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Post by Otter on Dec 10, 2016 1:20:14 GMT
Not really. The ODSY's main advantages seem to be oriented to making it last longer without constant maintenance and not relying on established infrastructure. The Milky Way has plenty of travel infrastructure, in the form of the relays. Also, retrofitting your entire fleet with a new experimental engine is expensive and probably takes more than the six months between the games. I find it very hard to believe that after going to all the trouble and expense of making this miraculous new drive system, the first and only thing they bother to put it on is some crazy, speculative venture into the void. One would have thought that every military in the Galaxy would have been climbing over each other to grab this tech and install it in their warships. What with it being a game changing technology that would provide a huge advantage over the previous generation of ships, What advantage? On a large scale, it would still take weeks or months to move the distance of even a short relay jump, and on a small scale, every place that's been settled is already in reach of a standard ship's flight from a relay, and even then there's way more planets and systems than can be populated. Literally the only thing it's good for is throwing it at something without caring how long it takes to hit.
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Post by Fen'Harel Faceman on Dec 10, 2016 1:46:50 GMT
I find it very hard to believe that after going to all the trouble and expense of making this miraculous new drive system, the first and only thing they bother to put it on is some crazy, speculative venture into the void. One would have thought that every military in the Galaxy would have been climbing over each other to grab this tech and install it in their warships. What with it being a game changing technology that would provide a huge advantage over the previous generation of ships, What advantage? On a large scale, it would still take weeks or months to move the distance of even a short relay jump, and on a small scale, every place that's been settled is already in reach of a standard ship's flight from a relay, and even then there's way more planets and systems than can be populated. Literally the only thing it's good for is throwing it at something without caring how long it takes to hit. That would be incorrect. For systems that are close to one another, it would be a very interesting way to wage warfare, especially on civilizations closely watching relays for approaching enemies. Surprise mothertrucker! We can hit you from any direction now! Whoa, a whole fleet of long range stealth ships like the Normandy could seriously mess with an enemy. Sabotaging relays, hitting enemy shipyards, clogging up system shipping lanes. We also apparently have sensors that can reach all the way to Andromeda. So these longer-range FTL drives would be very handy for exploration without being strangled by the Mass Relay system. Extending the range (and speed, apparently) of the "standard" FTL on all ships would be tremendously useful in-galaxy.
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Post by Thrombin on Dec 10, 2016 1:49:54 GMT
I find it very hard to believe that after going to all the trouble and expense of making this miraculous new drive system, the first and only thing they bother to put it on is some crazy, speculative venture into the void. One would have thought that every military in the Galaxy would have been climbing over each other to grab this tech and install it in their warships. What with it being a game changing technology that would provide a huge advantage over the previous generation of ships, What advantage? On a large scale, it would still take weeks or months to move the distance of even a short relay jump, and on a small scale, every place that's been settled is already in reach of a standard ship's flight from a relay, and even then there's way more planets and systems than can be populated. Literally the only thing it's good for is throwing it at something without caring how long it takes to hit. I've been saying as much since before we even knew about the ODSY drive. This technology is not as revolutionary as people are making out. It was designed specifically to cope with the necessity of crossing the vast space between Galaxies where there is no means of discharging the core. Nobody has any need for it in the Milky Way because everywhere worth getting to can be accessed much quicker using the relays. Plus, the ODSY drive is described as being massive. It may fit on a dreadnought but that's about it. Even if there was some need for a Dreadnought to travel across unpopulated space to get somewhere, nobody is going to be sending a Dreadnought into combat without any support from other ships and the other ships would be too small for an ODSY drive! It's only use is for exploring and, in the MW, it would be fairly perverse to spend all that money on a huge experimental drive core just to find some unexplored cluster away from the Relay network when there are so many existing planets in more easily accessible clusters that don't need such a drive to get to.
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Post by Thrombin on Dec 10, 2016 2:00:18 GMT
What advantage? On a large scale, it would still take weeks or months to move the distance of even a short relay jump, and on a small scale, every place that's been settled is already in reach of a standard ship's flight from a relay, and even then there's way more planets and systems than can be populated. Literally the only thing it's good for is throwing it at something without caring how long it takes to hit. That would be incorrect. For systems that are close to one another, it would be a very interesting way to wage warfare, especially on civilizations closely watching relays for approaching enemies. Surprise mothertrucker! We can hit you from any direction now! Whoa, a whole fleet of long range stealth ships like the Normandy could seriously mess with an enemy. Sabotaging relays, hitting enemy shipyards, clogging up system shipping lanes. We also apparently have sensors that can reach all the way to Andromeda. So these longer-range FTL drives would be very handy for exploration without being strangled by the Mass Relay system. Extending the range (and speed, apparently) of the "standard" FTL on all ships would be tremendously useful in-galaxy. You can't stealth a dreadnought and a dreadnought is the only thing big enough for an ODSY drive. In any case, the Normandy was perfectly capable of coming out of a relay and remaining undetected. If you had a fleet of stealth ships you wouldn't need to be going the long way round if all you wanted to do was a surprise attack. What do you mean "strangled by the Mass Relay system"? The Mass Relay system is vastly more efficient than long range FTL. There's no advantage to not using it at all. There's no increase in speed with the ODSY drive. The journey took 600 years. That's less than 12 light years a day. Standard pre-reaper FTL speed is about 15.
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Post by themikefest on Dec 10, 2016 2:08:20 GMT
It still depends on the cost. As well, we don't know if the OSDY drive core can be used on every ship, or only in the Arks/Nexus because of their size (only the Ascension is supposed to be around the Ark's size, the other dreadnought are smaller). I don't see it being hard to put it on a dreadnought for a test drive. All they're doing is going on is to cross their fingers and hope for the best. If they have all this money for the ships and Nexus, then they have the money to do a test drive.
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Post by Fen'Harel Faceman on Dec 10, 2016 2:09:18 GMT
That would be incorrect. For systems that are close to one another, it would be a very interesting way to wage warfare, especially on civilizations closely watching relays for approaching enemies. Surprise mothertrucker! We can hit you from any direction now! Whoa, a whole fleet of long range stealth ships like the Normandy could seriously mess with an enemy. Sabotaging relays, hitting enemy shipyards, clogging up system shipping lanes. We also apparently have sensors that can reach all the way to Andromeda. So these longer-range FTL drives would be very handy for exploration without being strangled by the Mass Relay system. Extending the range (and speed, apparently) of the "standard" FTL on all ships would be tremendously useful in-galaxy. You can't stealth a dreadnought and a dreadnought is the only thing big enough for an ODSY drive. In any case, the Normandy was perfectly capable of coming out of a relay and remaining undetected. If you had a fleet of stealth ships you wouldn't need to be going the long way round if all you wanted to do was a surprise attack. What do you mean "strangled by the Mass Relay system"? The Mass Relay system is vastly more efficient than long range FTL. There's no advantage to not using it at all. There's no increase in speed with the ODSY drive. The journey took 600 years. That's less than 12 light years a day. Standard pre-reaper FTL speed is about 15. You're talking about the prototype and saying that literally the only use for exploring such ideas is launching stuff out of the galaxy. I'm making a case for the usefulness of developing the prototype for use in-galaxy. There are plenty of uses, as illustrated. What do I mean by "strangled by the Mass Relay System"? Again, how familiar are you with Mass Effect lore? Entire systems were closed off for exploration after the Council races ran into the Rachni. If a system can be approached without triggering a mass relay, it opens up new opportunities. Mass Relays also open up limited angles of approaching a system. You may have to go through Relay C to get to Relay D but could approach the system from your system from the opposite direction of Relay D. Nobody said to not use the mass relay system at all. ODSY tech, then, needs some re-adjustment for the lore, where 12 light year speeds per day were standard. But not adhering to lore seems to be standard with the Walters-helmed Mass Effect.
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Post by sgtsteel91 on Dec 10, 2016 2:47:55 GMT
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Post by Fen'Harel Faceman on Dec 10, 2016 2:49:42 GMT
That is a quarian, no doubt in my mind.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Dec 10, 2016 2:50:35 GMT
That is a quarian, no doubt in my mind. Looks more like a Geth than a Quarian.
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Post by Fen'Harel Faceman on Dec 10, 2016 2:51:28 GMT
That is a quarian, no doubt in my mind. Looks more like a Geth than a Quarian. Which one? I don't see a flashlight.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Dec 10, 2016 2:53:51 GMT
Looks more like a Geth than a Quarian. Which one? I don't see a flashlight. The one the link focuses on. The head sticks out too far to be Quarian but like a Geth, same with the tube that is connected to neck the chin to the neck. There are other things too like the shoulders don't match a Quarian and it looks like it has some tubes/wires running across its body(for example the legs) like a Geth.
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Post by Fen'Harel Faceman on Dec 10, 2016 2:54:24 GMT
That is a quarian, no doubt in my mind. Looks more like a Geth than a Quarian. It looks more like a quarian, in my opinion, especially with the hood. The face apparatus looks a little different but there's also the resemblances in the clothing and the feetsies.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Dec 10, 2016 2:56:32 GMT
Looks more like a Geth than a Quarian. It looks more like a quarian, in my opinion, especially with the hood. The face apparatus looks a little different but there's also the resemblances in the clothing and the feetsies. I don't think that is a hood, or at least may not be. It looks like the whole head/neck of that character is painted with a Color ID for further mesh adding.
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Post by Fen'Harel Faceman on Dec 10, 2016 2:57:50 GMT
I don't see the tubes you're seeing and the shoulders can just be chalked up to a different shoulder mantle design in the clothing.
Plus... at that point in time it's much more likely to be a quarian than a geth. I think only Legion was friendly with humans and it/he/they went back to the collective after the end of ME2, right?
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Post by sgtsteel91 on Dec 10, 2016 2:58:04 GMT
If that really is a Geth (but I'm betting it's a Quarian with their arm raised maybe), what's it doing in the Nexus?
Is it a re-purposed platform or did the True Geth get a free ride?
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Dec 10, 2016 3:05:09 GMT
I don't see the tubes you're seeing and the shoulders can just be chalked up to a different shoulder mantle design in the clothing. Plus... at that point in time it's much more likely to be a quarian than a geth. I think only Legion was friendly with humans and it/he/they went back to the collective after the end of ME2, right? The little band of light blue against the dark blue right above where the head connects to the torso is the neck tube, and the dark band on the leg is an example of a body tube/wire. As for the shoulders, the Quarians would have to have hunches now if that is a part of them, and why would their suits have that since it adds nothing. Mac Walters on multiple occasions now said Bioware has a plan that will allow all races from the Milky Way to be in Andromeda. So they have some way in mind as a possibility. As a side note, again why did they have to ruin Avina like that?
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Post by Fen'Harel Faceman on Dec 10, 2016 3:09:43 GMT
I don't see the tubes you're seeing and the shoulders can just be chalked up to a different shoulder mantle design in the clothing. Plus... at that point in time it's much more likely to be a quarian than a geth. I think only Legion was friendly with humans and it/he/they went back to the collective after the end of ME2, right? The little band of light blue against the dark blue right above where the head connects to the torso is the neck tube, and the dark band on the leg is an example of a body tube/wire. As for the shoulders, the Quarians would have to have hunches now if that is a part of them, and why would their suits have that since it adds nothing. Mac Walters on multiple occasions now said Bioware has a plan that will allow all races from the Milky Way to be in Andromeda. So they have some way in mind as a possibility. As a side note, again why did they have to ruin Avina like that? Yes, the crime they committed against Avina truly sucks. I respect your opinion, but still disagree. It looks more like a quarian to me. You think "all races" includes geth? Now that would be interesting, hopefully they'd invest some serious thought into that idea and not employ a bunch of hand-waving. Post-Sovereign the geth are not very popular with anybody, let alone the quarians.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Dec 10, 2016 3:22:08 GMT
The little band of light blue against the dark blue right above where the head connects to the torso is the neck tube, and the dark band on the leg is an example of a body tube/wire. As for the shoulders, the Quarians would have to have hunches now if that is a part of them, and why would their suits have that since it adds nothing. Mac Walters on multiple occasions now said Bioware has a plan that will allow all races from the Milky Way to be in Andromeda. So they have some way in mind as a possibility. As a side note, again why did they have to ruin Avina like that? Yes, the crime they committed against Avina truly sucks. I respect your opinion, but still disagree. It looks more like a quarian to me. You think "all races" includes geth? Now that would be interesting, hopefully they'd invest some serious thought into that idea and not employ a bunch of hand-waving. Post-Sovereign the geth are not very popular with anybody, let alone the quarians. That's fine. In either case, Bioware either wittingly or unwittingly revealed some alien that is not of the confirmed to us in that shot. I do, yes. And yes, I hope they do put in a lot of thought into explaining it. Us arriving after everyone else gives them some wiggle room I think, since even if when we arrive they are seen as friends maybe that wasn't always the case since clearly things happened between our arrivals. Either the Geth were known members from the start, or they tagged along and something happened that made the other races give them a chance. For the former, perhaps they struck a deal to serve as the crew of the ships while the organics were in stasis. For the latter, perhaps they helped against the Kett or some other threat. There could even have been a whole Kal'Reager moment with that, like the Geth arrive and say they are there to help and the common thought is "You know, ordinarily that wouldn't fly with me, but I can't afford to be picky right now." There was also that Alliance soldier in ME3 who responded similarly when a Geth Prime arrived to help them against the Reapers, albeit after shooting one of the flashlights of the Prime out. The Prime explained they were allies, and with the situation what it was the soldier was like "um...okay". As for the Quarians, it could be that the ones with the Andromeda Initiative were those like Admiral Koris who didn't see the Geth as outright villains. After all the ones with us clearly don't care about fighting them to reclaim Rannoch.
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Post by Arcian on Dec 10, 2016 5:06:26 GMT
Dozens of pages arguing about lore and technical limitations and here we go Deal with it, haters. Static charge is now used as power source, genius solution. Except that it violates the second law of thermodynamics. The ship is a closed system, which means it eventually runs out of usable energy unless it is supplied from the outside. This is made worse by the fact that recycling static energy is inefficient - you're not going to recycle 100% of it no matter how good your tech is - and even if it was 100% efficient, it wouldn't generate anywhere near the amounts of energy the ship needs to run. Harnessing 100% of the energy of every single lightning strike on earth for an entire year would only power 8% of US households for that period of time. Static energy is not a great source of power. Also, the design of the Arks quite clearly lacks the ram-scoop the ship would need to collect the insane amounts of hydrogen the ship would need to propel itself 2.5 million light years. Intergalactic space has a particle density of 1 atom per cubic meter. Considering how resource-intensive the FTL drive must be due to the stupendous mass of the Arks, it is guaranteed to consume fuel faster than it can replenish it. A Normandy-sized ship with an Ark-sized scoop? Maybe, though even that is a stretch. I will give them credit for actually trying to come up with an explanation. However, like with everything else about this game, they really should have given it more thought. Oh, and it still begs the question: where the fuck was this amazing technology during the Reaper War?
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Post by colfoley on Dec 10, 2016 5:19:35 GMT
On its way to the Andromeda Galaxy, obviously.
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Post by Fen'Harel Faceman on Dec 10, 2016 5:25:31 GMT
On its way to the Andromeda Galaxy, obviously. Since the technology was developed in the Milky Way, there's no reason to expect all the plans, diagrams and people who developed that technology and built it would all go to Andromeda - in a universe that makes any sort of sense.
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Post by Element Zero on Dec 10, 2016 5:30:17 GMT
Dozens of pages arguing about lore and technical limitations and here we go Deal with it, haters. Static charge is now used as power source, genius solution. Except that it violates the second law of thermodynamics. The ship is a closed system, which means it eventually runs out of usable energy unless it is supplied from the outside. This is made worse by the fact that recycling static energy is inefficient - you're not going to recycle 100% of it no matter how good your tech is - and even if it was 100% efficient, it wouldn't generate anywhere near the amounts of energy the ship needs to run. Harnessing 100% of the energy of every single lightning strike on earth for an entire year would only power 8% of US households for that period of time. Static energy is not a great source of power. Also, the design of the Arks quite clearly lacks the ram-scoop the ship would need to collect the insane amounts of hydrogen the ship would need to propel itself 2.5 million light years. Intergalactic space has a particle density of 1 atom per cubic meter. Considering how resource-intensive the FTL drive must be due to the stupendous mass of the Arks, it is guaranteed to consume fuel faster than it can replenish it. A Normandy-sized ship with an Ark-sized scoop? Maybe, though even that is a stretch. I will give them credit for actually trying to come up with an explanation. However, like with everything else about this game, they really should have given it more thought. Oh, and it still begs the question: where the fuck was this amazing technology during the Reaper War? I think the main point was not to use it as a power source, but to obviate the need to discharge. This is the great advantage it brings. Any amount of energy recouped is just a perk.u Ignoring the obvious meta-hurdle, this technology, deployed on a handful of dreadnoughts, wouldn't have drastically altered the war. It might've extended it, but it wouldn't have won it. The reapers may have needed longer to chase us down, but they still would've done so, in the end. Shepard ended the war long before this point ever became relevant. The true, monumental changes would've come after the war, when time was had to truly implement this tech. We won't be there to see those changes, of course.
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Post by colfoley on Dec 10, 2016 5:33:06 GMT
On its way to the Andromeda Galaxy, obviously. Since the technology was developed in the Milky Way, there's no reason to expect all the plans, diagrams and people who developed that technology and built it would all go to Andromeda - in a universe that makes any sort of sense. Sure, but since Arcian mentioned the actual technology itself and not the people who designed it. Since the tech is on the way to Andromeda and since, to the best of our knowledge, the technology was not used in the Milkyway, that is where the technology is going.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Dec 10, 2016 5:38:31 GMT
Except that it violates the second law of thermodynamics. The ship is a closed system, which means it eventually runs out of usable energy unless it is supplied from the outside. This is made worse by the fact that recycling static energy is inefficient - you're not going to recycle 100% of it no matter how good your tech is - and even if it was 100% efficient, it wouldn't generate anywhere near the amounts of energy the ship needs to run. Harnessing 100% of the energy of every single lightning strike on earth for an entire year would only power 8% of US households for that period of time. Static energy is not a great source of power. Also, the design of the Arks quite clearly lacks the ram-scoop the ship would need to collect the insane amounts of hydrogen the ship would need to propel itself 2.5 million light years. Intergalactic space has a particle density of 1 atom per cubic meter. Considering how resource-intensive the FTL drive must be due to the stupendous mass of the Arks, it is guaranteed to consume fuel faster than it can replenish it. A Normandy-sized ship with an Ark-sized scoop? Maybe, though even that is a stretch. I will give them credit for actually trying to come up with an explanation. However, like with everything else about this game, they really should have given it more thought. Oh, and it still begs the question: where the fuck was this amazing technology during the Reaper War? I think the main point was not to use it as a power source, but to obviate the need to discharge. This is the great advantage it brings. Any amount of energy recouped is just a perk.u Ignoring the obvious meta-hurdle, this technology, deployed on a handful of dreadnoughts, wouldn't have drastically altered the war. It might've extended it, but it wouldn't have won it. The reapers may have needed longer to chase us down, but they still would've done so, in the end. Shepard ended the war long before this point ever became relevant. The true, monumental changes would've come after the war, when time was had to truly implement this tech. We won't be there to see those changes, of course.Unfortunately. Personally I think the Galactic Reconstruction time period would have been a fascinating time to base the next games/books/etc. I understand why they aren't of course, just saying it has a ton of storytelling potential and is a shame we miss out on it.
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by Element Zero on Dec 10, 2016 5:41:30 GMT
I think the main point was not to use it as a power source, but to obviate the need to discharge. This is the great advantage it brings. Any amount of energy recouped is just a perk.u Ignoring the obvious meta-hurdle, this technology, deployed on a handful of dreadnoughts, wouldn't have drastically altered the war. It might've extended it, but it wouldn't have won it. The reapers may have needed longer to chase us down, but they still would've done so, in the end. Shepard ended the war long before this point ever became relevant. The true, monumental changes would've come after the war, when time was had to truly implement this tech. We won't be there to see those changes, of course.Unfortunately. Personally I think the Galactic Reconstruction time period would have been a fascinating time to base the next games and would have had a ton of potential. That was the game I really wanted, as excited as I presently am for Andromeda. I wanted, coincidentally, to lead an exploratory mission through an unmapped relay. Maybe something would go wrong and we'd get stranded, cut-off from help? I discussed it at length with JeffZero, if I recall correctly.
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