Heimdall
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Post by Heimdall on Dec 11, 2020 11:05:45 GMT
So the new teaser seems to leave us with the idea of a Mass Effect game taking place in the Milky Way after the events of ME3, at least going by the appearance of a Reaper(‘s wreckage?).
Which leaves us with questions like, how will they handle the endings?
The most straightforward thing to do is pick an ending and stick with it. Synthesis might be too alien a future to be recognizably ME so it probably wouldn’t be that one. It could be Control unless they’d really rather not have the Reaper’s sticking around. That would leave Destroy.
Either way I doubt Shepard would be coming back.
There’s also the Deus Ex approach: when developers handle a branching ending by crafting a sequel scenario where also the endings happen to some degree.
In this case that would mean something like the Crucible destroying most of the Reapers in the immediate vicinity of Earth. Some small percentage of the populace would be changed according the Synthesis ending, creating social strife and conflict, and what’s left of the Reapers break off their invasion to pursue some inscrutable agenda that may or may not be driven by Shepard’s will.
I’ve actually become more attached to this idea the more I think about it because I think it creates some fantastic opportunities for the writers to craft a fresh and interesting setting out of the post ME3 Milky Way galaxy. Set the story a few decades after ME3 and it could be pretty interesting.
Any thoughts?
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Post by SofaJockey on Dec 11, 2020 11:50:56 GMT
It's possible that the game includes the option to 'pick' your choices from the trilogy in some way so that the endings are a 'backdrop' after which your story continues.
Or, more clever, could be that the Legendary Edition allows a 'save state' to be recorded.
Or a 'default' state is chosen for people who don't choose (just as happened with Inquisition).
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Post by coldsteelblue on Dec 11, 2020 12:04:35 GMT
I'm thinking they may have canonized the destroy ending, but that's just a gut feeling at this point, I'm salivating for more info
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Post by Pounce de León on Dec 11, 2020 12:37:49 GMT
BW needs to figure out for themselves. It's tricky enough to pull off with that ending of the trilogy. The thing with exponential choice outcome has come a bit far with entitled players expecting all their choices be considered and present.
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Post by alanc9 on Dec 11, 2020 12:57:47 GMT
I never figured out who the Deus Ex approach was supposed to appeal to.
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Post by The Elder King on Dec 11, 2020 13:26:46 GMT
With a return of some relevance of the events of the trilogy in the next game (it’s irrelevant if the game will be focusing a sequel for the trilogy or also Andromeda, for the sake of this conversation), they clearly have to make a decision about the endings...and I don’t think there’s a way to satisfy everyone. Someone is bound to be disappointed.
Based on the teaser, either they canonized Destroy or went for a new/unified ending...but in this case, the Legendary Edition has to have some differences. They can’t have the original endings as they were, and then create a fusion ending or a new one for the next game. It’d make zero sense, as the LE is the perfect way to introduce players to what is coming next (and I think regardless of the direction they picked, a teaser for the next game could be present in the LE).
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Post by themikefest on Dec 11, 2020 14:51:42 GMT
How to handle the endings? Simple. Use Hackett's ending. The player hears Hackett tell Shepard the crucible has enough energy to destroy the reapers. That's your ending. Just after Shepard passes out, and the arms to the Citadel are fully opened, the crucible fires the red wave destroying the reapers. It wouldn't be hard to have in the remaster. Just remove everything from when Shepard passes out onward.
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Post by xMissWoox on Dec 11, 2020 15:24:28 GMT
I've always felt it was simple enough to reconcile destroy and control: * Destroy = The Reapers are destroyed and the galaxy slowly rebuilds on it's own. * Control = The Reapers quickly rebuild and then are destroyed/destroy themselves. Either way you're left with a galaxy that's mostly intact and devoid of Reapers. It's synthesis and refuse that can't really be made to fit, as they change the setting far too drastically.
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Post by gothpunkboy89 on Dec 11, 2020 15:31:20 GMT
Very simple way to handle the endings. Retain the original ending and just have this story take place during one of the potential endings. In fact this concept could allow them to handle multiple stories.
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Post by parsival on Dec 11, 2020 16:31:40 GMT
How about the indoctrination theory finally being proven? That would kind of be fun, though I also hold out hope for the 'refuse' ending being made canon, and Liara helping an Andromeda group of returners take on the Reapers with Scourge level technology.
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Post by azarhal on Dec 11, 2020 16:39:31 GMT
Crazy Theory: the legendary version will be used to create whatever ending they are starting off for The Next Mass Effect game.
Like Sunrise creating movies of Code Geass TV series with some alterations and than spawning a continuation of that altered universe version.
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Post by Iakus on Dec 11, 2020 16:44:34 GMT
My own PERSONAL preference would be MEHEM But I also know that's never gonna happen, unfortunately.
An interesting setup, imo, would be
Don't canonize anything. The Reapers are gone. No one knows how or why.
Shepard's fate is unknown. no one knows if Shep lived or died. Or if survived, what happened later. No one even knows if Shepard was male or female! Obviously if Liara is still kicking around, this isn't going to happen, sadly.
The relays were trashed but not destroyed, and it took centuries for them to be repaired and interstellar travel (aside from systems extremely close to each other) to become a thing again. Yes, it meant a galactic dark age, but that allows for old locations to be new again as political and cultural lines get rewritten. We can see how systems survived (or didn't) isolated from each other for so long.
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Post by biggydx on Dec 11, 2020 16:47:54 GMT
My own PERSONAL preference would be MEHEM But I also know that's never gonna happen, unfortunately. An interesting setup, imo, would be Don't canonize anything. The Reapers are gone. No one knows how or why. Shepard's fate is unknown. no one knows if Shep lived or died. Or if survived, what happened later. No one even knows if Shepard was male or female! Obviously if Liara is still kicking around, this isn't going to happen, sadly. The relays were trashed but not destroyed, and it took centuries for them to be repaired and interstellar travel (aside from systems extremely close to each other) to become a thing again. Yes, it meant a galactic dark age, but that allows for old locations to be new again as political and cultural lines get rewritten. We can see how systems survived (or didn't) isolated from each other for so long. I think the isolation affects of no Mass Relays could make for some very interesting species conflicts. Could even reignite another Krogan War. The Citadel Council would definitely be thrown into disarray, especially with it being found out that the Asari hid info about the Reapers/Protheans from the Galaxy, though I imagine that might go against your "unknown" world state.
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Post by Conquer Your Dreams on Dec 11, 2020 17:06:33 GMT
Whatever they are planning do not involve Shep in it. That story is finished.
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Post by DragonRacer on Dec 11, 2020 17:34:37 GMT
I wonder if they may eventually go the Dragon Age Keep route for Mass Effect? Basically a website where you link your EA account and then can manually create various world states, selecting each decision you want reflected, and can then import into your new Mass Effect Next game to help dictate what paths it may go based on past actions/your canon ME3 ending, etc.
The Keep came about because of the awkwardness of DAI launching on PC, old consoles, and new consoles - 5 different platforms, when all was said and done. How to input world states if a PS3 user had upgraded to PS4? Or a PS3 user decided to switch to XBox One? Put it all in a website and let the current platform of use download what it needs. And in return, your current DAI playthrough added itself to the selected world state to create an ongoing virtually-housed world state save file.
One for ME would resolve folks who played on the old consoles who may be upgrading to the new consoles by the time the next ME launches, and be a way to do so if they don't purchase the Legendary remaster (or, if someone does, perhaps that save file can import over as well, depending on what you select for Mass Effect Next to pull historical data from).
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Post by Little Bengel on Dec 11, 2020 17:47:50 GMT
I wonder if they may eventually go the Dragon Age Keep route for Mass Effect? Basically a website where you link your EA account and then can manually create various world states, selecting each decision you want reflected, and can then import into your new Mass Effect Next game to help dictate what paths it may go based on past actions/your canon ME3 ending, etc. The Keep came about because of the awkwardness of DAI launching on PC, old consoles, and new consoles - 5 different platforms, when all was said and done. How to input world states if a PS3 user had upgraded to PS4? Or a PS3 user decided to switch to XBox One? Put it all in a website and let the current platform of use download what it needs. And in return, your current DAI playthrough added itself to the selected world state to create an ongoing virtually-housed world state save file. One for ME would resolve folks who played on the old consoles who may be upgrading to the new consoles by the time the next ME launches, and be a way to do so if they don't purchase the Legendary remaster (or, if someone does, perhaps that save file can import over as well, depending on what you select for Mass Effect Next to pull historical data from). Isn't that literally just the Mass Effect Archives?
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Post by DragonRacer on Dec 11, 2020 17:55:19 GMT
I wonder if they may eventually go the Dragon Age Keep route for Mass Effect? Basically a website where you link your EA account and then can manually create various world states, selecting each decision you want reflected, and can then import into your new Mass Effect Next game to help dictate what paths it may go based on past actions/your canon ME3 ending, etc. The Keep came about because of the awkwardness of DAI launching on PC, old consoles, and new consoles - 5 different platforms, when all was said and done. How to input world states if a PS3 user had upgraded to PS4? Or a PS3 user decided to switch to XBox One? Put it all in a website and let the current platform of use download what it needs. And in return, your current DAI playthrough added itself to the selected world state to create an ongoing virtually-housed world state save file. One for ME would resolve folks who played on the old consoles who may be upgrading to the new consoles by the time the next ME launches, and be a way to do so if they don't purchase the Legendary remaster (or, if someone does, perhaps that save file can import over as well, depending on what you select for Mass Effect Next to pull historical data from). Isn't that literally just the Mass Effect Archives? Heh, to be honest, either forgot or never realized that actually existed. I only did one Andromeda playthrough. Pulled it up and it appears to only be an archive of Andromeda data, though, right? Are there ME1-3 choices reflected in there at all? I'm having issues trying to get my world state to actually display anything discernible besides simply existing.
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Post by Little Bengel on Dec 11, 2020 17:57:42 GMT
Isn't that literally just the Mass Effect Archives? Heh, to be honest, either forgot or never realized that actually existed. I only did one Andromeda playthrough. Pulled it up and it appears to only be an archive of Andromeda data, though, right? Are there ME1-3 choices reflected in there at all? I'm having issues trying to get my world state to actually display anything discernible besides simply existing. Last I checked, I seem to remember there being ME1-3 choices there as well.
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Post by DragonRacer on Dec 11, 2020 17:59:59 GMT
Heh, to be honest, either forgot or never realized that actually existed. I only did one Andromeda playthrough. Pulled it up and it appears to only be an archive of Andromeda data, though, right? Are there ME1-3 choices reflected in there at all? I'm having issues trying to get my world state to actually display anything discernible besides simply existing. Last I checked, I seem to remember there being ME1-3 choices there as well. Yeah, apparently so. Geez, guess I started Andromeda with whatever default world state they had then because I have no memory of this Archives thing and looking at the default world state, it's definitely not one I'd have ever selected as my canon. I feel so out of the loop now. When in the hell did this thing drop? I 1,000% missed the memo on that.
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Post by bshep on Dec 11, 2020 18:23:33 GMT
I've always felt it was simple enough to reconcile destroy and control: * Destroy = The Reapers are destroyed and the galaxy slowly rebuilds on it's own. * Control = The Reapers quickly rebuild and then are destroyed/destroy themselves. Either way you're left with a galaxy that's mostly intact and devoid of Reapers. It's synthesis and refuse that can't really be made to fit, as they change the setting far too drastically. I believe destroy ending is likely canon considering the Reaper bodies Liara walk over on that frozen planet. Don't think they would show specifically that on the trailer otherwise.
I would bet on a high EMS ending so that no species is destroyed plus some form of "soft retcon" to make sure the Geth are alive. Perhaps the Catalyst was lying to Shepard or perhaps crazy admiral Xen found some way to shield the Geth from the Crucible energy blast.
Synthesis is downright bizarre and refuse is just a fancy game over, like Shepard dying during the Collector mission. No way to make a continuation from those two.
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Post by traks on Dec 11, 2020 20:45:00 GMT
Last I checked, I seem to remember there being ME1-3 choices there as well. Yeah, apparently so. Geez, guess I started Andromeda with whatever default world state they had then because I have no memory of this Archives thing and looking at the default world state, it's definitely not one I'd have ever selected as my canon. I feel so out of the loop now. When in the hell did this thing drop? I 1,000% missed the memo on that. You don't load any world state into Andromeda (because they don't matter), as far as I am aware. You can simply choose whether Shepard was male or female in game. To the question of the thread: I'll probably chime in with a longer answer at some point, but for now I would just say, "tell the story you want". As long as I'm not playing Shepard, I don't really care what kind of world state my PC finds itself in as long as the story interests me. I can imagine playing in all parallel universes ME3 created.
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Post by jrpN7 on Dec 11, 2020 20:56:33 GMT
Destroy is definitely the canon ending in this teaser. The dead reapers do not fit the synthesis or control endings.
The fresh spinning debris of the Mass Relay plus the N7 piece not being buried under 600 years of sediment makes me believe this was very recent after the war. Therefore, keeping the door open for Shepard to return. Combine Liara's shadow broker resources and Miranda's Lazerus project expertise, Shepard may be around to stay. "Tell me another story about the Shepard. Well, it's getting late... but, OK. One more story..."
Honestly, the more I think about the references to Andromeda, the less I think it means the two will be merged. The ark reference could just be part of the timeline of events. Showing the Andromeda galaxy, and then zeroing in on the Milky Way could just be a nod of moving on away from that AI story.
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Post by xMissWoox on Dec 11, 2020 20:59:21 GMT
I've always felt it was simple enough to reconcile destroy and control: * Destroy = The Reapers are destroyed and the galaxy slowly rebuilds on it's own. * Control = The Reapers quickly rebuild and then are destroyed/destroy themselves. Either way you're left with a galaxy that's mostly intact and devoid of Reapers. It's synthesis and refuse that can't really be made to fit, as they change the setting far too drastically. I believe destroy ending is likely canon considering the Reaper bodies Liara walk over on that frozen planet. Don't think they would show specifically that on the trailer otherwise.
I would bet on a high EMS ending so that no species is destroyed plus some form of "soft retcon" to make sure the Geth are alive. Perhaps the Catalyst was lying to Shepard or perhaps crazy admiral Xen found some way to shield the Geth from the Crucible energy blast.
Synthesis is downright bizarre and refuse is just a fancy game over, like Shepard dying during the Collector mission. No way to make a continuation from those two. Well, my point being that either destroy or control could be canon if they left it vague enough, as both could theoretically result in the worldstate we see in the trailer. So technically, players who chose either of those endings would still have their choice respected. Synthesis simply isn't an option because it changes too much - everyone would have to be green, glowing cyborgs, which clearly isn't the case. And you're right about refuse, but more to the point there simply wouldn't be much of Milk Way left to play in, so it wouldn't be that. I also think that destroy or control would be the most popular picks by fans, since they don't require a certain amount of EMS to unlock and are available to anyone (depending on whether the player destroyed or preserved the collect base in ME2). It will be interesting to see if the Legendary Edition makes any changes to the endings or keeps them as is. I never thought they'd change them, but now I've seen the trailer I'm not so sure.
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Post by Part Time Ninja on Dec 11, 2020 22:59:35 GMT
It’s nice to see the break away forum still exists, I tend to come here after new news. I hope everyone reading this is safe and well - and life is being as kind as if can be.
I looked at a few old posts I made in relation to this back in 2017, and I largely remain of the same position - Canon ending - and whilst upsetting some of the fanbase...nostalgia and time will probably heal those grievances. I think we are all ready to hit Afterlife and drink a few ryncols again...regardless of the state of the world when we get there.
The focus will now inevitably involve bringing new players - the series needs that to survive. Liara being in it is telling. Asari live a thousand years, I wouldn’t be surprised to see the story do a significant time jump to mitigate some of the problems from the OT and its ending.
Exicitng times for Mass Effect again.
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Post by Blast Processor on Dec 12, 2020 2:13:23 GMT
I never figured out who the Deus Ex approach was supposed to appeal to. People that would accept a part of there ending reflected instead of ignored? Personally, I couldn't care less what they do with the endings. Plus, the bigger problem I had with Invisible War is the game leading down path that ends with choosing basically the same endings again.
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