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Post by pessimistpanda on Feb 5, 2021 13:11:20 GMT
I don't feel like the protag being a Lord of Fortune is really all that likely.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 5, 2021 16:55:48 GMT
Ok, I see your point. I understood that the Lords of Fortune are considered to be among the best treasure hunters in Thedas. They are known for their colorful outfits, capes and charms and - some of them - for wearing their treasure. I got the impression that they are relatively wealthy and therefore kind of powerful. Not in political terms but all in all I would not say that a Lord of Fortune is someone without power. Especially when he has a career and a reputation. But this is just my personal understanding. One way or another, I can understand your point of view. Ah, I see what you mean. I imagine that would vary by the individual though. A less experienced Lord of Fortune would not have built up much wealth, and I didn’t get the impression they were necessarily uniform in their ostentatiousness. Just one big job under their belt that makes this new ‘Lord’ notable. I’m sort of taking the “someone without power” thing to mostly indicate we won’t be in charge of any organization like the Inquisitor was. I think you're right: a less experienced LoF who does not have any obligations towards an organization is probably someone we'd consider "powerless". Okay, granted, I wonder why someone should engage an inexperienced noob in order to save the harmony and the order of the world. But, on the other hand, this is a problem BioWare must resolve themself.
Anyway, I still have hope for another type of protagonist: experienced, matured, smart and skilful but due to several twists of fate he/she found himself/herself in a precarious situation - and has no power. For my part I much prefer this second option.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 5, 2021 17:53:06 GMT
Hrungr, first of all: Anders is neither whiny nor annoying. To say so is not only wrong, but also a sacrilege. This is punishable by three weeks house arrest and the cancellation of your pocket money, Mister.
Now that we've cleared that up, let's go ahead. I think it's possible we may start as something else, but my guess is we'll (after one intro adventure) wind up joining the Lords of Fortune. Beyond how it could work story-wise, I look at how they seemed to be crafted for a PC game-wise. They're based out of Rivain and are politically neutral, accept all races, and from any nation. That means you could freely work for the Vints, the Qunari, the Shadow Inquisition, or whomever else. They take on contracts, so there's your job board returning. And as an Adventurer's Guild, that means monster hunts, treasure hunts, heists, etc. which would tie in neatly with their live service. Another thing I thought was telling was the mention of their senior LoFs wearing more bling. So... there's your Cosmetics Store. This is perfectly understandable and it makes total sense. Nevertheless, or perhaps because of that, it would be disappointing. As a LoF you can do everything and work for everyone. In my view this is too simple and has a feeling of randomness. It is definitely not something I would describe as a sophisticated idea.
It perhaps sounds naive, but part of me wishes BioWare would create something more... special? I want to be surprised, I want something that I had not expected, I want to feel the magic of storytelling. This may sound ridiculous and incomprehensible, but it is what it is. A LoF as a protagonist reminds me too much of a blank cheque.
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Post by gervaise21 on Feb 5, 2021 18:32:30 GMT
People got attached to their DAO epilogues about going back to Antiva with Zevran or some such. That only happened after DAA. To be honest, I didn't think any of the DAO epilogues had you leaving the Wardens and at the celebration party I don't recall it really being an option either. I think what people were more upset about was that you couldn't take your LI interest through with you if that was Leliana or Zevran (Morrigan always leaving at the end of DAO whether you were on good terms or not) or Alistair if he remained a Warden. But this is a rather surprising one, especially given I was more surprised that Anders was able to eject himsel from the Order by the start of DA 2. Origins gave the distinct impression that being a Grey Warden was more or less 'for life.' Exactly. It didn't surprise me at all that I was still in the Wardens in DAA and to be honest I deserved to be made Warden Commander. What struck me as odd about Anders was that everything he said about his experience with the Wardens didn't chime with my DAA playthroughs with him. They made him get rid of his cat? Huh, the Warden Commander gave him that cat. Also, whilst it was clear much of DAA that he didn't consider the Wardens a permanent feature in his life, by the time of the epilogue, because my Warden's high approval with him, he always ended up staying with them. The short story didn't chime with any of my world states either. It was like they wrote the continuation of the story with the Hero having made the ultimate sacrifice and then the Orlesian Commander being an absolute bastard towards him. Also, the Grey Wardens were very odd for a military order if they didn't try tracking down deserters. If they were ordinary rogues or warrior perhaps that wasn't felt necessary but they were only able to recruit mages by special dispensation from the Chantry and I think that was on the understanding they would keep an eye on them, so even if initially they thought he might be dead (although even based off the short story that would seem unlikely) once he turned up again in Kirkwall and other Wardens were aware of this, why didn't they haul him back to Ferelden or execute him. After all, Duncan murdered Jordy for refusing to take the Joining because apparently once you've been recruited there is no turning back, unless you are Anders. However, there are hints that if the Exalted March had gone ahead then perhaps Anders would have gone back to the Wardens at the end (redeemed Warden), thus fitting once again with your DAA world state.
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Post by Heimdall on Feb 5, 2021 19:00:02 GMT
People got attached to their DAO epilogues about going back to Antiva with Zevran or some such. That only happened after DAA. To be honest, I didn't think any of the DAO epilogues had you leaving the Wardens and at the celebration party I don't recall it really being an option either. I think what people were more upset about was that you couldn't take your LI interest through with you if that was Leliana or Zevran (Morrigan always leaving at the end of DAO whether you were on good terms or not) or Alistair if he remained a Warden. That was just an example, but you’re right. I’ve gone check the wiki just to be sure.
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Post by gervaise21 on Feb 5, 2021 19:29:08 GMT
That was just an example, but you’re right. I’ve gone check the wiki just to be sure. I suppose you could argue that if the Warden decided to return to their clan/the alienage/Orzammar/Highever this wasn't respected but there is nothing to suggest that they didn't do so initially, whilst still remaining in the Wardens, and so split their time after defeating the Architect between Vigil's Keep and their other base. Plus, of course, if you had chosen that they were busy elsewhere, then to keep it consistent with your head canon, you could just play DAA with the replacement Warden Commander instead. So I don't really see what people had to complain about there. What people were also upset about was that some of the boons as our reward ended up not being permanent. Since we have never returned to Orzammar I suppose it is possible that the dwarven boon was honoured but the Dalish one only lasted as long as DA2 and Alistair also admitted that whilst he would give shelter to apostate mages from Kirkwall, he had no control over the Circle that we had been promised would be freed. That was rather more disappointing. I understood the excuse Alistair gave about the Circle because it was true that Ferelden could ill afford to upset the Chantry when so weakened by the Blight, as an Orlesian backed Exalted March would likely be the result of such action. However, it was rather disappointing that they nullified the Dalish boon as they did. Still it was even more disappointing to me that the plot of DAI for the Grey Wardens, the codices and the words of Bann Teagan in Trespasser, all seemed to ignore the events of DAA altogether.
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Post by catcher on Feb 5, 2021 20:24:15 GMT
Please, give me examples of characters from DA or other series who are showy without being shallow or haughty. I can't think of any. It's far from one scrap of information that has led to my pessimistic conclusion. (Hope I'm doing this right. My BB-fu is old and out of practice ) Given how you lead into that, I doubt anything I could say would sway you but I will give it a sally because I'm a hard-headed optimist like that Outside Bioware, I would suggest the character of Masha in Robert Asprin's 'Myth-Adventures' series. Her jewelry allows her to perform feats of magic but she wears more and flashy clothes besides to hide from a bit of a body issue. She statuesque and I don't mean in the Vidasalla way. She's also sharp but with a real world touch. I could wish for a character like that to be in a CRPG. Inside Bioware, there could be several but I'll stick with more recent vintages. Dorian can be conceited, self-important, and take martyrdom to extremes. He also can admit when he's wrong, use his notoriety to ease others admissions (see Mother Giselle in Trespasser), cares deeply for Felix, tries to bridge a gap with Sera, and has a heart-breaking series with Cole. He sees the decadence and cruelty that Tevinter has fallen to and yet cannot let go of its institution of slavery (that bit of rationalization hit very close to home for me as a white man from the US South). He is anything but shallow or (always) a prick and I would not mind playing that character in a CRPG if allowed to do so. Consider Varric in DA:I. You don't think of him as one of these flashy characters? The open shirt, medallion-swinging, famous writer fills an old trope from the 1970's that is every bit as flashy as some Vint popinjay. He even gets a unique weapon no one else can use with special rules so he's an in-game LoF. He's also dedicated to causes that earn him no praise or gold like rebuilding Kirkwall or sticking with Cassandra when she hauls him across Thedas just to see the sky blow up. He involves himself in Cole's plight and, if allowed, teaches Cole a powerful lesson about life and letting go. The chain above his heart is not worth as much as the gold in his heart. I would also not mind playing a character like that. As always your mileage may vary, but I think there's ample evidence that Bioware can write it for us IF they write it for US and not just the companions. It wouldn't be easy especially as everyone has favorites and there's so many things clamoring for dev attention as well. My own approach is to try to figure out how things can be done in ways that make that possibility a possibility in a AAA, high stakes gaming world. Thanks for your time and your thoughts.
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Post by catcher on Feb 5, 2021 20:37:05 GMT
Honestly, I would look forward to a PC with a little more... personality. But I doubt that will be the case. Whatever group the protagonist winds up joining (or not joining), personality-wise, they will likely be the same kind of blank-slate character the Inquisitor was. No strong personality, just something rather neutral that can applied across all races. If you don't mind me asking, what would you see in a game like DA4 that would instill the character with more personality? Not that I don't agree that the Inquisitor was bland but then, she/he had to be. That's always the challenge with making current CRPGs anyway: you have to deal with huge fanbases with vast differences in emphasis on different areas. Just look at how many companions in all three DA series are panned by different people and those are pick-and-choose. I'm trying to come up with ideas that might work but I'm afraid I've been out of the loop too long and don't know (exactly) what is wrong. Thanks for your time and if you feel like it, input.
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Post by Hrungr on Feb 6, 2021 1:57:41 GMT
Hrungr, first of all: Anders is neither whiny nor annoying. To say so is not only wrong, but also a sacrilege. This is punishable by three weeks house arrest and the cancellation of your pocket money, Mister. Don't make me smack Anders so hard he retroactively dies in your PTs too! This is perfectly understandable and it makes total sense. Nevertheless, or perhaps because of that, it would be disappointing. As a LoF you can do everything and work for everyone. In my view this is too simple and has a feeling of randomness. It is definitely not something I would describe as a sophisticated idea. I think of them as having the benefit of being a "neutral" (but respected) third party. At some point, the PC will have to resolve the conflicts of various/opposing factions, and being a "neutral" LoF could be a good way to get your foot in their doors so to speak. There's the Antiva/Tenvinter/Qunari conflict and all the factions involved with that, as well as the internal Antaam/Qunari issues, potentially slavery in Tevinter, and whatever else is going on. Then you'll have to get everyone on the same page to deal with Solas and the Evanuris. So you need someone who can rally companions from those various/opposing factions to work together. And someone who's not from one of those factions might have an easier time. It perhaps sounds naive, but part of me wishes BioWare would create something more... special? I want to be surprised, I want something that I had not expected, I want to feel the magic of storytelling. This may sound ridiculous and incomprehensible, but it is what it is. A LoF as a protagonist reminds me too much of a blank cheque. "No magic hand. No ancient prophecy. The kind of person they'll never see coming." This feels like the trope with your typical D&D adventurer getting swept up in a save-the-world event. We'll just have to wait and see.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Feb 6, 2021 2:08:34 GMT
Please, give me examples of characters from DA or other series who are showy without being shallow or haughty. I can't think of any. It's far from one scrap of information that has led to my pessimistic conclusion. (Hope I'm doing this right. My BB-fu is old and out of practice ) Given how you lead into that, I doubt anything I could say would sway you but I will give it a sally because I'm a hard-headed optimist like that Outside Bioware, I would suggest the character of Masha in Robert Asprin's 'Myth-Adventures' series. Her jewelry allows her to perform feats of magic but she wears more and flashy clothes besides to hide from a bit of a body issue. She statuesque and I don't mean in the Vidasalla way. She's also sharp but with a real world touch. I could wish for a character like that to be in a CRPG. Inside Bioware, there could be several but I'll stick with more recent vintages. Dorian can be conceited, self-important, and take martyrdom to extremes. He also can admit when he's wrong, use his notoriety to ease others admissions (see Mother Giselle in Trespasser), cares deeply for Felix, tries to bridge a gap with Sera, and has a heart-breaking series with Cole. He sees the decadence and cruelty that Tevinter has fallen to and yet cannot let go of its institution of slavery (that bit of rationalization hit very close to home for me as a white man from the US South). He is anything but shallow or (always) a prick and I would not mind playing that character in a CRPG if allowed to do so. Consider Varric in DA:I. You don't think of him as one of these flashy characters? The open shirt, medallion-swinging, famous writer fills an old trope from the 1970's that is every bit as flashy as some Vint popinjay. He even gets a unique weapon no one else can use with special rules so he's an in-game LoF. He's also dedicated to causes that earn him no praise or gold like rebuilding Kirkwall or sticking with Cassandra when she hauls him across Thedas just to see the sky blow up. He involves himself in Cole's plight and, if allowed, teaches Cole a powerful lesson about life and letting go. The chain above his heart is not worth as much as the gold in his heart. I would also not mind playing a character like that. As always your mileage may vary, but I think there's ample evidence that Bioware can write it for us IF they write it for US and not just the companions. It wouldn't be easy especially as everyone has favorites and there's so many things clamoring for dev attention as well. My own approach is to try to figure out how things can be done in ways that make that possibility a possibility in a AAA, high stakes gaming world. Thanks for your time and your thoughts. Don’t know Masha so can’t really comment. As for Dorian, you make good points but I was never really a fan of Dorian. He was fine as a squad mate, but not as a protagonist. As for Varric, I absolutely despise Varric. Hated him in DA2, hated him even more in DAI (Cassandra hit the nail on the head calling him a snake), and hate how he seems to be involved in DA4.
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Post by Hrungr on Feb 6, 2021 2:34:11 GMT
Honestly, I would look forward to a PC with a little more... personality. But I doubt that will be the case. Whatever group the protagonist winds up joining (or not joining), personality-wise, they will likely be the same kind of blank-slate character the Inquisitor was. No strong personality, just something rather neutral that can applied across all races. If you don't mind me asking, what would you see in a game like DA4 that would instill the character with more personality? Not that I don't agree that the Inquisitor was bland but then, she/he had to be. That's always the challenge with making current CRPGs anyway: you have to deal with huge fanbases with vast differences in emphasis on different areas. Just look at how many companions in all three DA series are panned by different people and those are pick-and-choose. I'm trying to come up with ideas that might work but I'm afraid I've been out of the loop too long and don't know (exactly) what is wrong. Thanks for your time and if you feel like it, input. See, I'm reluctant to even get into this for fear of planting some seed of expectation in my own mind. We've had games with both types of protags already - more defined (eg. DA2) vs. blank-slate (eg. DAI). The key element I'd like to see in a protag's personality is to always be the most interesting person in the room. However they'd want to achieve that. I want the things they say to be memorable. With a blank-slate protag, the onus is largely on who you're talking to, to make the conversation memorable. And again, I expect we'll have another blank-slate protag for DA4, for reasons like those you mention.
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Post by catcher on Feb 6, 2021 3:59:46 GMT
Don’t know Masha so can’t really comment. As for Dorian, you make good points but I was never really a fan of Dorian. He was fine as a squad mate, but not as a protagonist. As for Varric, I absolutely despise Varric. Hated him in DA2, hated him even more in DAI (Cassandra hit the nail on the head calling him a snake), and hate how he seems to be involved in DA4. Fair on all counts. The Myth-Adventures series is old and not really adult fare, but that character did come to mind so I thought I would mention her. Glad to see I was able to give Dorian some love. As to Varric, I would have to quote Wilhelm Stekel by way of The Lumineers, "The opposite of Love is Indifference." You are obviously not indifferent to him so the writers achieved a goal there. Though I wouldn't want to make you play him as a protag others might very well enjoy it. Neither is shallow and while we could debate the prickishness of Varric, I'm afraid I've wandered terribly off-topic. If you don't mind, I'll create a separate thread about building a better protagonist. Your thoughts and ideas would of course be most welcome and it was good talking with you here. Thanks again.
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Post by catcher on Feb 6, 2021 5:25:48 GMT
See, I'm reluctant to even get into this for fear of planting some seed of expectation in my own mind. We've had games with both types of protags already - more defined (eg. DA2) vs. blank-slate (eg. DAI). The key element I'd like to see in a protag's personality is to always be the most interesting person in the room. However they'd want to achieve that. I want the things they say to be memorable. With a blank-slate protag, the onus is largely on who you're talking to, to make the conversation memorable. And again, I expect we'll have another blank-slate protag for DA4, for reasons like those you mention. Me, I prefer talking how games could/should be with friends (OK, casual acquaintances right now but give me time. I grow on people ) to crying in my (root) beer about how they've gone downhill. Really, what's cheaper entertainment than electrons on a free BBS and I get all sorts of different angles on games I played I never saw before. Certainly, blank-slate is the easiest, though the Inquisitor isn't entirely blank-slate. There are some dialogues in the game based on race and class but those are not terribly impactful in the game (that I can tell) so it seems we haven't come far if any further at all since Origins. That's one of the reasons I suggested decoupling the selections from race and class. Those things are easily detected by the conversation system and really need no help outside of making them more impactful. Having a protag who is a bit selfish or self-centered who can act that out (or not). Or a protag that has a family and close ties that can get her into (and out of) trouble. Or a protag who is more selfless for say slaves and can trigger words and deeds that way. This is why I suggested being able to have the player select "cards" or have a default "hand" available in the character creation stage so there's less demand on resources there but more reactivity in the game itself. Like I told Hanako, this probably belongs in a topic of its own but I just couldn't let the chance to bring back an old tactic like the cards in Ultima IV especially since tarot-style cards were a stylistic link to DA:I. thanks for your time and , of course, you are welcome to spout off in any threads I wind up creating out o this.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 6, 2021 14:20:22 GMT
Don't make me smack Anders so hard he retroactively dies in your PTs too! You're not thinking of going down in history as the man who killed the most equitable, bright and clever, brilliant at tactical manoeuvring, direct in his criticism, attached to the people and passionate mage of all time? Not to forget: the most handsome one? Don't go break your mother's heart, Hrungr! I think of them as having the benefit of being a "neutral" (but respected) third party. At some point, the PC will have to resolve the conflicts of various/opposing factions, and being a "neutral" LoF could be a good way to get your foot in their doors so to speak. There's the Antiva/Tenvinter/Qunari conflict and all the factions involved with that, as well as the internal Antaam/Qunari issues, potentially slavery in Tevinter, and whatever else is going on. Then you'll have to get everyone on the same page to deal with Solas and the Evanuris. So you need someone who can rally companions from those various/opposing factions to work together. And someone who's not from one of those factions might have an easier time. What’s boring is mediocre ideas that aim to please everybody. What’s worse is trying to be every player's little friend. If you write and create characters, you will upset people, guaranteed. And that's ok.
BioWare should take the step from "a boring writer" to one who backs themselves and dares have an opinion. I have never seen a neutral character who has enriched a story in a sustainable manner. The concept is very convenient, I agree. All these arguments you mentioned earlierer are reasonable, I can't argue with that. But I am a fan of strong positions, of characters that tend to polarize and, of course, of dramatic stuff. I want something that really touches me. And therefore the concept of neutrality, diplomacy and common sense (with a view to storytelling and character development) - this is something that always makes me feel disappointed. This feels like the trope with your typical D&D adventurer getting swept up in a save-the-world event. This is perhaps due to the language barrier... but... I don't know what you mean by that.
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Post by The Elder King on Feb 6, 2021 14:46:06 GMT
The advantage of a neutral position, like the LoF, is that ideally, you can still take the strong stances that you want, but also more diplomatic ones, if one prefers. Other backgrounds allow you to do the same, but I think the LoF one is quite perfect, at least in my mind, for this idea.
What you’re saying about a neutral character could be true, overall, but when writing a player character that can be customized you should keep in mind to give the players enough freedom to develop it as they wish, and not everyone want to necessarily take extreme/strong position. Some could prefer more neutral, diplomatic or pacific approaches. It doesn’t mean that those have to yield the best result, necessarily, but I think a good PC is one that the player can mold in different ways. And the background should accomodate that.
On Anders...he’s definitely a character that brought strong emotions in the players. I’d debate if it’s all his ‘merit’ or not due the puppeeter behind him, but it’s all right. In my canon he should be happy in the afterlife, knowing that Hawke worked hard to protect the mages he sought to protect but also endangered greatly. Although in my case he tries to avoid that scenario, but J/V wouldn’t allow him to.
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Post by gervaise21 on Feb 6, 2021 15:09:57 GMT
I think we need to draw a distinction here between how you start the game and what wagon they hitch you to. In DAO you had a different background according to your race and class but regardless it led to you becoming a Grey Warden. Leaving aside DA2 which was about one person with one background and their rise to become Champion, DAI again had you select a race and you were given a background associated with it and all these then led to you being first the Herald and then the Inquisitor. In neither DAO or DAI were you given any choice about the organisation you were recruited into.
It is true that regardless or your race and class you could become a Lord of Fortune. However, that isn't your background but your profession. Whilst it is also true it would be a nicely neutral choice to make you a Lord of Fortune, what would be your motivation? Are they going to force that on you? At least with the Wardens it was a choice between them and death where you could accept that given that choice you would opt for the Wardens. Likewise with the Inquisition it was pretty much a choice of join up or remain our prisoner (they couldn't actually threaten you with death once they knew your anchor could close the rifts).
So what justification could they have in forcing you to become a Lord of Fortune? It seems entirely a voluntary organisation and if it doesn't suit you then you cease to associate with them, unless there is something unsavoury in the background that they haven't revealed about the group thus far.
By contrast we know that, say, the Tevinter Sicarri force loyalty by threatening the lives of your family. Now admittedly people could complain they have no emotional attachment to that family, just as they did with Hawke's, but it still gives a plausible reason why initially you are willing to join, plus the fact that as a slave you have no choice anyway. You have to join up; the threat to your family is to ensure you stay loyal. So the player could remain loyal because they RP they do care for their family, or out of self-interest until some better offer comes along and they find a way to jump ship. At least, though, there is a plausible reason for why you remain with them initially. I just don't see that for the Lords of Fortune. As Hanako has rightly pointed out, they are just forcing an allegiance on you that many just won't feel without any reason on the face of it why you might agree to it.
So from that PoV it would be better for them to give you a choice of organisation that you join up with initially, taken from, say, the Rivaini Lords of Fortune, Tevinter Sicarri, Antivan Crows or possibly Ben'Hassrath. Each of these could be looking for the same thing initially, may be some ancient artifact, and thus get caught up in the plot going forward but it would allow in some variety in dialogue and personal motivation, plus maybe a different personal sub-plot for each (or War Table mission if that is the way they choose to go).
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Post by Deleted on Feb 6, 2021 18:26:08 GMT
The advantage of a neutral position, like the LoF, is that ideally, you can still take the strong stances that you want, but also more diplomatic ones, if one prefers. Other backgrounds allow you to do the same, but I think the LoF one is quite perfect, at least in my mind, for this idea. What you’re saying about a neutral character could be true, overall, but when writing a player character that can be customized you should keep in mind to give the players enough freedom to develop it as they wish, and not everyone want to necessarily take extreme/strong position. Some could prefer more neutral, diplomatic or pacific approaches. It doesn’t mean that those have to yield the best result, necessarily, but I think a good PC is one that the player can mold in different ways. And the background should accomodate that. I actually thought about it and I tried to see the "neutral position-thing" from your perspective. And I realised that one of my favourite protagonists - Geralt of Rivia - fits the profile. He is a neutral protagonist, generally indifferent to political parties, and yet I have enjoyed playing part II + III. Hmmm. Maybe I have to revise my former statement. Because of his interesting background, strong character and his special appearance he never gives me the feeling as if he were dull. It must therefore be possible to combine one with the other: giving the players enough freedom to "develop" the character as they wish and still telling an appealing story, in the center of which stands a big personality. Ok, I am still not fully comfortable with the LoF-thing, but that is probably more due to the fact that... um... to be honest: I don't know. On Anders...he’s definitely a character that brought strong emotions in the players. I’d debate if it’s all his ‘merit’ or not due the puppeeter behind him, but it’s all right. In my canon he should be happy in the afterlife, knowing that Hawke worked hard to protect the mages he sought to protect but also endangered greatly. Although in my case he tries to avoid that scenario, but J/V wouldn’t allow him to. Oh, it is not my intention to unleash a serious debate about Anders. For me, his story arc was perfect and the fact that so many of us either love him or hate him shows how well written this character is. Regardless of the debate as to whether its all his merit or not.
Ok, I must admit that I hate the idea of a "happy" Anders in the afterlife. But at least your Hawke will ensure that his legacy continues.
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Post by Absafraginlootly on Feb 7, 2021 7:46:56 GMT
I feel like if we were a Lord of Fortune in the game (and I think this applies to the Siccari, the Crows, and other organisations/professions too) then it would not be the organisation that you join as the main story impetus like the Grey Wardens, the Inquistion and the Spectres, but rather it would be a part of your background. Like Shepard always being an N7 of the alliance military, regardless of whether their Pre Service History is Earthborn, Spacer, or Colonist. Or if their Psychological Profile is Sole Survivor, Ruthless, or War Hero. Seems like we're most likely to join (or form) a secret taskforce for fighting Solas, either independent from or secretly connected to the inquisition, and that whatever background we have, Siccari, Lord, etc, would establish skills we have to contribute. Just as Shepard while having a customizable profile and class is always established as an elite N7 and therefore qualified to join the Spectres. If they were to take up the mass effect 1 model of giving you side quests* and dialogue in response to your history (determined by race and mage status in DA probably) and choices about your past (like how you joined or something that happened during your career) then that would be an alternative to origins that would give some decent responsiveness (and would give us much more then that one convo with Josie). Obviously it would be lovely to have more then one choice of background organisation aswell (though i expect you'd get content for that, rather than aswell as career history choices content).
*and I don't mean text boxes like the war table
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Post by gervaise21 on Feb 7, 2021 9:45:46 GMT
I feel like if we were a Lord of Fortune in the game (and I think this applies to the Siccari, the Crows, and other organisations/professions too) then it would not be the organisation that you join as the main story impetus like the Grey Wardens, the Inquistion and the Spectres, but rather it would be a part of your background. Like Shepard always being an N7 of the alliance military, regardless of whether their Pre Service History is Earthborn, Spacer, or Colonist. Or if their Psychological Profile is Sole Survivor, Ruthless, or War Hero. Now I could accept Lord of Fortune as a sole background if they did the ME1 approach to it. I did like how you could vary your Shepard with those two different parameters and then, as you say, actually had a side quest associated with that. Also, there was dialogue that varied when talking with other people. If they did this it would make the character to feel less bland and only different in your head. What I wouldn't want is for them to say you are a Lord of Fortune, give a brief explanation of what that means and then that is it. However, they could equally do that if they varied the background like they did in DAI, so your race automatically had a background connected with it. Except, in DA4 they could adjust this concept so that you get the choice of more than one background for your race, as with DAO, but without the origin stories, which would mean far less resources expended on this aspect as dialogue and any sub-plots would be applicable to the background you chose. So all races could be offered LoF as a background plus one or more other alternatives that could cover most races, e.g. Sicarri; Warden, etc.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Feb 7, 2021 10:07:29 GMT
I feel like if we were a Lord of Fortune in the game (and I think this applies to the Siccari, the Crows, and other organisations/professions too) then it would not be the organisation that you join as the main story impetus like the Grey Wardens, the Inquistion and the Spectres, but rather it would be a part of your background.
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Post by The Elder King on Feb 7, 2021 10:42:00 GMT
I feel like if we were a Lord of Fortune in the game (and I think this applies to the Siccari, the Crows, and other organisations/professions too) then it would not be the organisation that you join as the main story impetus like the Grey Wardens, the Inquistion and the Spectres, but rather it would be a part of your background. Eh, I think that’s also a possibility. In all honestly though, I’m quite fine with any of the suggested background or organization, as well as something that’s come out of the blue. I just want to know more about the protagonist, hopefully, this year.
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Post by gervaise21 on Feb 7, 2021 11:04:32 GMT
I just want to know more about the protagonist, hopefully, this year. I agree. So far all we've have been told is what they aren't; they're not a returning PC (Inquisitor) and they don't have any special power or prophesy linked to them. Oh and Varric's got your back. So at the moment we could be just about anybody. It would be nice if they could narrow it down a bit.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Feb 7, 2021 11:30:53 GMT
Eh, I think that’s also a possibility. In all honestly though, I’m quite fine with any of the suggested background or organization, as well as something that’s come out of the blue. I just want to know more about the protagonist, hopefully, this year. They're a worthless sack of shit who are ruining the franchise. What more is there to know?
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Post by The Elder King on Feb 7, 2021 11:40:11 GMT
Eh, I think that’s also a possibility. In all honestly though, I’m quite fine with any of the suggested background or organization, as well as something that’s come out of the blue. I just want to know more about the protagonist, hopefully, this year. They're a worthless sack of shit who are ruining the franchise. What more is there to know? Well, to you, and I'm sure others. Not everyone feels the same. Although I also don't think it's the new protagonist's fault if Bioware went in another direction. The new protagonist can be interesting, or a good overall protagonist, even if they'd pale in the immersion of the Solas-related plot. You can loathe the new protagonist, it's fair. But objectively, they're not at fault for what happened.
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Post by Hanako Ikezawa on Feb 7, 2021 11:42:39 GMT
They're a worthless sack of shit who are ruining the franchise. What more is there to know? Well, to you, and I'm sure others. Not everyone feels the same. Although I also don't think it's the new protagonist's fault if Bioware went in another direction. The new protagonist can be interesting, or a good overall protagonist, even if they'd pale in the immersion of the Solas-related plot. You can loathe the new protagonist, it's fair. But objectively, they're not at fault for what happened. Well obviously not, since they aren’t real but just a bunch of 1s and 0s. But on the other hand, they kind of are since they are the character and story that were put on top despite ruining everything else. They won’t be good or interesting either. Just a piece of shit as I said, especially with all the moronic ideas spouted in here.
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