inherit
β― Alien Wizard
729
0
Sept 14, 2023 6:08:41 GMT
9,897
Ieldra
4,771
August 2016
ieldra
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Mass Effect Andromeda
25190
6519
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Post by Ieldra on Aug 12, 2020 9:01:41 GMT
Let's just take this easy? If you are living in a western country, there are laws for testing medicinal products. The vaccine will have gone through several phases of testing before release, that's why it takes so long to do. No politician can rush the vaccine without changing the laws first, and that's not going to happen any time soon. We learned a whole lot about testing vaccines during the previous pandemic. In 2009 the vaccine Pandemrix was found to cause narcolepsy in youths ages 12-16. The chance of this happening was 0.000036 per vaccination. While a small number, it of course means that hundreds got the side-effect. But the chance of dying for COVID-19 is currently about 0.03, or 3%. I think the vaccine has better odds here. And if you are vary of the vaccine, you are still in luck, as it will go through phase 4 testing, meaning there will be safety surveillance. So use a mask (I know you will), socially distance and wait. The results will be out eventually. That's true for ''normal vaccines, but this is, as far as I know, a RNA vaccine. Its a highly experimental approach, and with the obvious super short testing its definitely a no go for me. Don't care really what the protocols are for this vaccination, and if the scientists deem them ''adequate'', the vaccination has been rushed out and you cannot test for side effects -that can occur years later- in a matter of months. And there are many unknown factors with RNA vaccinations where scientists simply don't really know if they could be problematic. While Covid-19 can be very problematic and even lethal, if you are careful and don't contract it you have to expose yourself neither to the dangers of a barely tested experimental vaccination nor the dangers of suffering from an infection with a pneumonia virus on steroids. There are several vaccines in the testing phase, and most of them use well-known viral vectors according to the information I have. If I recall the latest WHO summary correctly, there are currently 28 candidates in phase III-testing, and only two of them are RNA-based. The Russian vaccine is not one of them BTW.
In general, of course it's smart to make a decision based on your personal risk. The risk you can't avoid, that is. For instance, I have a job where I spend most of the time in my own office, and I live in a country with few new cases atm, so my risk is negligible. In jobs where you have contact with lots of people, especially if you live in a country with lots of new cases, the risk calculation might be different.
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β― Alien Wizard
729
0
Sept 14, 2023 6:08:41 GMT
9,897
Ieldra
4,771
August 2016
ieldra
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Mass Effect Andromeda
25190
6519
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Post by Ieldra on Aug 12, 2020 9:10:27 GMT
Thing is, even if we have one, who would want to get vaccinated? Its a medical product that won't have gone through the mandatory testing protocols, long time side effects that will kick in years down the road are totally possible. In the past several rushed vaccinations and other drugs that were not thoroughly tested had life altering long time side effects which ruined lives. And if its an RNA vaccination, holy crap, that's a totally new concept with totally unpredictable long term side effects. If it was available right now it would be as dangerous as Covid-19 for me, with Cov-19 I can have a mild infection with barely noticeable symptoms (Statistically most likely), or I can get pneumonia so bad I choke. With rushed untested vaccinations people got narcolepsy and lethal nerve degeneration symptoms in the past. No thanks, being cautious and trying not to get infected seems to be the most sensible course of action for me. Maybe some years down the road when statistics are available and more tests have been done on the vaccination I might consider it. I'd take it if I were a test subject. I have no dependents right now and I'm old. If I can do some good this way, I will. I need to check this out... I'd volunteer for a clinical trial if there was one nearby, but not for a substance made by Russian scientists unter the thumb of Putin.
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β― Alien Wizard
729
0
Sept 14, 2023 6:08:41 GMT
9,897
Ieldra
4,771
August 2016
ieldra
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Mass Effect Andromeda
25190
6519
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Post by Ieldra on Aug 12, 2020 9:22:22 GMT
The Russians say they have one. They apparently skipped the phase III-safety tests, but they're confident enough that Putin's daughter used it. Or so they say. Somebody needs to do those tests... It's good to hear from you again, by the way! And you're right, proper testing needs to be done. Will Germany be doing any testing on this Russian vaccine? Thanks, and yeah, long time since I was here. Not much game-related stuff to discuss unfortunately. As for testing the new Russian vaccine, I have no information about that as yet.
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Another Crazy Finn
11505
0
Mar 27, 2024 15:21:57 GMT
4,378
rewindbutton
2,376
May 2020
rewindbutton
Dragon Age: Origins, KOTOR
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Post by rewindbutton on Aug 12, 2020 14:32:25 GMT
Let's just take this easy? [snip] While Covid-19 can be very problematic and even lethal, if you are careful and don't contract it you have to expose yourself neither to the dangers of a barely tested experimental vaccination nor the dangers of suffering from an infection with a pneumonia virus on steroids. I certainly see the value of this line of thinking. Particularly the "Don't get infected" -part.
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Another Crazy Finn
11505
0
Mar 27, 2024 15:21:57 GMT
4,378
rewindbutton
2,376
May 2020
rewindbutton
Dragon Age: Origins, KOTOR
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Post by rewindbutton on Aug 12, 2020 14:40:24 GMT
It may be a tin-foil hat moment for me, but if Russia managed to crank out an effective vaccine, let alone a safe one, this quickly, I'd be mighty curious as to how they managed to pull that off... It's not actually that unlikely. There are several other vaccine candidates in phase III tests at the moment, so they haven't been the first to reach this point. The problem is, without those tests you're basically running an experiment on the people that use it. [snip]
Having said that, it might just turn out to be cost-effective (in terms of health, not money) to use it anyway, if the side effects turn out to do less damage than the Covid-19 cases that occur if you don't use it. We don't know that, of course. It is a giant gamble they're taking there in Russia, but it's not as severely unethical as some comments make it appear. If the reported facts are correct, which admittedly is a big "if" with Russia.
Edit: I'm just now reading there have been no scientific publications in established journals or pre-print servers about this. That does not inspire confidence.
Unfortunately I am able to see the Russian way of thinking in their method. It's the usual "We have lots of people. Let them be the test subjects." And I do think this is severely unethical. Phase III tests are there for a reason.
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Another Crazy Finn
11505
0
Mar 27, 2024 15:21:57 GMT
4,378
rewindbutton
2,376
May 2020
rewindbutton
Dragon Age: Origins, KOTOR
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Post by rewindbutton on Aug 12, 2020 14:43:00 GMT
I'd take it if I were a test subject. I have no dependents right now and I'm old. If I can do some good this way, I will. I need to check this out... I'd volunteer for a clinical trial if there was one nearby, but not for a substance made by Russian scientists unter the thumb of Putin. Wishing I could like this line more than once.
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Another Crazy Finn
11505
0
Mar 27, 2024 15:21:57 GMT
4,378
rewindbutton
2,376
May 2020
rewindbutton
Dragon Age: Origins, KOTOR
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Post by rewindbutton on Aug 12, 2020 14:53:41 GMT
In case you are interested in RNA vaccines:
And about the Oxford (not RNA) vaccine, which entered phase 3 trials in june:
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Dark Helmet
1408
0
9,301
mybudgee
Fear is your only God
5,900
Sept 2, 2016 20:20:11 GMT
September 2016
mybudgee
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, KOTOR, Jade Empire
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Post by mybudgee on Aug 12, 2020 18:22:35 GMT
So, my GF and I got our results back from the 2nd Covid test in a week. Negative! That's double negative! We can finally let our guard down!!
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β The Bunny Chaser
2824
0
Mar 28, 2024 13:22:05 GMT
6,433
Energizer Bunny 211
So far 2024 is the same as the previous three years...
5,807
Jan 15, 2017 18:43:23 GMT
January 2017
energizerbunny211
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Mass Effect Andromeda, Anthem
Rumbler1138
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Post by Energizer Bunny 211 on Aug 12, 2020 21:52:10 GMT
*Bangs Drums loudly and spins in excitement, waves drumsticks in the air in celebration*
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inherit
2400
0
16,990
frosted
12,174
Dec 14, 2016 15:08:22 GMT
December 2016
frosted
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Post by frosted on Aug 20, 2020 19:57:54 GMT
2020 in a nutshell. Covid-19... and everything else.
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inherit
Spirit talker
764
0
16,331
Giant Ambush Beetle
9,261
August 2016
giantambushbeetle
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by Giant Ambush Beetle on Aug 21, 2020 10:35:50 GMT
2020 in a nutshell. Covid-19... and everything else. A few days ago I had a dream, it was set in the near future, end of 2020 - I was rehearsing all the negative events of that year and then I mentioned something I sadly cannot remember - but judging by the reactions and the general context it was something worse that happened close to the end of this year and it was, apparently, far worse than all the previous problems combined. Most of my dreams are total nonsense, but every now and then some come true in surprising and strange ways. So lets wait and see.
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inherit
β The Bunny Chaser
2824
0
Mar 28, 2024 13:22:05 GMT
6,433
Energizer Bunny 211
So far 2024 is the same as the previous three years...
5,807
Jan 15, 2017 18:43:23 GMT
January 2017
energizerbunny211
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Mass Effect Andromeda, Anthem
Rumbler1138
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Post by Energizer Bunny 211 on Aug 21, 2020 12:14:05 GMT
I have to admit, I have mixed feelings about returning to work. On one hand, I'm dying to return because I want to get back into routine and be busy. On the other hand, I'm nervous/skeptical of how the whole situation will play out, and I can't take any chances of bringing any kind of germs home at this point.
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melbella
N6
Trouble-shooting Space Diva
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Origin: melbella
Prime Posts: 2186
Prime Likes: 5778
Posts: 7,848 Likes: 23,991
inherit
214
0
Mar 28, 2024 10:58:14 GMT
23,991
melbella
Trouble-shooting Space Diva
7,848
August 2016
melbella
Bottom
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
melbella
2186
5778
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Post by melbella on Aug 23, 2020 22:37:48 GMT
Most of my dreams are total nonsense, but every now and then some come true in surprising and strange ways. So lets wait and see.
I heard on the news the other day an asteroid is heading this way and has a 0.41 chance of hitting Earth. Now, while that number is very small, it's still somewhat unsettling that there are no zeroes between the decimal point and the next digit.
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inherit
Spirit talker
764
0
16,331
Giant Ambush Beetle
9,261
August 2016
giantambushbeetle
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by Giant Ambush Beetle on Sept 11, 2020 20:59:39 GMT
We're having a pretty bad time in regards to Covid19, last couple days 500 new infections per day, today 900 infections. Does not sound like much, but Austria is a really small country, and the rate the infections are climbing is very steep. There are talks about a new lockdown, face masks will be mandatory everywhere again, there will be new restrictions for gatherings etc. In other words: Also, apparently one of the most promising vaccinations failed, there were cases of spinal cord inflammations after vaccinations of test subjects. Which is a very serious side effect, oftentimes such inflammations lead to permanent nerve damage and life long paralysis.
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Obadiah
N5
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem
Origin: Obadaya
XBL Gamertag: ObadiahPearce
Posts: 2,677 Likes: 3,624
inherit
658
0
Feb 27, 2024 12:23:57 GMT
3,624
Obadiah
2,677
August 2016
obadiah
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem
Obadaya
ObadiahPearce
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Post by Obadiah on Sept 12, 2020 21:42:05 GMT
We're having a pretty bad time in regards to Covid19, last couple days 500 new infections per day, today 900 infections. Does not sound like much, but Austria is a really small country, and the rate the infections are climbing is very steep. There are talks about a new lockdown, face masks will be mandatory everywhere again, there will be new restrictions for gatherings etc. In other words: Also, apparently one of the most promising vaccinations failed, there were cases of spinal cord inflammations after vaccinations of test subjects. Which is a very serious side effect, oftentimes such inflammations lead to permanent nerve damage and life long paralysis. Thanks for that "inflammation" info. Sounds like the company is taking is seriously, hope it turns out to be something else. www.statnews.com/2020/09/09/astrazeneca-covid19-vaccine-trial-hold-patient-report/P.S. Just heard on the news the trial is back on. Guess they ruled out the cause from the vaccine.
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Glorious Star Lord
822
0
Jan 24, 2024 17:47:40 GMT
16,819
KaiserShep
Party like it's 2023!
9,233
August 2016
kaisershep
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by KaiserShep on Sept 16, 2020 16:50:31 GMT
I have to admit, I have mixed feelings about returning to work. On one hand, I'm dying to return because I want to get back into routine and be busy. On the other hand, I'm nervous/skeptical of how the whole situation will play out, and I can't take any chances of bringing any kind of germs home at this point. Iβd love to be able to just go back to work. Since itβs just me and the cats, Iβm not as apprehensive about catching whatever and bringing it home, but I understand the concern. But this prolonged shutdown and limited funds will make this a fairly rough season.
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inherit
I refuse to believe that the cake is a lie
10461
0
Feb 27, 2024 12:53:29 GMT
10,995
ArcadiaGrey
4,894
September 2018
arcadiagrey
ArcadiaGrey
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by ArcadiaGrey on Sept 16, 2020 19:47:28 GMT
Life is getting back to normal here. School has started, work is back, aaaaaand cases are soaring despite there being nowhere near enough tests (which is terrifying)
Another lockdown is imminent.
Yay
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inherit
Spirit talker
764
0
16,331
Giant Ambush Beetle
9,261
August 2016
giantambushbeetle
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by Giant Ambush Beetle on Sept 16, 2020 20:24:34 GMT
Life is getting back to normal here. School has started, work is back, aaaaaand cases are soaring despite there being nowhere near enough tests (which is terrifying) Another lockdown is imminent. Yay You sure they gonna do another lock down? Cases here in Austria have been staggering but today our health minister assured us that there will never be another lockdown, ever, because it would hurt the economy too much. We have no plan anymore, but that ambiguous vaccine that might or might not work and might or might not lead to devastating side effects.
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I refuse to believe that the cake is a lie
10461
0
Feb 27, 2024 12:53:29 GMT
10,995
ArcadiaGrey
4,894
September 2018
arcadiagrey
ArcadiaGrey
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by ArcadiaGrey on Sept 16, 2020 20:30:41 GMT
Life is getting back to normal here. School has started, work is back, aaaaaand cases are soaring despite there being nowhere near enough tests (which is terrifying) Another lockdown is imminent. Yay You sure they gonna do another lock down? Cases here in Austria have been staggering but today our health minister assured us that there will never be another lockdown, ever, because it would hurt the economy too much. We have no plan anymore, but that ambiguous vaccine that might or might not work and might or might not lead to devastating side effects. Yup, they'll announce it on Friday It's kind of a half lockdown to prevent a fill one apparently
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inherit
Spirit talker
764
0
16,331
Giant Ambush Beetle
9,261
August 2016
giantambushbeetle
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by Giant Ambush Beetle on Sept 16, 2020 20:33:37 GMT
You sure they gonna do another lock down? Cases here in Austria have been staggering but today our health minister assured us that there will never be another lockdown, ever, because it would hurt the economy too much. We have no plan anymore, but that ambiguous vaccine that might or might not work and might or might not lead to devastating side effects. Yup, they'll announce it on Friday It's kind of a half lockdown to prevent a fill one apparently Are people welcoming that decision or does it only make them angry? Around here people are foaming at the mouth if any kind of measure is even mentioned, apparently wearing masks is already a violation of human rights and oppression, another lockdown of any kind and people here would riot, streets would burn of that I am certain.
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I refuse to believe that the cake is a lie
10461
0
Feb 27, 2024 12:53:29 GMT
10,995
ArcadiaGrey
4,894
September 2018
arcadiagrey
ArcadiaGrey
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by ArcadiaGrey on Sept 16, 2020 20:37:34 GMT
Yup, they'll announce it on Friday It's kind of a half lockdown to prevent a fill one apparently Are people welcoming that decision or does it only make them angry? Around here people are foaming at the mouth if any kind of measure is even mentioned, apparently wearing masks is already a violation of human rights and oppression, another lockdown of any kind and people here would riot, streets would burn of that I am certain. I think they'll just ignore it tbh There are the angry ones ofc, but most just get on with it. I stay in most of the time so I'm not sure what the mood is, but it feels like people are just over it all and want a normal life again. I wonder how many will actually honour the new lockdown tbh. I hate people so I'll happily do it
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Spirit talker
764
0
16,331
Giant Ambush Beetle
9,261
August 2016
giantambushbeetle
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by Giant Ambush Beetle on Sept 16, 2020 20:42:40 GMT
I hate people so I'll happily do it I share your attitude. But don't die from cabin fever! Sounds pretty much like our situation, this is going to be interesting. One big flaw in that concept is that nobody enforces these regulations and rules, so nobody really gives a damn. Of course, if I was a policeman in the city I would not enforce those rules either, I cannot buy me a new set of teeth for that meager salary. And I totally would have to do that.
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inherit
making pour decisions
8164
0
3,976
Chenowl Blanc
sip sip hooray!
1,427
May 2017
dreamowl
Top
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age Inquisition, Mass Effect Andromeda
traumeule
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Post by Chenowl Blanc on Sept 17, 2020 9:23:48 GMT
Are people welcoming that decision or does it only make them angry? Around here people are foaming at the mouth if any kind of measure is even mentioned, apparently wearing masks is already a violation of human rights and oppression, another lockdown of any kind and people here would riot, streets would burn of that I am certain. Seems like you're living in a different country after all. Yes, people complain - but that's just our way. When push comes to shove, they'll do what's required of them. Complaining is fun, being fined isn't. Vienna has just been declared a high risk area, which is understandable given the numbers of new cases - but the situation here is pretty calm. People are wearing masks and comply with the measures in place. The only problem is that there are none in place at the moment for all the situations where you're most likely to contract the virus (family settings, private group gatherings, work place in many cases etc.). Our government seems to focus on easily doable measures rather than effective ones. Which shows once more that the only possible countermeasure in all areas - common sense - is in short suppy. I am not surprised.
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inherit
Spirit talker
764
0
16,331
Giant Ambush Beetle
9,261
August 2016
giantambushbeetle
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by Giant Ambush Beetle on Sept 17, 2020 10:08:21 GMT
Are people welcoming that decision or does it only make them angry? Around here people are foaming at the mouth if any kind of measure is even mentioned, apparently wearing masks is already a violation of human rights and oppression, another lockdown of any kind and people here would riot, streets would burn of that I am certain. Seems like you're living in a different country after all. Yes, people complain - but that's just our way. When push comes to shove, they'll do what's required of them. Complaining is fun, being fined isn't. Says the girl from Vienna. Vienna is different from the rest of the country, it is its own little planet, planet Vienna, this is known. Vienna is the California of Austria, it even has a different language, culture and laws of physics compared to the rest of the country. I visited several hardware stores, post offices, gun shops and shooting ranges, and about half the people don't wear any mask at all or care about social distancing, including the staff. If Covid19 measures are being mentioned people react like they have rabies, they all just want back to normal, people either think its a complete overreaction from the government, a conspiracy or that the virus is no worse than the flu. There is a reason the infections have risen lately, people are angry, confused and don't care anymore, their attention spans have ended. Plus the laws are not enforced, so they are basically only suggestions. If people understood and obeyed those simple rules, infection rates would plummet.
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inherit
Dark Helmet
1408
0
9,301
mybudgee
Fear is your only God
5,900
Sept 2, 2016 20:20:11 GMT
September 2016
mybudgee
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, KOTOR, Jade Empire
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Post by mybudgee on Sept 17, 2020 23:07:05 GMT
Seems like you're living in a different country after all. Yes, people complain - but that's just our way. When push comes to shove, they'll do what's required of them. Complaining is fun, being fined isn't. Says the girl from Vienna. Vienna is different from the rest of the country, it is its own little planet, planet Vienna, this is known. Vienna is the California of Austria, it even has a different language, culture and laws of physics compared to the rest of the country. I visited several hardware stores, post offices, gun shops and shooting ranges, and about half the people don't wear any mask at all or care about social distancing, including the staff. If Covid19 measures are being mentioned people react like they have rabies, they all just want back to normal, people either think its a complete overreaction from the government, a conspiracy or that the virus is no worse than the flu. There is a reason the infections have risen lately, people are angry, confused and don't care anymore, their attention spans have ended. Plus the laws are not enforced, so they are basically only suggestions. If people understood and obeyed those simple rules, infection rates would plummet. Well, I hope this guy's theory takes some of the dead-weight out of the population & makes resources a bit easier for the rest of us
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