quarianmasterrace
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Post by quarianmasterrace on Jun 16, 2021 15:08:25 GMT
Kek major Auld Wulff vibes here. You didn't pick the same neapolitan ending as me so you're a racist sexist homophobe luddite genocide fetishist. Never said that (though ironic people balk at this yet have no qualms saying people who pick Control support dictatorships or people who pick Synthesis are rapists). You compared people who do a thing in a goofy pick a color video game ending to those perpetrating every real life evil thing you could come up with. Reminds me of Auld Wulf. Meanwhile who are you even talking about with the dictatorship rape crap? You responded to me but I didn't do that.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Jun 16, 2021 15:11:00 GMT
Never said that (though ironic people balk at this yet have no qualms saying people who pick Control support dictatorships or people who pick Synthesis are rapists). You compared people who do a thing in a goofy pick a color video game ending to those perpetrating every real life evil thing you could come up with. Reminds me of Auld Wulf. Meanwhile who are you even talking about with the dictatorship rape crap? You responded to me but I didn't do that. No, I compared their argument to those things to show how ridiculous the argument is. I know you didn't. But I've seen many posters who have, including in this current discussion.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Jun 16, 2021 15:14:12 GMT
Oh, so because their existence is illegal they should be mass murdered. Congratulations, you just supported every dictator who committed a genocide ever. Guess that means Hungary should kill all their LGBT people today since they made it illegal yesterday. Under council law, it is not recognized as murder. All AI are to be terminated. No more than unplugging your PC is considered murder. I can't speak for what Hungary or its LGBTQ+ population should do, in that regard. It's not my place to talk about their internal politics. That's your argument? So the Nazis did nothing wrong since under their laws the Holocaust was fine. Just because something is the law does not make it right or less an atrocity. It absolutely is your place to talk about that, especially in the scenario I brought up.
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Post by SirSourpuss on Jun 16, 2021 15:17:20 GMT
That's your argument? So the Nazis did nothing wrong since under their laws the Holocaust was fine. Just because something is the law does not make it right or less an atrocity. It absolutely is your place to talk about that, especially in the scenario I brought up. I think you are mistaking organics with synthetics. One is a real being. The other is a glorified toaster.
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quarianmasterrace
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Post by quarianmasterrace on Jun 16, 2021 15:30:54 GMT
You compared people who do a thing in a goofy pick a color video game ending to those perpetrating every real life evil thing you could come up with. Reminds me of Auld Wulf. Meanwhile who are you even talking about with the dictatorship rape crap? You responded to me but I didn't do that. No, I compared their argument to those things to show how ridiculous the argument is. I know you didn't. But I've seen many posters who have, including in this current discussion. If their argument is so patently ridiculous it should be immediately apparent to almost everyone, no? No need to compare them to a nazi or whatever. If not, I blame the writer for their idea of "clarity and closure" resulting in most people misperceiving what even happened at the end of their story..... But my take is debating these goofy "art" endings isn't worth any more brainpower than was put into them: i.e. little to none at all. That and indoctrination theory was a cool band aid over silly writing in the same way Jar Jar the Sith Lord was. Isn't real tho.
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Post by pessimistpanda on Jun 16, 2021 15:48:38 GMT
Okay, so, because Shepard is a soldier, he should have... followed Hackett's order to kill all the Reapers? But Hackett didn't actually give any order to do that when he said "Dead reapers, that's how we win", he was merely expressing an opinion, based on information he had at the time. There is no way to know what Hackett would have actually done if he had accessed the Crucible and been given those choices instead of Shepard, so the whole argument is moot.
That aside, the assertion that soldiers should just unthinkingly agree with everything a commander says and does and never question it or listen to dissenting perspectives is:
1) Pretty fucked up. Whether or not you agree that genociding the Geth is a war crime, that mindset of unquestioning obedience is precisely the reason why war crimes happen in real life.
2) Immensely hypocritical if players ever romanced anyone in the games, seeing as how that would be an abuse of Shepard's power over their subordinates and against regulations in literally any military force worth a damn. And even in ME2, when Shepard is not technically working in any military capacity, if "once a marine, always a marine", Shepard should still consider it inappropriate. Because that's the whole crux of the argument, isn't it? That Shepard will have a soldier's mindset for the rest of their life, and soldiers follow rules?
Actually, now that I think of it, how do people with this perspective justify "once a marine, always a marine" Shepard spending all of ME2 working for Cerberus, an organization that the Systems Alliance and the Council have officially declared to be terrorists? The player might think Cerberus is right, but that doesn't matter if Shepard is a marine, and marines follow orders and regulations.
Except... Shepard disobeys direct orders and flouts protocol multiple times in every single instalment of the trilogy, both as part of the story and as a result of player choices. So is Shepard a bad marine, or are marines suddenly allowed to think for themselves as long as it still involves killing (and/or fucking) things?
Sounds to me like people are just grasping at straws to justify the decision they personally like.
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Iakus
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Post by Iakus on Jun 16, 2021 15:49:13 GMT
I don't trust the Catalyst. But the original game and even the EC doesn't give me the option and only with meta game knowledge can I make that choice. My first choice, at the time, had been Synthesis, until I saw what it does. "Potentially" billions of beings, whose very existence is illegal under council law and a threat to all organic life, would die. If you believe the Catalyst. What is your main point? Letting the Reapers live and any AI is against the law. The one race that tried to "peacefully" interact with organics, started doing so by, effectively, destroying the being that tried to transition into their existence. It's like saying that the Picard at the end of Star Trek: Picard, is the same as the person that was in command of the Enterprise. Which is simply not true. So you still rust the Catalyst when choosing Destroy. If you don't trust him, choose Refuse. Oh, so because their existence is illegal they should be mass murdered. Congratulations, you just supported every dictator who committed a genocide ever. Guess that means Hungary should kill all their LGBT people today since they made it illegal yesterday. The main point was countering the "Hackett/our superior said we should kill them so we must" argument by saying it is the responsibility of soldiers to not follow immoral or unethical orders. In this case, the order is to commit genocide/mass murder of innocent races/beings to eliminate the targets. Trusting the Catalyst at all is a stupid idea. That said, killing the Reapers is justified in that they are the aggressors in this conflict and have proven unwilling or unable to stand down, barring complete capitulation on the part of the organics. Though shooting a tube and then walking into a fireball is, again a stupid way to go about it. Blue and Green are nonstarters because, again, they are complete capitulation to the Reapers, surrender of organic freedom or identity. Like the geth, organics should be free to build their own destiny. But the problem with Red is it not only kills the Reapers, but ALL synthetics. Even those who are fighting at your side. Including any that are simply existing, and may not be part of the conflict at all. In a way, EC made this worse, because regardless of the horrific war crime committed, Red, Green, or Blue, they galaxy is HAPPY you did it. What kind of weird-ass gaslighting cognitive dissonance is Bioware trying to pull here? This is the elephant in the room Bioware needs to address if they are ever to set a game in the MW again, regardless of what they end up canonizing.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Jun 16, 2021 15:58:34 GMT
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Post by Iakus on Jun 16, 2021 16:12:05 GMT
It's a pity that Bioware's response to anyone who DOESN'T want to follow the Catalyst's orders is "TROLOL! Rocks fall, everyone dies! Now reload and pick a color!"
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Jun 16, 2021 16:15:38 GMT
It's a pity that Bioware's response to anyone who DOESN'T want to follow the Catalyst's orders is "TROLOL! Rocks fall, everyone dies! Now reload and pick a color!" With the number of stormtroopers in that moment, that actually fits really well lol. The one who gets shot is Refuse, the other three that comply are Control, Synthesis, and Destroy, and Crosshair is Catalyst/Bioware.
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quarianmasterrace
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Post by quarianmasterrace on Jun 16, 2021 17:14:41 GMT
So you still rust the Catalyst when choosing Destroy. If you don't trust him, choose Refuse. Oh, so because their existence is illegal they should be mass murdered. Congratulations, you just supported every dictator who committed a genocide ever. Guess that means Hungary should kill all their LGBT people today since they made it illegal yesterday. The main point was countering the "Hackett/our superior said we should kill them so we must" argument by saying it is the responsibility of soldiers to not follow immoral or unethical orders. In this case, the order is to commit genocide/mass murder of innocent races/beings to eliminate the targets. Trusting the Catalyst at all is a stupid idea. That said, killing the Reapers is justified in that they are the aggressors in this conflict and have proven unwilling or unable to stand down, barring complete capitulation on the part of the organics. Though shooting a tube and then walking into a fireball is, again a stupid way to go about it. Blue and Green are nonstarters because, again, they are complete capitulation to the Reapers, surrender of organic freedom or identity. Like the geth, organics should be free to build their own destiny. But the problem with Red is it not only kills the Reapers, but ALL synthetics. Even those who are fighting at your side. Including any that are simply existing, and may not be part of the conflict at all. In a way, EC made this worse, because regardless of the horrific war crime committed, Red, Green, or Blue, they galaxy is HAPPY you did it. What kind of weird-ass gaslighting cognitive dissonance is Bioware trying to pull here? This is the elephant in the room Bioware needs to address if they are ever to set a game in the MW again, regardless of what they end up canonizing. The brat lies about Destroy now anyway if you go by the Shep torso scene & slides. They were supposed to die because "partially synthetic". They walked into an exploding object. Either Shep thought they'd die, or is a moron that doesn't care about seeing their peeps again or helping rebuild. Whatever that "partially synthetic" thing means anyway? Do the quarians' immuno boosting cybernetics count? Because that ending slide shows them just fine rebuilding their cities, not dying horribly when their implants explode or starving over levo-amino Earth (guess that Relay got rebuilt really fast!). What about biotic amps? They're wetware plugged directly into your brain, seems pretty "partially synthetic", but pretty much all the biotics we know of are shown to live too, Jack, Jacob, Miranda etc. The ending doesn't even do what it told me it would do, and doesn't give me enough information to really form any conclusions beyond "this is badly written". at least when it was a shitty dystopian dark age where almost everyone presumably dies it made more sense. It was still terrible, but it made more sense. EC just painted smiles over all the nagging questions that people had about their shitty endings.
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Post by Iakus on Jun 16, 2021 17:22:42 GMT
Trusting the Catalyst at all is a stupid idea. That said, killing the Reapers is justified in that they are the aggressors in this conflict and have proven unwilling or unable to stand down, barring complete capitulation on the part of the organics. Though shooting a tube and then walking into a fireball is, again a stupid way to go about it. Blue and Green are nonstarters because, again, they are complete capitulation to the Reapers, surrender of organic freedom or identity. Like the geth, organics should be free to build their own destiny. But the problem with Red is it not only kills the Reapers, but ALL synthetics. Even those who are fighting at your side. Including any that are simply existing, and may not be part of the conflict at all. In a way, EC made this worse, because regardless of the horrific war crime committed, Red, Green, or Blue, they galaxy is HAPPY you did it. What kind of weird-ass gaslighting cognitive dissonance is Bioware trying to pull here? This is the elephant in the room Bioware needs to address if they are ever to set a game in the MW again, regardless of what they end up canonizing. The brat lies about Destroy now anyway if you go by the Shep torso scene & slides. They were supposed to die because "partially synthetic". They walked into an exploding object. Either Shep thought they'd die, or is a moron that doesn't care about seeing their peeps again or helping rebuild. Whatever that "partially synthetic" thing means anyway? Do the quarians' immuno boosting cybernetics count? Because that ending slide shows them just fine rebuilding their cities, not dying horribly when their implants explode or starving over levo-amino Earth (guess that Relay got rebuilt really fast!). What about biotic amps? They're wetware plugged directly into your brain, seems pretty "partially synthetic", but pretty much all the biotics we know of are shown to live too, Jack, Jacob, Miranda etc. The ending doesn't even do what it told me it would do, and doesn't give me enough information to really form any conclusions beyond "this is badly written". at least when it was a shitty dystopian dark age where almost everyone presumably dies it made more sense. It was still terrible, but it made more sense. EC just painted smiles over all the nagging questions that people had about their shitty endings. All I could think of with the endings was "I guess they decided Saren was right after all": "The visions cannot be denied. The Reapers are too powerful. The only hope of survival is to join with them. Sovereign is a machine. It thinks like a machine. If I can prove my value, I become a resource, worth maintaining. There is no other logical conclusion....I'm not doing this for myself. Don't you see, Sovreign will succeed. It is inevitable. My way is the only way any of us will survive. I'm forging an alliance between us and the Reapers, between organics and machines, and in doing so, I will save more lives than have ever existed. But you would undo my work. You would doom our entire civilization to complete annihilation, and for that, you must die."
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Post by Spectr61 on Jun 16, 2021 18:18:22 GMT
The brat lies about Destroy now anyway if you go by the Shep torso scene & slides. They were supposed to die because "partially synthetic". They walked into an exploding object. Either Shep thought they'd die, or is a moron that doesn't care about seeing their peeps again or helping rebuild. Whatever that "partially synthetic" thing means anyway? Do the quarians' immuno boosting cybernetics count? Because that ending slide shows them just fine rebuilding their cities, not dying horribly when their implants explode or starving over levo-amino Earth (guess that Relay got rebuilt really fast!). What about biotic amps? They're wetware plugged directly into your brain, seems pretty "partially synthetic", but pretty much all the biotics we know of are shown to live too, Jack, Jacob, Miranda etc. The ending doesn't even do what it told me it would do, and doesn't give me enough information to really form any conclusions beyond "this is badly written". at least when it was a shitty dystopian dark age where almost everyone presumably dies it made more sense. It was still terrible, but it made more sense. EC just painted smiles over all the nagging questions that people had about their shitty endings. All I could think of with the endings was "I guess they decided Saren was right after all": "The visions cannot be denied. The Reapers are too powerful. The only hope of survival is to join with them. Sovereign is a machine. It thinks like a machine. If I can prove my value, I become a resource, worth maintaining. There is no other logical conclusion....I'm not doing this for myself. Don't you see, Sovreign will succeed. It is inevitable. My way is the only way any of us will survive. I'm forging an alliance between us and the Reapers, between organics and machines, and in doing so, I will save more lives than have ever existed. But you would undo my work. You would doom our entire civilization to complete annihilation, and for that, you must die." This. Well said sir.
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quarianmasterrace
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Post by quarianmasterrace on Jun 16, 2021 18:22:13 GMT
The brat lies about Destroy now anyway if you go by the Shep torso scene & slides. They were supposed to die because "partially synthetic". They walked into an exploding object. Either Shep thought they'd die, or is a moron that doesn't care about seeing their peeps again or helping rebuild. Whatever that "partially synthetic" thing means anyway? Do the quarians' immuno boosting cybernetics count? Because that ending slide shows them just fine rebuilding their cities, not dying horribly when their implants explode or starving over levo-amino Earth (guess that Relay got rebuilt really fast!). What about biotic amps? They're wetware plugged directly into your brain, seems pretty "partially synthetic", but pretty much all the biotics we know of are shown to live too, Jack, Jacob, Miranda etc. The ending doesn't even do what it told me it would do, and doesn't give me enough information to really form any conclusions beyond "this is badly written". at least when it was a shitty dystopian dark age where almost everyone presumably dies it made more sense. It was still terrible, but it made more sense. EC just painted smiles over all the nagging questions that people had about their shitty endings. All I could think of with the endings was "I guess they decided Saren was right after all": "The visions cannot be denied. The Reapers are too powerful. The only hope of survival is to join with them. Sovereign is a machine. It thinks like a machine. If I can prove my value, I become a resource, worth maintaining. There is no other logical conclusion....I'm not doing this for myself. Don't you see, Sovreign will succeed. It is inevitable. My way is the only way any of us will survive. I'm forging an alliance between us and the Reapers, between organics and machines, and in doing so, I will save more lives than have ever existed. But you would undo my work. You would doom our entire civilization to complete annihilation, and for that, you must die." Yeah, they really went with the whole themes are for 8th grade book reports approach to the writing. Pick ending A, B or C! One is the goal of the bad guy from this game, one is the goal of the bad guy from the first game, and the last will make you a bad guy! But no the ending is gud and artistic and if you disagree that it fits with the previously established character driven space adventure story you just didn't get it™
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Post by shotgunjulia on Jun 16, 2021 20:53:26 GMT
Because 1) despite being a Spectre, the default canon Shepard is an Alliance soldier, a Marine. Once a Marine always a Marine. As a Marine, you would have respect for your superior officers or even former superior officers - Anderson and Hackett. That's why. That's why you report your progress to them periodically during ME3. You're friends with Anderson whether you want to be or now. You report to Hackett whether you want to or not. The game even forces you to do that. You have a job to do. Soldiers also have a responsibility to disobey immoral and unethical orders, which using the Crucible to destroy the Reapers turned out to be since it commits complete genocide of countless synthetic races, and you just said genocide is completely irredeemable. You're thinking too much. You've tied your brain in knots. We all knew this war could involve sacrificing a few billion here to save 20 billion there. And you don't know about any other synthetic races in the galaxy. The story doesn't even allude to their existence. And the Geth might not even exist by this time. I'm going through the story right now, and the Quarians just took care of them. I had the Geth VI so it was one or the other and I chose the Quarians. And there went the Geth. Can't say I was sorry to see them go. Javik warns us about synthetics. The Leviathans created The Intelligence to solve the problem of synthetics continually rebelling against organics and galactic wars being fought against them. What was its solution? Turn advanced organic life into a slurry and mix them with reaper nanites and make a Sovereign class reaper out of the selected species, and make smaller reapers out of the other species, and turn the rest of the people into monsters. Come on, man. They have no redeeming qualities. Exterminating the reapers was a good thing. So we might just be looking at EDI and the virtual aliens getting fried. If the Geth don't exist anymore, that might be the end of it. If the Geth still exist, well, that's your problem. You should have thrown it out the airlock. Rewriting everyone's DNA without their permission is also a war crime. You've changed them. You've changed everything in the galaxy to become part organic, part machine whether they wanted it or not. And now everyone is connected. What happened to autonomy? Was doing this ethical? Controlling the reapers? You can become a totalitarian dictator if you want. And if the synthetics rise up again you might have to destroy them because you're a protector now. Or you could restart the harvest. Or you can refuse and sacrifice your cycle and kick the can down the road. According to Patrick Weekes, the next cycle uses the Crucible and destroys the reapers. I look at Control and Synthesis as indoctrination endings. They can't work. They just can't work. I'm getting real tired of this post-modernist nihilistic bullshit in my old age. As I've gotten older, I've found I want more upbeat endings like ME1 had.
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Post by Iakus on Jun 16, 2021 21:41:14 GMT
Rewriting everyone's DNA without their permission is also a war crime. You've changed them. You've changed everything in the galaxy to become part organic, part machine whether they wanted it or not. And now everyone is connected. What happened to autonomy? Was doing this ethical?
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t4rget
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Post by t4rget on Jun 16, 2021 23:19:12 GMT
Good. That was the right call then.
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Spectr61
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Post by Spectr61 on Jun 17, 2021 1:55:21 GMT
Just pick refuse.
Don't play Starchild's shitty little game of choice. Once you play his game in any way, you have lost. The choices presented of being war criminal(re-writing everyone without consent-synthesis), a forgiving dictator(let the murdering bastards live and then control them-control), or commit genocide(wipe out synthetics-destroy) are all fools' choices.
You and Liara have already prepared the ground via Liara's Beacons for the next cycle to properly end it. (Maybe this was what Patrick Weekes was thinking of when he alluded to the next cycle defeating the Reapers.)
Refuse - and don't shoot some colored tube that forever turns you into some sort of monster, but become immortal (Song of Achilles) by doing something legendary, like planting the Beacons and shooting that little phucker right in the face.
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guardian
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Mass Effect Andromeda, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by Guardian on Jun 17, 2021 2:52:58 GMT
I look at Control and Synthesis as indoctrination endings. They can't work. They just can't work. In a way yeah, this makes sense. And Refuse just feels like a giant middle finger to everyone who "didn't get the artistic interpretation". I'm getting real tired of this post-modernist nihilistic bullshit in my old age. As I've gotten older, I've found I want more upbeat endings like ME1 had. Also agree - an upbeat ending was all I wanted for this trilogy. But I do remember on the old BSN, too many complained and got tired of the "Disney Ending". I can't remember his name, but he had a dwarf avi from DA that said, "I'm done if they give ME3 a Disney ending. Unless Shepard dies, I don't care." Too many have become this... "need traumatic, edgelord ending for the sake of being edgelord!" But I'm tired, it's been a day....just trying to say I agree with you, julia
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Gileadan
N5
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Post by Gileadan on Jun 17, 2021 4:39:49 GMT
I never understood how people took "protagonist still alive but trillions died" as a Disney ending. I'm no expert, how many Disney movies end with a gigantic pile of corpses and the main character surviving? And how would one more dead person (the protagonist) added to all these dead bodies make such a massive difference? A trillion dead is a fine happy ending, a trillion and one is a grimdark mess? What the...?
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shotgunjulia
N2
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Post by shotgunjulia on Jun 17, 2021 4:40:50 GMT
Just pick refuse. Don't play Starchild's shitty little game of choice. Once you play his game in any way, you have lost. The choices presented of being war criminal(re-writing everyone without consent-synthesis), a forgiving dictator(let the murdering bastards live and then control them-control), or commit genocide(wipe out synthetics-destroy) are all fools' choices. You and Liara have already prepared the ground via Liara's Beacons for the next cycle to properly end it. (Maybe this was what Patrick Weekes was thinking of when he alluded to the next cycle defeating the Reapers.) Refuse - and don't shoot some colored tube that forever turns you into some sort of monster, but become immortal (Song of Achilles) by doing something legendary, like planting the Beacons and shooting that little phucker right in the face. "Speculations for everyone." And you're speculating.
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Guardian
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November 2016
guardian
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Post by Guardian on Jun 17, 2021 5:06:55 GMT
I never understood how people took "protagonist still alive but trillions died" as a Disney ending. I'm no expert, how many Disney movies end with a gigantic pile of corpses and the main character surviving? And how would one more dead person (the protagonist) added to all these dead bodies make such a massive difference? A trillion dead is a fine happy ending, a trillion and one is a grimdark mess? What the...?
Because to them, "Disney Ending = Protagonist alive". Doesn't matter how many trillions die, so long as the protagonist lives, that's how they define it as a "Disney Ending". The Protagonist lives, can go off and be "happily ever after".
The leaps in mental logic they have to make about this conclusion though....
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shotgunjulia
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shotgunjulia
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Post by shotgunjulia on Jun 17, 2021 5:11:15 GMT
I never understood how people took "protagonist still alive but trillions died" as a Disney ending. I'm no expert, how many Disney movies end with a gigantic pile of corpses and the main character surviving? And how would one more dead person (the protagonist) added to all these dead bodies make such a massive difference? A trillion dead is a fine happy ending, a trillion and one is a grimdark mess? What the...? They did. For some of the people on BSN I think the best ending would have been an outright reaper victory - Shepard is mortally wounded on the beam run. A marauder walks up and pumps two rounds in his/her skull. And the screen goes black. Credits. You're Commander Shepard. The game ends. Speculations for everyone. Did the reapers win? Or did someone make it up the beam? You don't know because you were Commander Shepard and died. It wasn't critical mission failure. You died. There was no way out of it. The "Sopranos" ending. Imagine the rage on the forums if they did that. I can't think of a darker ending. But hey, no Starbrat. For more adventures with Commander Shepard buy DLC. Artistic integrity. Okay - you could do that for the low EMS ending. For people who wanted dark. I agree with you. For the rest of us who tried hard, for those of us who got over 9000 EMS and got the same shitty ending, Shepard surviving is one person. Let Shepard survive. It wouldn't break the game. It wouldn't break the series. They wouldn't be forced into writing Shepard again. Make him an Admiral, Hackett's age for the next ME game, and be done with it. Or a Supervisor in the SPECTRE's Office - they have to have an administrative structure. I mean who handles pay? Who makes sure the operatives have the equipment they need? Who coordinates operations? Being on your own and above the law was a game mechanic. It makes no sense. You end up with Sarens if you have no checks and balances. Oh wait. And I forgot the operatives have to go dumpster diving, loot corpses, and rob bank ATMs.
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Spectr61
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Post by Spectr61 on Jun 17, 2021 6:53:27 GMT
Just pick refuse. Don't play Starchild's shitty little game of choice. Once you play his game in any way, you have lost. The choices presented of being war criminal(re-writing everyone without consent-synthesis), a forgiving dictator(let the murdering bastards live and then control them-control), or commit genocide(wipe out synthetics-destroy) are all fools' choices. You and Liara have already prepared the ground via Liara's Beacons for the next cycle to properly end it. (Maybe this was what Patrick Weekes was thinking of when he alluded to the next cycle defeating the Reapers.) Refuse - and don't shoot some colored tube that forever turns you into some sort of monster, but become immortal (Song of Achilles) by doing something legendary, like planting the Beacons and shooting that little phucker right in the face. "Speculations for everyone." And you're speculating. Exactly what am I "speculating"? Or are you giving out speculations? After all, you said "speculations for everyone". Are you the giver? Or did you possibly mean "speculation is for everyone"? If so, see above.
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helios969
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Post by helios969 on Jun 17, 2021 7:54:27 GMT
In its core form IDT was better than what we got...some of the details that were fixated on were firmly in tinfoil hat territory though. I could buy Shepard was in the early stages of indoctrination...he was after all overcome by Object Rho and spend a fair amount of time running around Collector ships. Honestly they should have just removed the stupid dream sequences...which was the main spawning ground for IDT.
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