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Post by Hrungr on Oct 4, 2019 18:42:18 GMT
From this tweet by Sean Obrigewitch (@shrimpbutch): What is your favourite level in a #BioWare game and why? I am doing important research and I need your help!
#Anthem #MassEffect #DragonAge #SWTOR #SWKOTOR #EnvironmentArt #GameDevelopment
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Post by Hrungr on Oct 4, 2019 18:48:58 GMT
My favourite levels are those that do the unexpected or subvert your expectations.
- The ME2 space-walk. - Going through the floor in the Citadel DLC. - The Library in the Fade in Trespasser - Getting flipped around on the ship in Liam's personal mission.
Also, anytime you can show off a feature in the environment in grand style - cresting a hill or rounding a corner and seeing... something awesome splayed out before you.
Colour and light are also very important. What I liked about DA:I was the variety of colour palettes across the different environments. Add in dynamic weather, interactive environment elements, day/night cycles, seasonal changes(?)... 👍
The more elements in the environment you can interact with the better as far I'm concerned.
- Knocking down the overhead bridge with a number of enemies on it in Griffon Wing Keep. - Turning the big winch to open the Crestwood Dam, which in turn opens up a new area to explore. - Activating those big mechanical traps in DA2's Legacy DLC.
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Post by colfoley on Oct 4, 2019 19:10:40 GMT
This whole thing is an interesting segue with a rescent convo... these days what constitutes a 'level' are we talking maps or quests?
In Your Heart Shall Burn though. Just the perfect range of emotional engagement, peaks and valleys, lowest of the low to highest of the high. Fear, anger, depression, hope, triumph.
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Post by Heimdall on Oct 4, 2019 19:12:20 GMT
I have a few on Twitter:
I mentioned the ME3 opening as an example of a level taking place in a larger scene that changes because of that scene, which I really liked.
I also like levels that take a familiar location and twist it around a bit (like, for example, setting it on fire) for which I mentioned running though Kirkwall during the Qunari attack.
Also Illium as a favorite hub, because I thought it effectively gave a sense of being a part of a much larger location.
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Post by Hrungr on Oct 4, 2019 19:38:05 GMT
This whole thing is an interesting segue with a rescent convo... these days what constitutes a 'level' are we talking maps or quests? He's an Environment Artist (and hashtagged #EnvironmentArt), so look at from that angle...
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Post by gervaise21 on Oct 4, 2019 19:41:08 GMT
I loved the Battle of Denerim in DAO from the stirring speech by the monarch right through to killing the arch-demon. It really put me through the emotional wringer. After the first fight we choose who is going to lead the second team, say our farewells to those who we are not taking with us and then get cheered on our way by the troops (which still has the power to move me every time). My first run I had also turned down Morrigan, anticipating that Riorden wouldn't make it through to the end, so every step was taking me (my character) closer to their doom. When Riorden did fall and the cut scene showed the Hero hang their head and shoulders slump, that was precisely how I felt because now there was no question that I was going to die. Then in the final moments Alistair talked me out of it, wanting to die heroically in the way he felt the king should and save the life of his friend at the same time. It blew me away and ensured I was hooked on the series for good.
A close second and favourite in the MET was of course the Suicide Mission, with an honourable mention for Mordin's finest hour and associated quest in ME3.
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Post by PCthug on Oct 4, 2019 19:52:55 GMT
I'm another one who likes when they take an environment you're familiar with and flip it around a bit. So Kirkwall at the end of Act II and III, In Your Heart Shall Burn, Denerim at the end of DAO, the end of ME1. It really kicks the emotional resonance into high gear.
Since I just replayed it, the Collector Ship mission in ME2's Act 2 is amazing and holds up years and countless replays later. It does a great job building fear and unease.
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Post by Gilli on Oct 4, 2019 20:36:59 GMT
Okay, let's see... Enviroment: DAI: Emerald Graves, Emprise du Lion and the Hissing Wastes Quests: DAI: In Hushed Whisper, Before the Dawn (the whole "look for clues in Emerald Graves & Emprise du Lions") That's all I can think of atm, maybe I can think of more later.
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Post by saandrig on Oct 4, 2019 20:54:14 GMT
Anyone says DAO's "Fade section" or "Deep Roads" gets an arrow in the face. So I will start...
DAO's "Fade section"...first time only. Cmon, it was the Fade, it felt like it had those weird dream rules and overall was a nice change of pace as a puzzle...for a while.
KOTOR's...well, almost all of it, but if I have to pick... Tatooine, because it had that great pace with side and main quests, plus it really felt like a hot place under the sun. And Korriban for all those Sith tombs, challenges, lore, tests and tons of RP. I know those planets can be considered as multiple levels, but they felt so well connected through the lore and questing that I feel them as one giant level.
ME1 - literally nothing...had to say it
ME2 - Jack's recruitment mission. That place felt like a space station and a prison. And the Migrant Fleet was an awesome experience. Then the suicide mission...is it one level? If not - then the biotic field section. Things got dicey in there (shut up, inner Kurt).
ME3 - Grissom academy. It was really nice to see that famous place and meet the students with some of their projects...during a firefight. Plus - Jack.
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Post by colfoley on Oct 4, 2019 21:28:10 GMT
This whole thing is an interesting segue with a rescent convo... these days what constitutes a 'level' are we talking maps or quests? He's an Environment Artist (and hashtagged #EnvironmentArt), so look at from that angle... well in that case, I don't know if I have a favorite level in terms of aesthetics...however: I thought the Hissing Wastes was gorgeous. Night time desert, moon overhead, wind blowing... the dwarven ruins. The Emprise was gorgeous. The Exalted Plains was the perfect 'war torn battlefield' with signs of war everywhere. And the Emerald Graves, didn't like the quests... don't like forests...but it really put me there to where it felt like my allergies were acting up. And yes I agree with a lot of people, maps that change over time are appreciated. Whether that's day/ night cycles, dynamic weather, or 'because story'. Also I liked the Deep Roads.
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Post by tatann on Oct 4, 2019 21:42:31 GMT
- ME1's Citadel - Virmire (except the Mako part) - Omega - Ilium (ME2) - Tuchanka (ME3) - Rannoch - all Normandies
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Post by Part Time Ninja on Oct 4, 2019 22:04:53 GMT
Suicide Mission from start to finish stands as my favourite ending stage in a game ever. The atmosphere, stakes, ambition, emotion and execution are absolutely breathtaking. Mass Effect 2 is the most character driven game in the series and knowing those character lives rest on your decisions...Bioware at its best, a stunning achievement.
One that may be a little less popular (maybe it is, I have no idea) is the Deep Roads in Dragon Age Origins. Love the expedition into the Darkspawn lair and whilst a slog...it was a highly enjoyable slog where you and your companions get to be awesome and take down hordes of monsters.
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Post by themikefest on Oct 4, 2019 22:10:20 GMT
Suicide mission because of the many different ways the player can complete it with the fewest or all squadmates recruited
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Post by arvaarad on Oct 4, 2019 22:18:06 GMT
My absolute favorite is probably the Fade level in Origins. I enjoyed the maze aspect where I was revisiting rooms, but entering and exiting by different routes. Really gave it a feeling of multiple overlapping realities, which is very on-theme for the Fade.
For both maps and combat, I’m a big fan of puzzle geography. Give me maps that I need to “solve”, e.g. by exploring an area to get an advantage/progress in a nearby location. For individual encounters, give me lots of terrain that I can manipulate with glyphs and walls.
Indoor and dungeon areas aren’t as pretty, but I do prefer them mechanically to big open fields, because there’s more ways for me to manipulate the flow of enemies with creative CC.
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Post by biggydx on Oct 4, 2019 22:27:28 GMT
The one I think about the most comes from ME1. It's one of the side missions you could do when exploring the Galaxy Map. I can't remember the exact location, but it's a civilian ship that was conducting tests on Biotics. You go through the level with little combat, but the datapads do a lot to build-up what's coming, with the captains log in the cockpit alluding to one of the Biotics onboard going psychotic. Upon leaving, this same Biotic looks to attack you.
I just found it to be a fun exploration mission.
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Post by legbamel on Oct 4, 2019 23:13:05 GMT
I have a few on Twitter: I mentioned the ME3 opening as an example of a level taking place in a larger scene that changes because of that scene, which I really liked. I also like levels that take a familiar location and twist it around a bit (like, for example, setting it on fire) for which I mentioned running though Kirkwall during the Qunari attack. Also Illium as a favorite hub, because I thought it effectively gave a sense of being a part of a much larger location. Also saving Redcliffe from the zombie horde, seeing the effect of everything you did over he course of the day and watching them come off the bridge in the dark--that was really stirring. Especially when I failed to keep the people I convinced to fight alive. Going AWOL with the Normandy in ME1 is one of my favorite game moments. Getting to commandeer a brand-new ship and run off with the love of my life to save the galaxy? Yes, please!
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Post by garrusfan1 on Oct 5, 2019 0:06:24 GMT
The deep roads in DAO those ryhmes were horrific.
In DA2 I would say the elf dlc just because it was so funny.
In DAI...I would say the tresspasser dlc was awesome.
In ME1 probably feros.
In ME2 I had so many I couldn't choose.
In ME3 it is incredibly hard but if I could narrow it down I would choose tuchanka's main mission and citadel dlc because it was just so fun.
Only played MEA a few times and it was a while ago so I can't really remember.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 5, 2019 0:18:20 GMT
1) The Battle through London in ME3... particularly, when you first jump off the shuttle, which did feel like dropping into a war zone with a battle raging. A similar effect was used at the beginning of the Turian Bomb mission. 2) The final battle to rescue the twin in ME:A was also pretty intense, which I liked. I liked the combination of having to hold positions and then move to hold another different one with the hoards of enemies attacking. (ETA: The overall mission demanded the use of all the mechanics previously introduced in the game at an elevated intensity. It also brought allies acquired during the game into the ending battle. It would have been even better if they could have been given larger roles and moments where the player could have directed them in some way. The surprise emergence of the architect during the battle was also well done.) The only disappointment was that the player did not actually have to defeat the architect and the archon to end the mission. 3) I enjoyed the concept behind the Suicide Mission in ME2 very much. Being able to pick and choose squad members for suitable jobs and therein determine their fate was a great way to end that particular game (a stroke of genius). The battles themselves, however, were very linear and pretty lackluster overall (The Long Walk in particular). Fighting the human Reaper larvae at the end was downright boring.
As far as opening up to a view though... nothing beats walking out onto the balcony area of the monastery during the Lessus mission in ME3. (ETA: The architecture of the monastery is organic and realistic... and this enhances the view. I literally felt like I was somewhere in Tibet.)
NOTE: I don't play the Dragon Age games... medieval swordplay is just not my thing. Hungr posted a link from the ME Twitter thread, so I followed it here.
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Post by Absafraginlootly on Oct 5, 2019 1:06:19 GMT
Adored the deep roads in Descent, they were beautiful, ominous and full of secrets.
I enjoy the Circle Tower and fade section in DAO. Fun puzzle, fun bit of soloing and it breaks up the dungeon crawl through the tower just before it might have started to get dull. Would have been even better if the companions nightmares had actually looked like the locations they took place in ie. Flemeths hut, crow dungeon etc.
Also the urn of sacred ashes with its creepy isolated village, fascinating ancient temple and the challenges to get to the urn, particularly the riddles and Guardian.
Speaking of Temples - the Temple of Mythal/the Arbor wilds was great. For similiar reasons to those mentioned above. Plus the tension and mounting drama of your enemy being there after the same thing.
Crestwood was also well done, i liked how much you could change that area and also how that uncovered another story about what happened to the tainted in Crestwood. Redcliffe in DAO did the drama of being a village under siege better though.
Also liked the crossroads in trespasser, good constant build up, cool locations, ancient lore. (I really like uncovering ancient secrets)
And the city of orzammar, just a cool map full of things that really let you feel the culture of the place, would like to see more cities.
It's hard to pick anything from da2 because they reuse the maps so much that i associate most levels with both good and meh quests. I suppose I'll choose the deep roads expedition with the primordial thag. That stood out and offered a whole new perspective on Dwarven culture, plus juicy betrayel and the fight to escape.
Been awhile since i played mass ever games but i remember enjoying the multiple ways to progress at various stages that was on Noveria. Plus the the transition from sleek corporate retreat>snowy Tundra>creepy underground lab kept things interesting and conveyed the mood of each part of the quest.
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Post by cypherj on Oct 5, 2019 2:35:16 GMT
Oh, that's a tough one. Really close between two levels.
Battle of Denerim.
Started with the rousing speech by Alistar, when we finally got to see him become the leader we thought he could be. You got to see your choices from an entire playthrough play out in the final battle. Which factions you chose, how much you donated to supply your army. Fighting in the different areas of the city, using multiple parties. You got to choose what faction fought where.
Earlier decisions decided What soul was taken to defeat the archdemon, including the possibility of your own. Then you had all the leaders of the different factions coming out and fighting beside you at the very end.
Just the scale and the reflection of your choices throughout the game makes this probably my favorite. There were other games where you were gathering strength for a final battle, but none even came close to playing it out on this scale.
Virmire
If not the Battle of Denerim, it would be this.
Just loved the setup, driving through with the Mako and taking down the aerial defenses so the Normandy could land. Then you had the hold the line speech and the confrontation with Rex, who was only trying to save his people.
Storming the base on foot through the bluffs, before you entered the base and had your first contact with a reaper. The dialogue exchange with Sovereign is still my favortie in the series.
You then had the Kaiden/Ashley choice, and the choice of whether to save the Salarians.
There was another good dialogue exchange with Saren, when you see that he's indoctrinated and doesn't even know. He thinks he's doing the right thing to save everyone. You almost feel sorry for him.
Then seeing the scene where Kaiden/Ashley is guarding the bomb to their last breath before it goes off. Back on the Normandy the somber music playing and the squad meeting is just the team sitting around struggling to cope with what just happened.
I like this level for the structure and the mixture of action/fighting and dialogue.
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Post by Zemgus on Oct 5, 2019 7:05:33 GMT
ME: Virmire. Having to first deal with Wrex and then deciding between Ashley and Kaidan. ME2: The Suicide Mission. The first time I did it I lost many squad mates (some of them were my favorites) and it was terrible but also great. Replaying it now doesn't feel quite the same as the first time, because purposely letting some of your companions die just because it would make the story better doesn't really work for a completionist like me.
DAI: Jaws of Hakkon and Trespasser DLC's.
Both Virmire and The Suicide Mission have a sense urgency that sometimes is missing even though the fate of the Galaxy is at stake. Same with Trespasser.
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Post by correctamundo on Oct 5, 2019 7:55:21 GMT
Well, let us see...there are so many to chose from. Anything Deep roads really. Pushing through Caridins cross, the the Dead trenches and finally the Anvil of the Void is such a monumental part of Dragon Age history. Then there is the Darkspawn Warrens into Heidrun thaig in the Descent. Wow. The space in that place. Fallow mire. The ambience, the mystery and the tragedy. In your heart shall burn. Probably the best quest ever. Liams loyalty mission. Pure gold from start to finish. Not liking this "plan" Liam. The Collector ship is spooky and really gets the blood pumping when it is time to haul ass. And last but not least. Definitely not least - The Echoes of reality.
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Post by helios969 on Oct 5, 2019 8:32:48 GMT
Lair of the Shadow Broker and the Tela Vasir skyway chase and confrontation. I still think that DLC is the most expertly crafted.
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Post by LukeBarrett on Oct 5, 2019 16:15:28 GMT
I really liked the haunted house mission in DA2. Obviously the repeated used of that same mansion level didn't help but the concept of spooky (as opposed to scary) is something that is always entertaining to me.
I bring up doing a nextgen remake of DA2 (with proper unique levels) whenever I have the opportunity but it doesn't ever get any traction haha
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Post by Blaze on Oct 5, 2019 17:49:46 GMT
I really liked the haunted house mission in DA2. Obviously the repeated used of that same mansion level didn't help but the concept of spooky (as opposed to scary) is something that is always entertaining to me. yeah i totally agree, that's why personally i liked the mission in haven so much. and the haunted house is another good example of it. another one i liked is the allianage mission with the templar, that's was also quite creepy. the mystery element always add to the creepiness =D great, keep it up. they are bound to break eventually!
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