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Post by Gandalf the Fabulous on Mar 15, 2018 2:04:55 GMT
I hear the cry "keep your politics out of my comic books/video games/movies" a lot and while I must admit I do find it a little eye rollingly cringy when the writer tries to force a political statement somewhere where it feels out of place, aren't most creative outlets influenced by the politics of their creators? Take for instance something like Judge Dredd, some believe it is a response to the Thatcher government (even though the comic was created before Thatcher was in power) you can't deny that the series does contain a lot of political satire poking fun at authoritarian governments by taking them to their logical extremes and it is fucking awesome!
So what do you think, should politics be kept out of creative media? Or is it only the politics you don't like?
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Post by Deleted on Mar 15, 2018 2:08:36 GMT
put this on the political thread.
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Post by DragonKingReborn on Mar 15, 2018 2:10:07 GMT
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Post by Gandalf the Fabulous on Mar 15, 2018 2:15:25 GMT
put this on the political thread. I dunno it isn't really discussing the actual politics themselves, moreso the concept of politics in creative media.
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Post by The Hype Himself on Mar 15, 2018 3:27:06 GMT
I don't see why not. I mean, a lot of games work quite well with the inclusion of politics - just look at the Bioshock series and how it juxtaposes ultra-far-right wing economic/social principles in the first game, ultra-far-left principles in the second game, and religious extremism in the third game. Extremism as a whole is the main theme of that entire series.
In 1, you had the ultra-capitalist/objectivist society of the individual and profit more or less founded on the 'philosophy' put forward by Ayn Rand and subsequently tearing said philosophy apart, in 2, you had the collectivist/pseudo-'altruistic' idea of pure equality. And of course, for 3, the game goes against more social aspects (religious extremism, nationalism, fascism, etc.) whereas the first two focused on more philosophical/economical models.
To be fair, each game could be said to represent some aspect of each end of the spectrum to some degree, though as I interpret it, it's fundamentally against extremism with a bit of a slant towards center-left politics as the ideal end state (though that may just be me.)
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Post by House Targaryen on Mar 15, 2018 3:44:06 GMT
Yeah, keep your out of my Badlur's Gate, Beamdog.
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Post by Larry-3 on Mar 15, 2018 6:38:15 GMT
There is more than one way to look at this. When you state politics, are you saying a political scene, or someone personal political views?
I do not mind political scenes in media.
Now in the case of personal political views being in media, that is more difficult to answer. As long as it is not being shoved down our mental throats.
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Post by Gandalf the Fabulous on Mar 15, 2018 6:53:03 GMT
There is more than one way to look at this. When you state politics, are you saying a political scene, or someone personal political views? I do not mind political scenes in media. Now in the case of personal political views being in media, that is more difficult to answer. As long as it is not being shoved down our mental throats. I am talking about somebodies political views influencing the work they create. I am curious what you would consider somebody shoving a political opinion down your throat when viewing something somebody else created? Can you give an example?
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Post by Pearl on Mar 15, 2018 7:59:48 GMT
I don't really care so long as the content is well-written and appropriate in the context of the media (as in, I don't want to see a medieval fantasy game suddenly try to lecture me about the US Patriot Act or something silly like that). However, if the content is blatantly shoehorned in and only serves to appeal to specific demographics with no regard for the characters involved or the established universe, then I think it's a serious problem, even if it's a message that I would otherwise agree with.
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Post by Gandalf the Fabulous on Mar 15, 2018 8:17:04 GMT
I don't really care so long as the content is well-written and appropriate in the context of the media (as in, I don't want to see a medieval fantasy game suddenly try to lecture me about the US Patriot Act or something silly like that). However, if the content is blatantly shoehorned in and only serves to appeal to specific demographics with no regard for the characters involved or the established universe, then I think it's a serious problem, even if it's a message that I would otherwise agree with. Yeah I agree with that, of course I would never say that people can't create this sort of content however I do think it is poor writing to do something like this.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 15, 2018 12:16:08 GMT
I don't really care so long as the content is well-written and appropriate in the context of the media (as in, I don't want to see a medieval fantasy game suddenly try to lecture me about the US Patriot Act or something silly like that). However, if the content is blatantly shoehorned in and only serves to appeal to specific demographics with no regard for the characters involved or the established universe, then I think it's a serious problem, even if it's a message that I would otherwise agree with. Pretty much this. As long as the political things actually serve a purpose, they're fine. But if they are just thrown out there just for the hell of it, then it becomes pandering that only pisses people off.
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Post by mousestalker on Mar 15, 2018 12:25:00 GMT
All creative media should be required by law to express only anarchist or libertarian viewpoints.
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Post by bmwcrazy on Mar 15, 2018 19:59:40 GMT
It's annoying when it gets too preachy.
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Post by Arijon van Goyen on Mar 15, 2018 20:37:29 GMT
All creative media should be required by law to express only anarchist or libertarian viewpoints.
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Post by Larry-3 on Mar 15, 2018 22:26:08 GMT
There is more than one way to look at this. When you state politics, are you saying a political scene, or someone personal political views? I do not mind political scenes in media. Now in the case of personal political views being in media, that is more difficult to answer. As long as it is not being shoved down our mental throats. I am talking about somebodies political views influencing the work they create. I am curious what you would consider somebody shoving a political opinion down your throat when viewing something somebody else created? Can you give an example? No examples, but... I don't really care so long as the content is well-written and appropriate in the context of the media (as in, I don't want to see a medieval fantasy game suddenly try to lecture me about the US Patriot Act or something silly like that). However, if the content is blatantly shoehorned in and only serves to appeal to specific demographics with no regard for the characters involved or the established universe, then I think it's a serious problem, even if it's a message that I would otherwise agree with. Pearl kind of took the words out of my mouth with this.
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Post by Larry-3 on Mar 15, 2018 22:31:36 GMT
All creative media should be required by law to express only anarchist or libertarian viewpoints. I cannot tell if you are being serious or not, Mouse...
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Post by DragonKingReborn on Mar 15, 2018 22:37:30 GMT
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Post by Larry-3 on Mar 15, 2018 22:55:26 GMT
Well if one is going to be on the dark side side, might as well be open about it, ha.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 16, 2018 0:38:29 GMT
As with anything else it works when done well and is cringeworthy when not. Same goes for philosophical questions in general.
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Post by Vortex13 on Mar 16, 2018 16:13:24 GMT
What I find especially annoying with politics and current or trending social topics is how they tend to crop up in game narratives wholly divorced from our reality and so detract from the setting. BioWare is the biggest offender in this regard (IMO) though there are certainly other developers who have done this. A science fiction world, filled with myriads of strange and decidedly alien species… and all the narrative wants to do is focus on how X human minority or subgroup is represented and that they get their soapbox to stand on. Humans, and our latest #hashtag movements are incredibly boring. Especially when we have a freaking alien in the background that we could go and talk to otherwise. I can easily turn on the news, load up twitter, or just stick my head outside to get a dose of what the latest buzzwords or social movements are. I can not do the same for something like a rachni or elcor on the other hand. All of this potential for interesting storytelling, or even just exploration of non-human concepts at the very least... but no, we get to listen how this character has daddy issues, or who this other character happens to be sexually attracted to instead. Shoehorning those topics into the setting only makes whatever point the developer is trying to get across feel cringe worthy as well as overtly preachy. Want to talk about gender fluid dynamics in your science fiction game (for example), and not have it come across as forced? How about instead of inserting human NPC spokesperson to list the bullet points of that subject, you instead work it into a more palatable part of the setting? The Liir of the Sword of the Stars universe had to have been the most interesting and level-headed approach to representing gender dynamics, and even transgenerism, in a game while at the same time not coming across as preachy or out of place considering the setting that they exist in. IMO.
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Post by Heimdall on Mar 16, 2018 16:25:06 GMT
I’m fine with politics in art, it’s the people that object to any art that doesn’t pander to their politics that bother me.
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Post by Treacherous J Slither on Mar 16, 2018 16:41:03 GMT
I'm fine with it as long as it makes sense within the universe created.
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