inherit
Scribbles
185
0
Apr 19, 2024 15:24:55 GMT
30,241
Hanako Ikezawa
22,352
August 2016
hanakoikezawa
|
Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Jan 3, 2020 10:24:18 GMT
I think taking the Inquisitor's hand away was BioWare's way of telling us that this protagonist's story is over, intending to avoid demands for a return in future games like they got for the Warden - and once again underestimating people's attachment to their characters and stories. I wouldn't be overly surprised if the next protagonist gets killed off in the end only for players to demand a return as a force lyrium ghost. Personally I wouldn't mind playing a Götz von Berlichingen kind of badass, but since I don't feel any particular connection to Solas and his story - as far as I'm concerned Morrigan is welcome to kill him off in the prologue - I would be happy with a new character too. If that was the case though, you'd think Patrick Weekes would have said so rather than give this answer when asked: Gamedam Meister @gamedammeister @patrickweekes Is the reason why in Trespasser you had the Inquisitor lose their hand to "Conclusively tie off this protagonist"?
Patrick Weekes @patrickweekes @gamedammeister Not the hand -- plenty of amputee heroes. We took the Mark to make it clear that rift-closing was finished.
|
|
inherit
1265
0
Apr 14, 2024 11:47:48 GMT
1,669
isaidlunch
794
Aug 26, 2016 22:27:12 GMT
August 2016
isaidlunch
|
Post by isaidlunch on Jan 3, 2020 11:03:49 GMT
I think the Inquisitor deserves to be the PC and get proper closure in DA4, but I don't see it happening. And why do you want to play as Inquisitor for the whole game of DA 4? Can you name any other reason(s) then Solas and the final confrontation?
Nope, that's literally the only reason. If Trespasser had ended differently (i.e. proper closure with Solas), then I would've preferred a new protagonist, but now it feels like ditching Shepard after ME1 and having someone else fight the Reapers. It's extremely frustrating and something that could've been avoided.
|
|
Gileadan
N5
Agent 46
Clearance Level Ultra
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
Origin: ALoneGretchin
Posts: 2,671 Likes: 6,650
inherit
Agent 46
177
0
6,650
Gileadan
Clearance Level Ultra
2,671
August 2016
gileadan
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
ALoneGretchin
|
Post by Gileadan on Jan 3, 2020 12:29:26 GMT
I think taking the Inquisitor's hand away was BioWare's way of telling us that this protagonist's story is over, intending to avoid demands for a return in future games like they got for the Warden - and once again underestimating people's attachment to their characters and stories. I wouldn't be overly surprised if the next protagonist gets killed off in the end only for players to demand a return as a force lyrium ghost. Personally I wouldn't mind playing a Götz von Berlichingen kind of badass, but since I don't feel any particular connection to Solas and his story - as far as I'm concerned Morrigan is welcome to kill him off in the prologue - I would be happy with a new character too. If that was the case though, you'd think Patrick Weekes would have said so rather than give this answer when asked: Gamedam Meister @gamedammeister @patrickweekes Is the reason why in Trespasser you had the Inquisitor lose their hand to "Conclusively tie off this protagonist"?
Patrick Weekes @patrickweekes @gamedammeister Not the hand -- plenty of amputee heroes. We took the Mark to make it clear that rift-closing was finished. That could be the truth, of course. On the other hand, I remember at least one BioWare video stating that the goal of Trespasser was to "tie off" the Inquisitor's story. Also, the epilogue of Trespasser states that they have to find someone else, someone Solas doesn't know yet. If they just wanted to make clear that the rift-closing days were over, they could have just removed the green sparkle and left the hand itself alone. Are there any rifts left to close anyway? Also, bringing the Inquisitor back as a playable character, whether as a dual or single main protagonist, would cause them some additional difficulties that a new protagonist doesn't have: - They'd either have to design the gameplay of all classes around a one-armed character, or come up with some kind of prosthetic (and thus making the removal of the hand mostly pointless) - They'd have to come up with an explanation why the Inquisitor is level 1 again, like killing off Shepard at the beginning of ME2 (unless they're meant to show up late in the game as a dual protagonist). Not saying that it's impossible, it just doesn't look very likely to me. And sure, there are probably plenty of amputee heroes around, but how many of them are RPG protagonists?
|
|
inherit
Scribbles
185
0
Apr 19, 2024 15:24:55 GMT
30,241
Hanako Ikezawa
22,352
August 2016
hanakoikezawa
|
Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Jan 3, 2020 13:38:18 GMT
If that was the case though, you'd think Patrick Weekes would have said so rather than give this answer when asked: Gamedam Meister @gamedammeister @patrickweekes Is the reason why in Trespasser you had the Inquisitor lose their hand to "Conclusively tie off this protagonist"?
Patrick Weekes @patrickweekes @gamedammeister Not the hand -- plenty of amputee heroes. We took the Mark to make it clear that rift-closing was finished.That could be the truth, of course. On the other hand, I remember at least one BioWare video stating that the goal of Trespasser was to "tie off" the Inquisitor's story. Also, the epilogue of Trespasser states that they have to find someone else, someone Solas doesn't know yet. If they just wanted to make clear that the rift-closing days were over, they could have just removed the green sparkle and left the hand itself alone. Are there any rifts left to close anyway? Also, bringing the Inquisitor back as a playable character, whether as a dual or single main protagonist, would cause them some additional difficulties that a new protagonist doesn't have: - They'd either have to design the gameplay of all classes around a one-armed character, or come up with some kind of prosthetic (and thus making the removal of the hand mostly pointless) - They'd have to come up with an explanation why the Inquisitor is level 1 again, like killing off Shepard at the beginning of ME2 (unless they're meant to show up late in the game as a dual protagonist). Not saying that it's impossible, it just doesn't look very likely to me. And sure, there are probably plenty of amputee heroes around, but how many of them are RPG protagonists? The video you are thinking of is the quote the question is referencing. As for those two issues, a prosthetic limb solves both. They’d have to learn how to fight all over again so would be back at Level 1. And it wouldn’t make the loss pointless since they could work it into the story, like being a constant reminder of their mission to things like phantom limb syndrome, etc.
|
|
Felya87
N3
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
Posts: 876 Likes: 2,228
inherit
1004
0
2,228
Felya87
876
Aug 15, 2016 22:36:22 GMT
August 2016
felya87
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
|
Post by Felya87 on Jan 3, 2020 14:08:15 GMT
The lack of an arm is not a problem. A fantasy prostetic arm can actually be great for new types of unique abilities and gameplay. (Point out at Sekiro as example of prostetics used for different gameplay).
|
|
inherit
410
0
Apr 19, 2024 10:10:53 GMT
2,852
Sartoz
6,014
August 2016
sartoz
https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Ftse1.mm.bing.net%2Fth%3Fid%3DOIP.hVm-5wNStlyTEXjhwDoa_wHaEK%26pid%3DApi&f=1&ipt=8f745a5f30b08f8231ddb64664df7375d23cc10878aa50d66fec54e9d570c7e2&ipo=images
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
|
Post by Sartoz on Jan 3, 2020 17:15:55 GMT
I think taking the Inquisitor's hand away was BioWare's way of telling us that this protagonist's story is over, intending to avoid demands for a return in future games like they got for the Warden - and once again underestimating people's attachment to their characters and stories. I wouldn't be overly surprised if the next protagonist gets killed off in the end only for players to demand a return as a force lyrium ghost. Personally I wouldn't mind playing a Götz von Berlichingen kind of badass, but since I don't feel any particular connection to Solas and his story - as far as I'm concerned Morrigan is welcome to kill him off in the prologue - I would be happy with a new character too.
Morrigan killing Solas in the prologue? Good idea.
DA4 is due sometime in 2022. That's 8 years since DA:I was launched in Nov 2014. Bio is looking forwards to a new crop of players, that came up with the looter shooters. I doubt a traditional RPG is the studio's goal. Thus I see no reason to continue the Solas saga or keep any of the characters from DA:I (even though I love to see Varric, Cassie, Leliana, Hawk and Morrigan).
Bio's best approach is to start with a new crew, new background story in keeping with mostly, a MP game (not that I like this as I prefer the traditional RPG).
|
|
cuthbertbeckett
N4
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Posts: 1,683 Likes: 1,742
inherit
11318
0
1,742
cuthbertbeckett
1,683
Sept 28, 2019 14:19:10 GMT
September 2019
cuthbertbeckett
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
|
Post by cuthbertbeckett on Jan 3, 2020 20:27:24 GMT
Seemed to work for ME3. You know, the "best place" to start the trilogy. But really, new players will either care enough to find out more about the setting or they won't. I see no reason for Bioware to favor the latter over the former. I would say that ME 3 was the great exception but every other Bioware games have to be playable with you don´t have any previous knowledge. Dragon Age 2 and Dragon Age Inquisition worked that way and it would even argue that the Origins Addon Awakening is self contained.
And after these long time gap (we are talking about atleast 8 years) i really can´t see Bioware or even EA expect that the majority have played DAI or the DAI DLC Trespasser.
1. New players have this wonderful thing called the past games or the Internet to catch up. Games shouldn’t be held back and explain everything each time just because some are too lazy to look up what they missed when jumping into the fourth game of a series. 2. Bigots should not be paid attention to. BioWare certainly hasn’t cared about them before, so why now? 3. Fine. You can feel how you want. I don’t care and it doesn’t change that being an answer that fits your question. That idiotic rule is fine if they complete the story of each of those characters. This time however they did not, and I still believe in the rule a good story needs a beginning, a middle, and an end. 1. Sorry but EA clearly wants that everybody can easy follow the story of DA 4. 2. They are still costumers. 3. I know that you like all of the bland boring but sympathic characters. By the way Calpernia for Companion and romance. 4. Sorry but DA 2 / Hawke story also wasn´t finished in DA 2 so its no big deal for me.
Nope, that's literally the only reason. If Trespasser had ended differently (i.e. proper closure with Solas), then I would've preferred a new protagonist, but now it feels like ditching Shepard after ME1 and having someone else fight the Reapers. It's extremely frustrating and something that could've been avoided. Sorry for the arrogant tone but so what?!? Is it really important that the Inquisitor have to stop Solas himself/herself when is just another guy after Corypheus who wants to destroy Thedas? We all know that Solas can´t win and will very likely die at the end. I really don´t care for this boring storyline. But i care for the Tevinter vs Qunari or the Grey Warden Civilwar plot. For those stories you don´t need the Inquisitor. Also i really doubt that you guys want for the returning Inquisitor to do minor tasks. Collect this or bring me this. No the Inquisitor should only stop Solas. So please tell me again why do we need the Inquisitor for the whole game? Why not just for the final confrontation with Solas?
|
|
Heimdall
N6
∯ Interjector in Chief
Staff Mini-Profile Theme: Heimdall
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Origin: HeimdallX
Posts: 5,574 Likes: 12,623
inherit
∯ Interjector in Chief
279
0
1
12,623
Heimdall
5,574
August 2016
heimdall
Heimdall
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
HeimdallX
|
Post by Heimdall on Jan 3, 2020 21:09:28 GMT
. I would say that ME 3 was the great exception but every other Bioware games have to be playable with you don´t have any previous knowledge. Dragon Age 2 and Dragon Age Inquisition worked that way and it would even argue that the Origins Addon Awakening is self contained.
And after these long time gap (we are talking about atleast 8 years) i really can´t see Bioware or even EA expect that the majority have played DAI or the DAI DLC Trespasser. Well I think the solution there is to make sure there’s a very clear introduction to the threat of Solas and the Tevinter setting early on to communicate the stakes, though that will probably be needed regardless of who the protagonist is. That’s sort of what I want. The Inquisitor can play a “background” high level role, doling out orders and their own missions while leaving the lion’s share of the adventuring to the new guy. Then their stories can converge in the final act, giving the Inquisitor the chance to confront Solas one final time.
|
|
cuthbertbeckett
N4
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Posts: 1,683 Likes: 1,742
inherit
11318
0
1,742
cuthbertbeckett
1,683
Sept 28, 2019 14:19:10 GMT
September 2019
cuthbertbeckett
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
|
Post by cuthbertbeckett on Jan 3, 2020 21:23:48 GMT
That’s sort of what I want. The Inquisitor can play a “background” high level role, doling out orders and their own missions while leaving the lion’s share of the adventuring to the new guy. Then their stories can converge in the final act, giving the Inquisitor the chance to confront Solas one final time. Also everybody in Thedas knows who the Inquisitor is. I don´t think that he/she can operate effective against Solas with this handicap.
Maybe Scout Harding who could be very likely the party connection between the Inqusitor / the Inquisition and the new hero could tell the Inquisitor at the end of the game that they finally found Solas and you all get your Solas confrontation scene.
But before that the focus should be on the new hero and the other storylines. DA 4 isn´t just only about Solas.
|
|
inherit
Scribbles
185
0
Apr 19, 2024 15:24:55 GMT
30,241
Hanako Ikezawa
22,352
August 2016
hanakoikezawa
|
Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Jan 3, 2020 22:50:10 GMT
1. New players have this wonderful thing called the past games or the Internet to catch up. Games shouldn’t be held back and explain everything each time just because some are too lazy to look up what they missed when jumping into the fourth game of a series. 2. Bigots should not be paid attention to. BioWare certainly hasn’t cared about them before, so why now? 3. Fine. You can feel how you want. I don’t care and it doesn’t change that being an answer that fits your question. That idiotic rule is fine if they complete the story of each of those characters. This time however they did not, and I still believe in the rule a good story needs a beginning, a middle, and an end. 1. Sorry but EA clearly wants that everybody can easy follow the story of DA 4. 2. They are still costumers. 3. I know that you like all of the bland boring but sympathic characters. By the way Calpernia for Companion and romance. 4. Sorry but DA 2 / Hawke story also wasn´t finished in DA 2 so its no big deal for me. 1. Source? Also a story can be simply followed without having to reset it every game/movie/etc. 2. Ones that shouldn’t be catered to. 3. :rolleyes: 4. And it should’ve. The fact you don’t care about good storytelling is irrelevant. That’s sort of what I want. The Inquisitor can play a “background” high level role, doling out orders and their own missions while leaving the lion’s share of the adventuring to the new guy. Then their stories can converge in the final act, giving the Inquisitor the chance to confront Solas one final time. Also everybody in Thedas knows who the Inquisitor is. I don´t think that he/she can operate effective against Solas with this handicap.
Maybe Scout Harding who could be very likely the party connection between the Inqusitor / the Inquisition and the new hero could tell the Inquisitor at the end of the game that they finally found Solas and you all get your Solas confrontation scene.
But before that the focus should be on the new hero and the other storylines. DA 4 isn´t just only about Solas. People know of the Inquisitor. They don’t know the Inquisitor. They weren’t even recognized by people like the nobles at Celene’s ball and they’re right there.
|
|
Heimdall
N6
∯ Interjector in Chief
Staff Mini-Profile Theme: Heimdall
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Origin: HeimdallX
Posts: 5,574 Likes: 12,623
inherit
∯ Interjector in Chief
279
0
1
12,623
Heimdall
5,574
August 2016
heimdall
Heimdall
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
HeimdallX
|
Post by Heimdall on Jan 3, 2020 23:05:26 GMT
That’s sort of what I want. The Inquisitor can play a “background” high level role, doling out orders and their own missions while leaving the lion’s share of the adventuring to the new guy. Then their stories can converge in the final act, giving the Inquisitor the chance to confront Solas one final time. Also everybody in Thedas knows who the Inquisitor is. I don´t think that he/she can operate effective against Solas with this handicap.
Maybe Scout Harding who could be very likely the party connection between the Inqusitor / the Inquisition and the new hero could tell the Inquisitor at the end of the game that they finally found Solas and you all get your Solas confrontation scene.
But before that the focus should be on the new hero and the other storylines. DA 4 isn´t just only about Solas.
Remember Dorian gave the Inquisitor that sending stone thing. He’s in Tevinter and he’ll be able to give the Inquisitor updates in real time.
|
|
inherit
11389
0
Sept 2, 2020 22:46:34 GMT
23
inaforestdreaming
7
January 2020
inaforestdreaming
|
Post by inaforestdreaming on Jan 3, 2020 23:31:10 GMT
From a story telling standpoint, I just don’t really understand why they wouldn’t bring back the inquisitor? I mean purely from the way the story has been set up, ignoring any personal preferences and arbitrary new game / new pc rules - if one of your companions turns out to be a big old liar and now intends to do something that could destroy the world, if they gave us the option of choosing how to proceed against him (redeem /kill) and showed you and a small group of your allies plotting their next move (going to Tevinter) - that to me gives no good indication that we would change protagonist now, if anything it strengthens the reason to continue. Not to mention DAI was well received and brought in a lot of new players to the franchise and unlike origins they can’t be dead.
People usually bring up the same arguments against it but to me they are all just excuses not actual solid story reasons:
Inquisitor was boring- Subjective but regardless, you could consider Inquisition to be their origin story. They fought one bad guy to save the world only to find out the real bad guy was the friend standing beside them the whole time and now he’s off to try to destroy the world (again). That’s pretty compelling. They’ll also have a whole game to develop them further as a character and if the massive improvement in Trespasser was anything to go by, I’m sure they can do it in DA4.
Missing Arm - it’s a magical world, this is a non issue. A prosthetic would give us new combat possibilities and give a reason to start low level. Story wise it’s also an interesting thing for our character to deal with, provides character development.
New players - Most big franchises have recurring characters and personally I feel that recurring npcs and companions lose some of their appeal if I met them as a different pc so they don’t know who I am but I the player know who they are. That is immersion breaking for me but perhaps I’m in the minority. From a narrative standpoint, I feel that it loses any emotional connection that would otherwise be there - for me, sacrificing Hawke or Alistair in the fade was not really an effective moment because Inky didn’t know or really care about either of these people, the only reason it carried any weight was because I the player cared about them. This creates a disconnect between player and character. I imagine confronting Solas as a new pc would be similar. People worship The Witcher 3 as the best rpg ever and a huge portion of players started with that game not 1 or 2. I played ME2 and 3 before 1 and understood it perfectly fine. All you need is contextual clues and plenty of information for players if they need it. If anything going to Tevinter as a non native would help with this.
With regards to Solas - all you would need to do is to make it clear he was your friend / companion who lied to you for his own agenda which will likely destroy the world (simplifying for clarity). That already carries emotional weight and is fairly easy to identify with (a friend betraying you). Obviously the writers could come up with a reason for a new pc to have any feelings about him but frankly that seems like a lot of work and time and resources when it’s already been set up for inky. Contextually for new players it still makes sense. Someone new might have strong reasons to like or dislike Solas but I doubt it would trump the betrayal angle and would lose a lot of the built in nuance and pathos which is a foundation of effective story telling. And again, for me interacting with him as a new PC would be impacted by me the players thoughts and feelings about him rather than the new character or at the very least there would be some bleed over. Yes this is a role playing game and maybe I’m just bad at role playing but to me the whole point of narrative driven games is emotional investment, I’m playing this because I want to feel involved in and be moved by the story.
People have suggested dual protagonist and / or inky just deals with Solas at the end but that to me would be even worse for new players - a random character gets to do the final confrontation with the villain? That would be jarring and unsatisfying. Why would a new player who played as a new pc the whole or most of the game care what The Inquisitor wants to do about Solas? If they played the whole game as the inquisitor then it would come naturally as a part of the game and just have added drama and emotion for people who played DAI. Dual protagonist seems like it would be expensive and is to me unnecessary. Given we don’t know exactly what Solas is up to, I’m sure there would be plenty of side quests we could do in the downtime before things are more urgent. Not to mention they don’t have to be ‘go here, collect this’, just make them meaningful and tie into the narrative.
The only legit issue I can see is romances. I didn’t romance anyone in ME so not sure how that worked but it’s obviously possible. As far as we can tell a lot of potential LIs will still be around in the next game so they can likely make it work. Let’s not forget this is supposedly a live service game and a good way to keep people invested and coming back would be romance content so it would be in their best interests to continue at least the most popular romances.
People saying next game is not all about Solas - Sure but based on all marketing so far, he’s going to at least have a prominent role in DA4. The way they’ve set him up is interesting and full of potential, and to be honest, the main reason I’m still thinking about this game 5 years later. Quanari and Tevinter plots have lots of appeal too and I’m sure they will also be a prominent part of the next game but I’d be very surprised if the core narrative and overall themes don’t involve Solas. Not to mention he’s linked to most of the big lore elements of the franchise and many of the big secrets so will likely be a useful character plot wise in uncovering lore for players in DA4. Regardless of wether you like or care about his storyline, that’s the story that’s been set up. The twist from DAI was effective at increasing fan interaction with the franchise and in general his character was pretty well received regardless of wether you like him or hate him, a lot of people felt strongly one way or the other. It makes sense that they would use him prominently in da4.
Anyway, that’s my thoughts, apologies for the length! I’m probably bias as I only really play story based games so my perspective is more from a narrative viewpoint but continuing Inky as pc just makes the most sense to me.
|
|
cuthbertbeckett
N4
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Posts: 1,683 Likes: 1,742
inherit
11318
0
1,742
cuthbertbeckett
1,683
Sept 28, 2019 14:19:10 GMT
September 2019
cuthbertbeckett
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
|
Post by cuthbertbeckett on Jan 3, 2020 23:38:12 GMT
1. Source? Also a story can be simply followed without having to reset it every game/movie/etc. 2. Ones that shouldn’t be catered to. 3. :rolleyes: 4. And it should’ve. The fact you don’t care about good storytelling is irrelevant. 1. Have you ever played any Dragon Age game ? They are self contained games that new players can easy follow and DA vets are getting here and here some references from previous games. Or should i better say have to you ever played Dragon Age Awakening, DA 2 and / or DAI without importing your previous character / world state. I have done this. 2. So can name any other game where the main character has a dismemberment?
3. Of course this is your answer. Really no surprise. 4. Oh yeah i don´t have any clue of good storytelling. And you are clearly obsessed with Solas that you can´t imagine a game where he is one of many storyplots. Again my question i get the Solas part (i disagree but this doesn´t matter for this argument) but why do want the Inquisitor back for the Tevinter vs Qunari and Grey Warden Civilwar plot? Again DA 4 isn´t just about Solas? Also why don´t you like the idea of bringing the Inquisitor back just for the endfight / final confrontation with Solas?
Last but not least be honest do you really want to start as Level 1 Inquisitor and lost all powers? Do you really want to play as Inquisitor minor quest stuff that have absolutly nothing to do with Solas or do you only want to stop him?
So please tell me why should the Inquisitor be back for the whole game and not just for the Solas stuff? Your argument isn´t correct anymore. After the ball and mainly after the Corypheus fight everyone in Thedas knows who the Inquisitor is.
You can bet the Inquisitor is more of a VIP than the Hero of Ferelden or the Champion of Kirkwall.
Remember Dorian gave the Inquisitor that sending stone thing. He’s in Tevinter and he’ll be able to give the Inquisitor updates in real time. Well i would say this only correct when Dorian is friendly towards the Inquisitor. But if you punch him (which is an option) i doubt he will use this.
Harding or Charter seems to be for all worldstates the better option.
People usually bring up the same arguments against it but to me they are all just excuses not actual solid story reasons: I read your post and first again my question why do you need the Inquisitor to come back for the whole game? I diagree with your points but why isn´t it enough that Inquisitor just comes back for the final Solas part? Let the new hero and Harding / Charter do the finding of Solas and all the other stuff. What is so wrong about this? Because i don´t see any desire from you guys to play these quests when they aren´t part of Stopping Solas.
|
|
inherit
7457
0
Apr 25, 2022 11:48:41 GMT
133
smudjygirl
111
Apr 10, 2017 16:09:00 GMT
April 2017
smudjygirl
|
Post by smudjygirl on Jan 4, 2020 0:21:54 GMT
I don't think Hawke/Corypheus is the same thing. Hawke didn't know Coryppheus lived, at most they were vaguely suspicious about the Warden at the end. They were mostly an unwilling participant in their own story. Solas actively earned your trust or hatred and then told you all the ways he manipulated you and what he intends to do next. Warden to Hawke was perfect, Hawke to Inquisitor didn't feel unnatural. Inquisitor to new PC? I have my worries about it. They're games that are trying to be self-contained and not doing such a great job of it. That was always going to be a problem, though.
One of my biggest gripes about Inquisition was having people i knew tell me information I knew and my character being completely unaware of things i was already informed about. I knew how Varric got the lyrium, i didn't learn anything new there other than it hadn't driven him mad like it did Bartrand. It's great to make new games accessible to new players, but that doesn't warrant a new PC. The stories could be related but completely self-contained. There's so much going on in Thedas they don't need to make the stories so directly related. I don't even mind when an old companion comes back and updates me on how my former friends are doing, but it felt weird having two different relationships with Varric through two different PCs.
I would argue Inquisitor has ties to many things we could see in the next game. Obviously there's Dorian and what he is up to. We either allied with the Qunari and had them 'betray' us or double-crossed them in the first instance. Solas, of course. We either exiled or absorbed the Ferelden Wardens. The Inquisition probably has their fingers in a lot of pies. I don't expect the Inquisitor to come back, but i don't think "the GOLDEN RULE" or "NEW PLAYERS" are good enough reasons to retire them. I think whatever will connect the new PC to such things will be grasping at straws too.
And if the Inquisitor is not the PC, I hope they don't show up at all. Tell me everything through Dorian if there is a need to connect back to the Inquisitor.
|
|
inherit
11389
0
Sept 2, 2020 22:46:34 GMT
23
inaforestdreaming
7
January 2020
inaforestdreaming
|
Post by inaforestdreaming on Jan 4, 2020 3:57:22 GMT
I read your post and first again my question why do you need the Inquisitor to come back for the whole game? I diagree with your points but why isn´t it enough that Inquisitor just comes back for the final Solas part? Let the new hero and Harding / Charter do the finding of Solas and all the other stuff. What is so wrong about this? Because i don´t see any desire from you guys to play these quests when they aren´t part of Stopping Solas.
I feel like I covered that? To me, The inquisitor coming in at the end robs that interaction of any weight if you didn't play them for most or any of the game before that. You (as new pc) just worked hard to achieve a goal (stop bad guy) and then some other character comes in to have a final confrontation? And THEY get to choose if he lives or dies? What? That doesn't feel right to me from a basic story telling perspective. That would be taking the victory away from the new character, even if we get to control the Inquisitor or if the new character gets to decide then why have the Inquisitor there at all? And I would guess they allowed us to choose redeem or kill for a reason and that reason may be that there will be branching paths depending on what you choose to do and this may affect the outcome of the final confrontation. So changing to a different character to deal with the villain at that point just seems jarring to me. Granted that's all a guess but I'm basing it off what they set up at the end of Trespasser and extrapolating. If they had set it up differently I would accept a new pc without (much) complaining - I fully expected Solas to kill or turn my Inky to stone at the end of Trespasser. Heck, even the vanilla ending would have been fine, the Inquisitor didn't know about Solas' plans so why would they be leading the charge against him? I have other issues with the new game / new pc system but at least it would have felt more natural story-wise if it had ended differently. The main reason I would prefer Inquisitor only is not just about Solas - we interacted with many factions, we learnt a lot of new lore as the Inquisitor, I want to go into DA4 on the same page as my character, knowing about Evanuris, Titans, Qunari, having personal contacts in Tevinter, Nevarra, Antiva etc. I don't want to have to meet Morrigan AGAIN as a new character and go back to square one in terms of her character development / interactions, or have to meet Dorian AGAIN without any of the character development and backstory from DAI. To me that just relies on THE PLAYERS knowledge which creates a disconnect from your pc. That is my main issue. As the inquisitor the relationships to them can all be communicated through context or even our character briefly explaining to our new companions who those characters are and how we know them, as well as in codexes for new players. It works for most other multi-game franchises so I don't see why it wouldn't work here. I think it just comes down to personal preference. I prefer series (games, books, tv) with consistent elements, I don't generally like anthologies, I don't even like that they keep changing design and art style between games either. I want to be in my characters shoes and be fully immersed in the story and not be constantly pulled out of the narrative due to knowing things and people that my character does not. That's just me, I'm sure its different for others which is totally valid but wanting the Inquisitor back is not all about being 'obsessed' with Solas as many of the people who want a new PC tend to imply.
|
|
melbella
N6
Trouble-shooting Space Diva
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Origin: melbella
Prime Posts: 2186
Prime Likes: 5778
Posts: 7,901 Likes: 24,176
inherit
214
0
24,176
melbella
Trouble-shooting Space Diva
7,901
August 2016
melbella
Bottom
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
melbella
2186
5778
|
Post by melbella on Jan 4, 2020 4:59:47 GMT
I want to go into DA4 on the same page as my character, This is another good point in favor of the Inquisitor returning in at least some role, especially with regard to Solas. I hated going into Trespasser knowing who Solas really was while my PC did not. I don't want to play AN ENTIRE GAME like that. It's obviously unavoidable on subsequent PTs, but for at least the first time through the game, I want to be as uninformed as my PC.
|
|
inherit
410
0
Apr 19, 2024 10:10:53 GMT
2,852
Sartoz
6,014
August 2016
sartoz
https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Ftse1.mm.bing.net%2Fth%3Fid%3DOIP.hVm-5wNStlyTEXjhwDoa_wHaEK%26pid%3DApi&f=1&ipt=8f745a5f30b08f8231ddb64664df7375d23cc10878aa50d66fec54e9d570c7e2&ipo=images
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
|
Post by Sartoz on Jan 4, 2020 13:14:22 GMT
There is no reason for Bio to continue with the Solas/Quizzy characters.
If Tevinter is the next location, there is plenty of material to choose from to create a game. This allows Bio to go in any direction that fits with their internal goal(s). It is we, the Old Guard, that wants to live in the past. In 2022, however, there is so much "new blood" out there that previous DA games have no meaning for them. Their background is looter-shooters that nurtures minimum attention span to story telling and character bonding.
|
|
Heimdall
N6
∯ Interjector in Chief
Staff Mini-Profile Theme: Heimdall
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Origin: HeimdallX
Posts: 5,574 Likes: 12,623
inherit
∯ Interjector in Chief
279
0
1
12,623
Heimdall
5,574
August 2016
heimdall
Heimdall
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
HeimdallX
|
Post by Heimdall on Jan 6, 2020 16:27:48 GMT
There is no reason for Bio to continue with the Solas/Quizzy characters.
If Tevinter is the next location, there is plenty of material to choose from to create a game. This allows Bio to go in any direction that fits with their internal goal(s). It is we, the Old Guard, that wants to live in the past. In 2022, however, there is so much "new blood" out there that previous DA games have no meaning for them. Their background is looter-shooters that nurtures minimum attention span to story telling and character bonding.
You may not particularly like the Solas conflict, but to say they have “no reason” seems a bit disingenuous. The previous game very clearly built up him as an antagonist going forward, which they seem intent on continuing if the first teaser is at all indicative. I’ll leave aside your presumptions about Bioware’s internal goals and the attention span of the “New Blood”.
|
|
inherit
410
0
Apr 19, 2024 10:10:53 GMT
2,852
Sartoz
6,014
August 2016
sartoz
https://external-content.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=https%3A%2F%2Ftse1.mm.bing.net%2Fth%3Fid%3DOIP.hVm-5wNStlyTEXjhwDoa_wHaEK%26pid%3DApi&f=1&ipt=8f745a5f30b08f8231ddb64664df7375d23cc10878aa50d66fec54e9d570c7e2&ipo=images
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
|
Post by Sartoz on Jan 7, 2020 15:27:45 GMT
There is no reason for Bio to continue with the Solas/Quizzy characters.
If Tevinter is the next location, there is plenty of material to choose from to create a game. This allows Bio to go in any direction that fits with their internal goal(s). It is we, the Old Guard, that wants to live in the past. In 2022, however, there is so much "new blood" out there that previous DA games have no meaning for them. Their background is looter-shooters that nurtures minimum attention span to story telling and character bonding.
You may not particularly like the Solas conflict, but to say they have “no reason” seems a bit disingenuous. The previous game very clearly built up him as an antagonist going forward, which they seem intent on continuing if the first teaser is at all indicative. I’ll leave aside your presumptions about Bioware’s internal goals and the attention span of the “New Blood”.
Eight years after the last DA game and I ask who really cares about continuing the conflict into Tevinter with some DA:I characters?... Certain fanbois, of course. But then I'm a fan too and I like to see what Tevinter is all about. However, eight years later, the player landscape has changed. Plus, Bio in no way is tied down to delivering a continuation of Solas end game. Tevinter offers huge amount of new material in a Mageocracy. Add the Quanari into the mix and Solas becomes small potatoes. I mean, I'm looking at the Big Picture here. Besides, have the recent DA comics stories strongly hinted at what the game could be all about? I see them more as an anthology series.
Will the game design target only Dragon Age fans? Of course not. Bio will target as much of the player base as possible with a story arc designed to attract them. I admit I'm somewhat prejudicial. I don't like the little weasel so my viewpoint may be skewed.
Still, tempering expectations avoids disappointment.
.
|
|
luketrevelyan
N4
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
Posts: 1,390 Likes: 4,558
inherit
328
0
4,558
luketrevelyan
1,390
August 2016
luketrevelyan
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
|
Post by luketrevelyan on Jan 7, 2020 19:28:32 GMT
I definitely want a chance to create a new character after all these years. It would be disappointing to be stuck as only the Inquisitor. I also can't imagine they would do that since they are trying to draw in new players who didn't play previous games.
On the other hand, I feel like the Inquisitor's story is unfinished so I wouldn't mind sharing some time with them again as long as the primary focus is the new character.
|
|
Valkyrie
N1
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights
Posts: 17 Likes: 72
inherit
521
0
72
Valkyrie
17
August 2016
valkyrie
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights
|
Post by Valkyrie on Apr 19, 2020 23:10:50 GMT
I think that everyone keeps forgetting that for new player, Inquisitor would still be a new character, just with a rich backstory that they could explore later by playing Inquisition.
The biggest issue with returning Inquisitor as protagonist would be handling the romances. Most players would likely want to continue relationships from previous game and that's the difficult part, because all previous companions would have to make at least an appearance in DA4. What's more, some would be tempted to romance new characters, and feel conflicted over it - it would require breaking up with or cheating with old LIs. I can imagine the outrage.
That said, I would love to have an opportunity to play as Inquisitor again. There are so many opportunities, and I hope BioWare will go that way. Some of them are: - Inquisitor as previously great hero, with great power, army, a castle, worshipped by everyone around - now - fallen from grace. In some cases, lost almost everything in their life (hello, fellow dalish elves who lost their clan) and needs to find themselves in this new reality.
- The above would also be an interesting start for character development. Would it change them? Are they still the same after the mark is gone and they no longer can use the divine power to solve most of their problems? - Solas/Inquisitor relationship obviously, no matter whether they were friends or enemies
- We, the players, have never been to Tevinter. It would be good to explore it as someone who doesn't know that much about this place, so really what's a better opportunity than playing as someone from southern lands? At least, when we do not know some basics about life and politics in Tevinter, it's understandable (not so much if you have to play as character native to the land)
And many more...
Playing as new character would mean many lost opportunities for storytelling.
I want to have an option to develop the Inquisitor's story in next game. Will they change their views? Move on to start new relationships? How would they find themselves as an (almost) normal person again? How would they deal with a loss of the limb? With having to fight they previous companion?
|
|
andydandymandy
N3
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Mass Effect Andromeda
Posts: 285 Likes: 685
inherit
9775
0
685
andydandymandy
285
February 2018
andydandymandy
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Mass Effect Andromeda
|
Post by andydandymandy on Apr 20, 2020 0:50:08 GMT
I feel like a new protagonist would work better if DA4 was going to be a completely new story, but we know its not.
Solas is going to be the main antagonist. This game is going to build off of what was set up in Inquisition and Trespasser. I am worried that the payoff to all this build up is going to feel flat if Solas becomes Corypheus 2.0 because the game has to devote a ton of its narrative and game play real-estate to building a new protagonist from the ground up.
|
|
inherit
Friend of Red Jenny
90
0
18,890
vertigomez
5,281
August 2016
vertigomez
|
Post by vertigomez on Apr 20, 2020 1:24:19 GMT
My preference is to focus on a new protagonist, but I wouldn't mind a dual protag situation that's like... 30% Inky, 70% new hero.
|
|
inherit
11450
0
4,328
necrowaif
1,925
Mar 24, 2020 19:57:15 GMT
March 2020
necrowaif
Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition
LameZombieHunt
|
Post by necrowaif on Apr 20, 2020 2:51:57 GMT
As I said in the Tevinter Nights spoiler thread, I think the only chance of defeating Solas is to come at him with someone he doesn’t know.
He can petrify anyone he can see or touch, kill anyone in their sleep at a distance and commands an army of spirits and elves. He’s all but invincible, and the only advantage we might have is if the person coming to stop him is someone he doesn’t anticipate.
Oh, he might hesitate to kill the Inquisitor out of love, friendship or plain old guilt, but I don’t think that protection will last forever, especially if the Inquisitor poses a threat to his plans.
Also, I enjoy doing new romances. I have no desire to have my Inquisitor break up with Cullen just to go after someone new.
|
|
inherit
1033
0
31,194
colfoley
16,546
Aug 17, 2016 10:19:37 GMT
August 2016
colfoley
|
Post by colfoley on Apr 20, 2020 8:08:51 GMT
I feel like a new protagonist would work better if DA4 was going to be a completely new story, but we know its not. Solas is going to be the main antagonist. This game is going to build off of what was set up in Inquisition and Trespasser. I am worried that the payoff to all this build up is going to feel flat if Solas becomes Corypheus 2.0 because the game has to devote a ton of its narrative and game play real-estate to building a new protagonist from the ground up. I see your point but on the other hand you do have a Thanos situation with Solas that his character building and set up happened in Inquisition. Now while I hope this does not lead him to becoming a hollowed out husk of a character...like TIM...that could give them room to manuever.
|
|