Beerfish
N7
Little Pumpkin
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Mass Effect Andromeda, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Origin: Beerfish
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Post by Beerfish on Dec 28, 2021 17:47:27 GMT
I just hope the first aliens we meet have tentacles, like they just have to have tentacles.
(Okay I liked the movie 'Arrival')
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Post by Giant Ambush Beetle on Dec 29, 2021 1:54:52 GMT
I just hope the first aliens we meet have tentacles, like they just have to have tentacles.
(Okay I liked the movie 'Arrival')
You old perv you, I had no idea you were into hentai! Anyway, to those that say we're definitely not alone, I want to mention the timescales the Universe operates at. Humans have existed for around 1.2 million years, galaxies started to form 13-14 billions ago, and according to various theories (big inflation, heat death etc.) the universe will continue to exist in a way that allows energy to flow and complex life forms to exist for another many more billions of years. Its absolutely and perfectly possible that RIGHT NOW we're the only ones out there and tons of intelligent species have existed and simply perished or have yet to exist, or that we are the first ones. Maybe at this very moment some intelligent species is born, who knows? Also, far far in the future there will be a last intelligent species as well, witnessing the end of a habitable universe (if they don't manage to destroy themselves before), which is a quite chilling thought.
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Post by mybudgee on Jan 6, 2022 19:02:54 GMT
So between the enormous amount of likely Near-Earth worlds out there & the huge void of evidence for ETs, something has gotta give soon ... I hope
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Post by rewindbutton on Jan 7, 2022 11:17:47 GMT
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Post by q5tyhj on Jan 9, 2022 2:03:45 GMT
I fear that most civilizations destroy themselves, before they reach the level of space-faring technology that is required for interstellar travel. Yeah, this. I suspect that the answer to the Fermi Paradox is that there are several development bottlenecks ("Great Filter"), from abiogenesis to the evolution of intelligence and technology, and that ultimately once a species develops world/species-threatening technology (atomic weapons, the capacity for catastrophic/runaway climate change, biological weapons, etc) its almost certainly only a matter of time before they wipe themselves out, since it seems clear from our own technological development that the capacity to end life on our planet is easier to achieve than the capacity to leave the planet and sustain colonies off-world (let alone interstellar travel). So I suspect advanced technological/intelligent life to be extremely rare, but life in some form to be relatively common and abundant (here's hoping the James Webb Space Telescope can actually detect biosignatures on exoplanets, its a serious possibility that we discover compelling evidence of alien life some time in the near future). I'm even hopeful we'll discover life in our own system- I'm definitely on the Team Europa bandwagon. We already know from studying Earth organisms that life can thrive in extreme environments, and it seems like life develops pretty fast once the situation is suitable (it may even be that life arose twice, independently, here on Earth).
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Post by rewindbutton on Jan 10, 2022 15:25:54 GMT
the capacity to end life on our planet is easier to achieve than the capacity to leave the planet Well this. And you definitely need to leave the cradle sooner or later.
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Post by Gwydden on Jan 10, 2022 17:44:24 GMT
Does life exist elsewhere in the universe? Probably. Does intelligent life? Quite possibly. Will we ever meet them? Nope. I'm pretty sure interstellar travel is impossible or at best so utterly impractical as to make no difference. Earth and humanity are all we got, for better or worse.
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Beerfish
N7
Little Pumpkin
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Mass Effect Andromeda, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Origin: Beerfish
XBL Gamertag: Beerfish77
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Post by Beerfish on Jan 10, 2022 18:34:21 GMT
Does life exist elsewhere in the universe? Probably. Does intelligent life? Quite possibly. Will we ever meet them? Nope. I'm pretty sure interstellar travel is impossible or at best so utterly impractical as to make no difference. Earth and humanity are all we got, for better or worse. We may never meet them and they may never meet us but I think at some point definitive proof of other civilizations will be found.
Whether we find something from someone else or someone else finds something from us.
At some point a probe or exploration craft or radio waves of something else will be found.
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Post by Giant Ambush Beetle on Jan 10, 2022 21:08:26 GMT
Also there is another bummer scenario - what if intelligent alien life does exist but most species do not have access to resources and minerals required to develop advanced technologies? Imagine very intelligent life underwater, I do not think it would have the ability to mine, smelt, refine and transform minerals into materials absolutely necessary for technology. It would be basically stuck in the stone age even if it had an IQ of 300, workable limbs and a will to explore the universe.
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Post by B. Hieronymus Da on Jan 11, 2022 1:02:45 GMT
Also there is another bummer scenario - what if intelligent alien life does exist but most species do not have access to resources and minerals required to develop advanced technologies? Imagine very intelligent life underwater, I do not think it would have the ability to mine, smelt, refine and transform minerals into materials absolutely necessary for technology. It would be basically stuck in the stone age even if it had an IQ of 300, workable limbs and a will to explore the universe. Well, we have that case here on our own Earth. There are a number of animals we have to consider 'intelligent'. Various experiments put Gorillas' and Chimpanzees' intellectual capabilities in the order of around a 12 year old child. Similar experiments with Crows, Ravens, Parakites and Parrots, suggest their intellectual capabilities are also in the 7 to 12 year range. Then there are Racoons... Crows, btw, is one of extremely few animals that can manufacture tools that they use. The skill has to be learned and transferred inside the flock. And that is a thing that should be considered whenever hunters propose to exterminate a flock of Crows. That flock has a collective heritage of knowledge that could be crucial for the individual Crows' ability to survive. Same with Whales, Orcas and Dolphins. Even if we have great difficulty in understanding them, their intellectual capacity is probably great, and I think it's safe to assume that they have a collective heritage of knowledge. And they probably also has some kind of communication that serves the same purpose as our speech, transfer of ideas. And if you have that, then you can internalize that in order to structure and fix your ideas better, think better. But their intelligence is captured inside a bubble of what can interest them. Food, mating, water, places, navigating. And that is limiting. They'll never come up with math, chemistry or physics. Aquatic Intelligent species will never form technical civilizations. They will always live as animals. As you said, they have no access to the materials and processes which that requires, even if they have limbs that can manipulate things (like an octopus has, for instance). Why did humans? Humans are the product of an extreme evolutionary process, which is totally fused with weapons and tools. Weapons primarily. The ability to make and use Tools is just a byproduct of making and using weapons. The animal Human, is not complete without a made weapon, and that animal evolved with that, and could never exist without it. And without making weapons and tools, you can probably never acquire an understanding of natural laws and all that. And even then, your civilization maybe never transcends a point. Humans developed large organized civilizations that lasted thousands of years, Egypt, in India, in China, in Mesopotamia, In and around the Mediterranean. Thousand of years in close to stasis, never progressing further, locked in traditions and social order. Most of the advance of human technical and social civilization have occurred in only a few, recent hundreds of years. When I was younger, I used to believe this was a natural progression, that one thing begat another, etc. Like a ladder of progression. I no longer believe it's that simple, natural or inevitable. Rather, it seems to me, the natural order is that human societies, civilizations, form traditions and a social order, which they then adhere to, statically, unchanging. Europe actually went mostly backwards for a thousand years, from 300 to 1300. It sort of paraphrases natural evolution of species. They don't change either, once they've taken a form that allows them a stable existence. What happened in Europe that changed that? I don't know, but one of my favorite candidates as the igniting 'spark' of events, is the Black Death.
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Post by q5tyhj on Jan 11, 2022 22:54:05 GMT
Does life exist elsewhere in the universe? Probably. Does intelligent life? Quite possibly. Will we ever meet them? Nope. I'm pretty sure interstellar travel is impossible or at best so utterly impractical as to make no difference. Earth and humanity are all we got, for better or worse. We may never meet them and they may never meet us but I think at some point definitive proof of other civilizations will be found.
Whether we find something from someone else or someone else finds something from us.
At some point a probe or exploration craft or radio waves of something else will be found.
I mean, this could plausibly happen in the very near future- as in, the next few years. One of the goals for the James Webb Space Telescope (the $10 billion dollar successor to Hubble that was just launched a couple weeks ago) is to use transmission spectroscopy to search exoplanets (possibly even exo-moons?) for chemical signatures of life ("biosignatures"). Physicists and astrobiologists are already writing papers on the subject. So our first detection of alien life will quite possibly, maybe even probably, come in the form of a blip on a graph, basically. (that sounds like sort of a downer but its actually genuinely amazing- we might have strong evidence for the existence of alien life in the next few years!)
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Post by Deleted on Jan 12, 2022 7:22:31 GMT
Imagine if we found evidence of a stellar mega-structure in the next couple years. Dyson's “Sphere”, systems of suns impossible to naturally occur, massive FTL trail forming while we watch. Something big and and easily verified.
...something big that also makes it very clear they’re more advanced than us. Way more. Brick shitting time. Could be useful, cohesive.
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Post by Giant Ambush Beetle on Jan 12, 2022 11:51:40 GMT
Imagine if we found evidence of a stellar mega-structure in the next couple years. Dyson's “Sphere”, systems of suns impossible to naturally occur, massive FTL trail forming while we watch. Something big and and easily verified. ...something big that also makes it very clear they’re more advanced than us. Way more. Brick shitting time. Could be useful, cohesive. All the religious nutjobs would crawl out of the woodwork and would go crazy because if there is a species that is doing better mankind is clearly no longer the favored species of their god(s) which causes all kinds of contradictions and proves all kinds of ancient texts wrong. Next, those businesses that build those doomsday shelters and bunkers would have to work overtime for the next 50 years or so.
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Post by Pounce de León on Jan 12, 2022 17:32:03 GMT
Imagine if we found evidence of a stellar mega-structure in the next couple years. Dyson's “Sphere”, systems of suns impossible to naturally occur, massive FTL trail forming while we watch. Something big and and easily verified. ...something big that also makes it very clear they’re more advanced than us. Way more. Brick shitting time. Could be useful, cohesive. All the religious nutjobs would crawl out of the woodwork and would go crazy because if there is a species that is doing better mankind is clearly no longer the favored species of their god(s) which causes all kinds of contradictions and proves all kinds of ancient texts wrong. Next, those businesses that build those doomsday shelters and bunkers would have to work overtime for the next 50 years or so. Fear could lead to further rise of autocratic rule, impeding progress and rather stfling research or outrigjt regression when paired with wars when the strong autocracies clash.
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Post by Vortex13 on Jan 13, 2022 16:57:23 GMT
Imagine if we found evidence of a stellar mega-structure in the next couple years. Dyson's “Sphere”, systems of suns impossible to naturally occur, massive FTL trail forming while we watch. Something big and and easily verified. ...something big that also makes it very clear they’re more advanced than us. Way more. Brick shitting time. Could be useful, cohesive. All the religious nutjobs would crawl out of the woodwork and would go crazy because if there is a species that is doing better mankind is clearly no longer the favored species of their god(s) which causes all kinds of contradictions and proves all kinds of ancient texts wrong. Next, those businesses that build those doomsday shelters and bunkers would have to work overtime for the next 50 years or so. I never understood this predicted outcome but then again I figure I'm fairly weird compared to most people haha. As a Christian myself I have pondered the idea of humanity encountering alien life and I have come to the following conclusion: I've never attributed the human form to be something that makes us God's unique creation; especially since the human form can come in many different shapes and sizes. When the Bible says we (humans) are made in the image of God I always took that to mean that, like God, we are creating spirits. The will and drive humans had to plant a flag on the moon is a reflection of the same drive that made God say "Let There Be Light". So if what makes us unique is that drive to create and to be aware of the universe around us, then an alien species would likewise be made in the image of God. And if said aliens are more advanced than humanity technologically that's no different than how the European settlers were more technologically advanced than the Native Americans as faith isn't based on how advanced the sciences are. That also wouldn't change the belief that God sent salvation for mankind either. I mean, if that were the case then why would those Native Americans, or even the Europeans be eligible to be saved if Jesus was crucified outside Jerusalem? If the distance of the continents and oceans doesn't matter then the gulf of space wouldn't either; especially since God created both. As for my personal opinion to the subject of there being alien life outside Earth: I believe there is. The universe is too vast and varied to not be inhabited. To tie it back to my faith, the Bible says God is life. And God is out there in the universe. It wouldn't impact my faith one way or the other to discover that we are not alone in the universe.
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Inactive Moderator
ღ The Untitled
Just here for the cosplay
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Post by mousestalker on Jan 13, 2022 17:11:00 GMT
I doubt we are the only intelligent life in the universe. My own personal theory, lacking any evidence to the contrary, is that our solar system is the Galactic equivalent of the pariah table in the middle school cafeteria. But we'll show them all. We'll go the Prom anyway, and then they'll be sorry.
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Beerfish
N7
Little Pumpkin
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Mass Effect Andromeda, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by Beerfish on Jan 13, 2022 17:44:10 GMT
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Post by DragonKingReborn on Jan 13, 2022 23:12:35 GMT
I doubt we are the only intelligent life in the universe. My own personal theory, lacking any evidence to the contrary, is that our solar system is the Galactic equivalent of the pariah table in the middle school cafeteria. But we'll show them all. We'll go the Prom anyway, and then they'll be sorry. Turians and Asari be like;
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Post by Phantom on Jan 13, 2022 23:41:23 GMT
All the religious nutjobs would crawl out of the woodwork and would go crazy because if there is a species that is doing better mankind is clearly no longer the favored species of their god(s) which causes all kinds of contradictions and proves all kinds of ancient texts wrong. Next, those businesses that build those doomsday shelters and bunkers would have to work overtime for the next 50 years or so. I never understood this predicted outcome but then again I figure I'm fairly weird compared to most people haha. As a Christian myself I have pondered the idea of humanity encountering alien life and I have come to the following conclusion: I've never attributed the human form to be something that makes us God's unique creation; especially since the human form can come in many different shapes and sizes. When the Bible says we (humans) are made in the image of God I always took that to mean that, like God, we are creating spirits. The will and drive humans had to plant a flag on the moon is a reflection of the same drive that made God say "Let There Be Light". So if what makes us unique is that drive to create and to be aware of the universe around us, then an alien species would likewise be made in the image of God. And if said aliens are more advanced than humanity technologically that's no different than how the European settlers were more technologically advanced than the Native Americans as faith isn't based on how advanced the sciences are. That also wouldn't change the belief that God sent salvation for mankind either. I mean, if that were the case then why would those Native Americans, or even the Europeans be eligible to be saved if Jesus was crucified outside Jerusalem? If the distance of the continents and oceans doesn't matter then the gulf of space wouldn't either; especially since God created both. As for my personal opinion to the subject of there being alien life outside Earth: I believe there is. The universe is too vast and varied to not be inhabited. To tie it back to my faith, the Bible says God is life. And God is out there in the universe. It wouldn't impact my faith one way or the other to discover that we are not alone in the universe. You are normal. Religion only concerns itself with Humanity and only Humanity and anything else That is God's duty, not theirs.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 14, 2022 1:22:43 GMT
I doubt we are the only intelligent life in the universe. My own personal theory, lacking any evidence to the contrary, is that our solar system is the Galactic equivalent of the pariah table in the middle school cafeteria. But we'll show them all. We'll go the Prom anyway, and then they'll be sorry. IIRC, we actually are in the middle of a bit of a void relative to our more dense neighbours in Laniakea.
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Post by ergates on Jan 14, 2022 18:13:04 GMT
Interesting question.
The only viable answer to the question: 'what could be out there?' when a near-infinite universe is taken into consideration is 'anything'.
So certainly, there will be life elsewhere in the universe because the statistical probability of us being alone in the universe among the mega-quadrillions of galaxies, each containing mega-quadrillions of star systems etc. etc. is as mathematically close to zero as to make little difference - to all intents and purposes it may as well be zero.
The key (and perhaps more pertinent) question is: 'Has Earth ever been visited by aliens?'
Personally I find this far less likely, given the usual limiting factors of travel across the distances involved. Even if a race existed out there who had managed to overcome these challenges via whatever means, wormhole generation, warp technology.. whatever.. it seems hard to imagine they'd be interested in an obscure, super-primitive backwater planet like Earth. It would be like us going out of our way to visit a colony of bacteria in Tristan da Cunha.
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Post by Giant Ambush Beetle on Jan 14, 2022 21:21:02 GMT
It would be like us going out of our way to visit a colony of bacteria in Tristan da Cunha. Which sounds pretty interesting to me though, we still learn a lot of bacteria and really remote places are awesome for a number of reasons. Recently we found a new fungi species completely encased in artic ice. Remote. Primitive. SUPER INTERESTING. I think an advanced intelligent race would be mostly driven by logics, and the most logical thing there basically is is gathering as much information about your environment as you can (exploration). More information = good. Always. No matter how insignificant the data you collect may be, if it does not draw too much energy / resources so that other priorities would need to be dropped or neglected exploration is a good thing. Even gathering data about the most mundane of life forms in some super far away place. So I think it makes perfect sense to steadily create drones that collect data of all kinds of stuff throughout the universe which maybe even send the data back in real-time via quantum entangled information (if thats possible).
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Post by AngryFrozenWater on Jan 24, 2022 17:57:32 GMT
A lot of great points have been made in this thread. What interests me is how long does the average civilization exist before it destroys itself or will be destroyed by a natural disaster (either on the planet itself or by a threat from space, like an asteroid, rogue planet or supernova nearby). And when does it start? It takes time before a civilization starts and not all start at the same time. So chances are that some have already vanished and some will start in the future. That diminishes the chance that we find one now. Sabine Hossenfelder has made an interesting video about how we search for alien life. Current and Upcoming Searches for Extraterrestrial Life - Sabine Hossenfelder.
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