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Post by xerrai on Aug 25, 2021 3:48:12 GMT
Elves Fu*k everything up. Then to fix their previous Fu*k ups they Fu*k up some more. Fucking based. One of the things I love about the Dragon Age series is the extent to which you can humiliate the Dalish at every turn. Stupid elves But don't you know? Every race and organization is stupid in Dragon Age. Stupid elves, stupid dwarves, stupid humans, stupid Chantry, stupid Wardens, stupid Mages, and so on. Stupid, stupid, and more stupid. Stupid everywhere!
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Post by yarus on Aug 25, 2021 4:46:49 GMT
Fucking based. One of the things I love about the Dragon Age series is the extent to which you can humiliate the Dalish at every turn. Stupid elves But don't you know? Every race and organization is stupid in Dragon Age. Stupid elves, stupid dwarves, stupid humans, stupid Chantry, stupid Wardens, stupid Mages, and so on. Stupid, stupid, and more stupid. Stupid everywhere! Hahahaha, so true
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Post by Buckeldemon on Aug 25, 2021 5:46:11 GMT
Elves Fu*k everything up. Then to fix their previous Fu*k ups they Fu*k up some more. Fucking based. One of the things I love about the Dragon Age series is the extent to which you can humiliate the Dalish at every turn. Stupid elves 1) Solas=/=Dalish. 2) I prefer bled-dry templar corpses myself. And a bunch of crispy priests. Perhaps a hornless Viddasala? Heard conflicting things about their popularity in Kekistan.
Fucking based. One of the things I love about the Dragon Age series is the extent to which you can humiliate the Dalish at every turn. Stupid elves But don't you know? Every race and organization is stupid in Dragon Age. Stupid elves, stupid dwarves, stupid humans, stupid Chantry, stupid Wardens, stupid Mages, and so on. Stupid, stupid, and more stupid. Stupid everywhere! 1) You forgot templars specifically. And Qunari. And the Tevinters. And the Inquistion. And Orleeeee... 2) Not all stupid is equal. The above is surely a fine case of firework, but by comparison, it should really happen more often. At least once per game.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Aug 25, 2021 6:34:58 GMT
Fucking based. One of the things I love about the Dragon Age series is the extent to which you can humiliate the Dalish at every turn. Stupid elves 1) Solas=/=Dalish. 2) I prefer bled-dry templar corpses myself. And a bunch of crispy priests. Perhaps a hornless Viddasala? Heard conflicting things about their popularity in Kekistan.
But don't you know? Every race and organization is stupid in Dragon Age. Stupid elves, stupid dwarves, stupid humans, stupid Chantry, stupid Wardens, stupid Mages, and so on. Stupid, stupid, and more stupid. Stupid everywhere! 1) You forgot templars specifically. And Qunari. And the Tevinters. And the Inquistion. And Orleeeee... 2) Not all stupid is equal. The above is surely a fine case of firework, but by comparison, it should really happen more often. At least once per game. It kind of does. DAO has multiple Chantrries wrecked by the Blight. DA2 has one destroyed by the warmongering terrorist abomination. And DAI literally starts with a bang of one.
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Post by Buckeldemon on Aug 25, 2021 7:35:01 GMT
It kind of does. DAO has multiple Chantrries wrecked by the Blight. DA2 has one destroyed by the warmongering terrorist abomination. And DAI literally starts with a bang of one. Eh, as opposed to our chances of murdering Dalish (or otherwise trashing them) because we don't like them? Not quite. DAO stuff is on the Darkspawn, including a certain DLC, with a few percent Loghain perhaps. DAI as well, kinda. Yeah, one could technically voice support for ba-boom in DA2, but, as you like to point out at times, you have no character agency. Oh, and when it comes to just dumping... ooh, boy, where do I start? DAO gives us a few chances to dump on the more bigoted priests. Later on? No chance. Calling Elthina useless doesn't count.
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Post by gervaise21 on Aug 25, 2021 7:40:03 GMT
Fucking based. One of the things I love about the Dragon Age series is the extent to which you can humiliate the Dalish at every turn. Stupid elves Yes, the writers did seem to have a specific desire to humiliate the elves. However, in DAO that didn't seem to be directed at any particular group of elves. I seem to recall there was a fair bit of city elf humiliation going on in DAO: kidnap, rape, murder and that was just in the origin story. Then in DA2, whilst there was the potential there for the anti-elf players to wipe out another Dalish clan, you have no choice but to kill dozens of city elves who had joined the Arishok's forces as a reaction to city elves receiving no justice whatsoever from the Chantry controlled city authorities. Let's face it, being an elf in Thedas in those two games sucked. However, it is noticeable how the writers have moved away from dumping on all elves and instead decided to direct the abuse particularly towards the Dalish. Even their desire to maintain their freedom and independence of culture from the human overlords is now represented as something to be ridiculed and despised rather than admired. Then to cap it all, it turns out that Solas, who was the poster boy for dumping on the Dalish (along with the s elf-hating Sera), is revealed to be a potential genocidal manic. Yet, instead of giving our Dalish Inquisitor the satisfaction of knowing that their people had been right about Fen'Harel, he excuses himself with the revelation that the elven gods were worse. I know many players seem to revel in the elf bashing. I don't. I like playing elves. Modern elves aren't responsible for what their ancestors did. They need a proper hero to save them from jerks like Solas. I want to be the new Shartan (the one from DAO, although the one in the Canticle of Shartan would also be okay since Andraste acknowledged him as her equal). If next game I end up slaughtering waves of elves yet again instead of saving them for a better future, but not at the expense of the other races, that will be when I abandon the franchise.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 25, 2021 13:24:10 GMT
Fucking based. One of the things I love about the Dragon Age series is the extent to which you can humiliate the Dalish at every turn. Stupid elves Yes, the writers did seem to have a specific desire to humiliate the elves. However, in DAO that didn't seem to be directed at any particular group of elves. I seem to recall there was a fair bit of city elf humiliation going on in DAO: kidnap, rape, murder and that was just in the origin story. Then in DA2, whilst there was the potential there for the anti-elf players to wipe out another Dalish clan, you have no choice but to kill dozens of city elves who had joined the Arishok's forces as a reaction to city elves receiving no justice whatsoever from the Chantry controlled city authorities. Let's face it, being an elf in Thedas in those two games sucked. However, it is noticeable how the writers have moved away from dumping on all elves and instead decided to direct the abuse particularly towards the Dalish. Even their desire to maintain their freedom and independence of culture from the human overlords is now represented as something to be ridiculed and despised rather than admired. Then to cap it all, it turns out that Solas, who was the poster boy for dumping on the Dalish (along with the s elf-hating Sera), is revealed to be a potential genocidal manic. Yet, instead of giving our Dalish Inquisitor the satisfaction of knowing that their people had been right about Fen'Harel, he excuses himself with the revelation that the elven gods were worse. I know many players seem to revel in the elf bashing. I don't. I like playing elves. Modern elves aren't responsible for what their ancestors did. They need a proper hero to save them from jerks like Solas. I want to be the new Shartan (the one from DAO, although the one in the Canticle of Shartan would also be okay since Andraste acknowledged him as her equal). If next game I end up slaughtering waves of elves yet again instead of saving them for a better future, but not at the expense of the other races, that will be when I abandon the franchise. This. Elf bashing is cool, because elves are different/other. Take me off of this fucking planet. The truth that I see in elf-bashing, is real life bigotry needing an escape. Look long in the mirror ye elf haters, and be prepared for an ugly visage. BioWare loves playing both sides, showing us how intermixed the black is with the white. The problem is, they are full of shit. You cannot always be the goddamned devil's advocate, and that is precisely what BioWare is guilty of. Very progressive, but we save room for hatred too.
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Post by yarus on Aug 25, 2021 16:05:47 GMT
Perhaps a hornless Viddasala? Why would hornless Viddasala be a humiliation, rather than having the opposite effect? Isn't a hornless Qunari supposed to be a sign of them being a chosen one/paragon/etc? I prefer bled-dry templar corpses myself. And a bunch of crispy priests. The above is surely a fine case of firework, but by comparison, it should really happen more often. At least once per game. lol
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Post by gaycaravaggio on Aug 25, 2021 17:21:21 GMT
Humans bore me a little. Call me when we have literal lizard people in-game and not just in codex entries.
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Post by Iddy on Aug 25, 2021 19:16:47 GMT
Elves Fu*k everything up. Then to fix their previous Fu*k ups they Fu*k up some more. Fucking based. One of the things I love about the Dragon Age series is the extent to which you can humiliate the Dalish at every turn. Stupid elves Until they learn to use their unwashed bare feet to walk in accordance with the Chant of Light.
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Post by duskwanderer on Aug 25, 2021 20:43:10 GMT
Fucking based. One of the things I love about the Dragon Age series is the extent to which you can humiliate the Dalish at every turn. Stupid elves Yes, the writers did seem to have a specific desire to humiliate the elves. However, in DAO that didn't seem to be directed at any particular group of elves. I seem to recall there was a fair bit of city elf humiliation going on in DAO: kidnap, rape, murder and that was just in the origin story. Then in DA2, whilst there was the potential there for the anti-elf players to wipe out another Dalish clan, you have no choice but to kill dozens of city elves who had joined the Arishok's forces as a reaction to city elves receiving no justice whatsoever from the Chantry controlled city authorities. Let's face it, being an elf in Thedas in those two games sucked. However, it is noticeable how the writers have moved away from dumping on all elves and instead decided to direct the abuse particularly towards the Dalish. Even their desire to maintain their freedom and independence of culture from the human overlords is now represented as something to be ridiculed and despised rather than admired. Then to cap it all, it turns out that Solas, who was the poster boy for dumping on the Dalish (along with the s elf-hating Sera), is revealed to be a potential genocidal manic. Yet, instead of giving our Dalish Inquisitor the satisfaction of knowing that their people had been right about Fen'Harel, he excuses himself with the revelation that the elven gods were worse. I know many players seem to revel in the elf bashing. I don't. I like playing elves. Modern elves aren't responsible for what their ancestors did. They need a proper hero to save them from jerks like Solas. I want to be the new Shartan (the one from DAO, although the one in the Canticle of Shartan would also be okay since Andraste acknowledged him as her equal). If next game I end up slaughtering waves of elves yet again instead of saving them for a better future, but not at the expense of the other races, that will be when I abandon the franchise. I like and dislike the story for one reason only: The elves were racist pricks. Look at the ones we saw: The Dalish clan in the Brecilian was okay, but even Lanaya was pretty haughty about humans, calling them children. And yet, for all their bile, they never even stopped to consider that the elves did it to themselves. They can only think "humans did it." As much as the Dread Wolf might be the Dalish's great villain, they are not so different from Solas. Perhaps modern elves do need a hero to save them from Solas. How many of them will stand against him? And how many of Solas's forces will desert merely because it looks like he'll lose? Someone willing to go to such extremes to kill humans, I don't believe deserves any mercy. Your desire is admirable, but there are many elves who joined Solas's delusions.
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Post by gervaise21 on Aug 26, 2021 8:02:50 GMT
I like and dislike the story for one reason only: The elves were racist pricks. Were they racist because of the treatment they received? Take this account from the Long Walk to Halamshiral: "I used to have a master, a mage. He fed me well, never beat me, even taught me how to read and write so I could do his accounts. But if he had a theory or spell he wanted to test out, he'd get out his daggers, have other servants tie me to a post, and carve furrows into my skin. I was so afraid. Every time, I was sure I would die. But at worst, I'd collapse, got bandaged up and lie in bed too weak to move for days. The other elves would visit me in secret to survey the damage. I'd heal just enough before he needed the blood again.
That is why I traveled from Val Dorma to the Dales with nothing but the rags on my back. ......... That is why I fell to my knees and wept when we crossed through the gates of my new home, a village for my people."
Then, when the elves thought they were safe, surrounded by the barbarian tribes who had fought alongside them for their freedom, along comes Drakon, the grandson of a Tevinter Magister, who slaughters everyone among those human tribes who won't accept his rule and his religion. Is it any wonder they thought them "no better than Tevinter" and wanted nothing to do with them? Incidentally, the idea that the Dalish did nothing during the 2nd Blight is a lie. I've already pointed out before that if the elves were looking on when Montsimmard fell, they were actually well into Orlesian territory, so clearly they had attempted to help but got there too late. After which, it probably did seem expedient to "hold the line" If the darkspawn were swarming across southern Orlais, it is likely they were emerging inside the Dales as well. When Drakon first marched north, it was not to help with the Blight but to try and do a land grab from Tevinter whilst they were pre-occupied elsewhere. It was only after the Grey Wardens heard his army was in the vicinity that they pleaded for his assistance in the Anderfels and Drakon obliged, annexing that nation in the process. So, it was understandable that the Dalish did not want to form part of Drakon's army when it headed north. Of course, current writers conveniently forgot all this history when they were writing JoH, and made the Dalish seem wholly the villains, so everyone could dump on them once again. I would also point out that in the 5th Blight once the Dalish clans got word of the Grey Wardens' calling on them to honour their ancient treaty with that organisation, they responded. It wasn't just Zathrian's clan but all the clans in Ferelden (apart from the Sabre clan apparently). Who most benefited from their assistance? The humans of Ferelden. Who failed to honour the Dalish boon: the humans of Ferelden. Is it any wonder the Dalish are so cynical? So, no, the modern elves have every justification for their suspicion of humans, the city elves even more so because they are descendants of the ordinary commoner elves, probably the ones too old or young to fight, who were rounded up, transported to remote cities and then forced to live in enclaves where they were routinely preyed upon by the local humans. The only way out of the Alienage was to serve in one of the human brothels. Zevran's mother was forced to do this by the Crows in order to pay off the debts of her husband they killed. In DAO, Vaughan kidnapped and raped the female members of a marriage party, calling them whores simply for being elves, and thinking nothing of raping and murdering them. Because even in Ferelden, elves are not protected by the law and so you can mistreat them with impunity. We also learn that those elves who try to make something of themselves, are successful and move out into the wider community, are eventually forced back to the alienage by their human neighbours. Then this mistreatment of city elves continues into DA2. The only escape for the city elves is the Dalish, who up until the travesty of Masked Empire, were only too willing to take them. Their motto is "Never again will we submit". Is it any wonder they feel that way? These elves did not "do it to themselves" but it is clear that people like you use that as a justification for killing and ridiculing them. Enough said.
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Post by duskwanderer on Aug 26, 2021 11:41:51 GMT
I like and dislike the story for one reason only: The elves were racist pricks. Were they racist because of the treatment they received? Take this account from the Long Walk to Halamshiral: "I used to have a master, a mage. He fed me well, never beat me, even taught me how to read and write so I could do his accounts. But if he had a theory or spell he wanted to test out, he'd get out his daggers, have other servants tie me to a post, and carve furrows into my skin. I was so afraid. Every time, I was sure I would die. But at worst, I'd collapse, got bandaged up and lie in bed too weak to move for days. The other elves would visit me in secret to survey the damage. I'd heal just enough before he needed the blood again.
That is why I traveled from Val Dorma to the Dales with nothing but the rags on my back. ......... That is why I fell to my knees and wept when we crossed through the gates of my new home, a village for my people."
Then, when the elves thought they were safe, surrounded by the barbarian tribes who had fought alongside them for their freedom, along comes Drakon, the grandson of a Tevinter Magister, who slaughters everyone among those human tribes who won't accept his rule and his religion. Is it any wonder they thought them "no better than Tevinter" and wanted nothing to do with them? Incidentally, the idea that the Dalish did nothing during the 2nd Blight is a lie. I've already pointed out before that if the elves were looking on when Montsimmard fell, they were actually well into Orlesian territory, so clearly they had attempted to help but got there too late. After which, it probably did seem expedient to "hold the line" If the darkspawn were swarming across southern Orlais, it is likely they were emerging inside the Dales as well. When Drakon first marched north, it was not to help with the Blight but to try and do a land grab from Tevinter whilst they were pre-occupied elsewhere. It was only after the Grey Wardens heard his army was in the vicinity that they pleaded for his assistance in the Anderfels and Drakon obliged, annexing that nation in the process. So, it was understandable that the Dalish did not want to form part of Drakon's army when it headed north. Of course, current writers conveniently forgot all this history when they were writing JoH, and made the Dalish seem wholly the villains, so everyone could dump on them once again. I would also point out that in the 5th Blight once the Dalish clans got word of the Grey Wardens' calling on them to honour their ancient treaty with that organisation, they responded. It wasn't just Zathrian's clan but all the clans in Ferelden (apart from the Sabre clan apparently). Who most benefited from their assistance? The humans of Ferelden. Who failed to honour the Dalish boon: the humans of Ferelden. Is it any wonder the Dalish are so cynical? So, no, the modern elves have every justification for their suspicion of humans, the city elves even more so because they are descendants of the ordinary commoner elves, probably the ones too old or young to fight, who were rounded up, transported to remote cities and then forced to live in enclaves where they were routinely preyed upon by the local humans. The only way out of the Alienage was to serve in one of the human brothels. Zevran's mother was forced to do this by the Crows in order to pay off the debts of her husband they killed. In DAO, Vaughan kidnapped and raped the female members of a marriage party, calling them whores simply for being elves, and thinking nothing of raping and murdering them. Because even in Ferelden, elves are not protected by the law and so you can mistreat them with impunity. We also learn that those elves who try to make something of themselves, are successful and move out into the wider community, are eventually forced back to the alienage by their human neighbours. Then this mistreatment of city elves continues into DA2. The only escape for the city elves is the Dalish, who up until the travesty of Masked Empire, were only too willing to take them. Their motto is "Never again will we submit". Is it any wonder they feel that way? These elves did not "do it to themselves" but it is clear that people like you use that as a justification for killing and ridiculing them. Enough said. It sounds like you excuse everything the elves had done, including all of the murders committed by elves. The whole war of the Dales started because some elves killed a human. The elves had plenty of agency in their own fate. The things you're describing about the Dales is pure theory, and doesn't match even the elves own tradition. Even if you ignore the fact that ignoring darkspawn is stupid, attacking the humans because your people killed a human and they got mad about it is...well, not pleasant.
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Post by gervaise21 on Aug 26, 2021 12:28:46 GMT
The whole war of the Dales started because some elves killed a human. Even in DAI, there is a codex that casts some doubt that this was the case. I would ask why, when the elven army was defeated, the elves who did not take part in the conflict were not allowed to remain in their own land with human governors? Instead they were shipped out and their land given to human nobles. In DAO it was definitely implied that the blame for the war was equally the responsibility of Orlais for trying to enforce their religion as it was the elves for resisting it. The story of Red Crossing in DAI would still seem to show equal blame. The elves killed a human by mistake. The humans deliberately killed and mutilated the body of her lover when he wouldn't leave her. The things you're describing about the Dales is pure theory, and doesn't match even the elves own tradition The Dalish claim the Chantry missionaries and in particular the Templars were becoming overbearing. Remember by this time the Chantry was locking human mages up in the Circles. The Dalish were happy to have free mages despite their experiences with mages in Tevinter. This was always going to be a source of conflict. Also, look at the reaction of the two sides to the truth about Red Crossing. The Dalish at least tried to make some sort of peace offering as an apology for the past. Even our own advisors weren't happy about delivering this in the spirit in which it was given. If you give the evidence to the Chantry, they show no willingness to build bridges. Then there is the truth about Ameridan. Apparently for years his clan was declaring this but everyone refused to believe them. Then when we have proof of their claim, the reaction of Leliana is that we should buy them off to keep them quiet. Even when she restores the Canticle of Shartan to the Chant, scholars immediately start to spread the idea that he wasn't a real person. So whatever happened in the past, and let's face it this was 700 years ago, the humans in the present are no more willing to compromise or be tolerant than they were back then. Even if you ignore the fact that ignoring darkspawn is stupid, They did not ignore the darkspawn. They simply chose not to support Drakon. The history given in the timeline is said to be written by an in-world Chantry scholar. So you can assume it would be biased. So it is perfectly reasonable to assume they put the worst possible interpretation on the elves failure to help Montsimmard. Also, where was Drakon? Montsimmard was sacked in 9:25. He didn't relieve Weisshaupt until 9:33. So what was he doing inthe intervening 8 years? During the 3rd Blight Orlais and Tevinter did help but then annexed the nations they "helped", failing to return home once the threat was gone. During the 4th Blight neither Orlais nor Tevinter helped against the darkspawn because their lands were largely unaffected and they clearly saw no benefit to themselves. Who condemns them? I only excuse the elves as I do because people are so happy to buy into Chantry propaganda to justify the treatment of elves and someone needs to champion an alternative point of view, particularly considering the actual writers have chosen not to do so but only confirm Chantry prejudices. It started with Masked Empire and I don't see it ending any time soon. I'm still of the opinion that the elves and the Dalish in particular are being set up to be cannon fodder the next game.
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Post by duskwanderer on Aug 26, 2021 12:39:02 GMT
There is a massive difference between an implication and a fact. DA:O told us a story. DA:I, written later, told us the actual truth. It is another "what is the true meaning of vallaslin" thing: People have an idea, it's actually false. It's an interesting bit of world lore: A way to handle retcons if you need to use them. But I'll take the actual account over an implication.
Someone being overly preachy is not an excuse to murder. Conflict always exists in the world. If the Dalish didn't have mages or whatnot, there would be something else. The existence of something that would cause conflict isn't a knock on any party. It's how you deal with it. The elves made a choice: They killed Adalene. They also chose not to help against darkspawn. Ameridan confirms that the elves had an alliance with Drakon that they chose not to honor. Not honoring an alliance, especially against howling relentless horrors, is certainly a case for bad blood. And that is a choice the elves made. The consequence is real.
The concept you are suggesting is "We can't trust the records because it comes from a human." But that's not enough. You need to provide a source that tells us more about what happened.
As for what Drakon was doing? Fighting the Blight. People who played the games remember that Ferelden's Blight was ended in a year, but the other Blights took significantly longer.
Orlais and Tevinter didn't help against the 4th Blight. Sure. So what? This is a conversation about the elves, not about the Blight. The Blight is only relevant because the elves broke their alliance with Drakon during it. They could just as easily been attacked by Nevarra and it wouldn't change anything.
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Post by pessimistpanda on Aug 26, 2021 13:44:01 GMT
Awww, poor widdle empire has no friends.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Aug 26, 2021 13:53:01 GMT
Also, look at the reaction of the two sides to the truth about Red Crossing. The Dalish at least tried to make some sort of peace offering as an apology for the past. Even our own advisors weren't happy about delivering this in the spirit in which it was given. “Sorry we massacred an entire town of innocent people, then invaded and did that to countless more. Here’s a deer (just for the first one btw).”
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Post by duskwanderer on Aug 26, 2021 14:16:54 GMT
Also, look at the reaction of the two sides to the truth about Red Crossing. The Dalish at least tried to make some sort of peace offering as an apology for the past. Even our own advisors weren't happy about delivering this in the spirit in which it was given. “Sorry we massacred an entire town of innocent people, then invaded and did that to countless more. Here’s a deer (just for the first one btw).” I'll give the Dalish credit for the offering, it's more than I would expect from them. It would make an interesting story to hear what Red Crossing says about it. I'm reminded of a cool story bit from Icewind Dale 2, when Iselore has a garden planted to honor the heroes, because they saved lives, and so, their memory should be associated with something living. But it's not enough for what the Dalish did wrong.
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Post by pessimistpanda on Aug 26, 2021 14:24:35 GMT
It's more than Tevinter, Orlais or the Chantry have given to any descendants of the hundreds of thousands of people they slaughtered.
What's the bet that if those groups were asked to pay reparations, the tune would suddenly change to "Why should white peop- I mean the Chantry have to pay for something that happened a hundred years ago? They're not responsible for the actions of their predecessors!"
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Black Magic Ritual
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Post by Black Magic Ritual on Aug 26, 2021 14:30:06 GMT
It's more than Tevinter, Orlais or the Chantry have given to any descendants of the hundreds of thousands of people they slaughtered. What's the bet that if those groups were asked to pay reparations, the tune would suddenly change to "Why should white peop- I mean the Chantry have to pay for something that happened a hundred years ago? They're not responsible for the actions of their predecessors!" I mean, they're not.
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Post by pessimistpanda on Aug 26, 2021 14:38:03 GMT
It's more than Tevinter, Orlais or the Chantry have given to any descendants of the hundreds of thousands of people they slaughtered. What's the bet that if those groups were asked to pay reparations, the tune would suddenly change to "Why should white peop- I mean the Chantry have to pay for something that happened a hundred years ago? They're not responsible for the actions of their predecessors!" I mean, they're not. Then neither are the Dalish, but here we are, in this very thread, with people tripping over themselves in their haste to condemn them and talk about how killing them and treating them like shit is okay.
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Cyberstrike
N4
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Post by Cyberstrike on Aug 26, 2021 14:45:05 GMT
"What I am doing will save this world, and those like you - the elves who still remain - may even find it better, when it is done." I mentioned this up above (but under a spoiler). This statement is ambiguous since only just before he was apologising again to the Inquisitor for what he must do and Charter asks if he really thought they wouldn't try to stop him. Also, Charter's response to this is to think of her human lover and realise that even if she were to survive, her lover would not. As I've also pointed out above, the ambiguity stems from the fact we do not know if in fact Charter is an awakened ancient elf or a straight forward modern one. It would seem odd if it were the latter because in many cases the Inquisitor was a modern elf and yet he says the same to them as any other race concerning the possible survival of "their people". When you consider that Abelas drew a distinction between modern elves and Solas when it came to "his People", I'm inclined to think that if Solas was being sincere to Charter, she must be a secret ancient elf. Otherwise, he is being wholly inconsistent. Mind you, given his reputation as a trickster, that wouldn't surprise me. I suppose there is an outside chance that the modern elves will be so transformed by the restoration of magic that essentially the people that they are currently will no longer exist. May be it will even wipe their memories of their former existence, so even though they survive, technically their former self was destroyed along with everyone else.
Solas does state in DAI when talking to him if get Celene and Briala back together (or if you support Briala) and the Inquisitor says Briala could help his people and he replies to effect is: "My people? Oh you mean the elves! I've lived apart from them so long that I no longer see them as my people." So he clearly doesn't see modem elves as "true elves" I think refers to the Dalish "children playing pretend" or something like that. In quest that locks the Inquisitor/Sera romance he says "Sera is as much elf as I am a horse!" So I think it's safe to say that Solas doesn't have high opinion of modern elves.
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Post by duskwanderer on Aug 26, 2021 14:48:45 GMT
I mentioned this up above (but under a spoiler). This statement is ambiguous since only just before he was apologising again to the Inquisitor for what he must do and Charter asks if he really thought they wouldn't try to stop him. Also, Charter's response to this is to think of her human lover and realise that even if she were to survive, her lover would not. As I've also pointed out above, the ambiguity stems from the fact we do not know if in fact Charter is an awakened ancient elf or a straight forward modern one. It would seem odd if it were the latter because in many cases the Inquisitor was a modern elf and yet he says the same to them as any other race concerning the possible survival of "their people". When you consider that Abelas drew a distinction between modern elves and Solas when it came to "his People", I'm inclined to think that if Solas was being sincere to Charter, she must be a secret ancient elf. Otherwise, he is being wholly inconsistent. Mind you, given his reputation as a trickster, that wouldn't surprise me. I suppose there is an outside chance that the modern elves will be so transformed by the restoration of magic that essentially the people that they are currently will no longer exist. May be it will even wipe their memories of their former existence, so even though they survive, technically their former self was destroyed along with everyone else.
Solas does state in DAI when talking to him if get Celene and Briala back together (or if you support Briala) and the Inquisitor says Briala could help his people and he replies to effect is: "My people? Oh you mean the elves! I've lived apart from them so long that I no longer see them as my people." So he clearly doesn't see modem elves as "true elves" I think refers to the Dalish "children playing pretend" or something like that. In quest that locks the Inquisitor/Sera romance he says "Sera is as much elf as I am a horse!" So I think it's safe to say that Solas doesn't have high opinion of modern elves.
I love the fact that Solas is so genocidal that he thinks the elves, and only the elves, who remain "might" find it better. The man just loves killing those flat ears and dur'gen'len so much he won't care if the elves hate his choices.
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mousestalker
Inactive Moderator
ღ The Untitled
Just here for the cosplay
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Post by mousestalker on Aug 26, 2021 14:56:10 GMT
No real world politics, please.
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Post by gervaise21 on Aug 26, 2021 14:57:20 GMT
Ameridan confirms that the elves had an alliance with Drakon that they chose not to honor. They never explained that one. On the one hand he says they think Drakon is "no better than Tevinter". On the other, he maintains they had an alliance with him. What alliance? There had never been any suggestion of that before, even by the Chantry. If they had actually had an alliance with Drakon, wouldn't the Chantry have used that as yet more propaganda against the Dalish? Yet, there was nothing until Ameridan mentions it in JoH. Was the alliance some sort of agreement they came to so the Dalish would continue to ignore human affairs and not ally with Drakon's rivals when he was going around killing them? Again, the lack of any suggestion of this prior to JoH seems to be another example of ignoring previous lack of information to paint the Dalish in the worst possible light.
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