aoibhealfae
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The stars, the moon, they have all been blown out
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Post by aoibhealfae on Aug 29, 2016 11:43:55 GMT
Ok, I'm still wondering; how would any of the others' testimony help since none of them were aware of the Arrival mission that Shepard underwent alone? Especially since they're part of a team hired by Cerberus? Wouldn't their accounts be considered highly suspect? As for the events of ME2, everyone was working their own agenda. Wrex was trying to unite the krogan (and only making progress because the genophage was working in his favor). Tali went back to her people...and does research that got dropped in ME3. Nothing relating to the Reapers. Liara went off after the Shadow Broker and didn't really make any progress with stopping the Reapers. Until after ME2, same time as when Garrus went to his father for help. But he didn't know his father could take his concerns to the Primarch. He was grasping at straws for anything at that point. He's still doing something about the Reapers, same way he contributed in the suicide mission by offering weaponry that kept people alive, by helping Shepard stay alive in missions for people who choose to take him along. His contributions are tangible to those players. We don't know what Kaidan's been doing, we can speculate he's been training his biotic squad, doing investigations for the alliance, all we know is that he refused to help Shepard for legitimate concerns and is not there. But that's not a strike against him whereas for some reason Garrus can do nothing right in your eyes. And what is odd is that you're singling out Garrus of all people regarding the genophage. What parts of his concerns regarding the krogan any different from what others think about them? When did he ever say he condones krogan suffering? When was he ever about oppressing another race? His concerns are legitimate; especially if Wreav is in charge. Who says it's only going to take centuries to repopulate if females can lay clutches of up to hundreds of eggs? Entire colony worlds never recovered because of krogan inhabitants. And that was when the Krogan were still allies of the Asari and Salarians. Alliances meant nothing when resources became strained during the Krogan rebellions. And as a side thought, why is it acceptable for Kaidan to become bigoted because of Shepard but Garrus is the next Godwin comparison for his flaws? Renegade Kaidan's views that the council was inefficient is not bigotry. The council are always self-serving and acts on their races' best interest. But regardless of his point of view in ME1, he still risk his life to protect the council. That never change. Kaidan is not perfect nor anyone's cup of tea and is deathly boring to many but he never wish to inflict genocide on anyone. Neither did Ashley either and yet everyone claim she's more racist. The trial isn't just about the Bahak system incident (and preventing an outright war between Batarians and humanity) but its also to determine Shepard role in Cerberus and the kidnapping of the colonists in the Terminus system. Shepard could have been executed by the end of the trial if it wasn't for the Admirals and Virmire Survivor. As much as either Kaidan and Ashley receiving the heat for refusing to join Shepard's suicide team on Horizon, the only ones who stayed from ME2 crew are Joker, Chakwas, Ken and Gabby who was with the Normandy was it was impounded. That's barely a handful to defend Shepard who was being accused for treason. Liara did mention that she was using the Shadow Broker resources to find more prothean resources she could use and she did found the plans for the Crucible from the Shadow Broker resources and Hackett's help. Tali was involved when the Quarians attacked the Geth in the Perseus Veil which lead them to ally themselves to the Reapers and she and Legion was essential to build peace and help during the reaper war. Wrex commited his troops to Shepard if you resolve his thousand years old dilemma. Kaidan's biotic company also deals with training other biotics in the military much like Jack's teenage team, and Ashley used her experience and rank and both did contribute to the war assets if not used as a squadmate. That's still contribution to Shepard's fight against the reapers. EDI talk about the clutches was merely a discussion about the possibility of the Krogan achieving full fertility pre-Genophage. The krogan never have that for over a thousand years. The genophage isn't cured and still affect the fertility rate of all krogan. The cure only affect pregnant mothers to enable them to carry children alive and full term by preventing the genophage attempting to inhibit nervous system formation. Plus the society impact on the krogan people for a thousand years that trapped their females by being valued as nothing but breeders and decoys because their entire race would die off. Garrus only let go of his prejudice on Quarians because he fancied Tali. Turian-Krogan alliance and Rannoch arc still happen and resolved with or without him. His only significant contribution to the reaper ME3 was an additional squadmate, romance sideplot and : If it wasn't for his people who need the krogan's help, he would be happy to not see the krogan ever be cured at all. This is not an attack on your favourite LI. I don't make this up just to be spiteful. Brandon Keener himself voiced Garrus who said these things. How the krogan need to be more contrite for defying the council races or how the genophage isn't a mistake or how he would side with the Salarian Dalatrass. There's not a single line in his entire script that he took that statement back that convince me that he let go of his prejudice against the krogan or even try to understand what the genophage is and its effect and the cure and the science and everyone involved including every other Turians who were willing to sacrifice themselves to preserve the krogan alliance. He just accept that Shepard make the choice he wouldn't make and enjoy that he doesn't have any responsibility over it (because that's what he's good at). He claim the name Archangel but all I could think of was he was closest to Josef Mengele, aptly called Angel of Death. This is what made the idea of romancing him somewhat troublesome for me. I am well aware of the hype about Garrus' romance, I have attempted them as well (and pretty much prefer SWTOR's Trooper and Aric Jorgan romance instead). But I don't romanticize someone who would casually whisper that he would unleash a genocide "if it was up to him" and I don't see my Shepard being comfortable with this either. Besides, all these sentiment bear a close resemblance to "you have to take out their families" by some guy I don't want to name.
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Post by dalinne on Aug 29, 2016 13:18:41 GMT
Ok, I'm still wondering; how would any of the others' testimony help since none of them were aware of the Arrival mission that Shepard underwent alone? Especially since they're part of a team hired by Cerberus? Wouldn't their accounts be considered highly suspect? As for the events of ME2, everyone was working their own agenda. Wrex was trying to unite the krogan (and only making progress because the genophage was working in his favor). Tali went back to her people...and does research that got dropped in ME3. Nothing relating to the Reapers. Liara went off after the Shadow Broker and didn't really make any progress with stopping the Reapers. Until after ME2, same time as when Garrus went to his father for help. But he didn't know his father could take his concerns to the Primarch. He was grasping at straws for anything at that point. He's still doing something about the Reapers, same way he contributed in the suicide mission by offering weaponry that kept people alive, by helping Shepard stay alive in missions for people who choose to take him along. His contributions are tangible to those players. We don't know what Kaidan's been doing, we can speculate he's been training his biotic squad, doing investigations for the alliance, all we know is that he refused to help Shepard for legitimate concerns and is not there. But that's not a strike against him whereas for some reason Garrus can do nothing right in your eyes. And what is odd is that you're singling out Garrus of all people regarding the genophage. What parts of his concerns regarding the krogan any different from what others think about them? When did he ever say he condones krogan suffering? When was he ever about oppressing another race? His concerns are legitimate; especially if Wreav is in charge. Who says it's only going to take centuries to repopulate if females can lay clutches of up to hundreds of eggs? Entire colony worlds never recovered because of krogan inhabitants. And that was when the Krogan were still allies of the Asari and Salarians. Alliances meant nothing when resources became strained during the Krogan rebellions. And as a side thought, why is it acceptable for Kaidan to become bigoted because of Shepard but Garrus is the next Godwin comparison for his flaws? Renegade Kaidan's views that the council was inefficient is not bigotry. The council are always self-serving and acts on their races' best interest. But regardless of his point of view in ME1, he still risk his life to protect the council. That never change. Kaidan is not perfect nor anyone's cup of tea and is deathly boring to many but he never wish to inflict genocide on anyone. Neither did Ashley either and yet everyone claim she's more racist. The trial isn't just about the Bahak system incident (and preventing an outright war between Batarians and humanity) but its also to determine Shepard role in Cerberus and the kidnapping of the colonists in the Terminus system. Shepard could have been executed by the end of the trial if it wasn't for the Admirals and Virmire Survivor. As much as either Kaidan and Ashley receiving the heat for refusing to join Shepard's suicide team on Horizon, the only ones who stayed from ME2 crew are Joker, Chakwas, Ken and Gabby who was with the Normandy was it was impounded. That's barely a handful to defend Shepard who was being accused for treason. Liara did mention that she was using the Shadow Broker resources to find more prothean resources she could use and she did found the plans for the Crucible from the Shadow Broker resources and Hackett's help. Tali was involved when the Quarians attacked the Geth in the Perseus Veil which lead them to ally themselves to the Reapers and she and Legion was essential to build peace and help during the reaper war. Wrex commited his troops to Shepard if you resolve his thousand years old dilemma. Kaidan's biotic company also deals with training other biotics in the military much like Jack's teenage team, and Ashley used her experience and rank and both did contribute to the war assets if not used as a squadmate. That's still contribution to Shepard's fight against the reapers. EDI talk about the clutches was merely a discussion about the possibility of the Krogan achieving full fertility pre-Genophage. The krogan never have that for over a thousand years. The genophage isn't cured and still affect the fertility rate of all krogan. The cure only affect pregnant mothers to enable them to carry children alive and full term by preventing the genophage attempting to inhibit nervous system formation. Plus the society impact on the krogan people for a thousand years that trapped their females by being valued as nothing but breeders and decoys because their entire race would die off. Garrus only let go of his prejudice on Quarians because he fancied Tali. Turian-Krogan alliance and Rannoch arc still happen and resolved with or without him. His only significant contribution to the reaper ME3 was an additional squadmate, romance sideplot and : If it wasn't for his people who need the krogan's help, he would be happy to not see the krogan ever be cured at all. This is not an attack on your favourite LI. I don't make this up just to be spiteful. Brandon Keener himself voiced Garrus who said these things. How the krogan need to be more contrite for defying the council races or how the genophage isn't a mistake or how he would side with the Salarian Dalatrass. There's not a single line in his entire script that he took that statement back that convince me that he let go of his prejudice against the krogan or even try to understand what the genophage is and its effect and the cure and the science and everyone involved including every other Turians who were willing to sacrifice themselves to preserve the krogan alliance. He just accept that Shepard make the choice he wouldn't make and enjoy that he doesn't have any responsibility over it (because that's what he's good at). He claim the name Archangel but all I could think of was he was closest to Josef Mengele, aptly called Angel of Death. This is what made the idea of romancing him somewhat troublesome for me. I am well aware of the hype about Garrus' romance, I have attempted them as well (and pretty much prefer SWTOR's Trooper and Aric Jorgan romance instead). But I don't romanticize someone who would casually whisper that he would unleash a genocide "if it was up to him" and I don't see my Shepard being comfortable with this either. Besides, all these sentiment bear a close resemblance to "you have to take out their families" by some guy I don't want to name. I think you accommodate the way you feel with certain character with the facts the game present the character to us. First, please, show me the link where Brandon Keener states all the things you say about Garrus. And then, please, explain me why you don't quote the Garrus' writers, basically Mac Walters and John Dombrow who seem more suitable explaining a character more than a voice actor. Second, the Council thing in ME1: do you know that ALL characters, with maybe the exception of Liara, can potentially suggest let the council die in ME1? It deppends on the combination of squadmates you choose: Tali-Garrus: Tali suggest let the council die, Garrus don't; Tali-Wrex: Tali suggest save the council, Wrex let it die; Garrus-Kaidan: Garrus pro death, Kaidan pro live; Kaidan-Liara: Kaidan pro death, Liara pro life. Third: You sistematically twist your arguments in order to make Garrus a monster because you don't like him. You can hate him, the Galaxy is free, and if hating him motivates you that's good. But don't pretend you are not personally biased. You are speaking things they are not canon. Canonically, nothing you say it's true. If I'm wrong, please, tell me what in which point it's canon Kaidan helped in Shepard's case. In which point is canon Shepard almost faced DEATH in the Alliance trial when that trial was merely a pantomime for the Public Opinion. You made that things in your head, that is canon for you, but don't pretend that is canon for the rest of us. Precisaly the best thing of this game and the reason why I replayed so many times is how I can fulfill the gaps of information making my own canon. So, take your GarrusMengele if you like it, but please, Garrus Mengele? Really?
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Post by yan on Aug 29, 2016 14:45:07 GMT
Quick update. Already beat the game and dont know if I said before, but im a Talimancer =p I engage romance with her ten times or more, but I also made a run with Liara and Miranda too. That said, Kaidan's romance trumps the others o_0 I found it very good and sweet. Best part is when he's allowed to go back to Normandy and then, Shepard checked on his ass and then smile Ah Shep, you dog.
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Post by yan on Aug 29, 2016 14:47:07 GMT
Maybe next time I go with Garrus
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Beregond5
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Post by Beregond5 on Aug 29, 2016 16:45:39 GMT
Maybe next time I go with Garrus If you do, have fun!
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Post by saberchic on Aug 29, 2016 16:50:00 GMT
During the six months incarceration period and Shepard's trial, it was only Hackett, Anderson and Kaidan/Ashley who testify for Shepard and manage to convince the tribunal from convicting Shepard as a war criminal. None of ME2 characters stayed with Shepard for this including Miranda Lawson who could testify that Shepard doesn't have a choice about working with Cerberus and how she rebuild Shepard from death. But even among all old squadmates, Liara still working with Hackett to find a way to destroy the reapers, Tali becoming an Admiral for her people, Wrex uniting his people with the intention to prepare themselves for reaper invasion (he did said it himself). But Garrus spend exactly three years sitting on his butt rather than talk to his father and his uncle Fedorian about the reapers and choose exactly last minute to convince his people to prepare against the invasion... which does absolutely nothing since he hardly affect any war assets anyway. But considering Sparatus answers directly to the Primarch, doesn't this make it ironic that he always openly ridicule Shepard? You have a bro who have the most political pull on Turian Hiararchy via nepotism to make them take Shepard seriously and he does exactly nothing? This is how Garrus think. Eve is admirable for enduring the genophage but that child doesn't deserve to live. That child is Wrex's son. When he said if it was up to him he would accept the Dalatrass offer. It showed the extend of his bigotry toward the krogan race. He believed killing Krogan babies as the right way to oppress another race, whose only crime was their longevity and threatening presence to the dominant power structure in Council space. Garrus could easily wipe out an entire generation of children and kill Wrex's son if he have the power to do so. This wasn't something I would casually forgive and dress up as a simple character flaw because Garrus romance is the most adorable thing ever. Its even more disgusting that Wrex even considered him as a friend. Understand that the Genophage cure is only a mutagen that mutate endocrine organs functions to allow live birth. It didn't correct the original and modified genophage strain at all. Even with the a possibility of Krogan Empire under Wreav, it would take them centuries to build up the numbers. And even then, the Human are allied with them and the Turians owed their lives to them. The only ones who are threatened by the rise of the Krogan was really just the Salarians and the Asari. The extend of Renegade Kaidan's stance was that the alien council was useless as f. He'll never go all out racist even if you tried. There's no ambient dialogue of Kaidan wishing death and extinction on all aliens and their children either. Ok, I'm still wondering; how would any of the others' testimony help since none of them were aware of the Arrival mission that Shepard underwent alone? Especially since they're part of a team hired by Cerberus? Wouldn't their accounts be considered highly suspect? As for the events of ME2, everyone was working their own agenda. Wrex was trying to unite the krogan (and only making progress because the genophage was working in his favor). Tali went back to her people...and does research that got dropped in ME3. Nothing relating to the Reapers. Liara went off after the Shadow Broker and didn't really make any progress with stopping the Reapers. Until after ME2, same time as when Garrus went to his father for help. But he didn't know his father could take his concerns to the Primarch. He was grasping at straws for anything at that point. He's still doing something about the Reapers, same way he contributed in the suicide mission by offering weaponry that kept people alive, by helping Shepard stay alive in missions for people who choose to take him along. His contributions are tangible to those players. We don't know what Kaidan's been doing, we can speculate he's been training his biotic squad, doing investigations for the alliance, all we know is that he refused to help Shepard for legitimate concerns and is not there. But that's not a strike against him whereas for some reason Garrus can do nothing right in your eyes. And what is odd is that you're singling out Garrus of all people regarding the genophage. What parts of his concerns regarding the krogan any different from what others think about them? When did he ever say he condones krogan suffering? When was he ever about oppressing another race? His concerns are legitimate; especially if Wreav is in charge. Who says it's only going to take centuries to repopulate if females can lay clutches of up to hundreds of eggs? Entire colony worlds never recovered because of krogan inhabitants. And that was when the Krogan were still allies of the Asari and Salarians. Alliances meant nothing when resources became strained during the Krogan rebellions. And as a side thought, why is it acceptable for Kaidan to become bigoted because of Shepard but Garrus is the next Godwin comparison for his flaws? A-fucking-men, opuspace! I like Kaidan, but did he do any better? NO!
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Post by natureguy85 on Aug 29, 2016 21:29:32 GMT
it'd be unfair to say Kaidan/Ashley sat back and wasted time while Shep faced a suicide mission without support from them. Kaidan/Ashley were clearly working though we weren't given enough information on what was going on. Thy helped build useless cannons named for something else the writer thought sounded cool but didn't bother reading the C But Garrus spend exactly three years sitting on his butt rather than talk to his father and his uncle Fedorian about the reapers and choose exactly last minute to convince his people to prepare against the invasion... which does absolutely nothing since he hardly affect any war assets anyway. But considering Sparatus answers directly to the Primarch, doesn't this make it ironic that he always openly ridicule Shepard? You have a bro who have the most political pull on Turian Hiararchy via nepotism to make them take Shepard seriously and he does exactly nothing? This is how Garrus think. Eve is admirable for enduring the genophage but that child doesn't deserve to live. That child is Wrex's son. When he said if it was up to him he would accept the Dalatrass offer. It showed the extend of his bigotry toward the krogan race. He believed killing Krogan babies as the right way to oppress another race, whose only crime was their longevity and threatening presence to the dominant power structure in Council space. Garrus could easily wipe out an entire generation of children and kill Wrex's son if he have the power to do so. This wasn't something I would casually forgive and dress up as a simple character flaw because Garrus romance is the most adorable thing ever. Its even more disgusting that Wrex even considered him as a friend. Understand that the Genophage cure is only a mutagen that mutate endocrine organs functions to allow live birth. It didn't correct the original and modified genophage strain at all. Even with the a possibility of Krogan Empire under Wreav, it would take them centuries to build up the numbers. And even then, the Human are allied with them and the Turians owed their lives to them. The only ones who are threatened by the rise of the Krogan was really just the Salarians and the Asari. The extend of Renegade Kaidan's stance was that the alien council was useless as f. He'll never go all out racist even if you tried. There's no ambient dialogue of Kaidan wishing death and extinction on all aliens and their children either. Please realize that Miranda would be arrested for being a high level Cerberus operative. She wouldn't be given the leniency Joker, Chakwas, or the two engineers received. This is particularly true once Cerberus became involved in the plot once more, starting with murdering Alliance personnel, though that's after. Please tell me where it's stated that: 1) the VS testified for Shepard. (And what would they testify considering they are suspicious of Shepard's involvement with Cerberus, even suggesting that Cerberus is manipulating him/her?) 2) Garrus is for killing Krogan children vs what he thinks is preventing them from ever being alive in the first place. (Argument on when life begins aside; just roll with it for sake of genophage argument.) 3) "that the Genophage cure is only a mutagen that mutate endocrine organs functions to allow live birth. It didn't correct the original and modified genophage strain at all." I don't remember any of these things but I only played ME3 once. Garrus' concerns about the Krogan are legitimate. He knows it as the thing that ended the Krogan Rebellions. He has reason to think they will be a problem again. There is one major flaw there that he shares with the Dalatrass, but I'll address that a bit later. Remember that, for good or ill, the races in Mass Effect are given the " planet of hats" treatment and discussed in a monolithic way. Also, as was mentioned, Wrex is only able to pacify the Krogan under his control because of the Genophage. Once that is removed, they don't have a lot of incentive to follow. The game says they do so we have to go with that, but that is an argument after the fact. That said, the concern over what the Krogan will do is silly because long term problems only matter if you survive that long. It's just a matter of which will help more between Krogan and Salarian support. Considering ships and research are far more important than footsoldiers, I can't blame a practical Renegade for taking the offer. (I would like to know why you can lie to Wrex/Wreave but not the Dalatrass. How would she know if the Genophage is cured or not? Probably because everyone would do that, the same reason Destroy kills the Geth and EDI.)
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Post by opuspace on Aug 29, 2016 21:41:36 GMT
Renegade Kaidan's views that the council was inefficient is not bigotry. The council are always self-serving and acts on their races' best interest. But regardless of his point of view in ME1, he still risk his life to protect the council. That never change. Kaidan is not perfect nor anyone's cup of tea and is deathly boring to many but he never wish to inflict genocide on anyone. Neither did Ashley either and yet everyone claim she's more racist. The trial isn't just about the Bahak system incident (and preventing an outright war between Batarians and humanity) but its also to determine Shepard role in Cerberus and the kidnapping of the colonists in the Terminus system. Shepard could have been executed by the end of the trial if it wasn't for the Admirals and Virmire Survivor. As much as either Kaidan and Ashley receiving the heat for refusing to join Shepard's suicide team on Horizon, the only ones who stayed from ME2 crew are Joker, Chakwas, Ken and Gabby who was with the Normandy was it was impounded. That's barely a handful to defend Shepard who was being accused for treason. Liara did mention that she was using the Shadow Broker resources to find more prothean resources she could use and she did found the plans for the Crucible from the Shadow Broker resources and Hackett's help. Tali was involved when the Quarians attacked the Geth in the Perseus Veil which lead them to ally themselves to the Reapers and she and Legion was essential to build peace and help during the reaper war. Wrex commited his troops to Shepard if you resolve his thousand years old dilemma. Kaidan's biotic company also deals with training other biotics in the military much like Jack's teenage team, and Ashley used her experience and rank and both did contribute to the war assets if not used as a squadmate. That's still contribution to Shepard's fight against the reapers. EDI talk about the clutches was merely a discussion about the possibility of the Krogan achieving full fertility pre-Genophage. The krogan never have that for over a thousand years. The genophage isn't cured and still affect the fertility rate of all krogan. The cure only affect pregnant mothers to enable them to carry children alive and full term by preventing the genophage attempting to inhibit nervous system formation. Plus the society impact on the krogan people for a thousand years that trapped their females by being valued as nothing but breeders and decoys because their entire race would die off. Garrus only let go of his prejudice on Quarians because he fancied Tali. Turian-Krogan alliance and Rannoch arc still happen and resolved with or without him. His only significant contribution to the reaper ME3 was an additional squadmate, romance sideplot and : If it wasn't for his people who need the krogan's help, he would be happy to not see the krogan ever be cured at all. This is not an attack on your favourite LI. I don't make this up just to be spiteful. Brandon Keener himself voiced Garrus who said these things. How the krogan need to be more contrite for defying the council races or how the genophage isn't a mistake or how he would side with the Salarian Dalatrass. There's not a single line in his entire script that he took that statement back that convince me that he let go of his prejudice against the krogan or even try to understand what the genophage is and its effect and the cure and the science and everyone involved including every other Turians who were willing to sacrifice themselves to preserve the krogan alliance. He just accept that Shepard make the choice he wouldn't make and enjoy that he doesn't have any responsibility over it (because that's what he's good at). He claim the name Archangel but all I could think of was he was closest to Josef Mengele, aptly called Angel of Death. This is what made the idea of romancing him somewhat troublesome for me. I am well aware of the hype about Garrus' romance, I have attempted them as well (and pretty much prefer SWTOR's Trooper and Aric Jorgan romance instead). But I don't romanticize someone who would casually whisper that he would unleash a genocide "if it was up to him" and I don't see my Shepard being comfortable with this either. Besides, all these sentiment bear a close resemblance to "you have to take out their families" by some guy I don't want to name. [If Kaidan was persuaded to be anti-alien] Ash backed those salarians until the very end. And we still can’t get any respect. If they don’t want to do anything, they should get the hell out of our way. It could only improve things if the Alliance was in charge. o Paragon – That’ a bit harsh: That’s throwing the baby out with the bathwater, don’t you think? • Kaidan: What? That isn’t what you’ve been pushing? Didn’t you make an argument for pushing the Council out? That the Alliance should demand its due instead of waiting to be accepted? • Paragon – No, nothing that drastic: Ease it back, Kaidan. I’m not talking revolution, just getting our due. o Kaidan: That’s not what I got out of it. Did I misread you? Geez, what else have I got wrong? • Paragon Persuade – I’m sorry if I mislead you: Sounds like I crossed some wires. I was probably angry after a rough day. I’m sorry. Let’s take a step back. • Kaidan: All right. I don’t want to get you wrong. I’ve got a lot tied up in this mission. I’ve got a lot tied up in you. [Skip to…No Bull] • Renegade Intimidate – These things take time: Whether they want to or not, they’ll have to listen to us. But they’re not the enemy. They’re just…misguided. • Kaidan: All right. I don’t want to get you wrong. I’ve got a lot tied up in this mission. I’ve got a lot tied up in you. [Skip to…No Bull] • Paragon – Settle down, soldier: Kaidan, there’s a difference between me ranting in private and us – I don’t know – launching a coup or something. [Same response branch as Renegade option] • Neutral – You took me too seriously: • Renegade – Doesn’t matter. I’m in charge: That’s why I wear the stars. If I change my mind, all you have to do is keep up. • Kaidan: Shepard, I was gearing up to confront the Council. As an officer, you should keep me in the loop. As a friend, I’d hope I wouldn’t have to remind you of that. Maybe – maybe I got the message wrong. This is a really drastic shift compared to what Kaidan started out with. Now, I don't consider that really part of Kaidan's character. But it is there, the same as Garrus' douchebag comments towards Tali and Wrex. In someone's playthrough, this side of Kaidan can be canon. He's arguing for overturning an entire established government. I'm glad they discarded that by ME2, but ME1 had some wtf moments here. As for Shepard's trial, where is it said that any humans that served with Shep during the suicide mission could sway public opinion? Again, no one was there; they can't vouch for Shepard because no one knows what's going on. We've only got Shepard's word alone. Anyone working with Shep is already biased and unreliable. And Shepard had just committed actual genocide on an entire colony for the sake of ruthless calculus. Again, no one on the team did anything useful relating to the Reapers before Shepard's resurrection. They all did last minute contributions before Shepard is released to stand trial. I'm not here to say Kaidan and Ashley did nothing. They did work their ass off for the Alliance as they should be. Who in their right mind would drop a military job and not expect consequences? But hey, that's Horizon's awful script for us. What I'm arguing is that the reasons for your dislike for Garrus are strangely applied in areas where he's not doing anything different from others. There's nothing distinct in what he believes that suggests it's any worse than what someone else already has. All the arguments made to defend Kaidan can also apply to Garrus; sure he'd have considered the Dalatrass' offer. He still will fight and risk his life to help the krogan get their cure. Until then, Wrex will explicitly withhold help. And there's still the question of how much should we trust the Krogan not to slip back into the Krogan Rebellions. Do we have proof that EDI was speculating about krogan fertility? It's too risky otherwise if we're not sure. In the meantime, is everyone being irrational for being nervous about the Krogan regaining their numbers? We have no certainties as to how long it'll take nor if the reforms will actually hold after the ending slides. And I am still looking for where Garrus condoned genocide. He discusses making the hard decisions but he's been consistently portrayed as someone who cares about people. Perhaps a bit too much. We see this time and time again. It's his Turian cultural teachings that has him bringing up the more calculating aspects of war, not his personal preferences. While it's fine to dislike a character and I wouldn't want to dismiss someone's thoughts about why they don't like someone, the way you portray him as being on the level of the Illusive Man and Miranda's father doesn't match up with his motivations and flaws. He learns from his mistakes (Does he not still apologize to Tali even when romanced?), he will still fight to protect people regardless of race.
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Post by opuspace on Aug 29, 2016 21:51:16 GMT
Maybe next time I go with Garrus You naughty Yan! Were you trying to pit fangirls against each other for a cat fight? Shame! SHAAAAAME!!
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Post by dalinne on Aug 29, 2016 23:53:07 GMT
Maybe next time I go with Garrus You naughty Yan! Were you trying to pit fangirls against each other for a cat fight? Shame! SHAAAAAME!!
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Post by yan on Aug 30, 2016 1:10:38 GMT
I declare myself innocent of all charges
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Post by Beregond5 on Aug 30, 2016 6:42:11 GMT
Oh, I don't know. There's always the other option...
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Post by dalinne on Aug 30, 2016 10:36:54 GMT
Oh, I don't know. There's always the other option... Well, Garrus is better in hand-to-hand combat but Kaidan is a pretty great Lx2 Biotic with flexibility... wait
THE SHIP HAS SAILED, I repeat: THE SHIP HAS SAILED!!!
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Post by SpiritVanguard on Aug 30, 2016 12:13:29 GMT
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Post by Beregond5 on Aug 30, 2016 13:40:20 GMT
Well, Garrus is better in hand-to-hand combat but Kaidan is a pretty great Lx2 Biotic with flexibility... wait
THE SHIP HAS SAILED, I repeat: THE SHIP HAS SAILED!!! I'm having way too much fun with this.
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Post by dalinne on Aug 30, 2016 13:52:47 GMT
Well, Garrus is better in hand-to-hand combat but Kaidan is a pretty great Lx2 Biotic with flexibility... wait
THE SHIP HAS SAILED, I repeat: THE SHIP HAS SAILED!!! I'm having way too much fun with this. I'm dying with this. There are fanfictions with Kaidan&Garrus pairing. And Garrus&Kaidan&MaleShep/FemShep WHY wasn't aware of this? WHY??? We deserve this, guys. WE DESERVE THIS!!
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Post by Beregond5 on Aug 30, 2016 14:06:48 GMT
I'm dying with this. There are fanfictions with Kaidan&Garrus pairing. And Garrus&Kaidan&MaleShep/FemShep WHY wasn't aware of this? WHY??? We deserve this, guys. WE DESERVE THIS!! TO THE NEAREST FANFICTION ARCHIVE! You know... for research.
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Post by SpiritVanguard on Aug 31, 2016 1:18:47 GMT
I actually saw this pic the other day and it's still making me laugh every time I see it. We should've known that the only way to bridge the fan gap was to combine our loves! And I admit now I've been thinking about what kind of relationship this pair would have...
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Post by dalinne on Aug 31, 2016 2:11:08 GMT
I actually saw this pic the other day and it's still making me laugh every time I see it. We should've known that the only way to bridge the fan gap was to combine our loves! And I admit now I've been thinking about what kind of relationship this pair would have... Obviously this two would work awesomely in good-cop-bad-cop dynamic: Kaidan, the new C-Sec Officer, a paragon, diplomatic person, by the rules kind of guy. Papa Vakarian wants to adopt him inmediately. Garrus, a veteran C-Sec Officer who is sick of red tape and paperwork because he thinks that interfers with his job. Bailey wants to fund a club "Anti-Rules Cops" but Executor Pallin decides Garrus must have a new partner. They don't agree at first because their differences about how approach cases but at the end Kaidan loosen up a little and Garrus learns the value of playing by the book... ...sort of
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Post by SpiritVanguard on Aug 31, 2016 3:18:13 GMT
Obviously this two would work awesomely in good-cop-bad-cop dynamic: Kaidan, the new C-Sec Officer, a paragon, diplomatic person, by the rules kind of guy. Papa Vakarian wants to adopt him inmediately. Garrus, a veteran C-Sec Officer who is sick of red tape and paperwork because he thinks that interfers with his job. Bailey wants to fund a club "Anti-Rules Cops" but Executor Pallin decides Garrus must have a new partner. They don't agree at first because their differences about how approach cases but at the end Kaidan loosen up a little and Garrus learns the value of playing by the book... ** ...sort of LOL luv that gif. And to quote EDI: "I reasoned along similar lines."
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Post by opuspace on Aug 31, 2016 3:45:01 GMT
Dalinne Funny thing is that in the Citadel dlc, they do mention which role they'd have as good cop, bad cop! Kaidan: And here I had my good cop routine worked out... Garrus: And here I had my bad cop routine worked out... (Unless that was your point all along. In that case, carry on!)
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Post by dalinne on Aug 31, 2016 4:29:29 GMT
Dalinne Funny thing is that in the Citadel dlc, they do mention which role they'd have as good cop, bad cop! Kaidan: And here I had my good cop routine worked out... Garrus: And here I had my bad cop routine worked out... (Unless that was your point all along. In that case, carry on!) I knew the inspiration was coming from somewhere!! Nah, I didn't have a point, I'm just bored studying and right now the forum is like the salvation Edit: it seems like someone (FluffyNinjaLlama of course!) has made a video with all the companions in the casino. Garrus comments come right after Kaidan's. It's so great
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Post by Ms. Noxxy on Sept 10, 2016 22:15:05 GMT
I found Garrus more fun and "my type" Did try Kaidan once, but it just wasn't for me. Especially Citadel DLC was something to wait every time (yes, lots of playthroughs) with Garrus "Lucky for you, Archangel is your boyfriend" yes, please...
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Post by yan on Nov 11, 2016 21:55:02 GMT
I´m back, couldn't stay away for too long. I was not in the mood to play 1st, so I grabbed the same save that had the Romance with Kaidan and I started from there. Already made Horizon and this image resume my Shep´s current situation. Damn Garrus, talk to me
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Post by dalinne on Nov 11, 2016 22:03:52 GMT
I´m back, couldn't stay away for too long. I was not in the mood to play 1st, so I grabbed the same save that had the Romance with Kaidan and I started from there. Already made Horizon and this image resume my Shep´s current situation. Damn Garrus, talk to me Oh boy, that feeling... There is EVEN A SONG OF THAT!!! (with a beautiful voice)
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