azarhal
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Post by azarhal on Jun 12, 2022 21:49:27 GMT
Ok, rewatched, looked at some screen captures too and my conclusions are: - Bethesda jank is still there. - Looks like there is a dialogue system that support both a persuasion mechanic and background/traits unlocked dialogue options..but they didn't show it, it's just mentioned in skills/traits. - Some of the skills ranks are unlocked via challenges instead of buying them with "points", looks like a different way of doing "raise skills via usage" to me. - This game won't support joining all the factions at the same time (going by traits wording and the way the Crimson Pirates sound super territorials about membership) - There seems to be some weird religions in 2330, we might have some joinable religious factions with it (maybe not as important as the others) - There are companions (mentioned in a trait) - Some of the custom ships seems to have lots of cargo containers, so I suspect we can be traders. It's not all about chasing after or being pirates, outside the main story. Also one of the starting "class" is Long Hauler. - We need more lore about the game... - Neuroamps being good for parlor tricks is mentioned in the description of the "cyberneticist", this makes me think the game has some sort "powers" skills, even if there is no skill tree for it - Speak of skill trees: Physical, Social, Combat, Science and Tech - I find it hilarious that the starting "classes" include Chef, Bouncer, Professor and Homesteader. - Ship building can have a big impact on ship LY jumping, I've seen 18LY to 30LY there. - Despite not showing it, melee weapons are mentioned in certain skill descriptions. There will be an extended preview next Tuesday! Cyberneticist is what a fan of the Green ending in ME3 is.
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Post by smilesja on Jun 12, 2022 22:31:43 GMT
I really loved the ship building aspect. It looks accessible and customizable! For the first time, I'm going to spend hours building my ship! XD Also liked the many backgrounds that you can choose it makes for deeper roleplaying.
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Post by AnDromedary on Jun 12, 2022 23:01:30 GMT
Guys, can I just quickly say .... I AM SO FUCKING HYPED!!!!! This really was exactly what I was hoping for. I had a couple of fears about the game design and a couple of hopes and they dissuaded all of my fears and delivered on all the hopes! - Deus Ex like gun combat, no VATS or any such shenanigans - Character system with a mix of perk unlock and learn-by-use improvements - No more door loading screens - Freelancer Style space combat - Fully explorable planets with points of interest (this is the most important, combine that with modding support and the possibilities are endless) - Planets with different gravities and zero-g combat Also, huge bonus for the kinds of different environments we've already seen. So sure, it's Bethesda, still some of the old stuff visible (e.g. in the faces during dialogues and whatnot) and it'll probably be buggy as hell and have 1000 other problems but I don't care. This looks by far the closest to a single player Star Citizen with modding capability that we've ever seen and I am here for it. Man, can't wait to get my hands on this.
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Post by hoku on Jun 12, 2022 23:12:50 GMT
Never played a Bethesda game so far, not interested in any of their other worlds/IPs. Very happy we finally got more information and visuals.
This all feels like a single player story RPG, a multiplayer "loot grinder" + open world game smashed together into 1. = Not really liking that. Hope I can do a streamlined "primary story" play trough first, followed by an open world spaceship/fraction whatever I want. was not impressed by the game play & game engine overall, looked kinda sluggish/not really fluid - especially walking/running/jumping around parts. Thus the game play looked very dated - expected at least MEA fluidity/smoothness. too many (1 thousand +?!) planets you can (but hopefully don't have to all) visit = I fear copy/paste empty auto generated grinding rinse/repeat worlds = highly skeptical of it all. Honestly would have preferred 10-20 or so unique ones that all at least contain 1 handmade hub/mission and the rest of the planet being free to explore. Yay character customization spaceship customization spaceship flying (and fighting) landing anywhere on a planet
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azarhal
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Post by azarhal on Jun 13, 2022 1:20:38 GMT
I really loved the ship building aspect. It looks accessible and customizable! For the first time, I'm going to spend hours building my ship! XD Also liked the many backgrounds that you can choose it makes for deeper roleplaying. Going by how it looks similar to Kinetic Void, it's going to be easy to build something, but making something fly great is probably going to require trial and errors (and be expensive). Each modules will impact different aspect of the ship (like handling, speed, energy level, etc). Never played a Bethesda game so far, not interested in any of their other worlds/IPs. Very happy we finally got more information and visuals. This all feels like a single player story RPG, a multiplayer "loot grinder" + open world game smashed together into 1. = Not really liking that. Hope I can do a streamlined "primary story" play trough first, followed by an open world spaceship/fraction whatever I want. was not impressed by the game play & game engine overall, looked kinda sluggish/not really fluid - especially walking/running/jumping around parts. Thus the game play looked very dated - expected at least MEA fluidity/smoothness. too many (1 thousand +?!) planets you can (but hopefully don't have to all) visit = I fear copy/paste empty auto generated grinding rinse/repeat worlds = highly skeptical of it all. Honestly would have preferred 10-20 or so unique ones that all at least contain 1 handmade hub/mission and the rest of the planet being free to explore. First rule of a Bethesda game: learn to enjoy the Jank! Because after 30 years, it is clearly not going away. Second rule of a Bethesda game: do whatever you want and remember that you don't have to do everything!I tend to focus on one storyline (one of the joinable factions or the main one) when I do a PT of an Elder Scroll game instead of trying to do all the content. It's a lot more focused that way. I never bothered with housing/base building in Skyrim or Fallout 4, but the one in this reminds me of Subnautica/Astroneer and I really liked it in both of those games. Third rule of a Bethesda game: they design open worlds the right way!
Nobody does open worlds like Bethesda, because everyone else is too busy trying to be realistic about it when Bethesda is just focusing on creating fun atmospheric simulated pocket worlds with lots of "dungeons". The 1000 planets probably include planets, moons and spacebases. One of the "planet" they showed in the trailer while talking about it looked like a moon. I think the most handcrafted worlds are going to be in the Settled Systems which is a subset of all the systems we will be able to explore. The rest are most likely going to be rather empty of anything human, because that is how things are when they aren't settled. Those places are probably mostly there to gather resources if we decide to do crafting or building settlements. Also, there is no atmo to planet surface manual landing form the looks of it (press X to land) and we can see markers from space (one says Structure) that shows point of interest. So no real need to walk all over the surface on them unless you want to. Will some planets feel the same, most probably. I'm pretty sure Mars feels similar to another red rock planet. We can see Mars in the trailer, the playable character pass right by the remains of the Curiosity rover (it was confirmed). Yes, the Sol system is in the game, so I expect Earth to have been blown up or something so they don't have to generate it. Fourth rule of a Bethesda game: their will be mods!It's already confirmed the game will support mods. In other words, Welcome to your new " spending hours installing mods before playing" overlord. ----- No multiplayer. They said Starfield was more like Skyrim (than Fallout), so enemies should drop the armor and weapons they were using and containers will have random loot tables. Most of the stuff you pick-up will be vendor trash.
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Post by smilesja on Jun 13, 2022 2:11:23 GMT
Ohhhh! Now I'm really interested in the traits!
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azarhal
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by azarhal on Jun 13, 2022 2:52:26 GMT
Ohhhh! Now I'm really interested in the traits! The majority feels more like background elements than "traits" to me. And the list confirms at least three religions: The Great Serpent, The Enlightened and Sanctum Universum.
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Post by Hrungr on Jun 13, 2022 4:25:57 GMT
What do you think the odds are that one of those 1,000+ worlds is Nirn/Tamriel/Starts-Loading-Skyrim-The-Moment-You-Land?
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Post by Hrungr on Jun 13, 2022 4:30:49 GMT
The majority feels more like background elements than "traits" to me. And the list confirms at least three religions: The Great Serpent, The Enlightened and Sanctum Universum. "The Great Serpent" sounds like a nod to the 7th Day Avent Hop-ists from Red Dwarf.
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Post by Unicephalon 40-D on Jun 13, 2022 7:07:10 GMT
The best: 3rd person view - I hope can combat properly with it too.
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Post by therevanchist25 on Jun 13, 2022 8:10:48 GMT
What do you think the odds are that one of those 1,000+ worlds is Nirn/Tamriel/Starts-Loading-Skyrim-The-Moment-You-Land? "Hey, you! You're finally awake!"
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Post by therevanchist25 on Jun 13, 2022 9:46:23 GMT
On a more serious note however. This is clearly just Fallout 4 in space. Which I suspected would be the case, but was still hoping it wouldn't be, because Fallout 4 was nothing but worthless Settlement mechanics and god awful radiant quests with a few mediocre scripted quests thrown in now and then.
the 1,000 planets and the "land literally anywhere" is most likely the patented Todd overpromise/lie. Even if it's not, I highly doubt there's ever gonna be a reason to really take advantage of a system like that, because unless they have like literally 1,000,000 man hours into development then 95% of those planets are gonna be empty, barren rocks with nothing to do except farm resources and build stupid settlements that probably still won't provide you with much of anything. The gunplay still looks terrible, like their shooting the same old fake bullets that enemies don't react to.
They seemingly took a step in the right direction in regards to skills and character customization however. Finally let us construct a basic background for the character and even give us optional traits to take to grant additional flavor? That's a huge step up from their most recent releases.
However, until I get some assurance that this isn't basically just another Building Simulator and that these planets(that are unrelated to the main quest) will have actual crafted content, I have no real interest in wasting hundreds of hours just building pointless shit.
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Post by azarhal on Jun 13, 2022 12:10:47 GMT
On a more serious note however. This is clearly just Fallout 4 in space. Which I suspected would be the case, but was still hoping it wouldn't be, because Fallout 4 was nothing but worthless Settlement mechanics and god awful radiant quests with a few mediocre scripted quests thrown in now and then. the 1,000 planets and the "land literally anywhere" is most likely the patented Todd overpromise/lie. Even if it's not, I highly doubt there's ever gonna be a reason to really take advantage of a system like that, because unless they have like literally 1,000,000 man hours into development then 95% of those planets are gonna be empty, barren rocks with nothing to do except farm resources and build stupid settlements that probably still won't provide you with much of anything. The gunplay still looks terrible, like their shooting the same old fake bullets that enemies don't react to. They seemingly took a step in the right direction in regards to skills and character customization however. Finally let us construct a basic background for the character and even give us optional traits to take to grant additional flavor? That's a huge step up from their most recent releases. However, until I get some assurance that this isn't basically just another Building Simulator and that these planets(that are unrelated to the main quest) will have actual crafted content, I have no real interest in wasting hundreds of hours just building pointless shit. Bethesda called it Skyrim in Space. I already suggested that the 1000 planets included at least moons. In the trailer, when they say "resource rich barren world", they are pointing to a moon around a gas giant. They are clearly using planets as a shorthand for planetary bodies (just like BioWare since ME1). Makes them look uneducated, but in-game it is labelled properly (Kreet is a moon for example). Also, it's a bit unclear if they are using 1000 to refer to every things or just what we can land on. Because gas giants and planets like Venus, temperature is 475 degrees Celsius on the surface and pressure is 1000x more than Earth -aka bone crushing-, should technically not be something you can land on and explore, but they should still be in the game. Also, 1000 for 100 systems means ~10 things per system which is very low....as Jupiter has 80 known moons. We also know there is at least one fully aquatic world where Neon is situated. I agree about the "land literally anywhere", as we can see the "Press X to land" and we can scan planets which will show point of interests like structures on them, but those "planets" are open world. I'm seeing people claim it was already confirmed the largest was the land size of Skyrim (I can't find the source thought). That would mean those planets looks bigger in space than once on the ground. Finally, I don't think this is a building simulator unless you want it to be, since the Crimson Pirates aren't into making colonies and it is a joinable faction. Constellation, the starting faction, isn't into colonies either, they are scientists and explorers. United Colonies and Freestar Collective might give some create outpost objectives, but the trailer gave me the impression the joinable faction in those are actually the defense forces.
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Post by azarhal on Jun 13, 2022 12:54:19 GMT
I'm watching some older videos Bethesda made about the game and Starfield has a persuasion mini-game. They don't show it, but they compared it to Oblivion's, but claims it is better because it feels like you are trying someone of something. Oblivion was just about raising disposition.
That explain the "close-up" that feels straight out of Oblivion.
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Post by 10k on Jun 13, 2022 13:50:39 GMT
On a more serious note however. This is clearly just Fallout 4 in space. Which I suspected would be the case, but was still hoping it wouldn't be, because Fallout 4 was nothing but worthless Settlement mechanics and god awful radiant quests with a few mediocre scripted quests thrown in now and then. the 1,000 planets and the "land literally anywhere" is most likely the patented Todd overpromise/lie. Even if it's not, I highly doubt there's ever gonna be a reason to really take advantage of a system like that, because unless they have like literally 1,000,000 man hours into development then 95% of those planets are gonna be empty, barren rocks with nothing to do except farm resources and build stupid settlements that probably still won't provide you with much of anything. The gunplay still looks terrible, like their shooting the same old fake bullets that enemies don't react to. They seemingly took a step in the right direction in regards to skills and character customization however. Finally let us construct a basic background for the character and even give us optional traits to take to grant additional flavor? That's a huge step up from their most recent releases. However, until I get some assurance that this isn't basically just another Building Simulator and that these planets(that are unrelated to the main quest) will have actual crafted content, I have no real interest in wasting hundreds of hours just building pointless shit. I have to agree with you. Looking at the outpost building and the 1000 planet thing, I can't help but to think the game will feel as dead as fallout 4 did. I just hope outpost building isn't as big of a thing like it was in FO4.
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Post by luketrevelyan on Jun 13, 2022 14:12:24 GMT
One important thing I haven't seen is the dialogue system and whether we are voiced/silent. A major problem I had with FO4 was the protagonist and the really lackluster dialogue options. I think I'd prefer silent protagonist for this game, but if they are voiced I hope they made a lot of improvements over FO4.
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Post by themikefest on Jun 13, 2022 14:57:09 GMT
I just watched the video. Looks good. It will be interesting to see what players come up with for the look of their ship and outposts. I'm curious who the VA's will be for the main character. Game has 1000 planets to be explored. I wonder how many hours it will take to do a 100% completionist run? Once the game gets closer to release date, I will get the xbox series x to play the game.
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Post by Kappa Neko on Jun 13, 2022 15:05:14 GMT
Fallout 4 was nothing but worthless Settlement mechanics Get out! LOL This worthless settlement mechanic was the only truly amazing thing about FO4 to me! I probably have spent over 1000h building settlements... I am SO hyped now!!! OK, my first reaction to the "trailer" in the middle I watched first with the woman talking gave me strong Outer Worlds vibes visually and I'm not sure that's a good thing. I was slightly disappointed but can't really say why. I hope they fix the bug eyes. Forbidden West had the same problem at launch but fixed it later and now the eyes are a thing of beauty. So fingers crossed. I'm still on the fence about the realistic art style. Will have to see more. I like colorful environments. There were some among the planets they showed, so I shouldn't worry too much about it. Character creator looks awesome and perks are back!!! YESSSS! I did not expect so many planets, so we ARE getting NMS as a proper RPG. Huh. I expected something like 15 quest planets and maybe a bunch of empty planets for mining, lool. The laser mining is NOT something I ever enjoyed in NMS, so I'm a bit worried about that... I don't want this game to be an endless mining grind for base building. I enjoyed looting junk in FO4 as building materials. It was fun and I could just do it effortlessly while exploring. I don't want to stand in front of rocks all day. This was also something a little annoying in Subnautica. The mining drill arm was cool for five minutes. After that just boring. You just stand there and press the button until the resource is fully extracted. And while I don't see the point of 1000 planets, I can't help being hyped for the modding potential. This is literally the perfect setup for an forever modding paradise. OMG... Space combat I never cared about and I avoid it in NMS too. But I know this is a dream come true for most people so I'm happy for everyone who wanted this. I hope it won't be too frequent a situation and not too drawn out. I really don't like space combat, but at least I can switch to third person so I can actually see what's going on, lol. (Yeah, not a flight person AT ALL...) The few seconds of base building they showed was underwhelming. I hope it's going to be more than putting a few prefab rooms together. I'm sure there'll be many options to build and decorate bases the way I want. And even if not, mods to the rescue again! And I hope there are different types of bases as well. Farms, mining bases, research labs, maybe even a trading post. Super happy there will be settlers again generating stuff for me like in FO4. What I want to know now is, can I build anywhere I want? Because THAT is the best thing about NMS for me. Looking for pretty places to build a base. If Starfield gives me total freedom to settle anywhere on those 1000 planets, I'll be in heaven!
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Post by AnDromedary on Jun 13, 2022 15:29:19 GMT
What I want to know now is, can I build anywhere I want? Because THAT is the best thing about NMS for me. Looking for pretty places to build a base. If Starfield gives me total freedom to settle anywhere on those 1000 planets, I'll be in heaven! Well, Todd did say "you can choose where and how to build each one". I guess that doesn't completely confirm total freedom but it sure sounds like it and I don't see why they wouldn't allow it as long as the terrain is good enough.
BTW, didn't they st some point also say that you can also build modular space stations? I don't remember if that was official or just a rumor though.
Personally, I am not that muhc of a builder, I usually do it but more for the functional aspect of it. So let's see how that goes but in general, I am more about exploration than base building. This does look like it'll cater to both kinds of players though.
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Post by azarhal on Jun 13, 2022 15:53:05 GMT
More discoveries from the trailer. Character creation: - They used gel electrophoresis bands of DNA for the sliders - Argos Extractor is written at the top. The mining scenes in the gameplay trailer are probably the start of the game Ship building: - Some modules seems to require a specific skill: Starship Design. We can see it on landers and engine. - Companies that makes ship modules: Nova Galatic, Xiang, Taiyô Astroneering, Deimos, Stroud Eklund, Reladyne. There might be more. - We can see that the vendor has money, so we can probably sell modules back to them. - We can see various ship name or models: Longsword 1, Ranger, Privateer, Mako, Frontier (the Frontier is the starter ship) - The ship building is done in various port, we can see the location under the ship name/model: New Atlantis and Vectera in this case. - All modules seems to add health to the ship, some have functions (landing gear, cockpit, engine, fuel tanks) while others appears mostly decorative (just add health) Going by the skill requirements, I think editing the ship beyond "cosmetics" will require investing into the science and/or tech skill tree. Pre-made ships are probably available for those who don't want to invest into ship building. Map/exploration: - Map list the amount of planets, moon and outposts in the system. Alpha Centauri has 4 planets and 8 moons...it's probably a typical system. - We can see point of interests on planetary bodies (cities, outposts, structure) or floating in space - There is a scanning feature for planets so you probably have to scan to find area of interests instead of going blind - You can set your landing target on a planet, - Survey on planet side shows resources, flora and fauna... - there is a system-wide Survey % Crafting/Researching: - Categories: pharmacology, food and drink, outpost development, equipment, weaponry - Pharmacology has medical treatment 1, physical enhancement 2 in research - Outpost development has resource extraction 1 - Equipment has helmet mod 1 - the little 1 is because there are research trees - Some research can have skill requirement Reminds me of MEA crafting personally, with more stuff. It's a bit unclear if researching is what create the item or there is another view for it that wasn't shown. Outpost build: - You start by placing a beacon (already settled planet/moon might not allow you do so) - Like ship, certain modules seems to have specific functions: hydroponics, science, military, watchtower... - There is a power cost to certain things - There is a "production/min" rating (along cargo and crew), so I think we can setup outpost to create resources and build specific things out of them Looks like we can become Tycoons in Starfield.
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Post by Kappa Neko on Jun 13, 2022 15:53:11 GMT
What I want to know now is, can I build anywhere I want? Because THAT is the best thing about NMS for me. Looking for pretty places to build a base. If Starfield gives me total freedom to settle anywhere on those 1000 planets, I'll be in heaven! Well, Todd did say "you can choose where and how to build each one". I guess that doesn't completely confirm total freedom but it sure sounds like it and I don't see why they wouldn't allow it as long as the terrain is good enough.
BTW, didn't they st some point also say that you can also build modular space stations? I don't remember if that was official or just a rumor though.
Personally, I am not that muhc of a builder, I usually do it but more for the functional aspect of it. So let's see how that goes but in general, I am more about exploration than base building. This does look like it'll cater to both kinds of players though.
True. And I believe in FO76 you are free to build anywhere as well? I never played it, only saw some bases online. So yeah, it's reasonable to expect we'll be able to build really anywhere. FO76 is really the latest reference point for base building. Skyrim had only a few places for limited modular homestead building. Not much variety there. FO4 was a huge improvement. FO76 was a step back in scope but introduced free building and lots and lots of decorations. They know by now that plenty of people have come to enjoy base building in their games. So I'm excited for it! I love the exploration aspect of Bethesda games like everyone, and I believe they'll deliver. Content density will vary greatly though, I imagine. And that's fine. Sometimes it's awesome to just roam around an unsettled planet too and check out wildlife and plants, scan everything. The feeling of solitude is not an unpleasant one. One of the things most people didn't like about NMS at launch was that every damn system was already settled. You were never the first one to step on it. There ARE unsettled systems now but the sense of going where no man has ever gone was never there. And people were disappointed. Some still are. There will probably be "something" to discover on every planet, even if just procedurally generated. But some kind of cool loot that makes it worthwhile to go anywhere. I'm really curious about how they'll make a story and the large number of planets come together as an organic experience. I hope we can really feel like explorers OR junk haulers or pirates. Leaving a bustling city to deliver stuff to some backwater outpost in the middle of nowhere. Or a dangerous cargo run through hostile environments. Or going on a research expedition way out there, collecting data that helps us develop some cool gadget or maybe bring local fauna and flora back to study in more detail at the base. I'm probably setting myself up for disappointment when it comes to just how immersive the experience can be and how different one can play the game. Need to keep my expectations realistic. But man, Todd isn't helping, lol. At the very least it should be a decent game that entertains me for a while in its vanilla state and then let's see what the modding community does with it.
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Post by smilesja on Jun 13, 2022 15:57:03 GMT
On a more serious note however. This is clearly just Fallout 4 in space. Which I suspected would be the case, but was still hoping it wouldn't be, because Fallout 4 was nothing but worthless Settlement mechanics and god awful radiant quests with a few mediocre scripted quests thrown in now and then. Those "worthless" settlement mechanics was what made Fallout 4 more alive. The radiant quests were fine but needed more variety I'd say.
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Post by smilesja on Jun 13, 2022 16:04:40 GMT
I've heard that we get to choose NPCs for the crew. The real question is can we romance them?
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Post by AnDromedary on Jun 13, 2022 16:23:08 GMT
Yea, for exploration, I am hoping they will embrace a similar attitude as the Star Citizen devs, aka, have different tiers of content: Tier 1: Completely hand crafted and bespoke content. This would include the main story quest locations and some major side quests (i.e. New Atlantis and other major cities as well as some quest related bases, outposts and "dungeons"). Tier 2: Procedurally generated content which has been touched up a bit by the devs by hand for more minor side quests and such Tier 3: Fully procedurally generated explorable content, that doesn't need to be hand crafted but can be placed in the world by the algorithm, such as some abandoned bases and outposts for radiant style quests and such. Tier 4: Just procedurally generated environment and surfaces with algorithmically distributed resources and such. This is just an example of what I mean. But I think this general approach would be awesome. That way, you can build some cool bespoke quests but also have some (hopefully semi interesting) randomly generated content as well that the players wil basically never run out off (though they will get tired of it after a while for sure).
Add mods to that, with modders being able to just add their own quests and quest locations to the world and we'd be set for the next decade.
I've heard that we get to choose NPCs for the crew. The real question is can we romance them? One of my friends always gets ridiculed because when he played MELE last year, he managed to mess up romancing Miranda (don't ask me how ). We already promised him a Miranda mod for Starfield yesterday.
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luketrevelyan
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by luketrevelyan on Jun 13, 2022 16:23:39 GMT
One important thing I haven't seen is the dialogue system and whether we are voiced/silent. A major problem I had with FO4 was the protagonist and the really lackluster dialogue options. I think I'd prefer silent protagonist for this game, but if they are voiced I hope they made a lot of improvements over FO4. Guess Bethesda was listening I think silent works best for this type of game but not as excited about the first person aspect. Oh well, at least 3rd person is available outside of dialogue. Bethesda Game Studios @bethesdastudiosYes, dialogue in @starfieldgame is first person and your character does not have a voice.
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