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Post by tomice on Mar 19, 2017 10:54:52 GMT
Hi!
I'm posting this in the spoiler section to allow discussion of certain construction details regarding the Nexus & the Arcs, but I'd prefer if this thread would stay free of significant story spoilers, especially mid- and lategame (I've played 5 hours of the trial so far).
As someone very interested in architecture and industrial design, it bothers me immensely that the Nexus and the Arcs seem so unrelated in their appearance, as if they would have been designed by two completely unrelated species on a vastly different tech level. It bothers me even more that their size relation is so ridiculous.
The Nexus is almost 10 times longer, resulting in at least 100 times the interior volume. We know that each arc contains around 20.000 colonists, which is the majority from each species. If we take the number of 100.000 total colonists from the release trailer, this only leaves a few 1000 per species on the Nexus.
What do they with all the space that's left? Sure, there might be cargo, but why do they split the load so weirdly? If an arc is lost, there aren't enough individuals left from the corresponding species to allow for a prospering colony. If the Nexus is lost, the whole initiative loses all of it's equipment and probably also all frigates / mid-sized ships (as it seems that the arcs only contain shuttles and fighters)
In my humble opinion, I would have preferred if the Nexus was around 10 times the volume of the arcs and contained half of the population of each species. The much larger arcs could then also contain more equipment, being more self-sufficient in case of the destruction of the Nexus. They should have also given the arcs 1 frigate (Tempest-style ship) each, while the HQ at the Nexus should have another 4-6.
This version would also better explain the enormous role the human arc played for the wellbeing of the Nexus (it powers the whole Nexus after all, which is just strange considering how very small it appears).
Do you agree or have I missed something?
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Post by Space Cowboy on Mar 19, 2017 14:58:33 GMT
It made no sense to me that the pathfinder was on the ark but didn't have a ship until he got to the nexus. The shuttles were obviously not enough given what happened on Habitat 7.
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Post by armass81 on Mar 19, 2017 15:29:36 GMT
No guns in the rovers, or the ships. Poor crisis situation handlers.
To be fair, the whole initiative seems to be tought up by some naive idealists. Its apparent when you walk in the museum for example, and woow do some races twist the truth of their histories(cough asari).
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Post by tomice on Mar 19, 2017 15:36:48 GMT
It made no sense to me that the pathfinder was on the ark but didn't have a ship until he got to the nexus. The shuttles were obviously not enough given what happened on Habitat 7. Haven't even thought about it, but that's true. Why separate your most important specialists from their equipment? What use is it to bring the scout ships one year earlier when there's no crew for them??? I mean, if they already have one super-important main ship 100 times larger than the other 4, why would any sane person send the big, irreplaceable ship one year earlier? IMHO, a way more sane plan would have been this: 1) Send one arc-sized (1,5km) ship ahead, containing mostly scouts/pathfinders, pioneers and diplomats. The ship should have a relatively small crew of specialists but have hangars for as many shuttles an scout frigates as possible. These scout ships should check out the 7 golden worlds, then direct the first arc to the most promising candidate and create a foothold. If unexpected problems occur, they could send word to the nexus and redirect it somewhere safe. 2) The nexus (13km) should follow where the "scout arc" already secured an initial outpost. As it is the main vessel containing most of the equipment, it should carry half the colonists from all species. 3) The other arcs should serve as backup in case the Nexus somehow gets destroyed. They should assure that each species has a second chance in case the population on the Nexus gets killed. Each arc should carry enough cargo to somehow allow the foundation of a colony, even if it's way less prosperous than it could have been with the more elaborate equipment from the nexus. In case everything goes well, they should speed up the colonization effort by dropping it's equipment off on one of the 6 other golden worlds. Wouldn't this make way more sense? |
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Post by Space Cowboy on Mar 19, 2017 15:51:30 GMT
Yep, way more sense.The ark should have had all the gear, Tempest and Nomad included.
They pretty much put all their eggs in one Nexus shaped basket and hoped the arks wouldnt get separated.
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Post by Ahriman on Mar 19, 2017 17:09:32 GMT
You make total sense, but that's a little late, isn't it?
Besides even if founders were total idealists, they are facing reality in Andromeda. And know what? Nothing, they still try to stick with original plan, despite the fact that Kett have military fleet and can obliterate all their colonies from the sky, since AI refuses to gear up. Though for story reasons Kett will be honorable and will send only a handful of soldiers in waves.
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Post by laxian on Mar 19, 2017 18:08:19 GMT
No guns in the rovers, or the ships. Poor crisis situation handlers. To be fair, the whole initiative seems to be tought up by some naive idealists. Its apparent when you walk in the museum for example, and woow do some races twist the truth of their histories(cough asari). Well, the Asari are deceitful little shits, we all know that (I still like them, but I'd love to see them lose their council seat for a number of years after breaking council laws regarding Prothean tech over all and beacons especially!)...then again: They are kind of designed that way (I really wounder what/how they were before the Protheans stepped in and genetically modified them and uplifted them...they might have been totally different!) But yes, I agree with the sentiment (Gien Garson and her other leaders seem damn naive! No guns on ships and vehicles (any half decent Terminus Merc Outfit can take that expedition on damned, probably without breaking much of a sweat (except for the Krogan maybe and people who brought guns and equipment in their personal stash - the stuff Vetra hints at!)), barely any hand-weapons (and not very good ones - you have to make your own if you want anything half way decent...come on Avengers and Predators? Damned, that's weapons for some company door guard and/or for police (not SWAT or other special units, but regular cops on the street!) but not something you'd take on an expedition somewhere IMHO!) and they don't even have plans for SHTF...if I would plan something like that, then the Nexus would be FINISHED (!) and it would have enough food output to feed all my colonists for some time and enough energy to go somewhere else if worlds turn out to be a bust (and my Nexus would have guns and some frigates to put up a credible defense!)...I mean what would they do without the Remnant-Technology on those planets making them habitable? Lay down and die? Shoot themselves?) greetings LAX |
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Post by armass81 on Mar 19, 2017 18:48:25 GMT
Maybe its because Garson lived on the higher society(i think), they rarely see the world as it is, as she only saw the side of the peaceful citadel life. Ignorance. A few years on the frontier in attican traverse or terminus would have been good for her.
When you live in a bubble you tend to ignore the rest.
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Post by SwobyJ on Mar 19, 2017 19:54:54 GMT
Maybe its because Garson lived on the higher society(i think), they rarely see the world as it is, as she only saw the side of the peaceful citadel life. Ignorance. A few years on the frontier in attican traverse or terminus would have been good for her. When you live in a bubble you tend to ignore the rest. Yep. People mock this setup but its pretty clear as you investigate that Bioware is also aware of how naive it is and how that bit everyone, nearly ruining everything. And we do improve our weapons, armor, Nexus, etc as we go, and in greater Milky Way and foreign ways. We don't get the greater effects of things because MEA is still probably within just a matter of months. We'd have to see DLC/sequel to see the longer term effects of success of the Initiative. I don't mind it. |
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Post by tomice on Mar 19, 2017 20:29:07 GMT
People mock this setup but its pretty clear as you investigate that Bioware is also aware of how naive it is and how that bit everyone, nearly ruining everything. Well, maybe you're right and the Initiative is intentionally depicted naive? Those advertisement vids on the walls and the initial encounter with AVINA certainly make it look this way. Maybe I just haven't reached the point where it becomes obvious, but until now, no one really got angry at Jien Garson for not having a proper Plan B (or something like that). |
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Post by vyndral on Mar 19, 2017 20:42:47 GMT
People mock this setup but its pretty clear as you investigate that Bioware is also aware of how naive it is and how that bit everyone, nearly ruining everything. Well, maybe you're right and the Initiative is intentionally depicted naive? Those advertisement vids on the walls and the initial encounter with AVINA certainly make it look this way. Maybe I just haven't reached the point where it becomes obvious, but until now, no one really got angry at Jien Garson for not having a proper Plan B (or something like that). The wall vids were what sold it for me. As soon as you wake up there is a video on the wall from the leader saying, 'the hard part is over'. Sleeping was the hard part? Yeah. I was sold on naive then. Either that or a plot twist somewhere along the line where the had more information about what was going on here. |
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Post by ts1279 on Mar 20, 2017 1:02:30 GMT
I haven't seen it said outright but... - The Council races and presumably the Initiative learned during the Geth invasion that the Citadel itself is a mass relay
- The Initiative put in their mission statement video that they hope to return to the Milky Way with resources and technology
- The Nexus is compared numerous times in marketing and in-game to the Citadel
Based on this I always assumed the intent was that the new tech and resources in Andromeda could be used to complete the Nexus, not as just a capital and administrative center, but as a mass relay back to the Milky Way. This dual role dictated the Citadel-like size and shape. I admit it would be naïve for them to assume they'd be able to do so when no one else has... but as others have pointed out naiveté is in character.
The Nexus is actually small in size for this, clocking in at a third the size of the Citadel, but almost exactly the same length as a Reaper-designed mass relay.
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Post by SwobyJ on Mar 20, 2017 2:45:57 GMT
People mock this setup but its pretty clear as you investigate that Bioware is also aware of how naive it is and how that bit everyone, nearly ruining everything. Well, maybe you're right and the Initiative is intentionally depicted naive? Those advertisement vids on the walls and the initial encounter with AVINA certainly make it look this way. Maybe I just haven't reached the point where it becomes obvious, but until now, no one really got angry at Jien Garson for not having a proper Plan B (or something like that). Mad at Jien? She's dead, and the angry people got exiled, and the remaining on the Nexus are fairly desperate. I don't know the content of Nexus Uprising though. |
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Post by laxian on Mar 20, 2017 4:48:19 GMT
Maybe its because Garson lived on the higher society(i think), they rarely see the world as it is, as she only saw the side of the peaceful citadel life. Ignorance. A few years on the frontier in attican traverse or terminus would have been good for her. When you live in a bubble you tend to ignore the rest. Maybe - but on the other hand, as a company leader (she was (or is? We haven't seen a dead body, so there's a chance she's alive!)) and an entrepreneur (do we know if she grew up wealthy or was she a self-made woman and became wealthy later on, kind of like say Mark Zuckerberg (as much as I hate/dislike that guy - I think he is a thief and should give a lot of his money to the guys he stole the facebook idea from!)?) she should be kind of used to backroom dealing and to needing security to not be robbed etc. Still, you could have a point  and anybody who survives the experience would profit from a few years in the traverse or directly in the terminus (maybe on Omega itself!) not that I'd love to go there myself (unless I get to pick my own crew etc. - I'd run my own merc outfit that way and the first person I'd recruit would be ZAED (he knows how to run a merc-group so he'd be my second in command!)) greetings LAX |
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and anybody who survives the experience would profit from a few years in the traverse or directly in the terminus (maybe on Omega itself!) not that I'd love to go there myself (unless I get to pick my own crew etc. - I'd run my own merc outfit that way