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Post by Lorn on Jan 11, 2018 6:21:34 GMT
Total War takes a trip to China! Safe to say I feel some hype. Was the one area I really wanted the franchise to visit and especially this era in China So what part of the Three Kingdoms is this game supposed to be taking place in? The Coalition against Dong Zhou occurred in ~190 which is 30 years before the Three Kingdoms even began (Wu, Shu, and Wei). Are they going to go back to having a victory conditions being based on a set year? Edit: On further consideration, why are they focusing on (presumably) Yuan Shao or Sun Jian, Dong Zhou, Liu Bei, Zhang Fei, and Guan Yu instead of the real hero Cao Cao? A man who lost at least two generations of troops in a single battle (supposedly) and still managed to end up essentially on top. Besides a handful of others they're really the only ones that were even present during the Coalition to even see the beginning of the Three Kingdoms Era (220). Lu Bu would be a "Legendary Lord" for about 20 years, and that's still 20 years short of the actual period!
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Post by Pounce de León on Jan 11, 2018 13:22:46 GMT
So what part of the Three Kingdoms is this game supposed to be taking place in? The Coalition against Dong Zhou occurred in ~190 which is 30 years before the Three Kingdoms even began (Wu, Shu, and Wei). Are they going to go back to having a victory conditions being based on a set year? Edit: On further consideration, why are they focusing on (presumably) Yuan Shao or Sun Jian, Dong Zhou, Liu Bei, Zhang Fei, and Guan Yu instead of the real hero Cao Cao? A man who lost at least two generations of troops in a single battle (supposedly) and still managed to end up essentially on top. Besides a handful of others they're really the only ones that were even present during the Coalition to even see the beginning of the Three Kingdoms Era (220). Lu Bu would be a "Legendary Lord" for about 20 years, and that's still 20 years short of the actual period! Arch thinks that this might be an historical game only in a very limited sense. Personally I know very little about the period, all I can say is that the trailer looks cool... I think I played one of the Koei games about that era. Even liked it. If CA put the effort and art talent in like in Shogun 2 it won't really matter if you don't know about the time beforehand.
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Post by Pounce de León on Jan 11, 2018 13:55:09 GMT
I think I played one of the Koei games about that era. Even liked it. If CA put the effort and art talent in like in Shogun 2 it won't really matter if you don't know about the time beforehand. Certainly possible. Though tbh I will likely prefer Warhammer, with the monsters and magic and heroes and different races. Just like I'd prefer a Sci-Fi title in most cases over a game about modern combat, be it shooters or strategy games, not that you can't tell a good story or make a fun game it's just too limited IMO. The possibilities are greater, yes. However, somehow the whole Warhammer fantasy setting didn't appeal to me at all. I played a fair share of the futuristic Warhammer. Forgot the name, but it kinda went downhill for my taste. Though, WH orcs are funny, I'm just satiated with the standard elf, dwarf, orc + human lineup.
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Post by Vortex13 on Jan 11, 2018 14:47:15 GMT
I'm rather indifferent to the Three Kingdoms era of Chinese history; and I've personally played enough Dynasty Warriors to get my video game fix of that time period to last a lifetime But I'm always happy to see new content coming out to reflect different interests of a very diverse fanbase. I may not have a desire to play this new game, but I know others who will so I won't begrudge them their entertainment. Really though this is good news, with CA and Total War moving to ancient China the likelyhood of seeing the Chinese themed Ogre Kingdoms in Total War: Warhammer just increased exponentially
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NO ONE lies to The Meat Man!
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Post by Babar Guy on Jan 11, 2018 18:14:10 GMT
I'm rather indifferent to the Three Kingdoms era of Chinese history; and I've personally played enough Dynasty Warriors to get my video game fix of that time period to last a lifetime But I'm always happy to see new content coming out to reflect different interests of a very diverse fanbase. I may not have a desire to play this new game, but I know others who will so I won't begrudge them their entertainment. Really though this is good news, with CA and Total War moving to ancient China the likelyhood of seeing the Chinese themed Ogre Kingdoms in Total War: Warhammer just increased exponentially I figured the Ogre Kingdoms would be almost guaranteed no matter what for the third game. There's not that many big factions left for them to add, especially since the main campaign for game 3 would be limited to an area of unknown size to the east of where the joined campaign map currently cuts off. They'll need the Ogre Kingdoms to be one of the big, headlining factions to sell that.
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Post by Lorn on Jan 11, 2018 18:30:26 GMT
So what part of the Three Kingdoms is this game supposed to be taking place in? The Coalition against Dong Zhou occurred in ~190 which is 30 years before the Three Kingdoms even began (Wu, Shu, and Wei). Are they going to go back to having a victory conditions being based on a set year? Edit: On further consideration, why are they focusing on (presumably) Yuan Shao or Sun Jian, Dong Zhou, Liu Bei, Zhang Fei, and Guan Yu instead of the real hero Cao Cao? A man who lost at least two generations of troops in a single battle (supposedly) and still managed to end up essentially on top. Besides a handful of others they're really the only ones that were even present during the Coalition to even see the beginning of the Three Kingdoms Era (220). Lu Bu would be a "Legendary Lord" for about 20 years, and that's still 20 years short of the actual period! Arch thinks that this might be an historical game only in a very limited sense. Personally I know very little about the period, all I can say is that the trailer looks cool... Well if it is based on the Romance of the Three Kingdoms fictitious book (like most of the games in the era) I can guarantee you it isn't based on history.
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Post by Vortex13 on Jan 11, 2018 18:41:17 GMT
I'm rather indifferent to the Three Kingdoms era of Chinese history; and I've personally played enough Dynasty Warriors to get my video game fix of that time period to last a lifetime But I'm always happy to see new content coming out to reflect different interests of a very diverse fanbase. I may not have a desire to play this new game, but I know others who will so I won't begrudge them their entertainment. Really though this is good news, with CA and Total War moving to ancient China the likelyhood of seeing the Chinese themed Ogre Kingdoms in Total War: Warhammer just increased exponentially I figured the Ogre Kingdoms would be almost guaranteed no matter what for the third game. There's not that many big factions left for them to add, especially since the main campaign for game 3 would be limited to an area of unknown size to the east of where the joined campaign map currently cuts off. They'll need the Ogre Kingdoms to be one of the big, headlining factions to sell that. I hope that's the case, I really don't want game three's vanilla races to just be the four facets of Chaos divided. If not the Ogre Kingdoms then I guess then that Cathy, the Chinese human empire in Warhammer, will have a better chance of making it into the game because of the new Total War title then.
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Post by CHRrOME on Jan 11, 2018 20:48:40 GMT
TW China? Nice, was one of the settings I wanted, although I know nothing at all about the period of the Three Kingdoms or anything else for that matter... Can someone give me a TL;DR about the announcement? is it the new historical title or another saga? I'm currently not at home and the internet here is dog-shit tier, and I'll be damned if I have to "wait" to watch a simple video in 480p, I'll watch the trailer when I'm at home.
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Post by Obsidian Gryphon on Jan 12, 2018 1:53:29 GMT
Nice! Three Kingdoms.
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Post by Arijon van Goyen on Jan 12, 2018 8:47:33 GMT
Cool vids
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NO ONE lies to The Meat Man!
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Post by Babar Guy on Jan 22, 2018 13:41:12 GMT
Gonna have to wait for my mods to get updated before I start a Tomb Kings campaign, but I'm probably also going for Settra or Arkhan to begin with, because that area of the map is the least familiar to me so it'll feel fresh. Khatep is sadly off the table for a while because I've spent so much time in that corner of the map already recently playing both Mazdamundi and Morathi.
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Post by Vortex13 on Jan 22, 2018 14:04:29 GMT
I was thinking Khatep, because I tend to like casters, but Setrra/Arkahan does look tempting.
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Post by Vortex13 on Jan 22, 2018 14:50:43 GMT
I was thinking Khatep, because I tend to like casters, but Setrra/Arkahan does look tempting. Aside from Khalida, all of them are casters. It's just that Settra and Arkhan are also decent in melee. (Settra is actually rather good) Yeah but isn't Khatep the only one with the new lore? I'll admit, being a castor that can slug it out in melee would be amazing though.
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Post by Vortex13 on Jan 22, 2018 15:25:17 GMT
In regard to Settra, I think that there's little point in using his unique mount (the Chariot of the Gods) when the one before it is a necrosphinx... Yeah, a chariot seems like a downgrade from that
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Post by Vortex13 on Jan 22, 2018 15:35:31 GMT
Yeah, a chariot seems like a downgrade from that I suppose that having him on his chariot leading a few other chariot units in a rear charge would look rather awesome...
Yeah but wouldn't Arkahan be better for that since he has a flying chariot?
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Post by Vortex13 on Jan 22, 2018 15:40:20 GMT
Yeah but wouldn't Arkahan be better for that since he has a flying chariot? Hmmm... that's a good point, but Arkhan's chariot doesn't have cool blue flames trailing after it... Na, just heavy metal purple
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Post by Babar Guy on Jan 22, 2018 16:08:39 GMT
Gonna have to wait for my mods to get updated before I start a Tomb Kings campaign, but I'm probably also going for Settra or Arkhan to begin with, because that area of the map is the least familiar to me so it'll feel fresh. Khatep is sadly off the table for a while because I've spent so much time in that corner of the map already recently playing both Mazdamundi and Morathi. Are you using Radius by any chance? I wonder how long it would take them to do their thing. Probably awhile. I might do one play through without mods.
Nah, got a bit tired of Radious' way of doing things back in Rome 2 although I did play it for quite some time before. Kinda made the factions lose their identity when everyone had a wide selection of every unit type ranging from meatshield trash to elite destroyers of worlds. I'm assuming Radious has kept the same style for WH/WH2, in which case it's not for me. Plus I did read something about him adding a bunch of not just lore inaccurate units, but stuff that outright contradicts the lore. I'm using a bunch of smaller mods to get the experience I enjoy, like KAM 2150's combat rebalance and camera mods, the campaign settlement pack(s), immersive battle banners, tier 4 minor settlements, a vampire counts reskin to make them a bit more spoopy, home region movement bonus, varied generals, rebanner... I'd also like to use Dryrain's reskins for all the factions, but I've found that while the impact for my battle performance is negligible, they add way too much to my loading times both into battles and back into the campaign map afterwards for me to bother with them (I'm assuming due to far more detailed textures being used and having to be loaded than in vanilla). The default skins for the factions are good enough though that I'm not that bothered.
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Post by Babar Guy on Jan 22, 2018 16:26:52 GMT
In regard to Settra, I think that there's little point in using his unique mount (the Chariot of the Gods) when the one before it is a necrosphinx... I think the two are meant for different roles. If you just want him to wade into melee and beast out a ton of kills in a prolonged melee engagement, the sphinx is the way to go. The chariot ought to let him rip through infantry lines and skirmishers by cycling charges over and over and/or pulling him through a unit after you land your charge, but will require more micro and won't be all that great if you get bogged down in a stationary melee fight. Besides, in campaign you can just switch between the two on the campaign map at will on a short cooldown, so you can have him on whichever mount makes the most sense at the time. Or just go on foot for something like a siege battle.
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Post by Vortex13 on Jan 22, 2018 19:03:21 GMT
Here's a cool match. It was close, really close... Yeah, the Ushabti have to be the coolest unit in the Tomb King roster for me
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Post by Vortex13 on Jan 24, 2018 15:17:13 GMT
So here's an update: I'm playing as Arkhan the Black, and I must say that so far the Tomb Kings are more than a little challenging. Fighting against the Dawi with basic units is the absolute worst. At least with Bretonia having access to the lore of Death makes them fairly trivial, all you need to do is snipe the leader with Spirit Leech, and they basically break on the spot. (if not you can help them on their way with some Doom and Darkness...) My Tomb Scorpion is basically the backbone of the army, with all other units serving as barely more than chaff. When it comes to Realm of Souls (healing and resurrection) triggering based on your losses, I'd say it's not even close to comparable to the Vampires and their Invocation of Nahak. It COULD have been worth it if the Ushabti you can summon don't degrade as fast as they do, but considering the speed in which summoned units degrade, you can do very little with a single unit of Ushabti. Still, I'm enjoying playing them for now. I believe there's several mods that remove the degrading effect from summoned units. As for the tomb kings legendary choices, is Arkhan the Black and Setra the Imperishable flat out better than Khatep, in your opinion? I know that Khatep is supposed to be the caster LL, but by the sound of things Arkhan and Setra get better melee stats on top of getting all the cool new spells. I haven't been able to start my own campaign yet, so I am trying to decide which of the three lords is worth it.
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NO ONE lies to The Meat Man!
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Post by Babar Guy on Jan 24, 2018 18:09:32 GMT
Outside of Ushabti, I believe the intended purpose for pretty much all of the Tomb King infantry, including the higher tier ones, is to just hold the enemy in place and keep them busy while your chariots and constructs do the killing. Saurus Warriors they are not
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Post by Obsidian Gryphon on Apr 29, 2018 6:24:20 GMT
Watching Thrones of Britannia gameplay. It's not bad but I'm in seeing Vikings moving about in disciplined formations like the Romans. Diplomacy aka classic Rome is back. A.I. is wanting though, none too intelligent.
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Post by CHRrOME on May 1, 2018 20:24:47 GMT
Watching Thrones of Britannia gameplay. It's not bad but I'm in seeing Vikings moving about in disciplined formations like the Romans. Diplomacy aka classic Rome is back. A.I. is wanting though, none too intelligent. Ye.. I've been following ToB for some time. And it has its ups and downs, but having Rome II animations still after all this time is a bit tiresome, like a bit too much. Units just look like reskins, and being someone who actually saw WH gameplay... every unit in that game has their own unique animation, every single last one. Historical tittles always have a few base animations shared across all factions. You can't tell me Romans fought the same as Persians, or Norsmen, or Gallic tribes... although there might've been some similarities in combat styles, it just feels like Creative Assembly being lazy. I was hoping for WH to set a precedent for all upcoming titles in the animation department... it remains to be seen if 3 Kingdoms will have custom animations for all factions. Settlements are great though, I believe those are the most diverse, well designed, and detailed settlements they've ever done, a single one equals like 4 Attila settlements together in size. The campaign map is more detailed also, although that really means little when the mechanics haven't changed much. All in all, game does look interesting, but the price tag ? ... eh.. I dunno. I feel like the game will be great for Multiplayer (which honestly I don't care), but for campaign it'll end up being more of the same sooner or later, unfortunately.
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Post by Babar Guy on May 1, 2018 20:42:11 GMT
I'm pretty sure there's a correlation between the level of detail on settlements and the level of detail and variety in unit rosters and animations. Vanilla Warhammer has generally very simple maps (especially when you compare siege maps from what I've seen of Thrones), but there they've focused a huge amount of attention and resources on the unit rosters of each faction and their animations. Historical titles are obviously never going to have such a huge variety as one faction bringing giant dinosaurs, another with skeleton chariots and living statues and a third with hordes of man-sized rats and giant cannons that shoot sort-of-lasers, so they can allocate more resources into making the maps more engaging and diverse. Granted, even with a setting like Thrones where I doubt the units each of these factions fielded IRL were all that different from one another, they could probably find a better balance of differentiating them both visually and in terms of animations etc. with map design.
Though if I had to choose for WH3 between the two, I'd in a heartbeat go for as detailed or even more detailed factions and rosters as the previous two games over getting simpler rosters but better siege maps.
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NO ONE lies to The Meat Man!
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Post by Babar Guy on May 1, 2018 20:52:48 GMT
And I'm now in the middle of my first ever Skaven campaign in WH2 as Queek. He's a goddamn BEAST, but the true MVP's of the campaign thus far (and it's not even close) are the Plagueclaw Catapults. Those things are insanely good. Singlehandedly turned things around for my armies of mostly Clanrat variants once they became available. A couple of those per army were all the difference I needed to make the Lothern Sea Guard spam I faced from those High Elf minor factions not just bearable, but fairly easily beatable. Kroq-Gar's Saurus stacks haven't done much better, though they do cause quite a bit of damage once they reach my line of poor rats before they die. That first lightning spell that you start with in the lore of Ruin on both Grey Seers and the engineers is pretty amazing on engaged infantry formations for how spammable it is. Between that one spell and my artillery, Clanrats are a very cost-effective infantry line to just hold the enemy with while my other units do the killing.
Not really a huge fan of the food mechanic they have though, I'm constantly in the red, but it could just be that I've been expanding too slowly and/or not taking the right settlements yet to help with that.
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