shotgunjulia
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Post by shotgunjulia on Jul 20, 2021 9:45:49 GMT
Mass Effect 5.... one of the multi-verses where Shepard is in prison for blowing up a mass relay, the reapers never invaded because their plan B (the Collectors) failed and they're waiting for another way to get the Citadel relay open. In other words, the dumpster fire that is ME3 never happened. Make a new character... a new spectre.
It doesn't matter if "your Shepard" didn't blow up the mass relay because in this multi-verse Shep did. And a galactic war is about to break out because of it.
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Post by Unicephalon 40-D on Jul 20, 2021 10:35:14 GMT
But Shepard is dead already.
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Post by SirSourpuss on Jul 20, 2021 13:17:30 GMT
But Shepard is dead already. Since ME2, but that didn't stop ME3.
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shotgunjulia
N2
Frustrated Golfer
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Mass Effect Andromeda, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by shotgunjulia on Jul 20, 2021 17:51:04 GMT
But Shepard is dead already. Okay Shepard is dead because fail-Shep in ME2. Arrival DLC not written. Done. Only survivors are Liara, Virmire survivor, and Joker. Dumpster fire of ME3 not written. New ME3 universe. It's the only way to get away from the endings.
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dmc1001
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Post by dmc1001 on Jul 20, 2021 19:51:18 GMT
But Shepard is dead already. Okay Shepard is dead because fail-Shep in ME2. Arrival DLC not written. Done. Only survivors are Liara, Virmire survivor, and Joker. Dumpster fire of ME3 not written. New ME3 universe. It's the only way to get away from the endings. Not really. No way Starbrat was on the agenda while ME2 was being made. Tali's recruitment mission was already pushing the dark energy idea. Had they gone down that road, ME3 would likely have been very different game. I don't think the idea was ever fleshed out enough, and I would bet it was repackaged somewhat in MEA, but it was there. Edit: By which I mean, ME3 would need some revision but the game would ultimately play out the same minus the Catalyst. No Catalyst = no three endings.
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Post by Iakus on Jul 20, 2021 19:53:17 GMT
But Shepard is dead already. Okay Shepard is dead because fail-Shep in ME2. Arrival DLC not written. Done. Only survivors are Liara, Virmire survivor, and Joker. Dumpster fire of ME3 not written. New ME3 universe. It's the only way to get away from the endings. A price I'd at least consider paying...
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Post by QuizzyBunny on Jul 20, 2021 20:00:38 GMT
Wow, people here really hate ME3... aside from the very ending I found most of it to be pretty good. I feel like an anomaly...
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Post by dmc1001 on Jul 20, 2021 20:12:37 GMT
Mass Effect 5.... one of the multi-verses where Shepard is in prison for blowing up a mass relay, the reapers never invaded because their plan B (the Collectors) failed and they're waiting for another way to get the Citadel relay open. In other words, the dumpster fire that is ME3 never happened. Make a new character... a new spectre. It doesn't matter if "your Shepard" didn't blow up the mass relay because in this multi-verse Shep did. And a galactic war is about to break out because of it. Shepard was in jail either way. Even without destroying a relay (which happens, apparently, even without your interference), Shep is jailed for working with Cerberus.
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Post by dmc1001 on Jul 20, 2021 20:15:14 GMT
Wow, people here really hate ME3... aside from the very ending I found most of it to be pretty good. I feel like an anomaly... I don't hate ME3. The only thing I didn't really like was the Omega DLC. I can skip it, but I'm a completionist and want every damn war asset I can find.
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Post by Phantom on Jul 20, 2021 20:15:32 GMT
Wow, people here really hate ME3... aside from the very ending I found most of it to be pretty good. I feel like an anomaly... Well Please follow the beautiful tall blonde lady to the nearest Cerberus Labs to get checked for any anomalous materials including Reaper Nanites.
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Post by KaiserShep on Jul 20, 2021 22:22:39 GMT
Wow, people here really hate ME3... aside from the very ending I found most of it to be pretty good. I feel like an anomaly... Despite my issues with the ending, it’s the one I play the most out of the entire trilogy. As many things as I like about the other two games, I have a fair amount of things I particularly don’t like that limit my replays.
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Post by themikefest on Jul 20, 2021 23:23:48 GMT
Wow, people here really hate ME3... aside from the very ending I found most of it to be pretty good. I feel like an anomaly... Despite my issues with the ending, it’s the one I play the most out of the entire trilogy. As many things as I like about the other two games, I have a fair amount of things I particularly don’t like that limit my replays. The one reason why I played ME3 the most is because of ems.
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Post by Unicephalon 40-D on Jul 21, 2021 7:05:25 GMT
@ shotgunjulia - I didnt mean that but it was good quick rant. I dont hate ME3 either, it just is not a good ME game for me - especially from combat and RPG side. I wish they just mostly ignore endings and its been 600 years or more - dont care so much about the ending of the trilogy - but I know some people do and I think we'll be all screwed somehow *nostradamus* I dont take it so seriously, sorry.
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Post by dmc1001 on Jul 21, 2021 18:32:21 GMT
@ shotgunjulia - I didnt mean that but it was good quick rant. I dont hate ME3 either, it just is not a good ME game for me - especially from combat and RPG side. I wish they just mostly ignore endings and its been 600 years or more - dont care so much about the ending of the trilogy - but I know some people do and I think we'll be all screwed somehow *nostradamus* I dont take it so seriously, sorry. Things like the three endings are a major reason why modders exist. They're capable of fixing problems devs are too lazy to handle and making the game generally better - by making it so you don't need to have any of those damn endings.
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Post by explorerclass on Jul 24, 2021 8:25:19 GMT
The more time goes on, the more faith I have that they may not force us to go with destroy. It goes against the themes and makes Shepard pretty terrible, so I’m heavily against that ending in a moral basis and I’d rather have no new Me than them ruin Shepard’s story by literally making him commit genocide, even killing his own friends, and actually act like he’s a decent person. And the more time goes on, the more and more likely it seems possible that they aren’t forcing THAT to be the canon ending to his story. Time and distance from the trailer make it seem possible they aren’t locking us with that. So I wish they’d just be straight forward and say “yes. That’s the canon” so I could at least spend this time getting over the death of ME instead of wasting time hoping for it. Well i’d Argue doing anything other than destroy makes shep pretty terrible and is a betrayal of all that came before and all the dead at the hands of the reapers. Destroy murders innocent people and allies when there’s better ways especially considering the catalyst dies regardless. Killing everyone reaper in revenge doesn’t make a hero, it makes a genocidal, vengeful maniac who can’t separate bloodlust from duty.
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Post by explorerclass on Jul 24, 2021 8:27:33 GMT
The more time goes on, the more faith I have that they may not force us to go with destroy. It goes against the themes and makes Shepard pretty terrible, so I’m heavily against that ending in a moral basis and I’d rather have no new Me than them ruin Shepard’s story by literally making him commit genocide, even killing his own friends, and actually act like he’s a decent person. And the more time goes on, the more and more likely it seems possible that they aren’t forcing THAT to be the canon ending to his story. Time and distance from the trailer make it seem possible they aren’t locking us with that. So I wish they’d just be straight forward and say “yes. That’s the canon” so I could at least spend this time getting over the death of ME instead of wasting time hoping for it.
To be fair when they were making the original trilogy the renegade endings to ME1 and ME2 were the default world state if you played the games without previous saves or the Genesis DLCs. I'm not sure if that is the case with ME:LE but I wouldn't be surprised if it is. IF the destroy ending is the renegade ending then that MIGHT be the default world state without saves, DLCs, the Archives, and just playing it straight out of the box.
Now if BioWare continues that trend it would make the destroy ending default not canon, like they did with the previous games.
That’s mainly because they were the easiest for any player to achieve because renegade or neutral have the same outcome. Now they aren’t focusing on easy. They *should* be focusing on what’s best for the narrative And the narrative isn’t helped at all by destroy. Actually destroy actually Goes directly against the *point* of ME.
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Post by explorerclass on Jul 24, 2021 8:28:34 GMT
But Shepard is dead already. Okay Shepard is dead because fail-Shep in ME2. Arrival DLC not written. Done. Only survivors are Liara, Virmire survivor, and Joker. Dumpster fire of ME3 not written. New ME3 universe. It's the only way to get away from the endings. Shepard is dead Because he dies in most of the endings anyway and they’ll probably retcon something that makes anything work And it’s been like 650+ years. He may exist in the game in for form if VI but the actual Shepard is long dead.
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Post by FiendishlyInventive on Jul 24, 2021 10:04:42 GMT
I certainly do not want Synthesis done to me so I am not going to force it on anyone else, even hypothetically, neither do I think anyone elected me to play God, so from that perspective I have no better option other than destroy as everyone signed on for that no matter the cost.
Narratively and thematically it is also a recurring point in Mass Effect that people who attempt to control the Reapers or make peace with them just usher in their doom.
But I also see the reasoning that the middle option's correct because the story's all about putting aside our differences for a greater unity but as someone who's had my bodily autonomy taken from me in the past making that choice for everyone will never be acceptable to me even if the outcome's utopian.
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Post by QuizzyBunny on Jul 24, 2021 10:10:21 GMT
Destroy murders innocent people and allies when there’s better ways especially considering the catalyst dies regardless. I mean, for others Destroy was the only moral option. When faced with the Catalyst at the end my reasoning was this: 1. The game has shown over and over how the Reapers cannot be controlled (see Illusive Man and Saren). The only one telling me any different is a Reaper themselves (convenient no?). The cost of getting this wrong could be the Reapers indoctrinating you and the cycle being finished with everyone's hard work wasted. 2. Similar can be said of synthesis. We had one quest where the mixture of man and machine resulted in intense suffering and despair, so hardly anything comforting for the future. And again, the thing saying this will totally work? A Reaper. And even if it does work it would mean changing the fundamentals of all beings in the galaxy without giving them any input, something I personally find wrong. 3.Destroy, which will result in the tragic death of all synthetics, at least will guarantee that the Reapers beings who have killed billions upon billions of beings will be forever gone. The ruthless calculus of war as Garrus would say. There's also the benefit that because synthetics are machines there might be a slim chance to rebuild them afterwards. 4.Refusal is just letting the Reapers finish what they started. If you didn't reason like this it's cool. No choice is objectively right. But I don't think it's fair moralizing the people who made this choice.
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Post by QuizzyBunny on Jul 24, 2021 10:12:14 GMT
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Post by FiendishlyInventive on Jul 24, 2021 10:15:45 GMT
Haha it's all good.
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Post by themikefest on Jul 24, 2021 11:31:35 GMT
Destroy murders innocent people and allies when there’s better ways especially considering the catalyst dies regardless. Killing everyone reaper in revenge doesn’t make a hero, it makes a genocidal, vengeful maniac who can’t separate bloodlust from duty. I will say the same to you that I did to another poster. Click on the link in my signature. That is how much damage can be done in a playthrough. I could have chosen the green. The only differences is the geth or quarians survive, and a few characters survive. Would that playthrough be any better? Thing remains if the green is chosen. What purpose does it serve? Depending on the playthrough, A/K and the platform are the only squadmates gone. I let the quarians deal with the geth. I would say that's a lot better than if I were to choose the green in the playthrough in my signature.
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Post by mtheillusive on Jul 24, 2021 14:24:50 GMT
3.Destroy, which will result in the tragic death of all synthetics, at least will guarantee that the Reapers beings who have killed billions upon billions of beings will be forever gone. The ruthless calculus of war as Garrus would say. There's also the benefit that because synthetics are machines there might be a slim chance to rebuild them afterwards. And....that also means that, in theory....someone could rebuild the Reapers.... Hmmm....pick destroy, years later people are trying to rebuild AI, and some ahole rebuilds the Reapers. Everyone dies. Pick control....Shepard goes rogue years later as he/she has a different mindset, everyone dies. Pick synthesis, a mathematical schism occurs, and something something Repears. Everyone dies Refuse....well...everyone dies. SEE! BOOM! Just like that all endings lead to the same conclusion
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Post by Deleted on Jul 24, 2021 14:31:54 GMT
People ignore this, so I'll drop it here -
Synthesis doesn't require you to choose that ending.
If you broker peace with the Quarians and Geth, as I do, Geth start living in Quarian soups.
That is no longer Quarian soup. It is a Geth Quarian stew, and it is better for both - everyone can eat.
Some sort of synthesis is inevitable. Let it be done by choice, not by brute force. It isn't for everybody.
Control.... did we learn nothing from Saren and TIM? AI's are supposed to evolve, and Shepard's essence will over-time become distinctly less "Shepard" and more "Intelligence". It is far too much power to be consolidated in this way. It takes a believer in Divine Right and other fantasy nonsense to follow this path and really believe it. A good dash of narcissism as well.
Refuse - honestly, Casey Hudson can eat my dirty post-diarrhea ass for this.
This leaves Destroy, and the emptiness that comes with it. I don't really have a choice, and I hate it. Yet this is the role of the Catalyst, to make change. The only way to break the cycle is to destroy the Reapers, and allow Synthesis to occur naturally where it wants to. Losing the Geth, who I spent every ounce of energy saving and then brokering peace between them and their makers, is heartbreaking. Other AI lifeforms as well, it is horrible.
And the only choice.
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Post by themikefest on Jul 24, 2021 14:43:50 GMT
Don't forget the reason peace is possible is because of reaper interference and the reaper code. I would rather have had Admiral 'I have an itchy trigger finger' Gerrell stand down leading to the geth stop firing. Both groups talk about whatever that leads to a temporary peace long enough to destroy the reapers. After that, worry about what might happen if the peace starts to fail. Of course that isn't an option in the game, and since the game gives me no reason to allow the geth to upload the code, I choose the quarians.
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