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Post by slimgrin727 on Jul 29, 2019 12:38:27 GMT
I actually think Rose Leslie (Ygritte from GoT) would have been a good pick/fit and she could just tell Geralt instead of Jon Snow that he "knew nothing" and her personality would be a good fit for Triss as well.  I'd say that Eleanor Tomlinson (Demelza from Poldark) would have made for a great Triss as well.  Yep.
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Post by Noxluxe on Jul 29, 2019 12:58:24 GMT
Like when Elba was cast as Roland Deschain, this is just an early warning that the show is generally going to be half-assed about trying to establish any kind of credible atmosphere. Which is a shame, because an unusually credible atmosphere is pretty much the foundation of the franchise. In the Dark Tower novels, Roland's character is trapped in an endless cycle of reincarnation and repetition, albeit the events of each "loop" aren't always the same each time. The books imply his personality may change between "loops", so why not his appearance?
Elba wasn't playing the Roland from the novels, he was playing a different iteration of Roland. (The next one, supposedly?)
That's an interesting way to look at it. But whether or not there's a hypothetical way of a character actually changing race in the lore of the setting is beside the point. What I'm saying is that the casting team not feeling particularly bound by the parameters of the story as written indicates that the other producers feel free to make equally liberal interpretations, almost unfailingly resulting in an unfaithful adaptation with a lot of corners cut. Because if Triss looks Greek anyway then who's going to notice that you make this little adjustment too? If she knocks it out of the park and I like her better than the books' or games' Triss, and Henry Cavil's frowning and puppy-dog eyes are somehow more endearing or communicative as Geralt than they were as Superman, and the rest of the story and dialogue are airtight and enrapturing and full of worthy additions to the franchise to compensate for every compromise they had to make, then I'll be a happy camper. I'm not saying that that isn't still possible. But it isn't what these trailers smell like.
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Post by dazk on Jul 29, 2019 20:47:51 GMT
I'd say that Eleanor Tomlinson (Demelza from Poldark) would have made for a great Triss as well.  Yep. Good choice Sifr I wasn't familiar with her, Poldark (the newer version) is one of those shows I have been meaning to watch since it came out..... Thanks for sharing the photo slimgrin727
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Post by fredvdp on Aug 7, 2019 9:35:40 GMT
I think the trailer has a very odd focus. Yennefer's transformation was mentioned here and there, but never all that important, so I'm not sure why that seems one of the focus points of this teaser. The teaser also seems to be going for a very serious tone, which unfortunately makes it come off as a bit generic.
In this trailer, Geralt fights here and there, but often he just stands there while people are talking to him. I think it wouldn't hurt if the teaser showed his personality a bit more. In the books Geralt likes to talk about morality, human nature, and for some reason the evolution of fish life. I'm sure they filmed all that stuff, so they should just stick one of Geralt's monologues in that trailer as a voice over. I don't care if it's "evil is evil" again. Just something that gives new fans a clue as to who this character is.
I also feel there's way too much going on for a teaser. We're bombarded with characters, locations, even major plot events and spoilers. They should have toned it down a little.
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Post by dazk on Aug 15, 2019 2:12:11 GMT
If anyones interested.
Also watched a YouTube video about the TV show and the stupid comments by the Director/Producer about why they changed a couple of the characters to black people (including Triss) and the answers were complete nonsense which is basically what the video was saying. And the second one is a follow up.
Its here if you want to watch it:
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Post by Obsidian Gryphon on Aug 15, 2019 2:53:55 GMT
Given what she said, the director is going to follow her own book, not the source material. Just from the trailers and what has been said, I'm not interested in it.
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Post by fredvdp on Aug 15, 2019 10:31:42 GMT
I saw that first video and I think he's grasping. Saying a character can't change appearance because the narrator described them in a certain way is a paper thin argument. I also feel like people have a much bigger issue with race changes than any other changes, which is apparent by the fact that almost no one complained about the changes they made to the appearances and personalities of characters like Triss and Dandelion in the video games. People are a lot more upset if they make changes to a character's ethnicity for some reason. I agree with some of his other points, especially how nonsensical Lauren's comments about American accents are, but I did chuckle a bit when he said there's no England in The Witcher when a good chunk of The Lady of the Lake takes place in King Arthur's realm, with Galahad being a fairly important character.
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Post by dazk on Aug 15, 2019 11:56:31 GMT
I saw that first video and I think he's grasping. Saying a character can't change appearance because the narrator described them in a certain way is a paper thin argument. I also feel like people have a much bigger issue with race changes than any other changes, which is apparent by the fact that almost no one complained about the changes they made to the appearances and personalities of characters like Triss and Dandelion in the video games. People are a lot more upset if they make changes to a character's ethnicity for some reason. I agree with some of his other points, especially how nonsensical Lauren's comments about American accents are, but I did chuckle a bit when he said there's no England in The Witcher when a good chunk of The Lady of the Lake takes place in King Arthur's realm, with Galahad being a fairly important character. I thought he specifically said the opposite of that. I thought he said of course a character can change appearance if it has no impact or makes sense to do that but that changing the character he referenced and not changing characters who are specifically related to her makes no sense in that one specific black character in a family of white characters is incongruous. He specifically said I thought that if they also changed the other characters then it would make more sense. I have watched so many videos the past few days so maybe I am confusing it with another but will re-watch it tomorrow. EDIT: I missed that you said you'd watched the first video, does that mean you didn't watch the second? He clarifies that point in that one.
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Post by Doominike on Aug 16, 2019 3:32:21 GMT
Never played any of the games nor read any of the books but I like fantasy settings so might check it out.
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Post by slimgrin727 on Aug 16, 2019 15:58:40 GMT
I saw that first video and I think he's grasping. Saying a character can't change appearance because the narrator described them in a certain way is a paper thin argument. I also feel like people have a much bigger issue with race changes than any other changes, which is apparent by the fact that almost no one complained about the changes they made to the appearances and personalities of characters like Triss and Dandelion in the video games. People are a lot more upset if they make changes to a character's ethnicity for some reason. I agree with some of his other points, especially how nonsensical Lauren's comments about American accents are, but I did chuckle a bit when he said there's no England in The Witcher when a good chunk of The Lady of the Lake takes place in King Arthur's realm, with Galahad being a fairly important character. The reason she's race-bending is the issue. We all know it wouldn't happen with an IP featuring a minority cast ( ie; brown people). Hell, Poles kind of are a minority and fans were looking forward to a series that embraced the Slavic source material. Instead she's filtering it through American politics and some bullshit notion of white guilt. Also, many people were critical of the changes CDPR made to certain characters. Dandelion in particular is a shallow depiction and doesn't come close to what he is in the books.
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Post by fredvdp on Aug 17, 2019 8:53:13 GMT
Yes, I just saw the first. I'm referring to the 2 minute mark where he says the descriptions of hair styles, hair colors, and eye colors are never there for just cosmetic reasons, which I disagree with. They add flavor to the story, but are otherwise not that important. That's why it doesn't matter that Triss' eye color changed in the games or that her skin tone isn't quite the same in the Netflix series. Just like how it doesn't matter that Syrio Forel has hair in the adaptation of A Game of Thrones or that the Hound's scar changed to the other side of his face. The person who made the video says it's important that Yennefer is pale because Sapkowski constantly describes her as such, but this adaptation is not Sapkowski's work, so that shouldn't matter. Sapkowski himself said many times that a completely faithful adaptation is not interesting, so these minor changes should not matter. (I believe he compared adaptations to women: the less faithful ones are more interesting.) I agree that Fringilla's race change is a bigger issue because of plot relevance. It was important in the plot that she looks very much like Yennefer, which becomes relevant in the Toussaint chapters, so that's gonna be a change in the adaptation that I won't really like. The reason she's race-bending is the issue. We all know it wouldn't happen with an IP featuring a minority cast ( ie; brown people). Hell, Poles kind of are a minority and fans were looking forward to a series that embraced the Slavic source material. Instead she's filtering it through American politics and some bullshit notion of white guilt. Also, many people were critical of the changes CDPR made to certain characters. Dandelion in particular is a shallow depiction and doesn't come close to what he is in the books. That's something I fully expected when they were making a mostly American adaptation (although this is a coproduction with the Polish Platige Image, which worked on the video games). I'm a Belgian and I wasn't too fond of the American adaptation of the Belgian comic book Tintin by Steven Spielberg, in which characters pay on a Belgian market with UK pounds for some reason. I think Sapkowski once mentioned that he thought the Russians could make the best big-scale adaptation of The Witcher because they understand the culture more, and I think he has a point there. Still, Tomek Baginski (who directed the game cinematics) is involved as executive producer, and they have a prominent Russian director (Alik Sakharov), so it does seem like a multicultural production, even if Netflix and Sean Daniel are calling the shots. At least it's interesting to seen an American take. We've had Polish adaptations before (a horrible TV show and three incredible video games), so I don't think anything is lost if this show ends up being awful.
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Post by Noxluxe on Aug 17, 2019 9:46:31 GMT
I don't have a huge problem with the way Yennefer looks per se.
What matters about her impression isn't her being pale, it's the extreme contrast between her jet-black hair and snow-white skin, and her wardrobe leaning into that, reflecting how she can go from zero to a hundred and unapologetically shift from one pole to another in a heartbeat, and you can never be entirely sure that she won't do exactly that. Making her feel sharp and edgy and unpredictable, making her both intriguing and intimidating.
Anya Chalotra is light enough to still be able to pull that impression off under most lighting conditions, I think.
What worries me more regarding her is how the trailer portrays her as an inexperienced, tragic young lady making a few sacrifices to become a force to be reckoned with.
Which, while definitely not a worthless narrative, is rather overdone as a theme these days and nowhere near as fresh and interesting as book!Yennefer being a jaded, lonely, cranky old woman fighting tooth and nail trying to partially reverse that exact process to reclaim some of her humanity, having matured enough to understand what it meant.
To my mind, that's a story a lot more in need of being told right now, if not in place of then at least in addition to and as an extension of the first one.
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Post by Sifr on Aug 17, 2019 10:44:55 GMT
At least it's interesting to seen an American take. I dunno, remember how the American version of Death Note turned out?
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Post by aglomeracja on Aug 17, 2019 11:39:41 GMT
Honsetly, I'm afraid that the "American take" is about making things more generic rather than adding some new perspective. It's not only about the main characters though, I personally was completely put off by the Dryads shown in the trailer. In TW they were a humanoid race of only female warriors that used bows. In the trailer, they're a group of black chics with spears, pretty much a stereotypical portrayal of some african tribe with gender twist. I'm afraid that's one of the things that will stand out to much for me to stay immersed in the story.
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Post by slimgrin727 on Aug 17, 2019 15:21:28 GMT
Honsetly, I'm afraid that the "American take" is about making things more generic rather than adding some new perspective. It's not only about the main characters though, I personally was completely put off by the Dryads shown in the trailer. In TW they were a humanoid race of only female warriors that used bows. In the trailer, they're a group of black chics with spears, pretty much a stereotypical portrayal of some african tribe with gender twist. I'm afraid that's one of the things that will stand out to much for me to stay immersed in the story. This is exactly my concern. American adaptations are more generic by nature. It's very rare to see an American production company do justice to a foreign IP. And yeah, the dryads....not a fan. They look like mangy hippies, not an unearthly, deadly race of forest warriors.
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Post by Noxluxe on Aug 17, 2019 16:47:37 GMT
To be fair, America has had an effective monopoly on high-budget international entertainment for as long as that's been a thing. If the "American take" feels generic then... well, yeah, of course it does. It's almost the only thing there's ever been in this industry.
Just because it feels beyond stale at this point doesn't necessarily mean the approach is bad or disrespectful by default, or that its cons as such outweigh the value it brings and has brought, which may long since have been taken for granted.
But yeah, it'd be nice if the politicking obsessives could contain themselves every once in a while, and we could get content that wasn't chopped up and spoon-fed for fear of backlash.
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Post by dazk on Aug 18, 2019 1:46:34 GMT
Honsetly, I'm afraid that the "American take" is about making things more generic rather than adding some new perspective. It's not only about the main characters though, I personally was completely put off by the Dryads shown in the trailer. In TW they were a humanoid race of only female warriors that used bows. In the trailer, they're a group of black chics with spears, pretty much a stereotypical portrayal of some african tribe with gender twist. I'm afraid that's one of the things that will stand out to much for me to stay immersed in the story. Yeah its funny when they go for inclusivity and actually get racial stereotyping and also dilute the "diversity" the author actually put into their books!!!!! In regards to the Dryads specifically I really like the female dryad at the Druids Grove in TW1, she had "Snark".
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Post by davesin on Aug 19, 2019 6:13:13 GMT
I don't have a huge problem with the way Yennefer looks per se. What worries me more regarding her is how the trailer portrays her as an inexperienced, tragic young lady making a few sacrifices to become a force to be reckoned with. Which, while definitely not a worthless narrative, is rather overdone as a theme these days and nowhere near as fresh and interesting as book!Yennefer being a jaded, lonely, cranky old woman fighting tooth and nail trying to partially reverse that exact process to reclaim some of her humanity, having matured enough to understand what it meant. To my mind, that's a story a lot more in need of being told right now, if not in place of then at least in addition to and as an extension of the first one. Well, most of the trailer shots on her are from time when she was an inexperienced young lady with several physical deformities, so if they go with this for flashbacks and then, by the time she's supposed to meet Geralt, shifts more into her book personality (about 80+ years already being alive and really becoming this jaded, lonely old woman), it might work. It would be nice if we could actually hear some of the Yen's lines to get a better idea about her though.
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Post by Hier0phant on Aug 19, 2019 14:33:24 GMT
In the books Yennefer is older than Triss whose actress is not only older than Anya but looks like she's twice her age, Geralt ever thinking Fringilla resembles Yennefer, or Geralt even having enough money to afford muscle supplements is a clear example of the casting crew and writers not giving a damn about accurately adapting the books. About the race bending of multiple characters, it makes the northern kingdoms' infamous xenophobia questionable, and depending on the amount of money the showrunners placed into the non humans' designs the pogroms could potentially become questionable too.
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Post by Sifr on Aug 21, 2019 19:55:15 GMT
Finally got around to watching Penny Dreadful and now I'm even more disappointed that Eva Green isn't Yennefer. (Even if she'd said no, knowing she'd been asked would have been some small consolation) 
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Post by Noxluxe on Aug 21, 2019 20:59:38 GMT
Finally got around to watching Penny Dreadful and now I'm even more disappointed that Eva Green isn't Yennefer. (Even if she'd said no, knowing she'd been asked would have been some small consolation)  I don't know. That'd have been like Alan Rickman playing Loghain. It'd just have been too perfect. A less obvious - and less recognizable - choice leaves the actor/actress some elbow room to put their own spin on the character. Which they need for it to feel fresh enough to be engaging at all. Once you're adapting a book series that has already been adapted into a video game series, and not even for the first time, making some tweaks is absolutely necessary. For those tweaks to be in direct conflict with the atmosphere of the source material and the authenticity of the setting, and very clearly politically motivated at that, is another matter. Timothy Dalton would have made a kickass Vesemir though. And you could basically have transplanted Harry Treadaway's doctor Frankenstein into the witcherverse as a morbidly enthusiastic alchemist or Oxenfurt researcher without any conflicts at all. Not sure about Creeve Carney as Dandelion. He has the looks, but I remember his Dorian Gray as very brooding and sensual, with none of Jaskier's flamboyancy or earnestness, and haven't seen enough of the guy's other work to know if he's capable of it convincingly.
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Post by Sifr on Aug 22, 2019 0:22:02 GMT
I don't know. That'd have been like Alan Rickman playing Loghain. It'd just have been too perfect. Rickman would have definitely been a great pick, but I wouldn't mind seeing Simon Templeman (Loghain's VA) reprise the role if they ever were to make a live-action Dragon Age series.
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Post by Noxluxe on Aug 22, 2019 1:12:34 GMT
Rickman would have definitely been a great pick, but I wouldn't mind seeing Simon Templeman (Loghain's VA) reprise the role if they ever were to make a live-action Dragon Age series.
Don't give them ideas.  I only brought it up for comparison. Look at what they're doing to this franchise. That said, you're totally right. I had no idea Templeman looked like such an ugly, dignified, badass cross between Woody Harrelson and Mick Jagger. Put him in plate armor and he'd be ready to go.
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Post by aglomeracja on Aug 22, 2019 16:40:01 GMT
Rickman would have definitely been a great pick, but I wouldn't mind seeing Simon Templeman (Loghain's VA) reprise the role if they ever were to make a live-action Dragon Age series.
That said, you're totally right. I had no idea Templeman looked like such an ugly, dignified, badass cross between Woody Harrelson and Mick Jagger. Put him in plate armor and he'd be ready to go. Hah, so basically he looks like Willem Dafoe 
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Post by masterwarderz on Aug 23, 2019 21:57:25 GMT
That said, you're totally right. I had no idea Templeman looked like such an ugly, dignified, badass cross between Woody Harrelson and Mick Jagger. Put him in plate armor and he'd be ready to go. Hah, so basically he looks like Willem Dafoe  ...Well you aren't wrong.
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