (Do I need to say more? ...besides not being fond of his "heroes don't help anymore, we need faith" tangents - Cassandra (In contrast to Sera, we sometimes get three different ways of comforting her when she's in doubt with no chance of mouthing off, and she cannot really be argued with over her ingnorant prattling of chantry BS)
- Cullen (even if running the risk of getting crucified for it: he's treated as too much buddy-buddy with the Inquisitor for my liking (think about that with a circle mage Trevelyan), while we aren't really allowed to argue with his rantngs at all and then he's just declared redeemed by meta, despite not doing much for it.)
supposed to dislike - Sera (many responses towards are kinda... ableist? I mean, in some dialogues, we seem to get three differrent ways of callng her crazy)
- Vivienne (she's got some pretty apparent villain coding, but we are still supposed to treat her as a "responsible" mage, as indicated by the lack of chance to argue with her views)
2) Her denial-and-run-away behaviour is one of the reasons her arc barely gets anywhere in the base game I guess, but it is at least a legit character trait, as opposed to the writing not really making much of her internalised racism. I suppose form this to go anywhere, pushing her "anti-elf=cool" mindset would have been off then. Because we cannot have a self-respecting elf who is not an ancient or a "faithful modern mainstream andrastian" (cue Amerdian theme, also your thoughts about Shartan bing cheapened if he wold be outed as just another agent of Solas)
That's partially what I meant when bitching about pro-andrastian bias in the other thread. Why is (Fantasy)Christianity treated as inherently more legit by some? Okay, the Chantry and lady Whats-her-name took a big shit into Sera's head, but I guess I cannot question that without the abrahamitic monetheism bias being questioned as well.
Oh, and I agree on the "dodgy underworld" stereotype. I can only go so far before "delinquent rogue" becomes boring.
...
At the end of this, I guess Bioware really needs an internal continuity checker.
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Post by LadyofNemesis on Dec 22, 2020 18:30:40 GMT
Well, I was mostly doing my usual pessimist spitballing. Of course, it could also be a kind of "least amount of baggage"... or just consequences. You know, I'm rather impassinionate about Alistair (as opposed to other topics... ) but I'm not that much of a fan of making him look bumbly or incompetent. If we take hardened Alistair as an example... he's still young and able to grow in DAO, so I don't buy the "bumbling fool who did not acquire any diplomatic experience in 10 years" excuse. Though to be fair, I've never chosen Celene as sole ruler, and I'm pretty much in favour of the Gaspard-Briala connection, with Celene being somewhat... dead. Well, if we go by how Maric is described in the books and with how Cailan acts in the first five minutes we meet him, I'd say 'bumbling fool' is something of a male Theirin requirement
That said, I take the 'work together or die' approach when concerned about Orlais...aka. I take the three way truce, let them work together if they want the throne so much. And if they should kill each other during this...no sweat of my back.
And I like to believe Alistair maintains his 'blundering fool' persona to throw people off, then make a 180 turn and own them at their own game. if we take the comics (which are considered somewhat canon) Alistair is quite capable of being diplomatic, I mean...he gains the aid of the bloody Arishok of all people. Granted said Arishok is a former comrade in arms, but one who considers him Basalit-an. I'd say that makes him quite capable
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Post by Buckeldemon on Dec 22, 2020 23:25:57 GMT
Well, if we go by how Maric is described in the books and with how Cailan acts in the first five minutes we meet him, I'd say 'bumbling fool' is something of a male Theirin requirement ... and now I see another reason why they came up with the Elf-bloodedness concept. Can't have Fiona's genes influence that. At least not on the mental level, as Alistair apparently got the skin tone from her, if nothing else. That said, I take the 'work together or die' approach when concerned about Orlais...aka. I take the three way truce, let them work together if they want the throne so much. And if they should kill each other during this...no sweat of my back. Well, Briala can't have anything directly. Wrong ears. My Lavellan took her as a chance. Adaar was mostly concerned with beating the whole court at their own game and bully them into submission. She was a tad bit more power-focused than Lavellan, I guess. The latter mostly viewed it as a tool. And I like to believe Alistair maintains his 'blundering fool' persona to throw people off, then make a 180 turn and own them at their own game. if we take the comics (which are considered somewhat canon) Alistair is quite capable of being diplomatic, I mean...he gains the aid of the bloody Arishok of all people. Granted said Arishok is a former comrade in arms, but one who considers him Basalit-an. I'd say that makes him quite capable Yeah, that reminds me of that epilogue slide saying he sneaks out and mingles with tavern patrons. Also, his comment about pulling obfuscating stupidity if the Wardens come asking why there's a dead archdemon, but no dead Warden.
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Post by LadyofNemesis on Dec 23, 2020 8:37:43 GMT
1) ... and now I see another reason why they came up with the Elf-bloodedness concept. Can't have Fiona's genes influence that. At least not on the mental level, as Alistair apparently got the skin tone from her, if nothing else. 2) Well, Briala can't have anything directly. Wrong ears. My Lavellan took her as a chance. Adaar was mostly concerned with beating the whole court at their own game and bully them into submission. She was a tad bit more power-focused than Lavellan, I guess. The latter mostly viewed it as a tool. 3) Yeah, that reminds me of that epilogue slide saying he sneaks out and mingles with tavern patrons. Also, his comment about pulling obfuscating stupidity if the Wardens come asking why there's a dead archdemon, but no dead Warden. 1) I still think it's mostly 'we don't want to make another race' then anything else concerning elf-blooded people. Also, most elf-blooded characters we've seen so far have been blond...aside from Slim Couldry...which I find somewhat amusing as well
2) My first Quizzy also did the three-way truce, my second and third did Celene+Briala, and my third and canon one as I said did the three-way truce as well. What can I say, aside from a few characters I don't particularly like Orlais
3) heh, I love how snarky he can be. Especially during the Landsmeet if he isn't hardened yet Alistair: *complaining to himself* stop whining Alistair Warden: I agree with Alistair Alistair: about the whining? Oh, I agree
Also, I agree about that comment, I love it if he's the one who did the ritual Alistair: what should I tell them? (the Wardens) Warden: tell them the truth Alistair: That a maleficar saved you and then ran off to have my demon baby? That has a certain ring to it, right?
No, I suppose I'll just keep that one to myself. I can shrug and look stupid, it's a talent
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Post by Rascoth on Dec 23, 2020 8:41:13 GMT
That said, I take the 'work together or die' approach when concerned about Orlais...aka. I take the three way truce, let them work together if they want the throne so much. And if they should kill each other during this...no sweat of my back. I call this approach "make everyone as miserable as possible while flipping all Orlais off as a bonus" Not the most stable approach, but let's be honest, none of provided options is truly stable.
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