Heimdall
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Post by Heimdall on Aug 29, 2017 19:06:51 GMT
On and off again I've watched videos for this game. I'm intrigued. Is there any ETA on the single player campaign bit? No, CIG is not doing the whole ETA thing anymore ... probably a good idea, too. My personal speculation (based on the little info we can gleem and piece together from some comments in the videos of the past 6 months or so) is that we won't see it until the end of 2018, possibly later than that. Well, I checked Reddit after I made the post and someone claimed that part 1 had been pushed back to Q4 2017, which I suppose is possible if it's being released in three parts. I won't hold my breath though.
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Post by AnDromedary on Aug 29, 2017 20:02:48 GMT
No, CIG is not doing the whole ETA thing anymore ... probably a good idea, too. My personal speculation (based on the little info we can gleem and piece together from some comments in the videos of the past 6 months or so) is that we won't see it until the end of 2018, possibly later than that. Well, I checked Reddit after I made the post and someone claimed that part 1 had been pushed back to Q4 2017, which I suppose is possible if it's being released in three parts. I won't hold my breath though. I wouldn't believe it. There is no official date anymore and from the info we get, they are still working on fairly basic stuff like creating the cutscenes and even assets. This would indicate that they haven't even reached the polishing phase yet. Add to that that all necessary hands (QA especially) are currently working madly on 3.0 (and will do so for at least another 2 months or so), I don't see how SQ42 can make any significant progress until basically the end of the year. I'd be very surprised if we see it before he end of 2018.
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Post by Heimdall on Aug 29, 2017 22:31:23 GMT
I will say, seeing Mark Hamil comment on his first mocap experience is pretty awesome
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Post by Obsidian Gryphon on Aug 30, 2017 0:25:48 GMT
I'm fine with the progress thus far and what I've seen. I'm not in a hurry for the game. I don't want another *cough* Andro.
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Post by Qui-Gon GlenN7 on Aug 30, 2017 0:25:50 GMT
He is such a thinking man.
His answers to the media about Luke Skywalker's sexuality were nothing short of perfect. Class dude.
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Post by Pounce de León on Aug 30, 2017 5:46:21 GMT
Looks like a big, inflated sales pitch for shady business to me.
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Post by Gileadan on Aug 30, 2017 7:35:35 GMT
Right now, Star Citizen has had about as much development time as MEA, spread over two games, and they didn't start out with a full budget and team. They were about 8 people at the beginning and grew from there. And they're pretty far in "no one has ever attempted this"-country by now, so I'm overall fine with their progress.
I understand that parts of the fan base are getting antsy though. 5 years is a long time and the budget is huge by now, so people are expecting results. And I think we've all gotten a bit used to being wowed by their next big breakthrough whenever Gamescom and Citizen Con roll around, so it might actually be "disappointing" if the next Citizen Con just showed off more 3.0, no matter how many bugs they squashed until then.
Imagine having this level of insight into MEA's development over the course of 5 years right up to its launch...
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Post by Heimdall on Aug 30, 2017 9:23:02 GMT
Right now, Star Citizen has had about as much development time as MEA, spread over two games, and they didn't start out with a full budget and team. They were about 8 people at the beginning and grew from there. And they're pretty far in "no one has ever attempted this"-country by now, so I'm overall fine with their progress. I understand that parts of the fan base are getting antsy though. 5 years is a long time and the budget is huge by now, so people are expecting results. And I think we've all gotten a bit used to being wowed by their next big breakthrough whenever Gamescom and Citizen Con roll around, so it might actually be "disappointing" if the next Citizen Con just showed off more 3.0, no matter how many bugs they squashed until then. Imagine having this level of insight into MEA's development over the course of 5 years right up to its launch... It is, at th very least, the most stunning example of feature creep that I have ever seen.
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Post by Gileadan on Aug 30, 2017 9:28:00 GMT
It is, at th very least, the most stunning example of feature creep that I have ever seen. Heh, I'm a fan of the project, but I agree wholeheartedly. As I always like to say: the great thing about Star Citizen is that Chris Roberts can do whatever he likes. And the terrible thing about Star Citizen is that Chris Roberts can do whatever he likes. He's very prone to feature creep. Even when he worked on Freelancer back then Microsoft had to essentially force him to finish the project or he would have added new features for years to come. In fact, I'm pretty sure that some of the things he planned for Freelancer but couldn't complete during its development ended up in Star Citizen.
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Post by Heimdall on Aug 30, 2017 11:45:33 GMT
A question I'm unclear on though, is squadron 42 supposed to feature a set character or our player avatar?
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Post by Heimdall on Aug 30, 2017 12:09:19 GMT
Heh, I'm a fan of the project, but I agree wholeheartedly. As I always like to say: the great thing about Star Citizen is that Chris Roberts can do whatever he likes. And the terrible thing about Star Citizen is that Chris Roberts can do whatever he likes. He's very prone to feature creep. Even when he worked on Freelancer back then Microsoft had to essentially force him to finish the project or he would have added new features for years to come. In fact, I'm pretty sure that some of the things he planned for Freelancer but couldn't complete during its development ended up in Star Citizen. Where is he getting the money? It's all crowd funding? Check out the site, they're selling access to the alpha build and letting players purchase ships with real money. The basic starter pack costs $45. The deluxe package that has all the things costs $10,000. I think their total stands at around $158 million.
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Post by Gileadan on Aug 30, 2017 12:12:39 GMT
Where is he getting the money? It's all crowd funding? It's almost all crowd funding, yes. While there is an AMD skin for one of the starter ships (it existed before I backed the project and has never been available again) and one single guy held up an "Intel" poster during the gamescom event, I am not aware of any sponsor or publisher involvement. Many of the backers are older gamers (which I witnessed in person this weekend) like me, who enjoyed the Wing Commander games greatly and now have jobs with some disposable income, and would like to see a colossal spiritual successor to it. A question I'm unclear on though, is squadron 42 supposed to feature a set character or our player avatar? As far as I remember, the Squadron 42 protagonist is our Star Citizen player character. The MMO is supposed to be the follow-up to Squadron 42, time line wise. "When you play Star Citizen, you play the future you from Squadron 42". Of course, your Star Citizen character can die, whereupon you create his or her "next of kin" who inherits their fleet and hangars.
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Post by Pounce de León on Aug 30, 2017 12:28:29 GMT
Heh, I'm a fan of the project, but I agree wholeheartedly. As I always like to say: the great thing about Star Citizen is that Chris Roberts can do whatever he likes. And the terrible thing about Star Citizen is that Chris Roberts can do whatever he likes. He's very prone to feature creep. Even when he worked on Freelancer back then Microsoft had to essentially force him to finish the project or he would have added new features for years to come. In fact, I'm pretty sure that some of the things he planned for Freelancer but couldn't complete during its development ended up in Star Citizen. Where is he getting the money? It's all crowd funding? Ye, mostly. Roberts is quite the pitching man. Able to hit on the dreams of players. It's quite the case study on promises and delaying with further promises. What gets delivered in the end remains to be seen. Their marketing is top notch and that plays a huge part in keeping it going. Braben (Elite Dangerous) and Roberts hit the nail on the head with the timing of their projects. They proved space sims are still desired by the market. Space-themed games since quite surged and for all it's worth - I'm glad the era of zombie survivals is come to an end.
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Post by AnDromedary on Aug 30, 2017 15:13:24 GMT
As far as I remember, the Squadron 42 protagonist is our Star Citizen player character. The MMO is supposed to be the follow-up to Squadron 42, time line wise. "When you play Star Citizen, you play the future you from Squadron 42". Of course, your Star Citizen character can die, whereupon you create his or her "next of kin" who inherits their fleet and hangars. This is correct. In fact, IIRC, if you play SQ42, your Star Citizen character will start as a citizen (because they went through military service during SQ42) and everything is good. If you did not play SQ42, you will need to buy your citizenship at the beginning of Star Citizen (you need to be Citizen because the lower class in the Empire, called "Civilians" are not just allowed to fly around and start businesses and stuff without special permits). Buying your Citizenship means that you will start with less money (or even a small debt possibly, which you will have a very long time to pay off though). So there even an advantage to having played SQ42 before heading into the MMO persistent world. This is all years away from us though, so I could imagine CIG might even change those plans if necessary.
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Post by AnDromedary on Oct 30, 2017 17:08:50 GMT
So, I know, 3.0 is still not out (though it's with the Evocati now) and everything got pushed back, people are unhappy etc. but I just watched the CitizenCon videos yesterday and what can I say, HOLY SHIT! Whatever happens with the game itself, the technology they are developing and the new thinking they apply to world development and content creation alone was worth the money I spent on this project so far IMO. The way they are re-thinking how to develop IMO has the potential to be a true revolution in game development. Just watch the video, check out the shiny visuals (the cool bit starts at about 14:30) but especially watch when they explain the tools they use (at about 32:00). That's what I call impressive technology for game development. Really cool stuff CIG is working on there. I am looking forward to 3.0 but just watching them come up with this kind of stuff year after year is a joy in itself IMO. /fan-mode
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Post by azarhal on Oct 30, 2017 18:27:49 GMT
They made an Earth-size Coruscant. It looks cool, but at the same time, so many empty buildings and I just know some people just wanted to see the ship crash to see what happens. lol
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Post by AnDromedary on Oct 30, 2017 19:14:25 GMT
They made an Earth-size Coruscant. It looks cool, but at the same time, so many empty buildings and I just know some people just wanted to see the ship crash to see what happens. lol True, they are only exteriors, but that's what's needed for this game. Most buildings in GTA are also just exteriors. Besides, seeing how they also develop tech for procedural interior building blocks, I wouldn't be surprised if we saw a combination of those technologies in the future .... maybe not in SC but from someone else who takes this tech and further builds upon it. In any case, the progress that is made here, not just in implementation but in how to think about content creation in the first place could prove to be fairly significant IMO.
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Post by CHRrOME on Oct 31, 2017 2:24:44 GMT
I watched Levelcap's video about it. I haven't followed SC since 2 years probably, but all I can say is holy fuck. The amount of stuff they added thus far is absurd. How they created an entire world with buildings and shit, even if it's just cosmetic for the most part, no other game out there has ever done that. The closest thing is probably GTA, and those games are super small in size. And the buildings were not low poly placeholders for background either. They used procedural generation, which is not a system people has much faith in based in previous experiences... however what they did with SC feels very natural, that proves that procedural generation can work if you code the system properly.
This game is certainly setting a precedent in the industry, to show in general how far a game can get if you're not being held by budget or the shadow of a publisher. It's a game that is gonna take quite a few more years to be finished, no wonder due to the scale of it, but it's already really impressive as it is.
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Post by azarhal on Oct 31, 2017 12:13:27 GMT
They used procedural generation, which is not a system people has much faith in based in previous experiences... however what they did with SC feels very natural, that proves that procedural generation can work if you code the system properly. People who don't have faith in procedural generation just failed to see when it was properly used and only remember the failed attempts. The entire overland map of Skyrim was done using procedural generation, including plants placement. It's actually quite common to use procedural generation to generate large open world terrain maps and then edit them to put static stuff in (villages, NPCs). Andromeda's planets were done in a similar way, as were ME1 uncharted worlds. Daggerfall has procedural generation for basically every not plot critical elements (dungeons, towns, land, NPCs, quests). There isn't enough quests templates so it gets repetitive eventually and the dungeons could get super weird, but it was pretty much what Star Citizen is now trying to be, but only the size of England, fantasy based and released in 1996 in a game that wasn't fully 3D. Nobody followed in Daggerfall's footsteps until post-2010 and that seems tied directly to the raise of development cost vs gamers wanting "more content". Star Citizen doesn't really have a choice with it though, they decided to go super realistic so that means making everything. Although, at this point making everything gives me the impression that the game is going to be "too big".
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Post by Superhik on Oct 31, 2017 13:52:17 GMT
Great visually, but after a few minutes it all started to look "samey". Lacks any character, hard to pull it off with this much of procedural generation. Try to go with hundred plus hours into it.
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Post by azarhal on Oct 31, 2017 14:53:16 GMT
Great visually, but after a few minutes it all started to look "samey". Lacks any character, hard to pull it off with this much of procedural generation. Try to go with hundred plus hours into it. Funny enough it's no different than on Earth right now, especially in Asia but even my town in Canada has a few street littered with cloned houses. It's just on a smaller scale than China or a planet covered in buildings using procedural generation.
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Post by AnDromedary on Oct 31, 2017 17:24:10 GMT
Keep in mind that these scenaries are meant as backdrops on which to build points of interest. You are not meant to fly along them just for the scenery for hours. Within those "cities", there will PoIs for quests and hand built landing zones like Area 17/18. Given that this is just one of 100s of planned planets (check out the last part of the video on Hurston which is completely different) and that it's still work in progress, I don't see an issue with variety.
That said, if you watched the part with the tools, it's not just procedural (that's IMO the actual coolness of it), it's procedural generation combined with artist decisions. The cities are layed out by hand into suburbs, industrial, residential and business areas. The procedural system just fills in these areas and build trnasport ways between them (a bit like in Sim City). IMO, you can see that perfectly while the guy is flying around and also from space. Given how much area they need to cover, I think that's a very cool way to make it feasible. Give me enough PoIs in there and a great landing zone, and I think that's enough to make a really believable city planet. After all, Drive through any city (especially suburbs) today and everything will also look kind of samey and will not be accessible for you as well. It's just a backdrop for the places you want to get to, just like here.
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Post by Obsidian Gryphon on Dec 29, 2017 1:20:35 GMT
Well, shucks, NPCs talk to you. The game world looks great and alive. I hope it is that way when Squadron 42 launches. *cross fingers*
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Post by Gileadan on Dec 29, 2017 12:00:40 GMT
This seems rather impressive for pre-alpha footage tbh. That Terminator quote at 16:44
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Post by slimgrin727 on Dec 29, 2017 18:47:21 GMT
Beautiful looking but the gameplay seems very rough, and has seemed that way for a long time.
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