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Post by ShadowAngel on Mar 6, 2021 20:47:47 GMT
I'll point out bioware was potentially going to shut down prior to EA or at least someone else buying up the studio. We can look at game receptions all day and argue that game was good, that game was bad, etc etc but end of the day bioware wasn't good enough to stand on it's own legs at that time (hell I doubt they could even today).
I will say personally bioware has made plenty of good games even under EA, and that really they're no different than any other studio that has put out mixed games that didn't blow the market. That said bioware also isn't made up of the same guys 20 years ago, or even 10 years ago🤷 new people = different ideas and philosophy to how things are done and even had EA not acquired bioware, I seriously doubt it'd still be the same old bioware.
To me you either like what they're doing or you don't, in a way it's like watching sports and having your favorite team. Every team runs differently, their priorities on how they build a team will differ and how they play compared to others will differ. Now I know maybe video game products isn't quite the same but I'm hoping the anology makes a little sense. As a fan, or consumer you move to what draws your attention.
For example lots of people talk about "old bioware" and how they don't make that stuff anymore but to be honest if one really looks you can find someone making stuff pretty close, especially in the indie market. I still play plenty of choice based RPGs that can have a good story to it with companions. Some will be different in their in ways but still share the original concept. There are isometric RPGs for example that have it, there are other 3pp RPGs, one just has to look. It beats that over sticking to one company hoping one day they do what they did 20 years ago🤷.
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Post by skekSil on Mar 6, 2021 21:27:07 GMT
I'll point out bioware was potentially going to shut down prior to EA Well this is news. |
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Post by ShadowAngel on Mar 6, 2021 22:54:23 GMT
I'll point out bioware was potentially going to shut down prior to EA Well this is news. It was a money issue, back then Microsoft was also a potential buyer of the company but EA got it done instead. I'm not going to say EA "saved" bioware because I'm aware some people don't view it like that, but bioware was on the verge of shutting down unless someone bought them out. |
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Sanunes
N6
Just a flip of the coin.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by Sanunes on Mar 7, 2021 0:18:11 GMT
gamerant.com/bioware-electronic-arts-sale-322/It was a money issue, back then Microsoft was also a potential buyer of the company but EA got it done instead. I'm not going to say EA "saved" bioware because I'm aware some people don't view it like that, but bioware was on the verge of shutting down unless someone bought them out. If the people on Reddit who claim they worked at BioWare are accurate Jade Empire left the studio in a precarious place. It was touch and go if Mass Effect 1 would be finished (I think the Xbox exclusivity is what saved it) and going by that article I linked from Dr. Greg it seems that he doubts BioWare would have survived the economic collapse that hit around that time without becoming part of another company. I am pretty sure if Microsoft had bought BioWare they would be gone by now for they purged many of their studios a few years back and now massively spending money to redevelop a first party studio setup.
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Post by SirSourpuss on Mar 7, 2021 0:24:01 GMT
I am pretty sure if Microsoft had bought BioWare they would be gone by now for they purged many of their studios a few years back and now massively spending money to redevelop a first party studio setup. That's not entirely true. Those studios were, effectively, not making games and the games they were making, weren't going anywhere, anytime soon. If Crackdown 3 was a terribly released game, you should have seen the ones that didn't make it. Personally, I am only really bummed out about Scalebound. And yes, I don't miss the irony that it is literally Anthem with Dragons, before Anthem with Dragons was a thing. |
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Post by majesticjazz on Mar 28, 2021 12:06:53 GMT
Just want to point out that remember, it was Mass Effect Andromeda that was sacrificed for this game. It was MEA that was given the "B team" while all the heavyweights work on Anthem cause apparently Anthem represented the future of Bioware as it was said to be a game that would be a 10-year service in terms of DLC and sequels.
Now look at them. Anthem has been scrapped and now Bioware goes back to seemingly putting more of their focus on Mass Effect with the upcoming remaster and then the next ME AAA game.
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Post by skekSil on Mar 28, 2021 20:11:14 GMT
Just want to point out that remember, it was Mass Effect Andromeda that was sacrificed for this game. It was MEA that was given the "B team" while all the heavyweights work on Anthem cause apparently Anthem represented the future of Bioware as it was said to be a game that would be a 10-year service in terms of DLC and sequels. Are you saying that if instead of B-team, who failed at MEA, there was A-team, who failed at Anthem, then MEA would have been a success? |
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Post by SirSourpuss on Mar 28, 2021 20:33:56 GMT
Now look at them. Anthem has been scrapped and now Bioware goes back to seemingly putting more of their focus on Mass Effect with the upcoming remaster and then the next ME AAA game. I don't know how positively this would have impacted Andromeda or whether this should excite me for their next game. I don't have a lot of faith in them, right now. Regardless of which internal Bioware team is developing it. |
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Sanunes
N6
Just a flip of the coin.
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by Sanunes on Mar 29, 2021 5:51:59 GMT
Now look at them. Anthem has been scrapped and now Bioware goes back to seemingly putting more of their focus on Mass Effect with the upcoming remaster and then the next ME AAA game. I don't know how positively this would have impacted Andromeda or whether this should excite me for their next game. I don't have a lot of faith in them, right now. Regardless of which internal Bioware team is developing it. I don't think it would have made Andromeda any better. I think its magical thinking to believe that if BioWare Edmonton worked on Andromeda it wouldn't have had the same or some other fundamental problem at its core. Anthem had a lot of fundamental issues just like Andromeda so thinking it would be a good game is well wrong. Since it was two different teams I would say its a problem at the very top of both games that allowed whatever was happening at the studios to go without correction.
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Post by KaiserShep on Mar 30, 2021 18:49:15 GMT
Just want to point out that remember, it was Mass Effect Andromeda that was sacrificed for this game. It was MEA that was given the "B team" while all the heavyweights work on Anthem cause apparently Anthem represented the future of Bioware as it was said to be a game that would be a 10-year service in terms of DLC and sequels. Are you saying that if instead of B-team, who failed at MEA, there was A-team, who failed at Anthem, then MEA would have been a success? I like to think that on some level, Mass Effect is at least provides more to work with out of the box, since there’s a whole trilogy to establish what Mass Effect is, whereas with Anthem, BioWare didn’t know jack of what to make of it, adding to the curse of live service. Maybe Andromeda might not have turned out any better, and maybe Edmonton might have futzed about with that procedural generation nonsense only to scrap it later like Montreal did, but it’s hard to believe that the game would have turned out as problematic as what we got if it had the main studio dedicated to it.
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Post by sjsharp2010 on Mar 30, 2021 23:45:05 GMT
I don't know how positively this would have impacted Andromeda or whether this should excite me for their next game. I don't have a lot of faith in them, right now. Regardless of which internal Bioware team is developing it. I don't think it would have made Andromeda any better. I think its magical thinking to believe that if BioWare Edmonton worked on Andromeda it wouldn't have had the same or some other fundamental problem at its core. Anthem had a lot of fundamental issues just like Andromeda so thinking it would be a good game is well wrong. Since it was two different teams I would say its a problem at the very top of both games that allowed whatever was happening at the studios to go without correction. Agreed it may have been less bug ridden had Edmonton had i tbut given the story was till writtemn more or less by the same people who worked on the earlier games I'm not so sure that story wise it would hav ebeen any different.
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Post by XCPTNL on Apr 15, 2021 15:10:08 GMT
I feel like they could have turned this around. What really needed fixing was the whole lootsystem as well as the flawed inscription system and the crafting. Then find better ways to scale powers and weapons to each difficulty level and after that put out more content. New strongholds, maybe horde-mode style maps and stuff like that. Then use some money for marketing and also possibly make it free to play to attract new players. I've talked with quite a few people who play other loot games and they all liked a lot about Anthem but left again because the core aspect (loot, gear, inscriptions) was useless and frustrating.
Just look at Outriders now: this game sucks ass on so many levels (graphics, leveldesign, cringy characters and storyline, etc.) and opinions about the game are very different. It does one thing right though: the loot and how easily you can modify and customize and make new builds. Even relatively early on you can make good use of things you find because you can disassemble them and use the mods on other stuff. It feels much more rewarding and can be a lot of fun despite all the flaws. Anthem is much better in a lot of areas but the just totally messed up with the loot and the inscriptions.
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Post by therevanchist25 on Apr 15, 2021 15:44:47 GMT
I feel like they could have turned this around. What really needed fixing was the whole lootsystem as well as the flawed inscription system and the crafting. Then find better ways to scale powers and weapons to each difficulty level and after that put out more content. New strongholds, maybe horde-mode style maps and stuff like that. Then use some money for marketing and also possibly make it free to play to attract new players. I've talked with quite a few people who play other loot games and they all liked a lot about Anthem but left again because the core aspect (loot, gear, inscriptions) was useless and frustrating. Just look at Outriders now: this game sucks ass on so many levels (graphics, leveldesign, cringy characters and storyline, etc.) and opinions about the game are very different. It does one thing right though: the loot and how easily you can modify and customize and make new builds. Even relatively early on you can make good use of things you find because you can disassemble them and use the mods on other stuff. It feels much more rewarding and can be a lot of fun despite all the flaws. Anthem is much better in a lot of areas but the just totally messed up with the loot and the inscriptions. You're absolutely right, they could have turned this around. This game had a lot of potential to be something incredible. It really, truly did. I very much enjoyed the gameplay at release, before they nerfed every single enemy into the dirt because people wouldn't stop whining about how broken they are. Fighting Titans pre-nerf was one of the most fun things I ever did in a game. Was a colossal, herculean accomplishment that felt incredible. As for Outriders, Yea the game is a mess. But remember, it's a Double A level game, one of the handful that still exist. It's unfair to hold it to Triple A standards of polish. I'm sure they'll fix it in time.
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Post by Pounce de León on May 4, 2021 11:09:01 GMT
I feel like they could have turned this around. What really needed fixing was the whole lootsystem as well as the flawed inscription system and the crafting. Then find better ways to scale powers and weapons to each difficulty level and after that put out more content. New strongholds, maybe horde-mode style maps and stuff like that. Then use some money for marketing and also possibly make it free to play to attract new players. I've talked with quite a few people who play other loot games and they all liked a lot about Anthem but left again because the core aspect (loot, gear, inscriptions) was useless and frustrating. Just look at Outriders now: this game sucks ass on so many levels (graphics, leveldesign, cringy characters and storyline, etc.) and opinions about the game are very different. It does one thing right though: the loot and how easily you can modify and customize and make new builds. Even relatively early on you can make good use of things you find because you can disassemble them and use the mods on other stuff. It feels much more rewarding and can be a lot of fun despite all the flaws. Anthem is much better in a lot of areas but the just totally messed up with the loot and the inscriptions. You're absolutely right, they could have turned this around. This game had a lot of potential to be something incredible. It really, truly did. I very much enjoyed the gameplay at release, before they nerfed every single enemy into the dirt because people wouldn't stop whining about how broken they are. Fighting Titans pre-nerf was one of the most fun things I ever did in a game. Was a colossal, herculean accomplishment that felt incredible. As for Outriders, Yea the game is a mess. But remember, it's a Double A level game, one of the handful that still exist. It's unfair to hold it to Triple A standards of polish. I'm sure they'll fix it in time. Werent the Titans the ones that spammed fireballs through cover and you needed to shoot their hands? I didn't find anything herculean about that. Collossal was maybe the undodgeable spam that three of them put up during the demo in a cramped room.
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Post by KaiserShep on May 5, 2021 23:40:25 GMT
I feel like they could have turned this around. What really needed fixing was the whole lootsystem as well as the flawed inscription system and the crafting. Then find better ways to scale powers and weapons to each difficulty level and after that put out more content. New strongholds, maybe horde-mode style maps and stuff like that. Then use some money for marketing and also possibly make it free to play to attract new players. I've talked with quite a few people who play other loot games and they all liked a lot about Anthem but left again because the core aspect (loot, gear, inscriptions) was useless and frustrating. Just look at Outriders now: this game sucks ass on so many levels (graphics, leveldesign, cringy characters and storyline, etc.) and opinions about the game are very different. It does one thing right though: the loot and how easily you can modify and customize and make new builds. Even relatively early on you can make good use of things you find because you can disassemble them and use the mods on other stuff. It feels much more rewarding and can be a lot of fun despite all the flaws. Anthem is much better in a lot of areas but the just totally messed up with the loot and the inscriptions. You're absolutely right, they could have turned this around. This game had a lot of potential to be something incredible. It really, truly did. I very much enjoyed the gameplay at release, before they nerfed every single enemy into the dirt because people wouldn't stop whining about how broken they are. Fighting Titans pre-nerf was one of the most fun things I ever did in a game. Was a colossal, herculean accomplishment that felt incredible. As for Outriders, Yea the game is a mess. But remember, it's a Double A level game, one of the handful that still exist. It's unfair to hold it to Triple A standards of polish. I'm sure they'll fix it in time. I get the distinct impression that a lot of people at BioWare just didn't want to touch Anthem anymore, now that we know how much of a mess the production actually was. BioWare had about 50 or so people keeping the game on life support, which is nowhere near enough necessary to really properly do the work to both overhaul the game's systems and create new content to attract players, but BioWare also has other more important properties in the pipeline that they need to devote resources to.
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Post by Deleted on May 6, 2021 0:55:07 GMT
BioWare had about 50 or so people keeping the game on life support, which is nowhere near enough necessary to really properly do the work to both overhaul the game's systems and create new content to attract players Absolutely. Absurdity. And in the process lose more of their old fan base, which if I am speaking my opinion is the only one that matters at this point. Good word of mouth from us goes a long ways. I found out about Mass Effect from LucasForums. |
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Post by therevanchist25 on May 6, 2021 5:52:20 GMT
BioWare had about 50 or so people keeping the game on life support, which is nowhere near enough necessary to really properly do the work to both overhaul the game's systems and create new content to attract players Absolutely. Absurdity. And in the process lose more of their old fan base, which if I am speaking my opinion is the only one that matters at this point. Good word of mouth from us goes a long ways. I found out about Mass Effect from LucasForums. You may be right. I think all of us old geezers here who sit around yelling at Clouds are the only people who still care about anything Bioware does. The public at large knows how fucking jaded most of us have become as well. If they actually make something that a large chunk of us starts talking about, word of mouth, I think people would take notice.
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Post by turianlannister on May 7, 2021 20:53:12 GMT
I've stuck with EA for so long, but this is just plain stupid. Anthem has so much potential, you can't just can the game after this much effort and give up. WTF? It has all the potential to be the next big thing, it just needed a bit more polish and more content. THAT'S IT. fucks sake. You spelled Mass Effect Andromeda wrong
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Post by turianlannister on May 7, 2021 21:19:46 GMT
Not to be a jerk but this is good news for DA and ME. I remember when ME was put on ice and MEA didn't get any DLC and one of the reasons they did this way to put time and resources into developing Anthem. I do understand how you feel OP because that is how I felt when MEA was swept under the rug but frankly and selfishly I am happy about Anthem development ceasing because it means DA and ME will get time and resources they need. Same here, I couldn't give two poops about Anthem being cancelled The game seemed to be Casey Hudson's baby, which is why they spent time and resources on developing it when he was there (including the reboot of it after he came back to run the studio and the game didn't get a good reception at launch), but now that he's gone, not so much. I thought Anthem was Hack Walters baby? It's true there is disappointment too but more from the BioWare 'regulars' shall I say that what I would view as the general playerbase. More resources for BioWare's most important and popular franchises in the form of Dragon Age and Mass Effect has to be a good thing in my book. I’m referring to general player base as well, which don’t seem to agree with you. Not when those resources are going to a shitty game like DA4 and probably ME5. Are you still crying about the Inquisitor not being the player character in DA4? I think it does have some relevance for Jade Empire didn't come to the PC until about a year after launch and Mass Effect: Andromeda didn't move to Steam until a year and half after its initial launch and it was available on PC on Origin before that. There won't be a perfect matchup, because its impossible to have a perfect side by side comparison from BioWare pre-EA and after EA because the market is always changing. My point was that not that they were a perfect match or sales numbers, but how long people who bought the game played it. People played Andromeda for a hour more then Jade Empire (on average) before stopping. Speak for yourself
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Post by KaiserShep on May 9, 2021 2:56:05 GMT
The game seemed to be Casey Hudson's baby, which is why they spent time and resources on developing it when he was there (including the reboot of it after he came back to run the studio and the game didn't get a good reception at launch), but now that he's gone, not so much. I thought Anthem was Hack Walters baby? Was Anthem really anyone’s baby? It seems to me that what we got was a lot of basic ideas on post-it notes that got incorporated into the final product after the E3 trailer provided the proof of concept as a jumping off point.
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∯ Interjector in Chief
Staff Mini-Profile Theme: Heimdall
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Origin: HeimdallX
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Post by Heimdall on May 16, 2021 12:30:19 GMT
I thought Anthem was Hack Walters baby? Was Anthem really anyone’s baby? It seems to me that what we got was a lot of basic ideas on post-it notes that got incorporated into the final product after the E3 trailer provided the proof of concept as a jumping off point. I know Casey was apparently a major player in the early stages of development before he left. After that, it seems like nobody in management could nail down a distinct idea of what the game should be though. That was a running theme of Anthem and Andromeda’s development problems, and to a lesser degree Inquisition: indecisive leadership. |
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Post by cloud9 on Feb 7, 2023 23:47:53 GMT
I've stuck with EA for so long, but this is just plain stupid. Anthem has so much potential, you can't just can the game after this much effort and give up. WTF? It has all the potential to be the next big thing, it just needed a bit more polish and more content. THAT'S IT. fucks sake. I told y'all EA is fucking everything up. But no one listens. |
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