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Post by Iddy on May 26, 2017 14:48:03 GMT
Yes, yes, I know what you're thinking. Briala, Briala, Briala.
But I believe those who suffer should take their destiny into their own hands rather than simply waiting for someone to come save them. For that reason, I'd like to focus on what they can do to accomplish this change.
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Post by lordofwar on May 27, 2017 3:38:55 GMT
If the Dalish can't or won't fight for a homeland, I think the city elves should, and would probably have better chances with long term stability too. Halamshiral still has a massive elven population (the largest single group in Southern Thedas), so it would need to be at the forefront of any such movment. The city elves need to abandon their slums all over southern Thedas and go back to the Dales, to settle and begin an insurgency against the Orlesian lords there, with the goal political recognition at the least and total independence at most.
The elves will never be able to successfully push for any real rights as small minority groups scattered across the world, and trying only leads to the dilution of their identity. Like you said, they need to seize their destiny, and a weakened Orlais just may give them that chance. And with city elves at the forefront, negotiation with the Chantry and Orlais's traditional enemies (Fereldan, Nevarra) will go more smoothly, and they'll have greater numbers than the Dalish could bring to the table.
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Nightscrawl
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Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Neverwinter Nights, Mass Effect Andromeda
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Post by Nightscrawl on May 27, 2017 4:22:47 GMT
If the Dalish can't or won't fight for a homeland, I think the city elves should, and would probably have better chances with long term stability too. Halamshiral still has a massive elven population (the largest single group in Southern Thedas), so it would need to be at the forefront of any such movment. The city elves need to abandon their slums all over southern Thedas and go back to the Dales, to settle and begin an insurgency against the Orlesian lords there, with the goal political recognition at the least and total independence at most. The elves will never be able to successfully push for any real rights as small minority groups scattered across the world, and trying only leads to the dilution of their identity. Like you said, they need to seize their destiny, and a weakened Orlais just may give them that chance. And with city elves at the forefront, negotiation with the Chantry and Orlais's traditional enemies (Fereldan, Nevarra) will go more smoothly, and they'll have greater numbers than the Dalish could bring to the table. The Dales isn't just some free land that anyone can go live on. It's part of Orlais. The Orlesians will not allow them to do that, and there would inevitably be conflict. The elves don't have anything, they're not organized, they have little in the way of resources (food, weapons to fight, etc). Also, a portion of the Dales (Exalted Plains) was ravaged by the Orlesian civil war, so there is nothing for them to settle there. I think the most realistic thing they can do, that has a chance of success, would be for small guerilla bands to essentially annoy the Orlesians to death. If the groups are too large, they will be easily tracked and made vulnerable to the chevaliers charging in and stomping them into the ground.
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Post by Deleted on May 27, 2017 7:55:42 GMT
Creating their own cities. If they fought for it they will be massacred no doubt
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Post by Deleted on May 27, 2017 8:44:54 GMT
This man should be able to help.
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DragonKingReborn
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August 2016
dragonkingreborn
http://bsn.boards.net/threads/recent/143
https://i.imgur.com/1myVt9D.jpg
DragonKingReborn
Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Mass Effect Andromeda, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by DragonKingReborn on May 27, 2017 10:55:47 GMT
This man should be able to help. He has a nice face. I'm sure he's a great guy.
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Post by Deleted on May 27, 2017 11:02:55 GMT
This man should be able to help. He has a nice face. I'm sure he's a great guy. Lol ... yeah as long as you like parties ..
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Post by Deleted on May 27, 2017 11:10:30 GMT
I would work on the human nobles who are sympathetic to their cause, like King Alistair, and lobby to get more elven education and more elves in powerful positions. Having their own city would just segregate them even more, I'd be for integration and teaching the humans (perhaps thru the Chantry) to have more compassion and understanding. You know, the usual liberal bullshit.
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DragonKingReborn
20,557
August 2016
dragonkingreborn
http://bsn.boards.net/threads/recent/143
https://i.imgur.com/1myVt9D.jpg
DragonKingReborn
Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Mass Effect Andromeda, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by DragonKingReborn on May 27, 2017 11:10:30 GMT
He has a nice face. I'm sure he's a great guy. Lol ... yeah as long as you like parties .. Oh man. Are we about to head down a dark path?
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Post by Deleted on May 27, 2017 11:36:09 GMT
Lol ... yeah as long as you like parties .. Oh man. Are we about to head down a dark path? I thought we already have >
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Fredward
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http://bsn.boards.net/board/40/dragon-age-4
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Post by Fredward on May 27, 2017 17:32:44 GMT
Briala, Briala, Briala.
Even without the eluvians she can potentially be in the best spot to enact meaningful change for city elves.
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Zemgus
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Post by Zemgus on May 27, 2017 18:23:07 GMT
Elven Inquisitor can help them. She has the Emperor of Orlais, Viscount of Kirkwall and the Divine in her pocket. Half of Thedas also owes her favors. Who could be in better position to help them than she? The common people of Thedas love her, some even worship her and would surely believe her if she told them the Maker wants the elves to be treated like equals by humans and it's a grave sin to oppress them, blah blah...
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May 17, 2024 16:43:43 GMT
26,699
gervaise21
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August 2016
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Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights
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Post by gervaise21 on May 27, 2017 19:53:52 GMT
To begin with I am going to rule out Briala because she could be dead and an elven Inquisitor because they may not exist. Also Leliana doing anything as she may not be Divine. Incidentally, Briala only claimed the eluvians on behalf of the elves of Orlais not the elves everywhere, so clearly her aspirations didn't stretch to all Thedas. This may have been a realistic approach as a Thedas-wide effort would be too difficult to manage, although if anyone could do it, it would be someone with access to the eluvians. Also would point out that elves are not nearly so numerous in Halamshiral as they used to be considering Celene massacred most of them.
So on the basis of a world state that exists for everyone, I would have them concentrate on improving their lot in individual states, focussing their efforts initially on those rulers who have shown themselves to be sympathetic to their cause. The ruler of Ferelden might be open to negotiation, as would Varric, as would Prince Sebastian, who once suggested to Fenris that he should train city elves, which was actually pretty subversive considering they are forbidden any weapons larger than a knife. The Freemarches and Ferelden do seem to be the best candidates. Orlais is too entrenched in its class system and its Game, although it might be possible to do something in the southern Dales with the help of Fairbanks.
So approach the relevant rulers and get their authorisation to train up a militia to defend their elven citizens from abuse and for the state to fund this. If this is successful then expand this to protect all peasants and the state generally. If the elves are seen to be helping to keep the state safer for everyone, then this raises goodwill. At the same time, set up schools in the alienages, initially just teaching simple things like reading and writing but eventually moving on to local history and elven folklore.
Encourage the brighter students to pursue their academic studies and set up a scholarship fund to enable them to do so. I imagine that the university in Markham is restricted more by wealth than by class (unlike Orlais), but even if not, with the backing of the relevant ruler, they ought to be able to gain admittance. Education is the key to improving the lot of the elves, together with pushing for laws of protection to apply universally to all citizens. Currently in Ferelden it is still an offence to kill someone in defence of an elf. That needs to be changed. Again, Orlais is going to be the worst place to achieve rights for all considering how the nobility and particularly the Chevaliers abuse the position of privilege, not just with elves but with all commoners.
Anyway, by working on improving the status of elves in those states where it is feasible, it should be possible to do so. Once this is achieved, then it will act as example to other states. If they refuse their elven citizens their rights, then they should simply go on strike (backed by funds from elves who have achieved greater status elsewhere). Considering how much the nobility of Thedas rely on elven servants, the nations would quickly grind to a halt. This approach worked for Sebastian's ancestor which is how his family originally came to power, through using a general strike to bring down a tyrant, so it can be done. If this doesn't work, then just offer the elves of that state the ability to leave and settle elsewhere. Then let the nobility see how well they manage without them.
Also encourage greater co-operation and openness between the alienage elves and ordinary commoners, so both communities are working to their mutual benefit. Expand the alienage schools to admit commoner children. Teach about the great heroes of both communities, using the Canticle of Shartan to show how Andraste and Shartan worked together in a common cause, and the story of Garahel to illustrate how a city elf helped save everyone from the Blight (a particularly good example in the Freemarches). This will help counter all the anti-elf propaganda previously issued by the Chantry.
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vit246
N2
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR
Posts: 118 Likes: 169
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0
169
vit246
118
August 2016
vit246
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR
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Post by vit246 on May 28, 2017 1:13:09 GMT
Claim the Free Marches, kick the Free Marchers out, and send them to Nevarra. They were always in denial about being Nevarran off-shoots anyway. or Get a Elf Moses and smite shemlen kingdoms with 12 plagues until they let his people go.
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3,727
August 2016
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Post by Iddy on May 29, 2017 12:56:33 GMT
To begin with I am going to rule out Briala because she could be dead and an elven Inquisitor because they may not exist. Also Leliana doing anything as she may not be Divine. Incidentally, Briala only claimed the eluvians on behalf of the elves of Orlais not the elves everywhere, so clearly her aspirations didn't stretch to all Thedas. This may have been a realistic approach as a Thedas-wide effort would be too difficult to manage, although if anyone could do it, it would be someone with access to the eluvians. Also would point out that elves are not nearly so numerous in Halamshiral as they used to be considering Celene massacred most of them. So on the basis of a world state that exists for everyone, I would have them concentrate on improving their lot in individual states, focussing their efforts initially on those rulers who have shown themselves to be sympathetic to their cause. The ruler of Ferelden might be open to negotiation, as would Varric, as would Prince Sebastian, who once suggested to Fenris that he should train city elves, which was actually pretty subversive considering they are forbidden any weapons larger than a knife. The Freemarches and Ferelden do seem to be the best candidates. Orlais is too entrenched in its class system and its Game, although it might be possible to do something in the southern Dales with the help of Fairbanks. So approach the relevant rulers and get their authorisation to train up a militia to defend their elven citizens from abuse and for the state to fund this. If this is successful then expand this to protect all peasants and the state generally. If the elves are seen to be helping to keep the state safer for everyone, then this raises goodwill. At the same time, set up schools in the alienages, initially just teaching simple things like reading and writing but eventually moving on to local history and elven folklore. Encourage the brighter students to pursue their academic studies and set up a scholarship fund to enable them to do so. I imagine that the university in Markham is restricted more by wealth than by class (unlike Orlais), but even if not, with the backing of the relevant ruler, they ought to be able to gain admittance. Education is the key to improving the lot of the elves, together with pushing for laws of protection to apply universally to all citizens. Currently in Ferelden it is still an offence to kill someone in defence of an elf. That needs to be changed. Again, Orlais is going to be the worst place to achieve rights for all considering how the nobility and particularly the Chevaliers abuse the position of privilege, not just with elves but with all commoners. Anyway, by working on improving the status of elves in those states where it is feasible, it should be possible to do so. Once this is achieved, then it will act as example to other states. If they refuse their elven citizens their rights, then they should simply go on strike (backed by funds from elves who have achieved greater status elsewhere). Considering how much the nobility of Thedas rely on elven servants, the nations would quickly grind to a halt. This approach worked for Sebastian's ancestor which is how his family originally came to power, through using a general strike to bring down a tyrant, so it can be done. If this doesn't work, then just offer the elves of that state the ability to leave and settle elsewhere. Then let the nobility see how well they manage without them. Also encourage greater co-operation and openness between the alienage elves and ordinary commoners, so both communities are working to their mutual benefit. Expand the alienage schools to admit commoner children. Teach about the great heroes of both communities, using the Canticle of Shartan to show how Andraste and Shartan worked together in a common cause, and the story of Garahel to illustrate how a city elf helped save everyone from the Blight (a particularly good example in the Freemarches). This will help counter all the anti-elf propaganda previously issued by the Chantry. Well, Celene went back on her word when she realized that being seen as an elf sympathiser would be detrimental to her political interests. Realistically speaking, most rulers probably would do the same as they tend to be selfish pricks. Thankfully, Varric and Alistair aren't the pragmatic sort so at least they wouldn't let the backlash from nobles and neighboring nations stop them from doing what is right.
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Post by ellehaym on May 29, 2017 15:37:53 GMT
One way for them to do it is find a small piece of land far enough from humans and start from there ... but will they succeed at defending it?
Alternatively, they can hope that a human in a position of power will give them more rights and slowly work them into establishments such as education, etc. But will this also last? Will future generations repeal such elven rights?
Varric being the 1st Dwarf (maybe?) non-human leader of a major Thedosian city is a big deal and will set precedent, especially if his rule was prosperous.
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Blaze
N3
Everyone seem normal till you get to know them
Posts: 893 Likes: 952
inherit
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0
Mar 26, 2023 11:03:39 GMT
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Everyone seem normal till you get to know them
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Aug 23, 2016 12:15:31 GMT
August 2016
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Post by Blaze on Jun 20, 2017 12:47:33 GMT
join the dread wolf? =P
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∯ Oh Loredy...
455
0
May 17, 2024 16:43:43 GMT
26,699
gervaise21
10,819
August 2016
gervaise21
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights
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Post by gervaise21 on Jun 20, 2017 18:45:36 GMT
Nah, that's the shortest way to getting annihilated. For a start off his plan is bound to backfire somewhere along the way. Everyone connected with the Inquisition knows he intends on destroying the world so joining him is going to result in even worse hate than the Chantry managed to create following the Exalted March on the Dales. Plus he says to an elven Inquisitor that his plan will result in the end for his people, in other words the modern elves, of whom the city elves are by far the largest group. Even if they survive the initial Veil-drop, there are going to be seven angry Evanuris to contend with who will likely view them as their property. So whether Solas succeeds or Solas fails, either way they are screwed.
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Post by canticleofshartan on Jun 20, 2017 19:16:32 GMT
Nah, that's the shortest way to getting annihilated. For a start off his plan is bound to backfire somewhere along the way. Everyone connected with the Inquisition knows he intends on destroying the world so joining him is going to result in even worse hate than the Chantry managed to create following the Exalted March on the Dales. Plus he says to an elven Inquisitor that his plan will result in the end for his people, in other words the modern elves, of whom the city elves are by far the largest group. Even if they survive the initial Veil-drop, there are going to be seven angry Evanuris to contend with who will likely view them as their property. So whether Solas succeeds or Solas fails, either way they are screwed. wait, are we certain he meant it quite so literally? that it would kill everyone, including the elves? i interpreted it to mean it would change the world in susch a way that itd be like the world ended and a new one (or old one) took its place
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Post by Iddy on Jun 20, 2017 19:36:57 GMT
Nah, that's the shortest way to getting annihilated. For a start off his plan is bound to backfire somewhere along the way. Everyone connected with the Inquisition knows he intends on destroying the world so joining him is going to result in even worse hate than the Chantry managed to create following the Exalted March on the Dales. Plus he says to an elven Inquisitor that his plan will result in the end for his people, in other words the modern elves, of whom the city elves are by far the largest group. Even if they survive the initial Veil-drop, there are going to be seven angry Evanuris to contend with who will likely view them as their property. So whether Solas succeeds or Solas fails, either way they are screwed. wait, are we certain he meant it quite so literally? that it would kill everyone, including the elves? i interpreted it to mean it would change the world in susch a way that itd be like the world ended and a new one (or old one) took its place The Inquisitor certainly believes he meant it literally: "You don't need to destroy this world. I'll prove it to you." And really... just think about it for a moment. If this plan actually were a good thing, there would be no need to stop Solas at all.
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Jun 26, 2019 23:40:38 GMT
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August 2016
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Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition
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Post by thats1evildude on Jun 20, 2017 19:43:52 GMT
Instigate a takeover in Tevinter. Forge a new elven state from the ruins of the Imperium.
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June 2017
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Post by canticleofshartan on Jun 20, 2017 19:47:16 GMT
wait, are we certain he meant it quite so literally? that it would kill everyone, including the elves? i interpreted it to mean it would change the world in susch a way that itd be like the world ended and a new one (or old one) took its place The Inquisitor certainly believes he meant it literally: "You don't need to destroy this world. I'll prove it to you." And really... just think about it for a moment. If this plan actually were a good thing, there would be no need to stop Solas at all. just wait, thisll all have been a big misunderstanding!
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Champion of Kirkwall
1212
0
8,023
Sifr
3,737
Aug 25, 2016 20:05:11 GMT
August 2016
sifr
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire
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Post by Sifr on Jun 20, 2017 20:21:11 GMT
Lol ... yeah as long as you like parties .. No-one should have to fight for their right to party! (Couldn't resist)
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ღ Aerial Flybys
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0
1
26,314
Obsidian Gryphon
10,186
August 2016
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ObsidianGryphon
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire
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Post by Obsidian Gryphon on Jun 21, 2017 3:07:06 GMT
For it to succeed;
* someone among the human nobility, middle class have to stand out to make a statement and gather supporters * someone must send the message through the lower class, even the poor, to support such a movement
Some of the factors that thus brought the end of slavery were of the two mentioned above. A captain of a slave ship ordered a 100 over sick and starving slaves thrown overboard after encountering problems during the journey. He and the crew were brought to trial but were acquitted. However, he regretted his heinous act and became a pastor and began to preach to the congregation and spread the message that slavery was wrong. His contribution added momentum to a gathering movement to abolish slavery.
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0
Apr 13, 2024 10:00:53 GMT
1,677
cloud9
3,871
Aug 14, 2016 11:41:22 GMT
August 2016
cloud9
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2
sicklyhour015
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Post by cloud9 on Jun 26, 2017 20:15:27 GMT
Would I would do with my elven Inquisitor I would make plans and negotiations by taking The Dales from Orlais to establish Independence and sovereignty and to rebuild. But first I would set plans to declare war against the Imperium if they refuse to free the elves from slavery.
1. If humans want to trade they could create a Bazaar district from the borders of the territory and negotiations should take place in the Embassy in the district.
2: No humans allowed in elven territory except in the Bazaar district and the Embassy building.
3:No human will be allowed to buy land in the territory, own mines, nor real estate investing.
4: The elves will honor the treaties from the Grey Wardens to fight against the darkspawn.
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