Blood Magic (possible spoilers all books and games)

Considering that the Tranquil - people cut away from the Fade also lose their emotions suggests strongly that both are intrinsically linked.

However I don't rally think that 'negative feelings' have greater impact on the Fade - I mean, aside from the fact that perception of the Fade/spirit influences how the spirits can present itself to a person who encounters them, I think the problem is that in Thedas there's an over-abundance of negative emotions and it creates a vicious circle of bad emotions fueling more bad emotions. In fact we have banter between Solas and Cassandra basically stating this:

Cassandra: Solas, I am sorry about your... friend.
Solas: Thank you.
Cassandra: I knew demons and spirits were similar, but I did not know one could become the other so easily.
Solas: Not similar, Seeker. The same. The Chantry sees black and white, but nature is, and always has been, grey. A spirit is a purpose. A demon is that purpose perverted.
Cassandra: That might be true with a spirit of compassion, but what is the purpose of a hunger demon?
Solas: Survival. Satiation. The pleasure of taste, of feeding. True hunger, however, is much darker. Think of all those who starve in this world. Mankind has itself to blame for the existence of demons.

Negative emotions attract demons and make possession more likely. Demons may also do deals with you to boost your power. However, I've never read that heightened emotion makes more powerful magic without some other agent being involved. The level of magic you get from the Fade is entirely based on your potential to absorb/expend mana.

This is why I ask what being is giving the additional power associated with pain? World of Thedas say that the idea that pain and violence is definitely associated with Old God worship so it would seem that they must have had some way to channel their power so that the person saw a tangible benefit to inflicting the pain. Or if at that time all blood mages were Old God worshipers and the Old God said that it was the pain and violence that gave them their power, then obviously that is the message that would be passed on to other believers.

However, Old God worship died out years ago, except for a few lingering cults. Blood mages occur in other parts of Thedas that have never been influenced by Old God worship. Nevertheless, in many cases blood mages have been taught by demons. So I do wonder if it is the demon that enjoys the pain and violence so encourages the idea that it is necessary for the magic to work. To my mind it is the amount of blood expended, in other words the physical life force, that actually determines the amount of mana gained and thus the power of the spell that can be produced. Pain without the blood achieves nothing; blood that is not directly from to veins of a living being achieves nothing but blood that is sacrificed the expense of the health of the donor is what gives the mana to the mage.

We have considered this on the Tevinter Nights thread. There is a strong possibility that everyone lives simultaneously in the Waking World and the Fade via their spirit/soul. This is dulled by the Veil, so very few people are aware of the connection but mages are and because their link is stronger that is why they can do magic. A tranquil has been cut off from their spiritual side; hence them no longer able to do magic but also their lack of emotion.

Blood magic would appear to thin the Veil and I suppose this could be to do with the emotion being generated, causing the demons to gather in great numbers and press against it. It is also possible therefore that it is the demons that aid the channelling of magic that makes the increase in mana from the ritual. However, that would mean that the blood wasn't really important at all but the emotion. So if you look back to my example in my first post, surely so long as there was violence, pain and possible death then that should achieve the same effect without actual blood letting, for example a mass immolation? In fact, as I have also discovered from the Chant of Light, apparently that was the case back in the time of Thalsian, when initially Dumat demanded the sacrifice by burning of large numbers of animals. So perhaps the term "blood magic" is misleading and it should rather be termed "death magic" as that is the logical consequence if you want the highest levels of power. In which case, I accept that the Mortalitassi are actually being called more accurately "death mages" rather than "blood mages" because their magic is apparently driven by pain and suffering (of spirits) if not by blood.

Do you think that we are ever going to encounter the sort of blood mages that were present in DA2 again? The reason blood magic was outlawed was not because of the sacrificial element, since mages could argue that they only ever use their own blood, but because of the spells specific to blood magic that can control the mind. The specific spells mentioned in the Core Rule Book are Blood Slave, Thought Taking and Wrack. It is said that this last spell in particular is why blood mages are so feared as it combines the use of pain to control the person in a form of torture that leaves no evidence of its use after the event.

Now back in DA2 I really understood the need to take down any mages as quickly as possible but particularly blood mages as they would use this last spell on my party or haemorrhage (another exclusive blood magic spell) to render them incapable of action whilst it was in place but would also harm them at the same time, unlike Stun or Paralyse. For example that apostate elf in the alienage who had turned to blood magic used the spell in his fight against us and he could be regarded as only a beginner in its use. There was also then potential for a blood mage to control members of our party so they turned against us, although they never used this in DA2.

So when we moved onto DAI and the Venatori I was expecting more of the same only more powerful but none of the Venatori we encountered were that problematic, most being Spellbinders rather than Blood Mages. It is true that Erimond did use blood magic mind control on the Wardens but that was implied to be tied into the control that Corypheus had over them and amplified by the Nightmare demon. If you weren't a Warden then Erimond's spell had no influence over you. Thus he was using blood magic mind control by proxy rather than having any expertise himself.
The only other reference to someone potentially using blood magic mind control was Dorian's father and only there did you get a sense of how terrible it can be because Dorian says it could have resulted in him being a drooling vegetable afterwards because trying to control someone against their nature in that way would literally break their mind.

The Venatori in Tevinter Nights use blood magic but either for quite trivial purposes such as maintaining their looks or for the power to conduct weird rituals. The former is a reason for contempt but not fear and the latter seems a combination of stupidity, because they invariably cannot control the results, and weakness because they haven't enough power of their own. Now whilst I will admit that part of the attraction of the Venatori is their propaganda that they will restore the Imperium to former glory for mages who actually were second raters among the ruling elite, as opposed to mages of true power like Maevaris, these cultists never instil the feeling of fear and anxiety that the blood mages in the former two games did when I encountered them. This of course is why using red lyrium also appeals to them as it gives them power they do not naturally have.

So do you suppose we are going to continue encounter these rather pathetic examples of blood mages in DA4 or the real deal? To be honest I wouldn't mind having a full on blood mage among our companions, with the full range of powers, so there can be a proper debate about the mortality of using it, as opposed to Merrill's blood mage lite version. There could be a real does the ends justify the means situation if blood magic turns out to be the only way we can get out of a tricky situation, not because our companion is using anyone's blood but their own but because of the spells they are using.

However, what I would really like to see would be a proper blood mage antagonist, who can control our party members with their spells and turn them against us or stop us in our tracks by boiling our blood or other high level blood magic spells, that really make you worry if you are going to survive the encounter. Do you think that is a possibility or are they simply going to continue down the route of blood magic devices and rituals of DAI and recent books?

To me, the most noteworthy blood magic moment across all three games is when Idunna uses blood magic mind manipulation on Hawke. We hear over and over again about how that is the reason blood mages are dangerous -- Cullen even mentions that in his rant in DAO -- but have rarely seen it in the games.

I honestly don't care how blood magic is utilized in gamey combat mechanics; the story implications are far more interesting. In a way, this is where DND dice rolls are handy, because you can use those sorts of things against the player and if they have high enough intelligence, for example, they can resist it. The Idunna scene in DA2 got around this by allowing a mage Hawke to resit it, or one of the followers to help out in the scene, which was interesting. I'd like to see more of this.

In addition, I'd like to see blood magic added to the plot. In The Stolen Throne, it's suspected (suggested? been a while since I've read it) that Meghren is being controlled or manipulated by his mage advisor, Severan. There is also a DAI war table mission involving King Marcus in Nevarra and Venatori infiltration. Those are noteworthy, but insignificant and passive because they have no direct impact on player experience. Having those elements as part of the plot, that the PC can possibly uncover and stop, would be far more compelling.

As a hypothetical scenario, what if a blood mage was manipulating Celene and part of WEWH was to uncover that? It would have changed the whole conflict in that part of the game.