About Anora

Yes, my post was in part about Alistair. Might as well add this good description.



For now? By himself only.



True. Knowing this character, what kind of POS he can be, no surprise if some heirs pop up all of a sudden.
Usual things for Dark Ages. Alistair is a product of that period and not an exceeption in this case.

Alistair is such a cunt.

He puts the player character, who has been on the job for a single day, in charge of saving the country because he can't deal with the pressure. He encourages you to and helps you kill little boys, and then gives you shit over it because he can't deal with the guilt. He deserts and abandons everything and everyone he's ever known to be devoured by darkspawn because you don't irrationally hate someone as much as he does.

And according to the Darkspawn Chronicles, without you there, he helps the werewolves massacre the elves and gives Branka the Anvil of The Void.

Compared to those, I'd say that having a couple of royal bastards by maids who will obviously be well-provided for is pretty negligible in terms of bad karma. And yup, he's exactly the kind of guy who might do that.

Hm? I didn't say I hate him, or that he's evil. Just that he is, as you say, childish, weak and irresponsible. Letting a cynical witch convince you to commit atrocities in the course of your duty doesn't exactly make you any less culpable or responsible for those atrocities, and is certainly no indication that you have a spine. And we have plenty of evidence that his capacity for devotion is shallow and fickle.

As pointed out earlier, he turns on every friend he has, up to and including his true love, all his duty and everything he holds dear the moment he realizes that he won't get to see Loghain's head roll just because he wants to.

He constantly makes impulsive decisions without thinking them through, and blames others both for not listening to him and for it blowing up in everyone's faces when they do.

And he immediately abandons the thought of being a loyal brother to his sister and an uncle to his nephews and nieces when she doesn't welcome him with open arms, gives no apparent thought to their safety when you find their street overrun with darkspawn, and never mentions them again.

Let's say he's good and well twenty years old by Origins. If he keeps in good shape and receives semi-regular attention from a royal healer, and isn't killed in battle or by assassination, that would leave him more than fifty around thirty consecutive years of sitting on the throne, in a hypothetically unfulfilling marriage, resisting the urge to pull the skirts up on some pretty elven maid who fancies him. Plus Grey Warden stamina/libido.

Yeah right the son of Maric and the brother of Cailan is going to keep it in his pants for that long with an increasingly sagging, frumpy and infertile Anora by his side. 

Although, to do him justice, he most likely won't allow his bastards to grow up sleeping in stables.

Obviously this is all worst-case scenario, assuming that Anora doesn't warm up to him or he to her and that kingship doesn't force him to grow up and become more responsible. But those things aren't improbable. 

Few things back:

1. Good point, I'd forgotten about that. Nonetheless, thirty years is still a LOT of time to stick it out in an unhappy marriage without a byblow here and there. 

2. It's not established, but certainly a reasonable assumption. Being a Grey Warden apparently increases physical endurance, metabolism and the building of muscle. It'd be silly to think that the Joining affects those three things and somehow doesn't increase testosterone levels. Ergo, probably a higher libido. 

3. A patently false statement. Blood relation absolutely determines a lot of personality traits, and conscientiousness or lack thereof is a popular one. Maric's, Cailan's and Alistiar's various issues with their responsibilities would definitely fit that pattern.

4. Nobody said that Anora was 'the infertile one'. I said that she was increasingly infertile, which is a fact given that she's ten years older than he is and only has around five years left - out of those thirty - before her ability to bear healthy children weakens dramatically until it becomes actually impossible after the second decade of their marriage.

Being a man, Alistair's swimmers will be effective until he dies, assuming the Joining doesn't have a dramatic effect on that as well. And no, what we know is that he thinks that two Grey Wardens are unlikely to have children together. What we also know is that Alistair, Loghain and the male PC Warden can all successfully father a child in their first attempt, so to speak. 'Very close to sterile' is obviously a gross overstatement.

And Anora has no children between DAO and DAI whether or not she's saddled with a Grey Warden husband. Which, as I've pointed out in this thread, puts her and Ferelden in a very awkward and vulnerable position. Meaning she had serious incentive to find another candidate for Prince-Consort. Meaning that she likely did try, and failed to bear children. Which wouldn't be a huge surprise, since she's middle-aged by the time we see her in Redcliffe whether or not she was ever fertile to begin with.

I have had Anora rule alone but normally I don't go for that usually that only tends t ohappen when Alistair has a stupid moment  as the last time Anora ruled was when I decided not to do the DR an dAlistai rwas stupid enough to take on the Archdemon himself hence dying and leaving me to pick up the pieces for Anora in Awakening. Doesn't happen very often though.

One of my favorite wardens, who was angry at his own father’s weakness and vowed never to follow suit married Anora. Though the fact he’s got the divine as a mistress, probably complicates relations.

Other wardens have tended to have her marry a hardened alistair.

Marry her
My Cousland hated the concept of nobility and his own parents for their failure to maneuver about Ferelden’s political landscape. He hated the Guerrins for being political jackals and manipulating Alistair like some meat puppet and considered Alistair’s execution a mercy.

His goal with supporting Anora was to give her the political backing and legitimacy to continue her rule for as long as she can while banking on the chance that the worst of Ferelden’s surviving nobility from Marik’s era will begin to die out in the following years, giving him and Anora the chance to elevate commoners to the ranks of nobility and establish a more meritocratic system in its place.

In turn, as long as Cousland survives she gains a valuable political ally who rehabilitated her father’s image and who provides her with a convenient excuse as to why she can’t provide children. Even fucking Eamon wouldn’t publicly move against Anora as long as Cousland was in the picture.

They enjoyed a platonic relationship until he was forced to look for a cure for the Calling. At least Trespasser confirms his survival, at least in a way

My favorite playthrough during the landsmeet is "outsmart her".

As human noble.
1) win her support and promise a marriage (we'll rule together, bal bla)
2) so she speaks against her father during the Landsmeet, condemning him to certain defeat and therefore to death
3) allow alistar to behead logahin and make him king (ahah). So maybe she realises that she counts absolutely nothing and that the power to make and undo king is now in the hands of the feredelden hero.
4) If Alistar meets a glorious death (the best outcome for his personal story, IMO), she is appointed queen (after all, she is a capable administrator)
5) contemptuously stay in Denerim and help the new ruler and go with the grey wardens to hunt down darkspawn in Amaranthin (btw, awakening canon)

F*** Anora.

People will say, "Well Alistair is not king material." Um. Has there ever been a person who is king material??! A person is not born to rule. A person is however, expected to rule. What he or she does during their reign is what makes a good or bad king or a queen.

Furthermore, Alistair was not expected to rule at all. People that knew of Alistair's parentage assumed that Cailan would have lots of little Cailans with Anora. They are married and both young. Thus, these people believed the line of succession was secured. So, Alistair being trained to be an heir would cause too many problems and raise too many red flags. And Cailan was given the highest education and expected to rule and look at what a tool he became.

True. Alistair makes a statement, "I never want to be king." But how many people can say the same in their position. People might not want to be a Grey Warden or sell trinkets on the street, but they have a responsibility.

Marrying Alistair to Anora, is another bad choice. It was confirmed by Gaider that Cailan was going to divorce Anora on account of her being barren and marry Empress Celene. That is why Loghain abandoned Cailan.

Plus, why would you torture poor Alistair to be married to someone who is a constant reminder of their father,[Loghain] and the deeds he has done? Would you want to be married to someone even for political reasons, knowing your father-in-law killed your brother, Duncan and your friends?!!?

So, let us say Alistair eventually finds a cure for the Grey Warden curse. He'll then be expected to produce an heir. Its bad enough I had Alistair sleep with Morrigan. And have him do it again with Anora....that is not only evil but it makes me want to vomit.

Anora reminds me of Cersi from Game of Thrones, she only cares about three things, herself, power and holding onto that power.

I am a stickler for tradition--mostly. And if there is only one Theirin alive, Alistair should take it. Not some noble whore who believes she is entitled to it simple because she spread her legs and manipulated her way there.

Personally, locking her in the tower is a rather kind gesture, I would have thrown her ass in the Deep Roads, with only her father's corpse to keep Anora company and locked the door behind her.

Didn't do that with my Cousland. Loghain ended up thoroughly approving of him, thinking he would be good for Ferelden and volunteering to sacrifice himself killing the Arch-demon, meaning my guy could tell Morrigan where to go with her Dark Ritual. You just have to be a smooth talker to win Loghain over.

Alistair on the throne either alone or married to the Warden if applicable. I forgot to talk to her once (honest mistake made by busy player/Warden) and she went to the Landsmeet and claimed the Warden was the biggest threat to the nation...during a Blight. If she's that desperate to keep power, she probably shouldn't have any. That was my reasoning, anyway.