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Post by Rascoth on Sept 26, 2020 16:27:28 GMT
That would be nice. I just hope that, in case we'd get quests from them, they're better marked than Miner in Forbidden Oasis. Or not marked at all. She could get me sooo confused with her marker. I think headdesking over trying to find her in that maze was half the point. I'd expect a whole caravan would be a tad easier to spot... Maybe you're right. And then reaching her is another puzzle. She did once fall down the ledge and got stuck on the wall in a place where I couldn't reach her from any side. I had to leave Forbidden Oasis and come back in hopes she'd spawn somewhere else. Fortunately that happened only once I think you underestimate people's ability to overlook things
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Post by AlleluiaElizabeth on Oct 3, 2020 14:06:04 GMT
I've yet to play any game that had an enjoyable underwater section. Such sections are invariably disorientating, annoying and confusing. combat is frustrating and the end result usually ends up being 'that one level'. In fact the only games I can think of that had a bearable underwater section were 'Flood zone' in the original Duke Nukem 3D, because it was pretty short, linear, and only half of the map was actually underwater; and Bioshock 2, because you were walking on the ocean floor rather than swimming. Final Fantasy 14 has nice underwater areas, but they also notably don't have combat. Its just traversal/exploration/resource gathering with the occasional quest objective. I agree, underwater combat is usually bleh. Though GW2 wasn't toooo horrible.
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Post by sandwichtern on Dec 20, 2020 12:58:03 GMT
So, given that there have now been a couple of concept art pictures depicting either underwater or waterfront fights and exploration, I thought this would be a good time for pictures of two bridge varieties I wouldn't mind seeing in future games. Pontoon bridges, aka floating bridges, are made by connecting together several boats or floats and have been in use since ancient times, both during wartime and peacetime. Their temporary nature is their best advantage: they can be assembled and disassembled relatively quick, e.g. to let other river traffic through, and high tide or flood can't submerge them. I'm also a big fan of arch bridges, both wooden and stone-made. The Japanese Kintai bridge is one the most famous and its profile looks completely different depending on the water level. I've never been on an arch bridge which consists of several archs but I found a photo taken by someone standing on the highest point of the Kintai bridge (the 3rd pic under the spoiler) and the view is very cinematic. If combined with a Nightingale floor, walking on this kind of bridge could provide a memorable experience. The Kintai bridge when water is low... ... and the same bridge when it's high. The view on top of an arch bridge. The view from under the Kintai bridge. A Swiss arch bridge made of stone. A stone bridge from Kromlau, Germany. Also, since it looks like we'll be venturing into areas fouled by red lyrium or Ghilan'nain's brine pools, I'm anticipating we'll get to see dead forests. I like the ominous mood in this picture with its dead grass, ancient statues and a shadowy entrance to a forest: if you changed the pic to having yellow grass start at edge of the forest and have the statues mark and guard the unspoiled areas of the land, you could easily turn it into the opening scene in Horror of Hormak in which the wardens are sensing that something feels wrong in the Nevarran forest they are in. Also, I found a perfect inspiration picture for a blighted tree, the Bracilian jabuticaba tree. It grows its fruits directly on its trunk which makes the tree look like it has been taken over by some parasitic plant. The tree is also very peculiar looking during its bloom, so if DA developers are looking for plants with a wow effect in their environments (like the trees in MEA which were clearly inspired by baobab trees), I'd say this tree would certainly do the trick. Inspired by it, I could also also easily imagine visuals of entire trees taken over by toadstool or other mushrooms.
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Post by legbamel on Dec 20, 2020 14:16:50 GMT
Say what you will about gameplay, but Anthem did some lovely things with verticality and water. You could dive into a lake, find a cave or ruin and some resources, watch the pretty fish and turtles, and then go the other way and pop out of a cave or pipe and be hundreds of feet in the air with water cascading away beneath your feet. Swimming around is one of my favorite things in that game.
And flying, but that's a much bigger leap for DA, pun defintely intended. As much as I would adore big, fluffy, cranky griffons I feel like flying would turn into a huge focus for the game and take a lot of resources and attention away from the rest of the game's design. Keep us on and under the ground, please. Let me explore nooks and crannies in an urban environment or delve into the Deep Roads. I want something tighter than soaring around on my beautiful mount could give me. I feel like the entire focus would get shifted to what it looked like from on high with less attention to the details below.
That said, a flying section in the Fade would be more than welcome, particularly if it's concurrent with juicy lore and a dreamscape worthy of the name.
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Post by AlleluiaElizabeth on Dec 20, 2020 14:20:10 GMT
Kay, well I don't get anxiety, but if I did, that would trigger it. Sheesh. o.o
EDIT: Actually, no. Now that I think about it, its giving me Death Stranding flashbacks. lol
A stone bridge from Kromlau, Germany. Well, that's just flexing now, Germany. (Seriously, I love that bridge.) The nightingale floor thing is cool. I'm just imagining, though, players enter some temple in Tevinter and the floor chirps whenever they walk on it, and there's a codex explaining the concept, but its in a REALLY hard to find place so everyone just thinks the devs put the wrong sound effect on the floor. lol
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Post by arvaarad on Dec 20, 2020 15:50:37 GMT
Say what you will about gameplay, but Anthem did some lovely things with verticality and water. I often wonder whether some games are made explicitly as testbeds for future games. Basically, “if we spend a bunch of time experimenting with these mechanics internally, that would be expensive, but if we bundle them into a game, we can recoup some of the R&D cost — even if the sales are modest.” Plus the advantages of having a real playerbase banging on the mechanic... devs could tweak the behavior, learn some things, and then reuse the mechanic in a flagship game once it’s ultra-polished. Maybe some of the games outside observers see as “flops”, studio folks were thinking sweet, that helped subsidize some extra research for our next game.
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Post by fairdragon on Dec 26, 2020 11:48:40 GMT
Well they HAVE criminally reduced Val Royeaux to a market square... So your worry is not unfounded... On the other hand, Bioware has a history of drastically overreacting to fan criticism, like how 95% of Inquisition takes place in wilderness and ruins after fans griped about not getting outside Kirkwall. So... the next game will take place 90% in Minrathous, going by history. Please no. Then they better take DAI Val Royeaux as exemple and make it a bit bigger and more detailed, with big building in the background. Don't go back to DA2. That was pure horror.
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Post by fairdragon on Dec 26, 2020 13:15:56 GMT
I would like: About 10 main location like in Origin. 1. A forest location but better than Brecilian Forest. something like Lothlorien 2. Antiva (Antiva city), but similar to the size of denerim. 3. Tevinter (Minrathous). It would be really hard to make it right. Maybe the best way would be to show us only the inside. like the market place concept art. 4. Anderfals or only weisshaupt like in the concept art. 5. coast like the stormy coast with this Colours. 6. mountain + snow 7. a red lyrium place. 8. a garden maybe 9. wide plains, but smaller than the hinterlands 10. and at least a Village.
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Post by fairdragon on Dec 26, 2020 14:22:20 GMT
What I don't want: - only one sort of landscape like DA2 - labyrinth like DAO (the only think i don't like in DAO) - anything i have to controle like swimming, riding and flying. If people want it than to chose.
Not the right topig but i would love better dance cinematics. Orlai was good, but too stiff. Maybe in a romance, something like street dance.
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Post by Heimdall on Dec 26, 2020 16:45:33 GMT
On the other hand, Bioware has a history of drastically overreacting to fan criticism, like how 95% of Inquisition takes place in wilderness and ruins after fans griped about not getting outside Kirkwall. So... the next game will take place 90% in Minrathous, going by history. Please no. Then they better take DAI Val Royeaux as exemple and make it a bit bigger and more detailed, with big building in the background. Don't go back to DA2. That was pure horror. Well, from what we’ve seen in what was revealed it seems like we’ll be getting a few cities, including Minrathous and potentially Antiva City. Not much wilderness to be seen, so I think we’ll get a lot more city to play with, but still seems like a lot of city.
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Post by Adia on Dec 27, 2020 10:59:07 GMT
I want wilderness and cities to be combined. I don't want "this area is a city, this area is just landscape" like they did in ME:A and DA:I. Because it made the experience very disconnected, and what really do I have to "explore" and "discover" in landscapes if I can't find any ancient city or hidden town or anything of that magnitude. I know that technically it may be tough but well... figure it out The most important thing for me when it comes to environment is unique environments on every map. I don't want enter a new place and feel like I've been there before. To me, it's a huge problem in DA:I and ME:A. - No more dwarven ruins / caves that have architecture that looks exactly the same in 4 different areas of the continent.
- No more remnant sites or vaults that look exactly the same on every new planet I visit.
Architecture is not a monolith. Every artist takes inspiration from what already exists and puts their own spin on it. Look at Germany for example. Even within the country there's variation as to how their architecture looks like. I know dwarves can't dream, but they have the ability to be creative. I hope. These repeated environments are not engaging. They're a chore and after I've seen them for the first few times I really don't want to see them again unless there's at least some kind of change made to them (color, lighting, meshes, anything unique). It makes exploring very unexciting. "Look at this area that you've seen before but now instead of being in B map, it's in C map!". At the end of the day, anytime you reuse assets they become less valuable, unique and exciting. I loved fighting the Remnant Architect. I didn't love fighting it 5 times, which is the exact time it's repeated in the game. I think the main key is to reuse assets smartly and sparingly. Sorry if my post came off as a little ranty.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Dec 27, 2020 13:30:28 GMT
Adia To be fair both examples kind of make sense. Dwarves are established as being super mired in tradition so it makes sense they’d all follow an established style. And the Remnant Vaults may have been constructed by Remnant so machines following the same programming would create similar products.
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Post by Adia on Dec 27, 2020 20:44:38 GMT
Adia To be fair both examples kind of make sense. Dwarves are established as being super mired in tradition so it makes sense they’d all follow an established style. And the Remnant Vaults may have been constructed by Remnant so machines following the same programming would create similar products. Making sense doesn't make them interesting. It's incredibly boring to look at and experience, and making excuses for it with lore isn't going to change that. Does it make sense that fade rift open all over Thedas? sure. Are fade rifts (all 80 of them) in the game anything more than a non dynamic, non strategic, repeated asset that recycle the same mobs again and again? You can bet on it.
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Post by Hrungr on Dec 31, 2020 8:37:31 GMT
I like some of the elements that are happening here in this bathhouse image. The low red canvas roof and lighting give it a nice vibe, maybe spruce it up a bit. Not that exciting, but I like this one as an example of how to make an area a little more interesting. The ruin is a ruin, but you add a flock of sheep (or something) milling about and now you've given it a mood. While not that impressive an image on its own, it is an example of adding colour to fog/distance fog to help bring out the mood of an area. Then any contrasting colours you bring in really pop (like torches, spells, etc.). A phosphorescent stream, especially if there were some varying/shifting tones, set against a contrasting environment would be quite striking. The low waterfall and the people sitting and watching are a nice touch.
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Post by Rascoth on Dec 31, 2020 10:08:26 GMT
While not that impressive an image on its own, it is an example of adding colour to fog/distance fog to help bring out the mood of an area. Then any contrasting colours you bring in really pop (like torches, spells, etc.). I really like this effect. And while I don't like the outcome every single time (usually due to me simply disliking chosen colour), I'd love to see more of it.
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Post by sandwichtern on Dec 31, 2020 16:31:46 GMT
Nice pictures as always, Hrungr. I especially liked that chandelier. Speaking of lights and lighting, besides candles and torches I'd like to see both ancient and modern oil lamps used as a source of light in DA games. When we're exploring very old caves and tombs coming across clay lamps or even rushlights would make more sense than candles. In its simplest form an oil lamp consists of a bowl, oil and a wick, but a lamp can also have several wicks or take the form of a mythical animal. Interestingly I also came across oil lamps made to resemble faces. In DAI we found those ancient statues of porcine faces and I think they would also make for excellent scary lamps. I also like modern versions of oil lamps which switch clay to glass and maybe add colored oil, ornamental stones or colourful flowers to make them stand out. Since glass windows featured prominently in DAI, presenting ideas concerning them is probably a fool's errand, but I came across pictures of opalised blue glass that, when shone with light, gave an orange shadow. It's apparently caused by Tyndall effect. I think windows made of this type glass could look very neat - or perhaps you could have a statue holding a globe, a halla or something else made of this kind glass which, when shone with light, would expose some hidden clue or shape. Also, if we're going to be thrown in the middle of Tevinter-Qunari war and had a night-time mission, I wouldn't mind if we could use sky lanterns for military purposes for which they were originally invented.
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Post by Hrungr on Jan 16, 2021 8:44:16 GMT
Although this is for Unreal, I'm loving the progress being made for accumulating snowfall. I remember Frostbite was experimenting with this (and seasonal changes in general) during the early development of Anthem, but we haven't seen any progress on that since then. Fingers crossed we might see some implementation in DA4.
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Post by Hrungr on Jan 16, 2021 21:06:52 GMT
Just a couple of random thoughts today... I like the colour gradation and variation happening in this flask. It'd be nice to see some more interesting things like this with fluids in general. Disaster films. Just imagine you're running along when disaster strikes and huge sections of the earth just fall away from out in front of you. It's a very strong visual if done right.
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Post by gervaise21 on Jan 16, 2021 21:15:51 GMT
It's a very strong visual if done right. You mean like when the bridge collapsed in front of us at Adamant and we fell....into the Fade.
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Post by Hrungr on Jan 16, 2021 21:29:33 GMT
It's a very strong visual if done right. You mean like when the bridge collapsed in front of us at Adamant and we fell....into the Fade. Yeah, but scale the event up 100x. And you don't necessarily have to use it to dunk the party, just being awe-inspiring to witness is enough.
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Post by sandwichtern on Jan 19, 2021 12:52:29 GMT
Let's talk about salt and brine pools. So apparently brine pools are deepsea lakes. They are filled with super-salty seawater that looks like dark grey curdled milk when disturbed. Some of them sit like hot tubs at the seafloor, with only a thin edge keeping normal seawater and brine from mixing. An Argentinian salt lake pool whose water resembles that of a brine pool (i.e. the same curdled appearance) However the wardens hadn't needed to dive to reach the pool in the Hormak story. If we get a chance to visit more than one brine pool I'm hoping there will be some variance in the water colour of the pools. Salt evaporation ponds are manmade ponds created for harvesting salt. Ponds which are low- to mid-salinity are green in colour while mid- to high-salinity ponds are red, pink, and orange in colour. (This does raise the question if green and red lyrium are suffering from some sort of salt poisoning. 🤨) What I'd especially like to see is salt ponds which are gorgeously pink. If Ghilan'nain's brine pools can only be of specific colour, perhaps we could see salt ponds on the coast of Tevinter. After all, historically salt business was lucrative.
San Francisco Bay salt ponds Salt flats of Camargue, France Speaking of salt, do you know what absolutely hates salt? Glowing slime. Glowing slime is a slime mold that exists in underground caverns and the Deep Roads. When it detects the warmth of a living creature it attacks with great speed and envelops its prey. Fire and salt are capable of injuring the slime and thus some miners place trails of rock salt in passages and doorways to defend against it. A couple pages past I talked about the cave ceilings in Sundermount and Descent's Heidrun thaig reminding me of glowworms. So guess what, the glowing slime is blue-green in colour, and now I'm suspecting it's this slime mold what we've been seing. As salt pools seem be in our future itinerary, I'm strongly advocating that we also have a glowing slime extermination quest. For the biggest impact I'd have the quest take place in a cave that has quartz crystals.
quartz Like sugar, quartz is known for a quality called triboluminescence, that is, it glows when struck, crushed, scratched, or broken. Imagine a torch going out during this quest and someone hitting a quartz crystal instead of rock salt with their weapon. Cue pretty blue light and someone, probably a dwarf, cussing others for not being able to tell salt from mineral.
Here's a gif of the phenomenon with a hard sugar candy getting crushed. This post was originally supposed to be about salt, but here's also a video about a car driving on a floating bridge in Hubei, China.
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Post by jrpN7 on Jan 25, 2021 16:57:26 GMT
So many people here saying they don't recall any underwater missions? What about ME3's DLC Leviathan? I agree we need more like this. I LOVED this mission. Something about the depths that is so mysterious and spooky. It scratched an itch I didn't know I had. ...now I want to play ME3. Hurry up, Remaster!
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Post by Pounce de León on Jan 25, 2021 17:05:27 GMT
I think subnautica players might have something to say for underwater. I know underwater worlds only from sim backgrounds. I'd like alpine mountain regions.
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Post by Hrungr on Jan 25, 2021 17:32:07 GMT
So many people here saying they don't recall any underwater missions? What about ME3's DLC Leviathan? It's more that extensive underwater adventures are rare in RPGs. Most are brief forays for as long as the protag can hold their breath. Even Leviathan is what... 2 min of actual underwater "exploration"? The rest being dialogue and cutscenes. Unfortunately, it doesn't seem likely in any case, if Jon Renish's comments during his recent DA:O PT is any indication. On the underwater concept art, it should not be interpreted as a promise of gameplay.
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xerrai
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Post by xerrai on Jan 25, 2021 17:58:53 GMT
I think subnautica players might have something to say for underwater. I know underwater worlds only from sim backgrounds. I'd like alpine mountain regions. Yeah but Subnautica is more an exception to the rule than anything else. Beautiful biomes aside (blood kelp forest was my fav), one of the big reasons why it worked was because the controls actually felt fluid and the environment was for more than just show. Which makes sense since that was basically the entire game. Underwater portions in other games are mostly just side forays, with the devs only putting an understandable amount of limited effort into making them. It looks nice, the movement suffices, and the enemy (if there is one) is probably going to be a shark, squid or a variant therein. Or time. The ever-common and dreaded enemy of limited time. There's a part of me that wants to give newer games a chance in these underwater sections since technology really is coming a long way, but I've just been burned too many times when it comes to underwater sections. So let's just say I won't shed any tears if DA4 has no underwater portion to speak of...
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