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Post by theascendent on Oct 9, 2017 22:58:15 GMT
Indeed I really want to see the Imperial Chantry. Doesn't the one in Tevinter precede the one in Orlais? In regards to being "evil". I prefer a sliding scale of realism Vs pragmatism, with appropriate consequences both good and bad as befitting our decisions. Bioware has a nasty habit in recent years of having the "stupid evil" trope afflict many of its games. Being evil for the sake of being evil is inevitable pointless as we are chastised both in and out of game for the sheer short sightedness of the actions of our "evil" PC's. If for instance I'm going to kill someone, I want to know why I should do so, what purpose will their death serve and how it benefits me. Killing someone just for a lark is pointless and a waste of time and effort. Unless you like to roleplay as a mass murdering, psychotic, genocidal sociopath than have fun! I prefer my villainy to be more nuanced and have meaning beyond petty self gratification or delusions.
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Post by Lazarillo on Oct 9, 2017 23:49:15 GMT
Indeed I really want to see the Imperial Chantry. Doesn't the one in Tevinter precede the one in Orlais? Orlesian Chantry was first. Go figure that Tevinter didn't immediately take to worshipping the chick who razed their empire. That said, Tevinters believed in "the Maker" long before there was an Andraste at all, let alone an Orlais. Think similar to Judaism and Christianity. Except then all the Jews became Mormons. Kinda. Maybe? Okay, that analogy stopped working.
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Post by wright1978 on Oct 10, 2017 12:27:15 GMT
I just want to see a living breathing functioning imperium. I hope there's some dispassion in their portrayal rather than preachy reformism.
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Post by cloud9 on Oct 12, 2017 19:04:53 GMT
To annihilate Tevinter to the Dark Ages.
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Post by bladefist on Oct 12, 2017 19:21:09 GMT
I want to be a blood mage and see the game recognize me as one. It shouldn't be hard because Tevinter.
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Post by bladefist on Oct 12, 2017 19:47:53 GMT
Yeah Orgins did this pretty well with Denerim and to a lesser extent Amaranthine DA2 continued the trend with Kirkwall Then Inquisition dropped the ball with Orlais. I really expected to be all over Orlais, and return to Denerim. But we just got these vast open spaces to adventure in.
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Post by vertigomez on Oct 12, 2017 20:15:33 GMT
Yeah Orgins did this pretty well with Denerim and to a lesser extent Amaranthine DA2 continued the trend with Kirkwall Then Inquisition dropped the ball with Orlais. I really expected to be all over Orlais, and return to Denerim. But we just got these vast open spaces to adventure in. I thought Denerim was a disappointment, too, to be honest. It's supposed to be this huge hub of commerce and you've got... like four people hawking their wares. I'd love it if Minrathous - or Vyrantium, or Qarinus - was basically Vintish Frostbite-beautiful Kirkwall with no loading screens. You move seamlessly from district to district. Ancient, crumbling buildings held together by magic... slums that put Dust Town to shame... give it to meeeee.
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Post by gervaise21 on Oct 12, 2017 20:29:26 GMT
No Tevinter was the first Church of the Maker though it probably wasn't called a Chantry. The name did indeed come from Orlais. They didn't immediately worship her in Tevinter. It took Hessarian 10 years to realise that he had heard the voice of the Maker at her death and convert. More likely he was just struggling to hold together the Imperium in the face of revolt by the downtrodden masses, in particularly the slaves inspired by her actions and also those of Shartan. Then he turned his conversion of the Imperium into a bloodbath of all those Magisters who refused to support his change of religion and wrote the Canticle of Silence to justify his actions.
Then 134 years after the death of Andraste, Drakon was born and having received a very convenient vision to spread the word of the Maker, at the age of 16 took to the battlefield to unify the clans of what was to be known as Orlais and wipe out any rival cults of Andraste in order to "simplify things" (in the words of Ameridan). Finally got the Chantry established officially 20 years later with the election of the first Divine.
For some peculiar reason the Tevinter Church was willing to bend over backwards to be accepted by this late comer to the scene, dropped the Archon as their head of religion as well as of state and transferred power to the Grand Clerics, although Orlais still refused to recognise them because they admitted men to the priesthood. However, at this time the highest ranking clergy were non-mages even if mages were still allowed in the priesthood (apparently unknown to the southerners).
The oddest part is the role played by the Canticle of Silence in everything. This was presumably in circulation in Tevinter, yet it was said to be the Orlesian Chantry that laid blame for the Blights on Tevinter and ultimately the southern Divine removed the Canticle of Silence from the Chant as political propaganda.
I shall be very interested to see the Imperial Chantry's take on the historical progress of their religion. Also the additional canticles that are only found in the Imperial Chant.
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Post by theascendent on Oct 12, 2017 22:23:46 GMT
No Tevinter was the first Church of the Maker though it probably wasn't called a Chantry. The name did indeed come from Orlais. They didn't immediately worship her in Tevinter. It took Hessarian 10 years to realise that he had heard the voice of the Maker at her death and convert. More likely he was just struggling to hold together the Imperium in the face of revolt by the downtrodden masses, in particularly the slaves inspired by her actions and also those of Shartan. Then he turned his conversion of the Imperium into a bloodbath of all those Magisters who refused to support his change of religion and wrote the Canticle of Silence to justify his actions. Then 134 years after the death of Andraste, Drakon was born and having received a very convenient vision to spread the word of the Maker, at the age of 16 took to the battlefield to unify the clans of what was to be known as Orlais and wipe out any rival cults of Andraste in order to "simplify things" (in the words of Ameridan). Finally got the Chantry established officially 20 years later with the election of the first Divine. For some peculiar reason the Tevinter Church was willing to bend over backwards to be accepted by this late comer to the scene, dropped the Archon as their head of religion as well as of state and transferred power to the Grand Clerics, although Orlais still refused to recognise them because they admitted men to the priesthood. However, at this time the highest ranking clergy were non-mages even if mages were still allowed in the priesthood (apparently unknown to the southerners). The oddest part is the role played by the Canticle of Silence in everything. This was presumably in circulation in Tevinter, yet it was said to be the Orlesian Chantry that laid blame for the Blights on Tevinter and ultimately the southern Divine removed the Canticle of Silence from the Chant as political propaganda. I shall be very interested to see the Imperial Chantry's take on the historical progress of their religion. Also the additional canticles that are only found in the Imperial Chant. Thanks for the clarification mate! I wonder if the site of Andraste's death is known or has the site been "forgotten" over the centuries.
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Post by bladefist on Oct 13, 2017 1:03:37 GMT
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Post by gervaise21 on Oct 13, 2017 10:17:27 GMT
I don't think anyone disputes that she died up in Minrathous or that she was burned at the stake. The reason for the latter was probably not simply a desire to be cruel but also to prevent the likelihood of her body being occupied/resurrected by a spirit. Tevinter must have known such things were possible, certainly the former, and would want to avoid a demon using her persona against them. So you burn her to ashes, not much scope for anyone believing in her return there. For all we know, Hessarian could have stabbed her because he was afraid she wasn't dying.
What is open to question is where exactly in Minrathous the execution took place. The Chant places it outside the gates in front of the opposing armies. That seems to have been disproved by the historians as utter rubbish since her army never reached the gates of Minrathous, so the alternative suggested by Genitivi, the public square inside the walls, seems far more likely.
What does seem to have been altered over time is the site of the Valarian Fields. This is now shown up near Minrathous as indicated in the Chant. However, Andraste was captured from her stronghold in Nevarra and it seems highly unlikely that she would have got as far as the gates of Minrathous, only to turn around and march hundreds of miles back down south again. Both historical accounts and the Canticle of Shartan suggest that the battle was fought in the south of Tevinter proper, somewhere between what is now Nevarra and Val Dorma. Following the battle, Andraste was eager to march on northwards into the heart of Tevinter but Maferath realised it had been a near run thing in the previous battle and they in fact had yet to take on the might of the true Magisterium, whilst Tevinter loyalists were already rallying in areas they had previously conquered, so he decided to call time on the Exalted March and consolidate their gains in the south. Naturally Hessarian was only too pleased to agree to the proposal to surrender Andraste in return for ceding the southern Imperium to Maferath, because Tevinter was finding it increasingly hard to control even before Andraste began her crusade. So each side avoided spending valuable resources on a fruitless enterprise and Andraste was handed over. A thoroughly political decision.
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Post by boxofscreaming on Oct 13, 2017 12:12:33 GMT
According to the codex (so it must be true), Darkspawn are a common problem in Tevinter even when there isn't a blight on, so let's see more of them.
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Post by Zatche on Oct 13, 2017 13:09:22 GMT
I just want to see a living breathing functioning imperium. I hope there's some dispassion in their portrayal rather than preachy reformism. I'd like to see the reformists at odds with the Imperium traditionalists. But I hope the slave owners and blood mages less mustache twirly than Lanarius, Erimond, or Howe. I'd rather they were dispassionate, and in some cases, the slave owners preachy, a la Fassbender in 12 Years a Slave.
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Post by SwobyJ on Oct 13, 2017 17:31:15 GMT
A city.
1/3-1/2 the base game content in Minrathous (DLC then could reduce this, though DLC taking place there could also happen). I imagine something like 1/3 Minrathous, 1/3 elsewhere Tevinter or close, 1/3 elsewhere (Anderfels? Arlathan? Nevarra?). DLC anywhere from other lands (Seheron? Nevarra? Antiva?) to just deeper look at previously unknown parts of Tevinter or Minrathous.
Able to be justifiably evil. I'd understand not being psychopathically evil, but if I can't be even justifiably evil in TEVINTER (especially if they put us in a strongly Tevinter role), I consider that a design failure. Same as if I couldn't be self-righteously Orlesian (granted Inquisitor is technically 'Marcher'), or if I can't be capitalistically Antivan, or brainwashing Qunari, or bizarrely Rivainian, or simplistically Ferelden, or free-spirited Marcher. Sure you can play around with things, but if I'm basically a Tevinter and I'm basically in a Tevinter story... let me be what is a)the stereotype of Tevinter to at least some extent, b)what Tevinter culture has a hell of a lot of. If I'm fighting Qunari, let me hate them more than ever before, and take callous action against them. Sure don't force it or make it cartoonishly extreme, but you can let it. If I'm in a mage-supremacist land, let me express my particularly high adoration of magic and those who wield it. Sure don't have me be the actual mustache twirling villainous Tevinter mage, but you can go pretty damn close while still being at least anti-hero in the end. If I'm in a slave-owning land, let me enslave and have defensible (even if perhaps arguably not winning defenses) reasons for slavery. Sure don't put it up as the ideal of Bioware (duh), but let my protagonist accept the world they're in, and even situationally reward him for that. Yes there's a realism vs idealism clash there, but get over it. etc
I want to visit the Circle, meet or see their Black Divine.
If done well, my dream is to fly across the city and take great screenshots.
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Post by SwobyJ on Oct 13, 2017 17:35:23 GMT
According to the codex (so it must be true), Darkspawn are a common problem in Tevinter even when there isn't a blight on, so let's see more of them. Yes and its a bigger issue in say Tevinter and Anderfels than it is in Orlais (mostly, and until Descent) and Ferelden (until recent surprise Blight). Its not exactly like Orzammar and the Deep Roads, sure, but they're much more mindful of the threat than the south is/was. If DA4 doesn't have a lot of Darkspawn, I'd be disappointed but hope for a Darkspawn focused expansion. If DA4 has zero Darkspawn, I'd be much more confused and dismayed than when there was (practically) no Desire Demons in DAI. There'd have to be a fantastic excuse and a promise of a huge focus on them coming (in DLC or a DA5), at the very least.
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Post by Iakus on Oct 13, 2017 20:49:40 GMT
The Silent Plains.
A dwarven ambassadoria
White haired, bronze skinned giants in gleaming steel armor.
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theascendent
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Post by theascendent on Oct 13, 2017 21:40:33 GMT
Really want to see what is in the forest of Arlathan. Especially poignant for any Elven PC's.
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Post by davesin on Oct 16, 2017 5:58:32 GMT
Hm, let's see:
- Tevinter schools of magic. And I mean both the Circles (or what do they call them in Tevinter) and various magic types (Dorian mentions Thaumaturgy. Ah, well, as VTM player, the sole sound of it makes me to boil someones blood in their veins...) - the way mages police themselves. Wiki claims that Rite of Tranquility is sometimes used even in Tevinter and there are apperently non-templar warriors trained to kill mages and demons. I'm sure it can be just as misused as in Southern Thedas (and it will make disscusions over mage freedom much more interesting). - the city of Solas. Fen'Harel will definitely burn it to the ground just out of spite. - more Qunari and Dwarven technology - Griffons. I'm sure we can make a trip to Anderfels... to solve some trouble... and ride one of those majestic beasties...
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Post by helios969 on Oct 17, 2017 7:40:09 GMT
i want to see the darkness of this country into his very deeps. i mean, all of why Tevinter is not popular and hated in the rest of Thedas. Yes, I would like to see such, but I'd also like the exact opposite. Societies are not monolithic; it's an entire spectrum from good to bad. Everything presented thus far has been from the South's perspective...probably just a tad biased.
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Post by rahavan on Oct 17, 2017 8:01:37 GMT
Hmmm there's a few things I'd like to see
The ability to play a bad guy whose logical not insane. I really dont want to be murdering people just cuz.
The specializations to feel like they're fleshed out and not just two or three skills.
I would love for the level environments to be vary diverse and fantastical. As much as I loved the beauty of DAI there weren't many areas that made me feel like I was in a fantasy world.
Oh and good hair styles though that might be too much to ask for.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 17, 2017 10:12:08 GMT
i want to see the darkness of this country into his very deeps. i mean, all of why Tevinter is not popular and hated in the rest of Thedas. Yes, I would like to see such, but I'd also like the exact opposite. Societies are not monolithic; it's an entire spectrum from good to bad. Everything presented thus far has been from the South's perspective...probably just a tad biased. I can quite understand it, anyway, for the moment we only can speculate based on what we know about it.
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