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Post by mastert on Mar 25, 2017 0:58:00 GMT
and what... the... WHY ARE THERE FEMALES EVERYWHERE?
When i saw the krogan female on nexus I said fine, but wtf, they are everywhere just chilling with their weapons like some viking female fantasy.
What's going on? I thought every krogan went mad about a female in the milky way, and now they're on par with the males?
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Post by mastert on Mar 25, 2017 1:00:17 GMT
and what... the... WHY ARE THERE FEMALES EVERYWHERE? When i saw the krogan female on nexus I said fine, but wtf, they are everywhere just chilling with their weapons like some viking female fantasy. What's going on? I thought every krogan went mad about a female in the milky way, and now they're on par with the males? Also since when the krogans are so civilised? So they're nice now? we're all equal?
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FireAndBlood
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Post by FireAndBlood on Mar 25, 2017 22:07:59 GMT
They mention they're doing things differently in Andromeda, for starters no more having males and females living in separate clans. You should check out the terminals there, it goes into further detail of integrating the two genders and has got some of the funniest e-mails in the game.
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Archangel
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had to be me...someone else might have gotten it wrong.
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Post by Archangel on Mar 25, 2017 22:40:06 GMT
They mention they're doing things differently in Andromeda, for starters no more having males and females living in separate clans. You should check out the terminals there, it goes into further detail of integrating the two genders and has got some of the funniest e-mails in the game. And you'll learn more about Varren Jerky than you ever wanted to know...
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Post by SwobyJ on Mar 26, 2017 6:13:42 GMT
I'm more bothered by already noticing like 3 salarian females in non-leading positions in politics (okay the one Pathfinder is something in a way).
This matter is supposed to be outright deeply ingrained in them. Come now. I can take one, maybe two, but when the story is putting them over and over in my face, I have to wonder whether anyone gave a remote damn about worldbuilding - you know, for MEA, the 'big world building' title?
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Post by nickles on Mar 26, 2017 8:13:55 GMT
Back in the milky way, female krogan were kept apart from male krogan for their own protection. They cover it pretty extensively in ME2 and 3. The jist of it is, there was no shortage of females -- there was a shortage of fertile females. Given Krogan birth rates and the abundance of hostility between clans, it was decided that for the survival of a clan, their females and young should live separately from their males; ideal scenario being that the females remain hidden and protected physically by their warriors as needed. The "last resort" was the exploitation of infertile females -- who were used as decoys to lure enemy clans from what was the very lifeblood of a clan. You wipe out a clan's breeders, and they're gone for good. Wrex made it clear that there's no recovery from that. Things are different in Andromeda because a) the increased birthrates and far less clans and hostility between them. They're not really in a state where they can just nuke each other, and even the Krogan realize that every female is pretty important given the very limited number of Krogan in Andromeda. Even to settle grudges, killing their women just wouldn't be worth it. I mean, some stuff regarding the Krogan is pretty off in Andromeda, but the number of females isn't really one of these things.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 26, 2017 8:37:12 GMT
For every population it would be a 50 - 50 split most likely, which is what we've finally seen in Andromeda for all the Milky Way races and The Angara. This is a non-issue, right?
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Post by laxian on Mar 26, 2017 10:35:55 GMT
I'm more bothered by already noticing like 3 salarian females in non-leading positions in politics (okay the one Pathfinder is something in a way). This matter is supposed to be outright deeply ingrained in them. Come now. I can take one, maybe two, but when the story is putting them over and over in my face, I have to wonder whether anyone gave a remote damn about worldbuilding - you know, for MEA, the 'big world building' title? 3 out of BILLIONS OF SALARIANS in the MW? I actually love this and it makes sense: Something like the A.I. would attract people that don't exactly life normal lives, people who don't fit in etc. (it attracts oddballs, the ones gaing against the grain! Nerds, explorers, scientists and people who are unsatisfied with their lives etc. - you will never get "normal" people when planing something like that and frankly: You don't want them! You want visionaries, dreamers! People thinking outside the box etc. etc.!) Same for that Krogan clan, it's a small one but open to new ideas (something that the bigger clans are not - hell, Wrex has to fucking beat new ideas into their head (or headbut, them into their heads as that might work better with Krogan!))...I loved having all of those Krogan around, especially since they were NOT all gung-ho fighters/mercs going for the glory, nope: They are as varied in their personalities as humans are (I actually don't like this stereotyping science fiction does for races - "so you are a Klingon, so you must be into fighting and honor. Hm...a Romulan? Deceitful bastard (even if you don't know him/her)!"...damned, people are individuals -.-) greetings LAX
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Post by Ahriman on Mar 26, 2017 11:02:53 GMT
I'm more bothered by already noticing like 3 salarian females in non-leading positions in politics (okay the one Pathfinder is something in a way). This matter is supposed to be outright deeply ingrained in them. Come now. I can take one, maybe two, but when the story is putting them over and over in my face, I have to wonder whether anyone gave a remote damn about worldbuilding - you know, for MEA, the 'big world building' title? Glad I'm not the only one. Female salarian as a secretary for Tann? Dafuq?
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Post by FireAndBlood on Mar 26, 2017 11:12:47 GMT
I'm more bothered by already noticing like 3 salarian females in non-leading positions in politics (okay the one Pathfinder is something in a way). This matter is supposed to be outright deeply ingrained in them. Come now. I can take one, maybe two, but when the story is putting them over and over in my face, I have to wonder whether anyone gave a remote damn about worldbuilding - you know, for MEA, the 'big world building' title? Glad I'm not the only one. Female salarian as a secretary for Tann? Dafuq? I'm guessing she's young? I doubt female salarians are made leaders from birth.
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Post by SwobyJ on Mar 26, 2017 19:39:19 GMT
Don't get me wrong - I can make justifications for all three of the female salarians.
Its more a matter of seeing them all in quick sequence without the game story justifying it to me. Or its even a matter of showing so many, so quickly and me getting a sense that its the writers just going "deal with it".
Female salarians are not directly and officially made to be leaders from birth. But they are a tenth of salarian population, sheltered, and focused on complex political and dynastic maneuvering. This tends to result in expectations of some degree of political leadership, as salarian families are highly political by default.
If you're going to show a male salarian as a political leader and three female salarians as not political leaders, that's more than worth just the hint of a note in the codex (I'm talking only early game so far, when this happens). An exception may be made to a Pathfinder as that can be considered a de-facto political leader, in regards to the Initiative framework, for the cause of the fate of the Andromedan salarian people.
I admit there's implications of things throughout my experience. Unlike some people I've seen online recently, I don't consider what I see to be an actual 'lore break'. However, I do consider the implementation to possibly be weak writing that may be for the sake of just including females of each species more.
One good thing to note is that the two female salarians have distinctly high voices which could indeed mean that they're rather young and we can imagine them to be breaking social boundaries (as I have to remind people, CODEX DOES NOT EQUAL TRUTH), whereas the voice of the dalatrass in ME3 can mean she's rather old. I may end up being cool with that. I'm just not okay with such bending of Mass Effect 'realities' as to feel like its pushing in my face that THIS INITIATIVE IS DIFFERENT AND EVERYONE IN IT WANTS TO BE SO DIFFERENT AND IT WORKS SOMEHOW OK? That basic concept, I can love. But it needs to be less in my face, and more just present and explained, and ideally we can make decisions regarding it.
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Post by SwobyJ on Mar 26, 2017 19:40:22 GMT
I'm more bothered by already noticing like 3 salarian females in non-leading positions in politics (okay the one Pathfinder is something in a way). This matter is supposed to be outright deeply ingrained in them. Come now. I can take one, maybe two, but when the story is putting them over and over in my face, I have to wonder whether anyone gave a remote damn about worldbuilding - you know, for MEA, the 'big world building' title? 3 out of BILLIONS OF SALARIANS in the MW? I actually love this and it makes sense: Something like the A.I. would attract people that don't exactly life normal lives, people who don't fit in etc. (it attracts oddballs, the ones gaing against the grain! Nerds, explorers, scientists and people who are unsatisfied with their lives etc. - you will never get "normal" people when planing something like that and frankly: You don't want them! You want visionaries, dreamers! People thinking outside the box etc. etc.!) Same for that Krogan clan, it's a small one but open to new ideas (something that the bigger clans are not - hell, Wrex has to fucking beat new ideas into their head (or headbut, them into their heads as that might work better with Krogan!))...I loved having all of those Krogan around, especially since they were NOT all gung-ho fighters/mercs going for the glory, nope: They are as varied in their personalities as humans are (I actually don't like this stereotyping science fiction does for races - "so you are a Klingon, so you must be into fighting and honor. Hm...a Romulan? Deceitful bastard (even if you don't know him/her)!"...damned, people are individuals -.-) greetings LAX Oh I get all that.
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Post by duskwanderer on Mar 26, 2017 20:13:01 GMT
Tann I can understand in his position simply because he's down the list of succession. He was eighth, the other seven are dead. The lore is established and I need nothing more on their part. The secretary could merely be the person who had that position. Or maybe she's only just been awoken.
Salarian females are required to be politicians: It's just that in the Milky Way, all politicians are female (except for Valern). I don't see a problem with salarian women in administrative roles, they're just kept from dangerous jobs due to their scarcity. It could be, as was stated, that Raeka could be an oddball drawn to the Initative like other oddballs. Variants always exist, it's just a bit weird. Maybe if you could ask her about it, it would be cool.
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Old BSN veteran, I guess.
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Post by Croatsky on Mar 26, 2017 20:25:26 GMT
Glad I'm not the only one. Female salarian as a secretary for Tann? Dafuq? I'm guessing she's young? I doubt female salarians are made leaders from birth. Yeah, I'm pretty sure they need to earn their ropes first before getting into leadership. Also AI was a disaster for first 14 months, so female salarians hardly can get same privileges like back in Milky Way.
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Post by FireAndBlood on Mar 26, 2017 20:32:39 GMT
Don't get me wrong - I can make justifications for all three of the female salarians. Its more a matter of seeing them all in quick sequence without the game story justifying it to me. Or its even a matter of showing so many, so quickly and me getting a sense that its the writers just going "deal with it". Female salarians are not directly and officially made to be leaders from birth. But they are a tenth of salarian population, sheltered, and focused on complex political and dynastic maneuvering. This tends to result in expectations of some degree of political leadership, as salarian families are highly political by default. If you're going to show a male salarian as a political leader and three female salarians as not political leaders, that's more than worth just the hint of a note in the codex (I'm talking only early game so far, when this happens). An exception may be made to a Pathfinder as that can be considered a de-facto political leader, in regards to the Initiative framework, for the cause of the fate of the Andromedan salarian people. I admit there's implications of things throughout my experience. Unlike some people I've seen online recently, I don't consider what I see to be an actual 'lore break'. However, I do consider the implementation to possibly be weak writing that may be for the sake of just including females of each species more. One good thing to note is that the two female salarians have distinctly high voices which could indeed mean that they're rather young and we can imagine them to be breaking social boundaries (as I have to remind people, CODEX DOES NOT EQUAL TRUTH), whereas the voice of the dalatrass in ME3 can mean she's rather old. I may end up being cool with that. I'm just not okay with such bending of Mass Effect 'realities' as to feel like its pushing in my face that THIS INITIATIVE IS DIFFERENT AND EVERYONE IN IT WANTS TO BE SO DIFFERENT AND IT WORKS SOMEHOW OK? That basic concept, I can love. But it needs to be less in my face, and more just present and explained, and ideally we can make decisions regarding it. I know of the Patfinder and Taan's aide but who's the third female salarian?
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Post by SwobyJ on Mar 26, 2017 21:11:40 GMT
Tann I can understand in his position simply because he's down the list of succession. He was eighth, the other seven are dead. The lore is established and I need nothing more on their part. The secretary could merely be the person who had that position. Or maybe she's only just been awoken. Salarian females are required to be politicians: It's just that in the Milky Way, all politicians are female (except for Valern). I don't see a problem with salarian women in administrative roles, they're just kept from dangerous jobs due to their scarcity. It could be, as was stated, that Raeka could be an oddball drawn to the Initative like other oddballs. Variants always exist, it's just a bit weird. Maybe if you could ask her about it, it would be cool. Yes! -Valern (and frankly Kirrahe, etc) was a thing, male salarians are not restricted from leadership roles, even in a sort of matriarchy -Being assistant to the outright director of the Initiative is major enough -Salarians are never understood to be necessarily sexist, except by a humancentric lens; resisting and rebelling against biology can (at least arguably) happen but when things are so drastic as with the salarians, things are just *alien* and that's *ok* -But salarians are also shown to be individuals. Even if stuff like thinking against their society is in itself 'unthinkable', that does not necessarily stop *very few* female salarians to have an individual take on things that make things work - though this is only so comfortable to comprehend within the story of the Initiative (we'll see if the point is to continue this way, or be only a sort of soft reboot of old things, or revisiting the old things, whatever). "Maybe you could ask her about it" - Exactly. It is very hard to just roll with seeing three (is there more?) female salarians in non-matriarchal roles in one game's story, all major enough to be in the more cinematic conversations scenes.
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Post by SwobyJ on Mar 26, 2017 21:14:22 GMT
Don't get me wrong - I can make justifications for all three of the female salarians. Its more a matter of seeing them all in quick sequence without the game story justifying it to me. Or its even a matter of showing so many, so quickly and me getting a sense that its the writers just going "deal with it". Female salarians are not directly and officially made to be leaders from birth. But they are a tenth of salarian population, sheltered, and focused on complex political and dynastic maneuvering. This tends to result in expectations of some degree of political leadership, as salarian families are highly political by default. If you're going to show a male salarian as a political leader and three female salarians as not political leaders, that's more than worth just the hint of a note in the codex (I'm talking only early game so far, when this happens). An exception may be made to a Pathfinder as that can be considered a de-facto political leader, in regards to the Initiative framework, for the cause of the fate of the Andromedan salarian people. I admit there's implications of things throughout my experience. Unlike some people I've seen online recently, I don't consider what I see to be an actual 'lore break'. However, I do consider the implementation to possibly be weak writing that may be for the sake of just including females of each species more. One good thing to note is that the two female salarians have distinctly high voices which could indeed mean that they're rather young and we can imagine them to be breaking social boundaries (as I have to remind people, CODEX DOES NOT EQUAL TRUTH), whereas the voice of the dalatrass in ME3 can mean she's rather old. I may end up being cool with that. I'm just not okay with such bending of Mass Effect 'realities' as to feel like its pushing in my face that THIS INITIATIVE IS DIFFERENT AND EVERYONE IN IT WANTS TO BE SO DIFFERENT AND IT WORKS SOMEHOW OK? That basic concept, I can love. But it needs to be less in my face, and more just present and explained, and ideally we can make decisions regarding it. I know of the Patfinder and Taan's aide but who's the third female salarian? Worker in the arrivals area. Again this stuff isn't utterly believable enough to me because I'm not a weird smudboy, but I think it at least needed more elaboration, and more reminder that no, this actually isn't normal and indeed the Initiative is an attempt at a sort of different society. A bit added to the codex isn't enough for me. If anyone knows of more lines or scenes, go ahead and say them.
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