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...lives for biotic explosions. And cheesecake!
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Post by Kappa Neko on Apr 2, 2019 20:39:35 GMT
Still it's hard to cheer when you pay for something and read people working on it are miserable and falling into depression. I'm not super fond of enabling an industry that ends up crushing their employee mental/personal lives. Frankly at this point I'd rather have smaller more tight games and pay a bit more. Also I'm sick and tired of Bioware guiltripping the fans over the years, sure some devs have been harassed in a very vicious manner by fans, but Bioware/EA/the game industries should also take their responsibilities, they are also driving their employees over the edge.
It's not just the industry as a whole but to a large degree management. I see the same shit currently happening in my own company. People in charge who have no idea how we work and what exactly we do. But they make all the decisions that FOR YEARS we've been telling them are bullshit and killing everyone's motivation and enjoyment of their work. Sick days have skyrocketed. People just count down the hours and take every opportunity to call in sick. In our case it's not burnout though but boreout. Because project management is such a shitshow and we spend half of our time waiting for things to be in a state where we can actually work properly. This is beyond frustrating. After every project we have a meeting about what went well or not so well. And every time it's the same things. Nothing ever changes! They always make excuses or gloss over the issues. We are short-staffed but the company won't hire new people because too expensive. So now they're trying to patch the holes by changing our job descriptions so we can jump in and fill the holes without extra cost. All the while management stuffs their pockets and leaves us swimming in our misery. They are ruining the company and making lots of money for themselves doing so. As in sending back our tiny raises with "thanks, we don't need it"... fuck these guys!
This is not an industry problem (even though I work in the same industry, but in a different area). This is THE problem of every large company! Mismanagement is a serious problem. They literally don't listen to what you're saying and then they try to blame you when the project is a nightmare. A nightmare we always see coming. But they keep saying it will all be fine.
Schreier could have written the same article about my company. It's falling apart and it's not the parent company who hurts us (like it's not EA's fault). It's incompetence and arrogance in our office.
Whoever is in charge at Bioware is extremely incompetent. And the devs are not good with Frostbite. So those two things combined killed Bioware. I knew they were creatively dead. Been saying this since Andromeda. But had some hope for Edmonton until Anthem released.
I don't think it's fixable. These people need to leave Bioware and get better job opportunities elsewhere. heal their bodies and minds and start over. There is no future for Bioware.
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Post by shinobiwan on Apr 2, 2019 20:39:37 GMT
I've mentioned previously that I thought Casey's comments at that presentation were really, really fucking weird.
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bshep
N5
We destroy them or they destroy us.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Origin: MasterDassJennir
Prime Posts: 1876
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Post by bshep on Apr 2, 2019 20:42:03 GMT
Yeah, keep working the game and fix those crunch habits. It's that simple, isn't it? Fix those crunch habits, and it's all better! I get it now! <furrowed brow creases> Wait... How do you fix those crunch habits? What is a crunch habit? A crunch "habit" is the result of chronic mismanagement. How do you propose fixing that? Firing all the managers? I agree they should all be fired, but that's only a bloodletting. It doesn't heal the wound, and after firing that group of morons you are left with a void. I'm sure quality people will rush to fill those spots, absolutely sure of it. Not even sure what "keep working the game" means, unless you mean that BioWare are actually grifters and you admit you like to be taken by con men masquerading as game developers, then uh ok I haven't say or implied this is easy to fix, don't try putting words in my mouth. Firing people is really not a solution, but more like a temporary fix, if old bad habits are the issue. They are likely to start again in the next devolopment cicle.
Also i may have forgot a article there but was it really that hard to understand i was talking about the game (Anthem)? As in keep patching, fixing bugs, releasing new content etecetera.
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blep mlem mlem
ratlobster banger
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Prime Posts: 3,912
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Post by Solas on Apr 2, 2019 20:42:46 GMT
@ thread: so what do u think this means for DA4?
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Post by river82 on Apr 2, 2019 20:43:50 GMT
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Little Pumpkin
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Mass Effect Andromeda, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Origin: Beerfish
XBL Gamertag: Beerfish77
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Post by Beerfish on Apr 2, 2019 20:43:57 GMT
Holy shit, that is a depressing read... Essentially 12 months of crunch to get the game out in EA's fiscal Q4...sounds "ME:A"-familiar, doesn't it? There are always "heroes" in these situations and it sounds like Mark Darrah was the adult in the room and got them working together to ship it on time. Also, Frostbite can go off and die somewhere..."full of razor blades"...Jesus EA needs to give BioWare the time to develop "Dragon Age 4"...they can't repeat this. Frostbite absolutely needs to go. It's a terrible engine and seems to be one of the major common threads between DAI's, MEA's, and Anthem's development issues. I've hated that engine for years. Sounds like it has been a pain in the ass to use for years and you simply cannot shoe horn one type of game into and engine totally designed for a different game.
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Partying like it's 1999
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Post by Little Bengel on Apr 2, 2019 20:44:52 GMT
so what do u think this means for DA4? As has been mentioned in the article, DA4 will be built on Anthem's codebase. Whatever it means, and I've been waiting for someone to clarify. All I know is that at least it means BioWare ain't starting from scratch. We'll wait and see.
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Post by river82 on Apr 2, 2019 20:45:40 GMT
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Post by smilesja on Apr 2, 2019 20:46:49 GMT
Holy shit, that is a depressing read... Essentially 12 months of crunch to get the game out in EA's fiscal Q4...sounds "ME:A"-familiar, doesn't it? There are always "heroes" in these situations and it sounds like Mark Darrah was the adult in the room and got them working together to ship it on time. Also, Frostbite can go off and die somewhere..."full of razor blades"...Jesus EA needs to give BioWare the time to develop "Dragon Age 4"...they can't repeat this. One can imagine the amount of stress they must’ve been under. It’s amazing they made a game that was functional in that timeframe.
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N5
We destroy them or they destroy us.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Origin: MasterDassJennir
Prime Posts: 1876
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Post by bshep on Apr 2, 2019 20:47:15 GMT
so what do u think this means for DA4? As has been mentioned in the article, DA4 will be built on Anthem's codebase. Whatever it means, and I've been waiting for someone to clarify. All I know is that at least it means BioWare ain't starting from scratch. We'll wait and see. I believe you answered your own question. Probably Bioware will not have to recreate the wheel during the game development.
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Always teacher, sometimes writer
Teaching Mode Activated
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
PSN: LinksOcarina
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Post by linksocarina on Apr 2, 2019 20:49:16 GMT
I've mentioned previously that I thought Casey's ignoring Anthem and randomly bringing up DA4 was really, really fucking weird. Hmmm. That is very unlikely because if true, they would get fired quick.
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Post by Camel on Apr 2, 2019 20:51:29 GMT
So Bioware has had a huge problem using the Frostbite engine for a RPG with dialogues in DA: Inquisition in 2014. But they still chose to use Frostbite in 2019 in Anthem and it's still not Bioware's fault. OK.
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Post by smilesja on Apr 2, 2019 20:52:00 GMT
I've mentioned previously that I thought Casey's ignoring Anthem and randomly bringing up DA4 was really, really fucking weird. Hmmm. That is very unlikely because if true, they would get fired quick. That has been debunked.
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Post by Camel on Apr 2, 2019 20:52:45 GMT
Background of Jason Schreier from the GamerGate perspective.
Member of GameJournoPros. Proven to have been active in the list. Dishonesty Following allegations of cronyism between Brandon Boyer and Stephen Thirion, he wrote an article minimizing the issues, calling them "misguided at best" and comparing them to a conspiracy theory, since the person used as a source to confirm these ties denied having discussed them when he asked. Hasn't updated the article or returned on the subject when more proof of Thirion and Boyer's relationship surfaced — not only confirming this relationship existed and showing that Thirion had received coverage from Boyer multiple times, but that Boyer was involved in at least five other conflicts of interest of comparable magnitude. Managed to twist GamerGate catching the harasser Mateus Sousa into an article blaming GamerGate's "atmosphere" for Sousa's actions. Lied about the results of a survey he held on Twitter — claiming "review scores" (which Kotaku doesn't use) were people's biggest issue with game journalism, when journalists relations (which Kotaku was having plenty of issues with at the time) had gotten over three times the votes. Claimed he wasn't contacted for comment before the original GameJournoPros emails leak, when he actually was, and publicly. His followup article after the end of the trial for the false Brad Wardell accusations echoes the false narrative of Kotaku's original piece by Kate Cox and completely inverts the real timing of the lawsuits. Released scandalmongering article about a drunk journalist hitting on a developer — but calls a colleague having an affair with a developer he favorably covered just a few days before not news worthy. Sensationalism Wrote a heavily circulated article about Trendy Entertainment, and a couple of follow-ups. In these articles,his anonymous sources described lots of issues at the “Video game studio from hell”, laying all the blame on then-president Jeremy Stieglitz. Issues included unfair crunch hours, bad management decisions, and, worst of all, offering lower wages to women candidates for the same positions. In 2016, a throughly researched article showed most of Schreier’s claims were heavily questionable: several of his sources were working at a competitor of Trendy, the woman offered a lower wage was significantly less qualified, and Trendy’s mismanagement seemed to come from individuals other than Stieglitz. Stieglitz lost his position immediately after the article, while actually still working for Trendy and being forced to co-operate with the people who had defamed him. The article was also eventually brought as evidence when Insight (Trendy’s owner) sued Stieglitz and the more-successful company he had founded, forcing him to settle for 40 million dollars. Initiated a moral panic surrounding the game Dragon’s Crown—first, on Kotaku, by comparing the art direction of the game’s artist and Vanillaware president George Kamitani to the work of a “14-year-old-boy”. After a response from Kamitani and some backlash, Schreier doubled down with a longer article—which included an apology for his tone—and, especially, with some infamous forum posts where he accused the game’s large-chested sorceress character of inciting pedophilia. His criticism generated much backlash, with his Editor-in-Chief eventually addressing it, stating Schreier had been misunderstood. Wrote two articles about a specific scene in the 2013 Tomb Raider prequel, eventually taking his reporting into scandalmongering territory. Trivia Portrayed in the People of GamerGate series. Compared asking for better ethics in journalism to the Ebola virus. Claims journalistic objectivity to be "a silly thing to strive for". Much later returned on the subject due to that claim's diffusion.
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N5
We destroy them or they destroy us.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Origin: MasterDassJennir
Prime Posts: 1876
Prime Likes: 376
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Post by bshep on Apr 2, 2019 20:54:27 GMT
I've mentioned previously that I thought Casey's ignoring Anthem and randomly bringing up DA4 was really, really fucking weird. Hmmm. That is very unlikely because if true, they would get fired quick. Pretty much. The idea they decided to make and announce a teaser for DA4 in secret without telling EA is silly to say the least.
So Bioware has had a huge problem using the Frostbite engine for a RPG with dialogues in DA: Inquisition in 2014. But they still chose to use Frostbite in 2019 in Anthem and it's still not Bioware's fault. OK. That would be EA's fault for making all their studios work with frostbite.
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Finished Dissertation long ago lol. Now happily employed :D
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Post by biggydx on Apr 2, 2019 20:57:40 GMT
So Bioware has had a huge problem using the Frostbite engine for a RPG with dialogues in DA: Inquisition in 2014. But they still chose to use Frostbite in 2019 in Anthem and it's still not Bioware's fault. OK. Don't think it's their choice at this point. Though BioWare initially chose to use the engine, when presented the opportunity, them signing on has likely led to EA mandating the engine across all their big name releases. Something I didn't even think about is what happens if Respawn encounters the same issues if they use Frostbite. Would that signal to EA that its time to give up Frostbite? I know most of their games are FPS, but if they decide to branch out, they'll likely encounter the same woes as other non-FPS studios.
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Post by thats1evildude on Apr 2, 2019 20:59:18 GMT
@ thread: so what do u think this means for DA4? Good question. My answer is "I'm not sure."
On the plus side, Dragon Age isn't wrestling with the same identify issues as Anthem. There's no having to figure out where it's going to be set or who the antagonist will be — those things are already set. And while Frostbite is apparently "full of razors," they at least have two games' worth of experience working with it.
On the down side, Bioware devs are trying to figure out exactly how to incorporate live service elements into Dragon Age. A lot of the same leadership problems exist — the heads of the studio swerve between wanting to build by committee to ignoring all the protests from the lower ranks.
So ... DA4 will be a toss-up in terms of quality?
It would be great if the DA fandom could rally together and present a clear message to BioWare about what we are looking for. Not demands, not criticisms — just our wants and expectations. We want a single-player campaign. We expect a multiplayer campaign separate from the SP. We want a continuation of the story from DAI. We expect you to take the time that's needed. We don't want you to work your employees to death.
But such efforts always face huge opposition from within the fandom, so I don't think that will be happening.
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Post by CHRrOME on Apr 2, 2019 20:59:18 GMT
As depressing as article reads, the part about making a demo for EA's CEO really made me chuckle. Bioware: " We need to make a demo to impress this guy! Let's add flying and some pretty graphics!!" Sonderlund goes: "Ohhhhhh, look at how good it is!" ( Lol, what is this guy, a six year old? ) The guy clearly knows jackshit about games, he only wants that sweet sweet money, and assumes that pretty graphics and some "woah" mechanic are gonna cut it for success. I'd tell him that early 2000s are long gone.
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Post by shinobiwan on Apr 2, 2019 21:00:53 GMT
I've mentioned previously that I thought Casey's ignoring Anthem and randomly bringing up DA4 was really, really fucking weird. Hmmm. That is very unlikely because if true, they would get fired quick. I'm not sure what you're talking about re: "if true." I mean the part where the interviewer is asking questions about Anthem and Casey is like enough about Anthem, let's talk about DA4. Two months before launch lol. That happened, and it was very odd.
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Post by Iakus on Apr 2, 2019 21:06:31 GMT
As depressing as article reads, the part about making a demo for EA's CEO really made me chuckle. Bioware: " We need to make a demo to impress this guy! Let's add flying and some pretty graphics!!" Sonderlund goes: "Ohhhhhh, look at how good it is!" ( Lol, what is this guy, a six year old? ) The guy clearly knows jackshit about games, he only wants that sweet sweet money, and assumes that pretty graphics and some "woah" mechanic are gonna cut it for success. I'd tell him that early 2000s are long gone.
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Post by smilesja on Apr 2, 2019 21:08:01 GMT
It's that simple, isn't it? Fix those crunch habits, and it's all better! I get it now! <furrowed brow creases> Wait... How do you fix those crunch habits? What is a crunch habit? A crunch "habit" is the result of chronic mismanagement. How do you propose fixing that? Firing all the managers? I agree they should all be fired, but that's only a bloodletting. It doesn't heal the wound, and after firing that group of morons you are left with a void. I'm sure quality people will rush to fill those spots, absolutely sure of it. Not even sure what "keep working the game" means, unless you mean that BioWare are actually grifters and you admit you like to be taken by con men masquerading as game developers, then uh ok I don't know if these people care or not. From what I've read they just want to play a "fun" game, even at BW employee's expense. 10k quit your generalizing seriously. Nobody wants to see these devs suffer.
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Post by river82 on Apr 2, 2019 21:09:14 GMT
Background of Jason Schreier from the GamerGate perspective. Not really interested in his opinions on the state of video game journalism here. All I'm interested in when he drops insider information about a studio is that he's never been wrong doing this with Bungie or Bioware. But sure, if I read an opinion piece of his then I'll take his stances into account. For example, Bioware released a statement in reply to Schreier which he calls an attack on a journalist doing his job. This statement is hyperbole because Bioware's statement was typical, corporate "say nothing" speak, and was far from an "attack". But he's entitled to his opinions.
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Cerberus is Humanity! Join us today and receive a limited edition commemorative pin!
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Post by 10k on Apr 2, 2019 21:13:33 GMT
I don't know if these people care or not. From what I've read they just want to play a "fun" game, even at BW employee's expense. 10k quit your generalizing seriously. Nobody wants to see these devs suffer. Why are you the only one to get defensive? If it's not true, then it shouldn't bother you. But for some reason you are the only one to respond to my "generalizing." If it doesn't concern you, than why does it bother you? Edit: I didn't mention any names. But here you come, defending yourself.
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Post by river82 on Apr 2, 2019 21:17:22 GMT
Anthem was always envisioned as an online multiplayer game, according to developers who worked on it, but it wasn’t always a loot shooter, the kind of game where you’d endlessly grind missions for new weapons. In these early versions, the idea was that you’d embark from a city and go out on expeditions with your friends, staying out in the world as long as you could survive. You’d use a robotic exosuit, and you’d fight monsters with melee and shooting attacks, but the focus was less on hoarding loot and more on seeing how long you could survive. One mission, for example, might take you and a squad to the center of a volcano, where you’d have to figure out why it was erupting, kill some creatures, and then fight your way back. “That was the main hook,” said an Anthem developer. “We’re going out as a team, going to try to accomplish something as a team, then come back and talk about it.” Along the way, you could scavenge or salvage alien ships for parts and bring them back to your base in order to upgrade your weapons or enhance your suit.
That sounds ... really dull to me. Could just be me though
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Post by smilesja on Apr 2, 2019 21:18:27 GMT
10k quit your generalizing seriously. Nobody wants to see these devs suffer. Why are you the only one to get defensive? If it's not true, then it shouldn't bother you. But for some reason you are the only one to respond to my "generalizing." If it doesn't concern you, than why does it bother you? Because you’re generalizing other people especially with what you said. Seriously can you not see how it paints people?
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