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Post by Hier0phant on Dec 4, 2019 17:58:25 GMT
Do you know how many banks i could rob if i had an army of savage gremlins, and with all of them having the force potential of yoda?
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Post by Iakus on Dec 4, 2019 18:09:22 GMT
Do you know how many banks i could rob if i had an army of savage gremlins, and with all of them having the force potential of yoda? Gremlins would have been a very different movie if Stripe was a Sith Lord...
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Post by AnDromedary on Dec 4, 2019 18:58:21 GMT
Done with Rebels. I was a bit disappointed that the rebels just had X-Wings at the end. I was really hoping to see how they acquired them. I was half expecting them to be the super secret new fighters that the empire built on Lothal and that the rebels would steal them somehow but alas, it wasn't that way. But whatever, I did really enjoy this series, especially given that it's animated, which I usually don't really like that much. So thumbs up for that one. Then watched Rogue One. Still my favorite SW movie, right behind Empire. Really love that movie and IMO it's proof that Disney can do it right as well. Then watched A New Hope. Ah, the nostalgia. The movie really holds up well. Even when viewed back to back with a modern CGI production like R1, Ep4's special effects kinda still look cool. The only thing that seems a bit silly is the Vader-Kenobi light saber duel. That just seems out of place after getting used to how force users fight in the newer productions. (I do like this remake, that someone made, obviously some SFX are subpar but for a fan made video, it's very impressive) One has to admit though, that Ep4 also is not exactly a pinnacle of story telling (at least IMO). While the action stuff and SFX are really great, a lot of the dialogue and character moments are rather odd. I kinda forgot how much Mark Hamill screeches in this movie. And especially Luke's 1 minute of complete sorrow for Kenobi's death, before he goes right back to normal seems odd. So I guess what I'm saying is that yes, the old movies were fantastic and Ep4 gets extra points for being the original work and for doing a fantastic job with the world building and stuff but from an objective point of view, also the old movies were far from perfect. And while I agree the TLJ was indeed a dumpster fire, I don't think TFA, Rogue 1 or even the Solo movie were actually that bad within the SW franchise, all things considered. Now you may flay me alive for my blasphemous thoughts.
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Post by docsteely on Dec 4, 2019 19:59:40 GMT
Done with Rebels. I was a bit disappointed that the rebels just had X-Wings at the end. I was really hoping to see how they acquired them. I was half expecting them to be the super secret new fighters that the empire built on Lothal and that the rebels would steal them somehow but alas, it wasn't that way. But whatever, I did really enjoy this series, especially given that it's animated, which I usually don't really like that much. So thumbs up for that one. Then watched Rogue One. Still my favorite SW movie, right behind Empire. Really love that movie and IMO it's proof that Disney can do it right as well. Then watched A New Hope. Ah, the nostalgia. The movie really holds up well. Even when viewed back to back with a modern CGI production like R1, Ep4's special effects kinda still look cool. The only thing that seems a bit silly is the Vader-Kenobi light saber duel. That just seems out of place after getting used to how force users fight in the newer productions. (I do like this remake, that someone made, obviously some SFX are subpar but for a fan made video, it's very impressive) One has to admit though, that Ep4 also is not exactly a pinnacle of story telling (at least IMO). While the action stuff and SFX are really great, a lot of the dialogue and character moments are rather odd. I kinda forgot how much Mark Hamill screeches in this movie. And especially Luke's 1 minute of complete sorrow for Kenobi's death, before he goes right back to normal seems odd. So I guess what I'm saying is that yes, the old movies were fantastic and Ep4 get extra point for being the original work and for doing a fantastic job with the world building and stuff but from an objective point of view, also the old movies were far from perfect. And while I agree the TLJ was indeed a dumpster fire, I don't think TFA, Rogue 1 or even the Solo movie were actually that bad within the SW franchise, all things considered. Now you may flay me alive for my blasphemous thoughts. Agreed about Rogue One (though I did not like Whitaker's take on Saw Gerrera), agreed even about Solo up to a point. But TFA? That scene where Leia just passes by Chewie, Han's friend and partner for a lifetime and goes on to hug Rey is painfully stupid at best. Not to mention Rey's "little" Force accidents which started in that movie... I admit though that I might have swallowed TFA if it had been followed by a good movie made by a decent human being. Unfortunately we know what came next.
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Post by mybudgee on Dec 4, 2019 20:30:34 GMT
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Post by mybudgee on Dec 4, 2019 20:40:48 GMT
No, but there's a minimum standard to be expected of a long standing successful franchise with multi-billion budget. ... After The Hobbit and Fantastic Beasts, not to mention the prequels a decade and a half ago, automatically expecting excellence from sequel or expanding trilogies made years after successful movie series is pretty silly, regardless of budget. In any case it's not worth complaining about forever. I can't believe it took fifteen years for every other sentence about Star Wars to be more than just bitching about the prequel trilogy being less than great. And that ridiculously over-the-top reaction definitely affected how this trilogy was approached. So that was great. Can we please please not do that again? It was annoying and embarrassing then and it's annoying and embarrassing now Whoa, comparing any of the moronic Harry Potter movies to Star Wars isn't a fair or reasonable one Also, it isn't the fans' fault the sequels are dogshit. It is the filmmaker's fault. Period Blaming the victim is not cool
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Post by aglomeracja on Dec 4, 2019 21:26:58 GMT
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Post by Noxluxe on Dec 4, 2019 22:11:49 GMT
Whoa, comparing any of the moronic Harry Potter movies to Star Wars isn't a fair or reasonable one Also, it isn't the fans' fault the sequels are dogshit. It is the filmmaker's fault. Period Blaming the victim is not cool I didn't compare them, I compared their budgets and success. And the idiocy of automatically expecting the same value walking into the theaters years and years later for a movie written and directed by completely different people using only a fraction of the material the originals worked off. George Lucas' imagination, in this instance. And then whining for two straight years upon being disappointed. Learn to adjust your expectations, "victim". Funny clip though.
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Post by masterwarderz on Dec 4, 2019 22:44:01 GMT
Whoa, comparing any of the moronic Harry Potter movies to Star Wars isn't a fair or reasonable one Also, it isn't the fans' fault the sequels are dogshit. It is the filmmaker's fault. Period Blaming the victim is not cool And then whining for two straight years upon being disappointed. Well not just whining if the box office takes for Solo are anything to go by...
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Post by Hier0phant on Dec 5, 2019 2:32:23 GMT
Do you know how many banks i could rob if i had an army of savage gremlins, and with all of them having the force potential of yoda? Gremlins would have been a very different movie if Stripe was a Sith Lord... "The sequence when the gremlins' ringleader used his psychic powers to pull the squadron of B-52 bombers out of sky is to date the most impressive display of visual effects since Star Wars Return of The Jedi..." - Random 1980s film critic
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Post by Sifr on Dec 5, 2019 7:48:22 GMT
But TFA? That scene where Leia just passes by Chewie, Han's friend and partner for a lifetime and goes on to hug Rey is painfully stupid at best. Not to mention Rey's "little" Force accidents which started in that movie...Have to agree about that moment, Rey getting that hug wasn't earned in the slightest. As for the random Force visions and "accidents" that Rey has in FTA, blame that on JJ being a hack writer who loves to create mysteries without any intention of ever solving it.
I have a feeling that the real reason TLJ put forth the idea that Rey was a "nobody" was because JJ had no clue and Rian figured that nipping that question in the bud would be easier than trying to manufacture an answer that no-one would like anyway. That's why I don't want Rise to undo it, because her being an unimportant nobody is so far the only interesting thing about her.
The other major issue with TFA is that Finn's character development makes no sense.
Finn doesn't want to kill anyone and gets traumatised by seeing a fellow Stormtrooper die in front of him... so he then become friends with the man who killed that Stormtrooper and proceeds to happily kill more fellow Stormtroopers?
Finn could have been way more interesting if he had been a loyal Stormtrooper that helped Poe escape as part of a plan by the First Order to try to infiltrate the Resistance, only for it to go awry as he's left stranded on Jakku with his only way-in to the Resistance seemingly dead. Then as the film goes on, his conditioning could have been shown to slowly chip away until he genuinely chose to defect and turns on his fellow Stormtroopers.
For fun, they could have had John Boyega use his native British accent while with the First Order, but had him affect the American accent in order to appear "more trustworthy" to the Resistance, as well as disguise his background as a Stormtrooper.
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Post by Hier0phant on Dec 6, 2019 3:06:11 GMT
The leaks turning out to be true confirms JJ's creative bankruptcy.
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Post by Iakus on Dec 6, 2019 19:16:35 GMT
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Post by Noxluxe on Dec 10, 2019 2:48:10 GMT
Every time the scene with Kylo spilling the beans about Rey's parents being "nobodies" comes up in videos about the movies, I get so confused. Not because I believe it for a minute, because I don't, but because it's such an unnatural place for that conversation to have gone, and people are always more caught up in what it might mean for Rey's force powers or whatever.
Like, are both Kylo Ren and Rey huge classists? She's a scavenger by profession and he's the son of a princess without a planet and a smuggler. Why would either of them place any importance on her parents' social status of all things? Her yearning to meet them again was set up as her needing to know that they loved her and that she wasn't as alone as she felt, not her needing to know that they were important people so she could feel important too.
Who waits dutifully for their mother and father to return for over a decade and is then satisfied to know that they were "filthy junk traders" and that they "sold you for drinking money" from such an obviously unreliable source? One at least sounds like it might be grounded in truth but the other is complete guesswork about their motives on his part even if he isn't just lying through his teeth.
Kylo apparently knew her parents. Why isn't she asking about her mother? If she was kind or smart or beautiful, if she looked like Rey or resembled her in any way? If her dad was good with tech like she is? If they traveled the stars like she wanted to? If either of them had the force like she does? How they lived their lives after abandoning her, or where they're buried so she can decide if she wants or needs to go pay her respects?
It reads like the writers decided to project all the fans' theorycrafting about Rey's backstory unto the characters and Rey should be disappointed about not coming from some great force lineage like the fans were supposed(?) to be, and that's all there was to the whole thing. At the cost of suddenly casting Rey - and Kylo - in a really weird and unflattering light in terms of how they view people who aren't heroes or royalty or force sensitive.
It makes Rey come off as an inexplicably arrogant girl who was waiting for an excuse to feel special rather than a young woman who profoundly misses people who meant everything to her before they suddenly disappeared, as she's presented in the first movie.
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Post by Hier0phant on Dec 10, 2019 4:10:46 GMT
Every time the scene with Kylo spilling the beans about Rey's parents being "nobodies" comes up in videos about the movies, I get so confused. Not because I believe it for a minute, because I don't, but because it's such an unnatural place for that conversation to have gone, and people are always more caught up in what it might mean for Rey's force powers or whatever. Like, are both Kylo Ren and Rey huge classicists? She's a scavenger by profession and he's the son of a princess without a planet and a smuggler. Why would either of them place any importance on her parents' social status of all things? Her yearning to meet them again was set up as her needing to know that they loved her and that she wasn't as alone as she felt, not needing to know that they were important people so she could feel important too. Who waits dutifully for their mother and father to return for over a decade and is then satisfied to know that they were "filthy junk traders" and that they "sold you for drinking money" from such an obviously unreliable source? One at least sounds like it might be grounded in truth but the other is complete guesswork about their motives on his part even if he isn't just lying through his teeth. Kylo apparently knew her parents. Why isn't she asking about her mother? If she was kind or smart or beautiful, if she looked like Rey or resembled her in any way? If her dad was good with tech like she is? If they traveled the stars like she wanted to? If either of them had the force like she does? How they lived their lives after abandoning her, or where they're buried so she can decide if she wants or needs to go pay her respects? It reads like the writers decided to project all the fans' theorycrafting about Rey's backstory unto the characters and Rey should be disappointed about not coming from some great force lineage like the fans were supposed(?) to be, and that's all there was to the whole thing. At the cost of suddenly casting Rey - and Kylo - in a really unflattering light in terms of how they view people who aren't heroes or royalty. It makes Rey come off as an inexplicably arrogant girl who was waiting for an excuse to feel special rather than a young woman who profoundly misses people who meant everything to her before they suddenly disappeared, as she's presented in the first movie. Good catch about that scene. Whenever i viewed it before your analysis i took it as Rian simply wanting to subvert our expectations, and break the 4th wall, but the shoddy writing resulted in Rey bold face believing in Darth Columbine's obvious lies because it helps her to cope with her abandonment issues.
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Post by Nayawk on Dec 10, 2019 8:25:22 GMT
Kylo apparently knew her parents. That isn't quite true. In the elevator scene Rey talks about her vision during the hand touchy touchy, Ren will turn blah blah. Ren then say "I saw something too, and because of that I know you will be the one to turn.......I saw who your parents are." He doesn't know them.. he saw them in a vision. As for why Rey trusts him.. Force Bond plus she had always known the truth, she says so herself later in the throne room, she had just buried the truth because of the trauma. Ren doesn't open with your parents are drunk trash, he makes her say it first. It is only after she says "they were nobodies" that he called them filthy junk traders. I don't think it reads as Rey being arrogant, more that she is deeply damaged by the experience of abandonment at 5 years old and the harsh life of Jakku, basically child slave labour, that she developed a fantasy as a way of coping. Because surely her parents must be off doing something important, or have hidden her away for her own good or have just gotten lost, the suffering has to have some meaning. It is a very common behaviour in trauma victims and I think it makes her more interesting.
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Post by Noxluxe on Dec 10, 2019 19:02:20 GMT
That isn't quite true. In the elevator scene Rey talks about her vision during the hand touchy touchy, Ren will turn blah blah. Ren then say "I saw something too, and because of that I know you will be the one to turn.......I saw who your parents are." He doesn't know them.. he saw them in a vision. As for why Rey trusts him.. Force Bond plus she had always known the truth, she says so herself later in the throne room, she had just buried the truth because of the trauma. Ren doesn't open with your parents are drunk trash, he makes her say it first. It is only after she says "they were nobodies" that he called them filthy junk traders. I don't think it reads as Rey being arrogant, more that she is deeply damaged by the experience of abandonment at 5 years old and the harsh life of Jakku, basically child slave labour, that she developed a fantasy as a way of coping. Because surely her parents must be off doing something important, or have hidden her away for her own good or have just gotten lost, the suffering has to have some meaning. It is a very common behaviour in trauma victims and I think it makes her more interesting. Good catch, I'd forgotten about that. I still think her parents particularly being "nobodies" is a weird thing for either of them to focus on in the conversation though, and an especially weird way for her to look at her own mother and father whom she presumably has vague memories of as actual people. Even traumatized as she is. I agree that the whole moment doesn't make me think less of her, mostly because it's such an uncharacteristic and out-of-left-field position for her to suddenly take that I can't help but attribute it to shoddily written dialogue instead. Which is really how I feel about a lot of her moments. It's not exactly the character's own fault that the story has a hard time building her in a satisfying way, and I do want to like her. The idea of her having developed grandiose and romantic fantasies about her parents on Jakku makes sense realistically, but nothing she actually says about them indicates that throughout either movie up to that point, so in that case it lacked a setup to pay off the way you're talking about at least in my instance. You can delete a past comment in the drop-down menu from the gear symbol next to it.
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Post by Nayawk on Dec 10, 2019 19:30:52 GMT
Good catch, I'd forgotten about that. I still think her parents particularly being "nobodies" is a weird thing for either of them to focus on in the conversation though, and an especially weird way for her to look at her own mother and father whom she presumably has vague memories of as actual people. Even traumatized as she is. I agree that the whole moment doesn't make me think less of her, mostly because it's such an uncharacteristic and out-of-left-field position for her to suddenly take that I can't help but attribute it to shoddily written dialogue instead. I agree the dialogue can sometimes be a bit clunky (thats SW calling card at this point, right back to the OT), but I don't feel it's totally out of left field. The fire side force chat is all about Reys feelings of isolation and not knowing her place in the world, who her parents are and what that means for who she is. Her sense of self is very tied up in who her parents are, talking about it in term of gaming it is her personal mini quest and it is all about finding her parents, it comes first before the rest of the game can move forward. So when Ren want her on his side he taps straight into that. He isn't the most socially or emotionally stable person in the world so his wooing her is basically 'you are nothing, your quest for your parents is finished they were trash and also dead, but I can make you something special, I can be the attachment you so desperately crave"
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Post by masterwarderz on Dec 11, 2019 0:19:02 GMT
Kylo apparently knew her parents. It is a very common behaviour in trauma victims and I think it makes her more interesting. So would both her and emo Ren being caught up in a hyperdrive breach. o.o Them being banished into chaos of that interdimensional hellscape is honestly better then they deserve. Them and Admiral Genderstudies.
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Post by mybudgee on Dec 11, 2019 3:12:22 GMT
Kylo apparently knew her parents. That isn't quite true. In the elevator scene Rey talks about her vision during the hand touchy touchy, Ren will turn blah blah. Ren then say "I saw something too, and because of that I know you will be the one to turn.......I saw who your parents are." He doesn't know them.. he saw them in a vision. As for why Rey trusts him.. Force Bond plus she had always known the truth, she says so herself later in the throne room, she had just buried the truth because of the trauma. Ren doesn't open with your parents are drunk trash, he makes her say it first. It is only after she says "they were nobodies" that he called them filthy junk traders. I don't think it reads as Rey being arrogant, more that she is deeply damaged by the experience of abandonment at 5 years old and the harsh life of Jakku, basically child slave labour, that she developed a fantasy as a way of coping. Because surely her parents must be off doing something important, or have hidden her away for her own good or have just gotten lost, the suffering has to have some meaning. It is a very common behaviour in trauma victims and I think it makes her more interesting.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Dec 11, 2019 4:03:22 GMT
Every time the scene with Kylo spilling the beans about Rey's parents being "nobodies" comes up in videos about the movies, I get so confused. Not because I believe it for a minute, because I don't, but because it's such an unnatural place for that conversation to have gone, and people are always more caught up in what it might mean for Rey's force powers or whatever. Like, are both Kylo Ren and Rey huge classicists? She's a scavenger by profession and he's the son of a princess without a planet and a smuggler. Why would either of them place any importance on her parents' social status of all things? Her yearning to meet them again was set up as her needing to know that they loved her and that she wasn't as alone as she felt, not needing to know that they were important people so she could feel important too. Who waits dutifully for their mother and father to return for over a decade and is then satisfied to know that they were "filthy junk traders" and that they "sold you for drinking money" from such an obviously unreliable source? One at least sounds like it might be grounded in truth but the other is complete guesswork about their motives on his part even if he isn't just lying through his teeth. Kylo apparently knew her parents. Why isn't she asking about her mother? If she was kind or smart or beautiful, if she looked like Rey or resembled her in any way? If her dad was good with tech like she is? If they traveled the stars like she wanted to? If either of them had the force like she does? How they lived their lives after abandoning her, or where they're buried so she can decide if she wants or needs to go pay her respects? It reads like the writers decided to project all the fans' theorycrafting about Rey's backstory unto the characters and Rey should be disappointed about not coming from some great force lineage like the fans were supposed(?) to be, and that's all there was to the whole thing. At the cost of suddenly casting Rey - and Kylo - in a really unflattering light in terms of how they view people who aren't heroes or royalty. It makes Rey come off as an inexplicably arrogant girl who was waiting for an excuse to feel special rather than a young woman who profoundly misses people who meant everything to her before they suddenly disappeared, as she's presented in the first movie. Good catch about that scene. Whenever i viewed it before your analysis i took it as Rian simply wanting to subvert our expectations, and break the 4th wall, but the shoddy writing resulted in Rey bold face believing in Darth Columbine's obvious lies because it helps her to cope with her abandonment issues. Things like this is why people like you just need to be ignored when it comes to views.
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