Toyish Batphone
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Post by Toyish Batphone on Feb 26, 2017 15:57:44 GMT
Hello all,
I have been wondering about the effects of Biotics usage and aging on non-Asaris - I was trying to imagine how people like Jack, Kaidan, Jacob, Miranda and Biotic Shepard would live when they are old.
For example, as Humans age, their body's processes starts getting slower. Mental functions and capacities will not be what they used to be and the same is true of our metabolisms and metabolic rates.
Since Biotics usage involve the nervous system and is tied to metabolism, does using Biotics a lot age a Human or Turian or Salarian prematurely ? Can Biotics usage lead to a higher chance of health complications like severe migraines or paralysis or stroke or Parkinson's Disease or dementia or Alzheimer's Disease in non-Asari ?
Do we have any information on this at all ? I can't seem to find any. Interestingly, we do not see any old Human or Turian or Salarian Biotic users in game - They are all young. We have only seen old Asari and Krogan Biotic users. Even Thane, who is a terminally-ill Biotic user is not old and his disease is not related to the nervous system.
Looking forward to your comments on this matter.
Cheers.
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bshep
N5
We destroy them or they destroy us.
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Post by bshep on Feb 26, 2017 16:10:44 GMT
Implications unpleasant. Can a Biotic cause damage to themselves through carelessness or due to their failing biology? Probably. As for old Biotics, I'd imagine that it largely depends on the state of their nervous system. If it's in working order, then I'd assume that theoretically they would be able to use biotics. They would likely be slower and much less effective, but that's true about old age in general, not just in regards to biotics. In Mass Effet 3 there is a conversation between two asari MP characters where they state the reason why they don't use Blink (the teleportation skill) is because it can render the user sterile. |
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Post by Psychevore on Feb 26, 2017 16:13:18 GMT
That there's a thing such as aging at all in the MEU is kinda baffling.
We, the human species, right now, are seriously considering that aging isn't something unavoidable, but something we can actively try to prevent.
Because in essence, aging is just a buildup of damage in your cells. If we could repair this damage, or even prevent it from building up at all, aging becomes nothing more than a preventable disease.
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Post by Qui-Gon GlenN7 on Feb 26, 2017 17:21:19 GMT
I am reminded of the old man in Toy Story 3, that had the shakes like mad until he lined up his needle.... And then it was on like a Reegar Kroguard vs Geth.
Age slows some processes down, but muscle memory never dies and skill is a legitimate thing that is developed by some more than others. This is why old Jiu-Jitsu players can still thrash the less experienced kids, even though they are physically outmatched.
So, the question is interesting. I think that it would be in ways detrimental, but that also it would be possible that a mastery could be achieved.
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Post by Psychevore on Feb 26, 2017 17:25:01 GMT
That there's a thing such as aging at all in the MEU is kinda baffling. We, the human species, right now, are seriously considering that aging isn't something unavoidable, but something we can actively try to prevent. Because in essence, aging is just a buildup of damage in your cells. If we could repair this damage, or even prevent it from building up at all, aging becomes nothing more than a preventable disease. It's not like cellular regeneration technology is just around the corner or anything. It is highly likely that no one living today will be able to enjoy it. Also, as long as we are still trapped on a single planet, introducing such technology to the public will be disastrous, we will reach very quickly population explosion if no one died and everyone kept reproducing. It's not about regenerating the cells per se. Ideally, we'd prevent the damage from accumulating at all. The mechanisms by which this damage occurs are quite well understood, except now we mostly deal with the effects of having the damage instead of preventing the damage. And some scientists beg to differ, the first person that will become a 1000 years old is likely to be alive today. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strategies_for_Engineered_Negligible_SenescenceI'm not that worried about population explosions by the way. Even in the current state of the world the effects of having a high life expectancy are drastic. In countries where the life expectancy is high people not only get children at a vastly later age than in countries where the life expectancy is low, but they also get vastly less children. This effect would only be increased when we reach lifespans of thousands of years, especially because it doesn't seem unlikely that we'd ever lose our fertility (though this might require a little tinkering with women...), so people can decide to have kids at age 500 or something. The pressure of having a child because of the biological clock would be removed completely. |
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Wulfram
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Post by Wulfram on Feb 26, 2017 17:43:00 GMT
We couldn't see any old human Biotic users around, because Biotics is the result of in-utero eezo exposure that wouldn't occur prior to the discovery of mass effect physics.
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SKAR
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Post by SKAR on Feb 26, 2017 17:52:28 GMT
Hello all, I have been wondering about the effects of Biotics usage and aging on non-Asaris - I was trying to imagine how people like Jack, Kaidan, Jacob, Miranda and Biotic Shepard would live when they are old. For example, as Humans age, their body's processes starts getting slower. Mental functions and capacities will not be what they used to be and the same is true of our metabolisms and metabolic rates. Since Biotics usage involve the nervous system and is tied to metabolism, does using Biotics a lot age a Human or Turian or Salarian prematurely ? Can Biotics usage lead to a higher chance of health complications like severe migraines or paralysis or stroke or Parkinson's Disease or dementia or Alzheimer's Disease in non-Asari ? Do we have any information on this at all ? I can't seem to find any. Interestingly, we do not see any old Human or Turian or Salarian Biotic users in game - They are all young. We have only seen old Asari and Krogan Biotic users. Even Thane, who is a terminally-ill Biotic user is not old and his disease is not related to the nervous system. Looking forward to your comments on this matter. Cheers. Considering the technology, they've probably found cures and solutions for all of that. Cancer is gone so Parkinson's and Alzheimer's should be too. Not quite sure about Joker's condition but they would've found a cure eventually. |
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midnightwolf
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Post by midnightwolf on Feb 26, 2017 18:15:52 GMT
Hello all, I have been wondering about the effects of Biotics usage and aging on non-Asaris - I was trying to imagine how people like Jack, Kaidan, Jacob, Miranda and Biotic Shepard would live when they are old. For example, as Humans age, their body's processes starts getting slower. Mental functions and capacities will not be what they used to be and the same is true of our metabolisms and metabolic rates. Since Biotics usage involve the nervous system and is tied to metabolism, does using Biotics a lot age a Human or Turian or Salarian prematurely ? Can Biotics usage lead to a higher chance of health complications like severe migraines or paralysis or stroke or Parkinson's Disease or dementia or Alzheimer's Disease in non-Asari ? Do we have any information on this at all ? I can't seem to find any. Interestingly, we do not see any old Human or Turian or Salarian Biotic users in game - They are all young. We have only seen old Asari and Krogan Biotic users. Even Thane, who is a terminally-ill Biotic user is not old and his disease is not related to the nervous system. Looking forward to your comments on this matter. Cheers. . Cancer is gone so Parkinson's and Alzheimer's should be too. Not quite sure about Joker's condition but they would've found a cure eventually. Indeed. It's my understanding from playing the games, that gene therapy is normal in the World of ME. So many health problems aren't issues anymore. Assuming you can afford it of course. |
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bshep
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We destroy them or they destroy us.
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Post by bshep on Feb 26, 2017 18:34:02 GMT
In Mass Effet 3 there is a conversation between two asari MP characters where they state the reason why they don't use Blink (the teleportation skill) is because it can render the user sterile. That's... bizarre, and too specific to be plausible. I mean, I can definitely see something like this tearing someone to shreds if they did it wrong, but that's just too specific and arbitrary IMO. It's ingame, so it is canon. Besides we are talking about a universe where some beings can manipulate gravity and travel faster than light, who (besides the devs) is to say what can or cannot happen.  |
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Post by shepherdcommander on Feb 26, 2017 18:40:41 GMT
I actually had the theory that the biotics were what allowed the asari to live long lifes in comparison to the other species. that and the fact that they were engineered by the protheans. as to why other species biotics are typically younger has to do with the lore, remember the eezo spills on XX planet (too lazy, cant remember) that cause the majority of human biotics (which was actually an intentional spill caused by cerberus as i recall). resulted in the majority of L2s then there was another event that led to the majority of L3s and the surgical processs for the L1-L5 implants have to be done at a younger age so that made all the L2 human biotics around the same age (20-25 i believe in ME1, so up to 30 by ME3?)
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Post by sageoflife on Feb 26, 2017 18:56:32 GMT
The flavor text for Jack's unique upgrade in ME2 notes that it's typical for human biotics to get weaker as they get older. However, Jack is an explicit exception in that she is continuing to get stronger. Kaidan likewise notes that his biotics are getting stronger as he gets older. Since these two are the only human biotics to be directly compared to asari, the answer seems to be that most non-asari biotics get weaker with age, but if the power level is above a certain threshold to begin with, they get stronger instead.
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bshep
N5
We destroy them or they destroy us.
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Post by bshep on Feb 26, 2017 18:58:27 GMT
It's ingame, so it is canon. Besides we are talking about a universe where some beings can manipulate gravity and travel faster than light, who (besides the devs) is to say what can or cannot happen. That's not saying much unfortunately. A lot of stupid things are part of canon. And in any case there is a difference between everything that's part of the "big lie" that's connected to the mechanics of Eezo, and something which makes little sense from a logical standpoint. It would make far more sense if the potential damage was something less specific, such as say, general cellular damage to the body, etc. Well, becoming infertile is a damage at cellular level. ps: Now i remembered that Jack according to ME2 suffers from neural degeneration. |
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Wulfram
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Post by Wulfram on Feb 26, 2017 19:10:57 GMT
It's ingame, so it is canon. Besides we are talking about a universe where some beings can manipulate gravity and travel faster than light, who (besides the devs) is to say what can or cannot happen. That's not saying much unfortunately. A lot of stupid things are part of canon. And in any case there is a difference between everything that's part of the "big lie" that's connected to the mechanics of Eezo, and something which makes little sense from a logical standpoint. It would make far more sense if the potential damage was something less specific, such as say, general cellular damage to the body, etc. They're Asari, their reproduction is somehow connected to their Biotics I think, so it could make sense for them maybe? Or maybe they just read it in the Asari Daily Mail and its a load of rubbish |
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midnightwolf
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Post by midnightwolf on Feb 26, 2017 19:13:10 GMT
That's not saying much unfortunately. A lot of stupid things are part of canon. And in any case there is a difference between everything that's part of the "big lie" that's connected to the mechanics of Eezo, and something which makes little sense from a logical standpoint. It would make far more sense if the potential damage was something less specific, such as say, general cellular damage to the body, etc. They're Asari, their reproduction is somehow connected to their Biotics I think, so it could make sense for them maybe? Or maybe they just read it in the Asari Daily Mail and its a load of rubbish LOL! Don't you mean Daily Fail. |
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Post by BansheeOwnage on Feb 26, 2017 19:40:19 GMT
In Mass Effet 3 there is a conversation between two asari MP characters where they state the reason why they don't use Blink (the teleportation skill) is because it can render the user sterile. I know I'm sort of echoing people, but: Like much of the Citadel DLC, it's hard to know how seriously to take it. It does seem oddly specific. It sounds more like someone saying "Having a cell phone in your pocket will make you sterile!" Besides which, it might only render asari infertile if true. That might actually make more sense, since their reproduction involves manual control over their nervous system, which is related to biotics. Edit: Clarification: Their nervous system is related to biotics, biotics are not related to reproduction. That there's a thing such as aging at all in the MEU is kinda baffling. We, the human species, right now, are seriously considering that aging isn't something unavoidable, but something we can actively try to prevent. Because in essence, aging is just a buildup of damage in your cells. If we could repair this damage, or even prevent it from building up at all, aging becomes nothing more than a preventable disease. While it might make some sense, from a meta perspective it depends what kind of world you want to make. A world of immortals would be much different to write than what we have. |
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Post by Revan Reborn on Feb 26, 2017 21:41:33 GMT
Biotics are unnatural for anyone that is not an asari, so I'd imagine the possible damage using such abilities over time could be disastrous. Of course, many of the non-asari biotic users that were squadmates were exceptional and not the norm. Cora also seems to be another unique example, given her unique opportunity to train with asari commandos. Even if the implications of inevitable body breakdown were likely, I'm not sure that's ever going to be an issue addressed in one of these games. We almost always have squadmates that are in their prime or this would never be a concern.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 26, 2017 22:00:06 GMT
I'm curious about this so I directed your question to Ian, he's directing me to Joanna Berry. Will post answer here when I get it.  |
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pantherdane
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Post by pantherdane on Feb 26, 2017 22:02:11 GMT
I would really think that an old Biotic person would either die from the strain of the Biotics or have to be contained (like someone with Alzheimer's) due to the dangerous nature of the power.
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kaind
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Post by kaind on Feb 26, 2017 22:38:13 GMT
Implications unpleasant. Can a Biotic cause damage to themselves through carelessness or due to their failing biology? Probably. As for old Biotics, I'd imagine that it largely depends on the state of their nervous system. If it's in working order, then I'd assume that theoretically they would be able to use biotics. They would likely be slower and much less effective, but that's true about old age in general, not just in regards to biotics. In Mass Effet 3 there is a conversation between two asari MP characters where they state the reason why they don't use Blink (the teleportation skill) is because it can render the user sterile. Mother of contraceptives! Hit it and blink it! |
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Post by rahavan on Feb 26, 2017 22:39:00 GMT
I would really think that an old Biotic person would either die from the strain of the Biotics or have to be contained (like someone with Alzheimer's) due to the dangerous nature of the power. Contained? Why? It's not like they are crazy or anything. And their ability would probably be weaker anyway. I don't think you've met or experienced someone with Alzheimer's, they can get very upset and even angry. Just imagine being told you've already said something and believing it's a lie because to your memory you didn't say anything. Some people would find that irritating and get upset. Now I'm not saying this is the case for everyone with Alzheimer's but it happens. Now here's a thought an autistic child with biotics that would be tough to raise. |
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Post by rahavan on Feb 26, 2017 22:53:01 GMT
I don't think you've met or experienced someone with Alzheimer's, they can get very upset and even angry. Just imagine being told you've already said something and believing it's a lie because to your memory you didn't say anything. Some people would find that irritating and get upset. Now I'm not saying this is the case for everyone with Alzheimer's but it happens. Now here's a thought an autistic child with biotics that would be tough to raise. Yes, but most old people don't suffer from this particular disease, and it has nothing to do with biotics specifically. Fair point, I imagine there really isn't a definitive answer either since bioware properly have not put thought into "oh yeah what if mentally ill or other uncontrollable people have biotics?" Hell, best guess we have is with Jack, just shove them in cyro freeze if they're uncontrollable. I would like to think that there would be a similar place like the ardat yashi monastery for other races. A place to put those who are too dangerous for the general public but have not committed a crime (or the government/public believes unethical to kill). |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 26, 2017 22:58:55 GMT
Got an answer to this just now.
SomebodyOfNobody@of_somebody
On the effects of Biotic usage&aging on non-Asari how do ppl like Jack, Kaidan, Miri and Biotic Shep would live when they r old?
SomebodyOfNobody@of_somebody
does using Biotics a lot age a Human or Turian or Salarian prematurely?
Ian S. Frazier @tibermoon
I don't know. But @joanna_Berry might.
Jo Berry @joanna_Berry
Using biotics doesn't affect the aging process. Asari live a long time because of robust cellular regeneration.
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Wulfram
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Post by Wulfram on Feb 26, 2017 22:59:18 GMT
If a non-asari biotic has long term mental problems you'd probably just take away their amp, maybe even disable their implant.
Admittedly, no-one seems to have thought that was a good idea with Jack for some reason.
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Post by KalleDemos on Feb 27, 2017 0:58:31 GMT
I think the best realistic answer to this question is that we don't know. Humans haven't been part of galactic society for long and have only recently discovered Biotics and trained people to use them. I don't think there are human Biotics old enough yet to give a clear answer to this question and that probably won't change in Andromeda re Cryo sleep. This question is probably better to ask of non-Asari and non-human species that have had Biotics long enough to understand the effects of life long use.
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Post by theflyingzamboni on Feb 27, 2017 1:44:00 GMT
*75-year-old Shepard uses Biotic Charge*
*All bones shatter*
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