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Post by Andrew Waples on May 21, 2017 0:12:08 GMT
For me, the number one thing must be quest design. To many of DAI's quests seemed unimportant and completely irrelevant. Like, i'm the Inquisitor here and i'm herding Halla and Druffalo over? Really, really BioWare? Yes, MEA had fetch quests and random quests as well, but they were few and far in between then say DAI. The majority of MEA's quest however felt relevant and important. The majority of them never felt like filler, although I did feel like some the quests in MEA took just a bit to long. Having to go from planet to planet one some of them was a bit annoying. The other thing, I feel like they need to reveal the game a bit earlier then did with MEA. The MEA team didn't really any feedback from the community till just a few months before the release the VGA trailer, with that whole facial animation issue. I'm no developer, but I doubt stuff like that can be fixed in a couple of months. It's a balancing act, you don't want to end up like The Last Guardian, but MEA wasn't given enough time for feedback from the community. I mean, the first gameplay (which really wasn't technically gameplay) footage of MEA was five months (if I remember correctly at the PS4 Pro event) before release.
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Post by Obsidian Gryphon on May 21, 2017 1:39:36 GMT
They have done a great job with interesting companions and dialogues so there's nothing to get from MEA (which didn't do very well) in those aspects.
Story pacing and content of side quests. Very important. These two comprise elements to immersion and enjoyment of the story / game. I never felt involved in MEA and ended up impatient to get everything over with and put it to rest. If they want to continue with the big zones, I hope they learn from feedback to create maps and put SQ that are of some relevance to the main story, not a useless time wasting jaunt for useless loot and no interesting story content.
Travel. The Nomad is an improvement over the Mako. Seriously, if they want to give us mounts. Kindly make them move realistically. I don't much care for a horse that leaves contrails and yet gallops at a walking pace.
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Post by rapscallioness on May 21, 2017 1:59:02 GMT
I would love an update at EA Play. Dragon Age galloping in like the Dark Horse. Alas....I'll be very surprised. Pleasantly surprised, though. I do think MEA improved on quest design and making small quests feel relevant to the overall situation. I would like to see DA build on that improvement.
And, you know, don't cut corners. I enjoyed MEA. It's such a shame they released it with the character animation issues. It's like they shot themselves in the foot. Don't cut corners. Don't sabotage yourself because I would like more good old fashioned BW games. k?thnx.
Other than that, it's hard to say because they're both very similar. The environments they've both got down pat. The combat in MEA is a ton of fun, but I don't like not being able to direct your party members. However, DAI did that first. I still don't like it.
And in DAI you could at least equip loot to your companions unlike MEA. I think DA also has a better leveling system for your companions, too. So, I don;t want DA to take on the companion leveling system of MEA.
I would like to see DA make meatier "loyalty missions" than they had in DAI. MEA had some cool LM's. And maybe a smaller crew like in MEA. I liked that.
I do agree that earlier exposure of the game to get some honest feedback might behoove them. Give them some time to adjust what may not be resonating for people. But isn't that what EA's CEO, Andrew Collins, I believe, said he wanted to do? IIRC, when he took on the job as CEO, he said he wanted to give the games earlier exposure for precisely that reason. I'm not seeing that in action, though.
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Post by Prince on May 21, 2017 2:55:34 GMT
Not the animations of the faces for sure.
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Post by Deleted on May 21, 2017 6:56:25 GMT
Hopefully nothing. Make area relate quest more related to the original plot, add cutscenes during dialogues and make the main plot longer. This was what DAI needed and none of them were provided in MEA
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Post by Catilina on May 21, 2017 9:21:08 GMT
The Inquisition was the worst game in the DA series, just as Andromeda in the MEA series (my opinion). It would be fine to back to the older games' concepts, and the Bioware finally would capable of dropping out this stupid open-world shit.
And better hair...
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Post by Deleted on May 21, 2017 11:39:38 GMT
Not much as ME:A had many of the same issues. They both need considerably less open world and more substantial side quests/companion quests. I'd also like the main quests to be cut up a little more like they were in ME:A (tho there we nowhere near enough of them), spending so long at the Winter Palace is a drag. If they'd chopped that in two somehow the pacing would've been better.
ME:A did have more of an effect after a choice, whereas when you choose the ruler of Orlais or Hawke/Warden you leave and it's never really mentioned again. At least you get specific Pathfinders in ME:A who play a part in the game, and Sloane/Reyes showing up at the end.
But other than that DA:I beats ME:A hands down in companions, romances, overall plot and world building.
I'd love an update but I suspect they'll be all on the new IP.
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Post by mmoblitz on May 21, 2017 12:48:42 GMT
The Inquisition was the worst game in the DA series, just as Andromeda in the MEA series (my opinion). It would be fine to back to the older games' concepts, and the Bioware finally would capable of dropping out this stupid open-world shit. And better hair... m with you on this. Concentrate on what made DA2 special in terms of the companions/timeline/combat and the Details that went into DAO which I thought were outstanding.
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Post by themikefest on May 21, 2017 13:26:59 GMT
Allow the player to have the option to not recruit companions Allow the player to get rid of companions.
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Post by dragontartare on May 22, 2017 3:38:34 GMT
I would love an update at EA Play. Dragon Age galloping in like the Dark Horse. Alas....I'll be very surprised. Pleasantly surprised, though. I do think MEA improved on quest design and making small quests feel relevant to the overall situation. I would like to see DA build on that improvement. And, you know, don't cut corners. I enjoyed MEA. It's such a shame they released it with the character animation issues. It's like they shot themselves in the foot. Don't cut corners. Don't sabotage yourself because I would like more good old fashioned BW games. k?thnx. Other than that, it's hard to say because they're both very similar. The environments they've both got down pat. The combat in MEA is a ton of fun, but I don't like not being able to direct your party members. However, DAI did that first. I still don't like it.And in DAI you could at least equip loot to your companions unlike MEA. I think DA also has a better leveling system for your companions, too. So, I don;t want DA to take on the companion leveling system of MEA. I would like to see DA make meatier "loyalty missions" than they had in DAI. MEA had some cool LM's. And maybe a smaller crew like in MEA. I liked that. I do agree that earlier exposure of the game to get some honest feedback might behoove them. Give them some time to adjust what may not be resonating for people. But isn't that what EA's CEO, Andrew Collins, I believe, said he wanted to do? IIRC, when he took on the job as CEO, he said he wanted to give the games earlier exposure for precisely that reason. I'm not seeing that in action, though. You can still direct party members in DAI. The tactics system is extremely watered down and the tactical cam sucks, true, but at least DAI still has a tactics system, in addition to being able to take control of companions directly. DA4 needs to keep companion control and tactical pausing, and bring back a more detailed tactics system like the older DA games had. Not much as ME:A had many of the same issues. They both need considerably less open world and more substantial side quests/companion quests. I'd also like the main quests to be cut up a little more like they were in ME:A (tho there we nowhere near enough of them), spending so long at the Winter Palace is a drag. If they'd chopped that in two somehow the pacing would've been better. ME:A did have more of an effect after a choice, whereas when you choose the ruler of Orlais or Hawke/Warden you leave and it's never really mentioned again. At least you get specific Pathfinders in ME:A who play a part in the game, and Sloane/Reyes showing up at the end. But other than that DA:I beats ME:A hands down in companions, romances, overall plot and world building.I'd love an update but I suspect they'll be all on the new IP. I agree with this completely, at least as of hour 43 of MEA. The only thing the DA team has to learn from MEA in this area is to NOT do what MEA did. I also agree with scaling back the open world. Wandering aimlessly through beautifully-rendered vistas with nothing of substance in them is a waste of my gaming time.
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Post by Deleted on May 22, 2017 9:56:01 GMT
Not much as ME:A had many of the same issues. They both need considerably less open world and more substantial side quests/companion quests. I'd also like the main quests to be cut up a little more like they were in ME:A (tho there we nowhere near enough of them), spending so long at the Winter Palace is a drag. If they'd chopped that in two somehow the pacing would've been better. ME:A did have more of an effect after a choice, whereas when you choose the ruler of Orlais or Hawke/Warden you leave and it's never really mentioned again. At least you get specific Pathfinders in ME:A who play a part in the game, and Sloane/Reyes showing up at the end. But other than that DA:I beats ME:A hands down in companions, romances, overall plot and world building.I'd love an update but I suspect they'll be all on the new IP. I agree with this completely, at least as of hour 43 of MEA. The only thing the DA team has to learn from MEA in this area is to NOT do what MEA did. I also agree with scaling back the open world. Wandering aimlessly through beautifully-rendered vistas with nothing of substance in them is a waste of my gaming time. Hour 43? That's just about the time when I went from really liking the game to feeling a bit meh about it all. ME:A is the first BioWare game that got worse towards the end for me, instead of ramping up the anticipation. Partly because I romanced Vetra and it was a bit lacklustre, but also I think that trying to wrap up all the side quests and having a 91% completion was also to blame. It drew the game out too much and I'd skip a lot of it next time round. Which is another thing, every other BioWare game I've played I've immediately started planning new runs, but for the first time I'm wanting to walk away and give it a few months.
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Post by Obsidian Gryphon on May 22, 2017 10:39:00 GMT
Which is another thing, every other BioWare game I've played I've immediately started planning new runs, but for the first time I'm wanting to walk away and give it a few months. Ditto. For games, it's not just Bioware, that have replay factor, I always think of what I could do differently next PT. But definitely, for me, MEA has no replay value. I uninstalled since I have no desire for further PTs. Even the MP holds no interest. I find ME3 MP more interesting; it's always funny to see everyone's reaction to an approaching Banshee or a possessed abomination leaping for you and you see the big bosses on its heels. * P.S. I'm wondering if...though in MEA everyone rides in the Nomad, if DA4 would allow companions mounts though I think it would cause more annoyance when A.I. pathing isn't done well. But in open spaces, it should be doable.
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Post by Deleted on May 22, 2017 10:45:49 GMT
Which is another thing, every other BioWare game I've played I've immediately started planning new runs, but for the first time I'm wanting to walk away and give it a few months. Ditto. For games, it's not just Bioware, that have replay factor, I always think of what I could do differently next PT. But definitely, for me, MEA has no replay value. I uninstalled since I have no desire for further PTs. Even the MP holds no interest. I find ME3 MP more interesting; it's always funny to see everyone's reaction to an approaching Banshee or a possessed abomination leaping for you and you see the big bosses on its heels. Uninstalled? Ouch. I haven't gone to those lengths as the damn thing took forever to download. I'm hoping I'll be enthusiastic about another run later in the year, I really wanna romance Cora so hopefully I'll want to play...probably alongside another game tho.
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Post by Obsidian Gryphon on May 22, 2017 10:53:25 GMT
Ditto. For games, it's not just Bioware, that have replay factor, I always think of what I could do differently next PT. But definitely, for me, MEA has no replay value. I uninstalled since I have no desire for further PTs. Even the MP holds no interest. I find ME3 MP more interesting; it's always funny to see everyone's reaction to an approaching Banshee or a possessed abomination leaping for you and you see the big bosses on its heels. Uninstalled? Ouch. I haven't gone to those lengths as the damn thing took forever to download. I'm hoping I'll be enthusiastic about another run later in the year, I really wanna romance Cora so hopefully I'll want to play...probably alongside another game tho. It's sad. When I changed to a new rig, the first game I installed was ME2 and DA II. Then ME3 and DAI and they have stayed, I never remove them because I'll play them now and then. Recently I reinstalled ME1 and it's going to stay too.
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Post by Deleted on May 22, 2017 10:59:07 GMT
Uninstalled? Ouch. I haven't gone to those lengths as the damn thing took forever to download. I'm hoping I'll be enthusiastic about another run later in the year, I really wanna romance Cora so hopefully I'll want to play...probably alongside another game tho. It's sad. When I changed to a new rig, the first game I installed was ME2 and DA II. Then ME3 and DAI and they have stayed, I never remove them because I'll play them now and then. Recently I reinstalled ME1 and it's going to stay too.
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Post by Obsidian Gryphon on May 22, 2017 11:09:31 GMT
It's sad. When I changed to a new rig, the first game I installed was ME2 and DA II. Then ME3 and DAI and they have stayed, I never remove them because I'll play them now and then. Recently I reinstalled ME1 and it's going to stay too. I'm not that terribly sad. Here's to DA4. It'll be like ...hopefully.
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Post by Iakus on May 22, 2017 15:23:55 GMT
The Inquisition was the worst game in the DA series, just as Andromeda in the MEA series (my opinion). It would be fine to back to the older games' concepts, and the Bioware finally would capable of dropping out this stupid open-world shit. And better hair... I would like to see them drop the open world part. The games were best when they were smaller and story and character driven. Not as linear as ME2, but yeah. Bioware games were at their best when they used large hub areas we could do in any order. Open world stretches the story thin and hampers companion content.
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Post by Deleted on May 22, 2017 22:05:57 GMT
Nomad. Totally awesome.
Strike teams for mp/sp boosts.
Planetary stories -good solid stories in every area
Way, way, way less exploration areas than in Inquisition. Andromeda got it better, but still could have lost one.
way, way smaller main hub: Tempest yay, Skyhold -ewwwwww
And what they did not do well enough in Andromeda, but I would wish they would in DA4: bisexual romances, watching the side- quests log through player eyes, to avoid too much back-and-forth, and place most of them to be done "as you go"; no abrupt fade-to-black, show some movement before slowly fading out the romantic scene;
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Post by NUM13ER on May 22, 2017 22:58:14 GMT
Direct lessons to learn from ME:A...
- It goes without saying the game needs to launch in a more polished, less buggy state than MEA to avoid a new shitstorm. The animations were better in Inquisition, so I'm not worried about the DA animation team suddenly forgetting how to do that next time around.
- Better mounts. The Nomad was a great way to get around and even fun to drive on certain terrain. Mounts need to better animated, more much faster and feel like they're moving faster. They were only moderately better than running around, so I barely used them.
- Improved side quests. MEA still had a lot of MMO checklist filler but Inquisition's sidequests lacked any narrative flair and in some cases very little connection to the overall story. Andromeda did this (relatively) better but Inquisition still needs to go much further.
- I don't want to see the removal of controlling companions and not being able to equip their gear. Just don't do that.
- Do not emulate MEA's Character Creator at all. At the very least just keep Inquisition's CC as is rather than streamline. Improvement and adding more options would be preferable, but lets not downgrade it as they did with Andromeda.
- Better looking hair. I'm tried of low-res static hair and especially of beards that look worse than some games from last gen. Of the scant few options of beards in Andromeda, all were lacklustre at best and one looked like they'd glued the hair to his face. DAI was poor in this area too.
- As for map size, please don't have a map be huge just for the sake of being able to brag about the games size. You can scale it down and give us more locations or better utilise a large map with meaningful things to do that justify more sizeable levels.
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Post by duckley on May 22, 2017 23:26:42 GMT
Just some minor things - BIGGER FONT and a better CC. I enjoyed MEA but I loved DA:I. I enjoy the collectables, go-fetch quests as well as the side quests. If they make the game less open world - then i want some really good DLCs.
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Post by Zemgus on May 25, 2017 3:33:49 GMT
DAI was a great game including all it's DLC I hope they learn more from it (and the other previous DA games) than MEA.
- Open World. I had no problem with DAI's openworld. I loved exploring different parts of Thedas. There's so much history and lore to discover. All the areas felt interesting and different (well there didn't really need to be THREE different desert areas...) and the enemies varied as well. MEA's planets in comparison were rather dull because the difference's were only superficial (if even that, at times): same enemies, same ruins, same beasts, from planet to planet. Andromeda had no history and that made the exploration often feel dull and pointless. You rarely find anything interesting, lore or otherwise.
- CC, player character and dialogue options. All of this DAI did exeptionally well (most of the time) - especially when compared to MEA. My only complaint about DAI's CC was the lack of decent hairstyles (and different options for different genders!) and not being able to change the colour of the eyebrows. That's it. Otherwise it was pretty great. Maybe the preset options could have been better looking so for those who do not wish to spend hours in CC can make a good looking character more easily. MEA's CC was better than DAI in two areas: hairstyles (including the wide range of different color options) and the makeup options. Especially the latter truly impressed me.
- Player Character. Ryder is MEA's greatest mistake. They are so pre-defined it's almost insulting to a fan of all previous Bioware games. You can't choose their background, don't have nearly enough control over their personality or relationships with other characters. Ryder family was disappointing and again seemed to define the player character too much, the CC system was fucked again, as you could have a white character with black parents, totally ruining the entire experience. Even Shepard was a thousand times better player character than Ryder... not to even mention Hawke, who I previously criticized for being a set character. Compared to Ryder, they are both damn near perfect.
- Dialogue. MEA's over-use of (character defining) autodialogue is it's biggest sin. You'd think they'd learned from ME3, but no. Once again, DAI is so much better in comparison and truly has nothing to learn from MEA's fuck up expect not to repeat it. It's ruins any roleplay you're trying to have when Ryder keeps blabbering on and on even more than SAM. I prefer my character to be silent. Let the companions comment the weather. Dialogue "options" were a joke, just the same thing said in 2 different ways most of the time. Why even give us the option, then? Seems like total waste of time. Ryder was automatically "snarky diplomatic paragon" and you could do little to play a different character, killing any replay value (or even playing the game once felt like a chore, I haven't even finished MEA yet and doubt I will touch it any time soon, it was just so very disappointing for a game I waited for years). DAI's dialogue options were very good most of the time, as they've been in all 3 games so far, so continue that and you'll be fine. Maybe more "evil" options in general would be nice, especially if we get to play a Tevinter born character.
- Companions. All MEA's companions seemed to get along most marvelously pretty much and that's just extremely dull to me. I don't like the "group of best friends" concept. I much prefer what the Dragon Age games have done: the companions are all here for their own reasons as well as the greater cause. They have their motivations and don't usually just happen to be there just because. I prefer it when there are tensions within the the group of wide ranging personalities and morality types instead of everyone just getting along and being friends. Like I love Vivienne and how she belittle's Blackwall all the time, or Solas and Sera never seeing eye to eye about anything, Fenris and Anders hating each other, Aveline and Isabela's dynamic, etc (as well as friendships like Wynne and Alistair, Isabela and Merrill, Bull and Vivienne, etc. It's great to have both). I also want there to be characters representing different factions. In MEA it feels like all companions think similarly about things. This has never been an issue in DA games before and I hope it continues to be so. If were going to Tevinter I hope we get a companion who is very much Pro-Tevinter, Pro-Blood Magic, Pro-Slavery and Pro-Magister kind of type (as opposed to another Dorian, Calpernia, etc).
- Class system. MEA's combat was great, but I truly favor the old class system over the profiles (which I never changed anyway and maybe that's why the combat got a bit repetitive after a while). It just works great for DA. Don't see why it should be changed now. I hope we get to see new abilities, specializations and stuff though. I liked the reactivity to our specializations that we get in DAI very much. I want to see blood magic return. DA doesn't feel same without it. Demon summoning would be something new I might want to see. We hear about it but never get to do it ourselves. Some consequences for using magic like that would be welcome, of course. Don't make things too easy.
So TL:DR: DAI was perfect and so were the other two DA games (yes, even DA2, despite it's grievous mistake of having no player races to choose from!). Continue the good work and don't repeat MEA's mistakes, and you should be fine. Better hair options would be most welcome though and bring back blood magic.
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Post by Obsidian Gryphon on May 25, 2017 4:28:21 GMT
- Companions. All MEA's companions seemed to get along most marvelously pretty much and that's just extremely dull to me. I don't like the "group of best friends" concept. I much prefer what the Dragon Age games have done: the companions are all here for their own reasons as well as the greater cause. They have their motivations and don't usually just happen to be there just because. I prefer it when there are tensions within the the group of wide ranging personalities and morality types instead of everyone just getting along and being friends. Like I love Vivienne and how she belittle's Blackwall all the time, or Solas and Sera never seeing eye to eye about anything, Fenris and Anders hating each other, Aveline and Isabela's dynamic, etc (as well as friendships like Wynne and Alistair, Isabela and Merrill, Bull and Vivienne, etc. It's great to have both). I also want there to be characters representing different factions. In MEA it feels like all companions think similarly about things. This has never been an issue in DA games before and I hope it continues to be so. If were going to Tevinter I hope we get a companion who is very much Pro-Tevinter, Pro-Blood Magic, Pro-Slavery and Pro-Magister kind of type (as opposed to another Dorian, Calpernia, etc). omg, this char would have to be one of the die-hard Tewinter nobility, someone I'd hate immediately.
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ShadowAngel
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uegshadowangel
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquistion, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda
UEG ShadowAngel
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Post by ShadowAngel on May 26, 2017 7:12:52 GMT
I don't think there's much to learn from Andromeda besides doing the opposite. Andromeda isn't being critically received well where as inquisition was and it was the best selling one. It's better to go off inquisition than an entirely different franchise anyways, especially when it's entirely different development teams doing them.
The only thing I think DA4 could pick up from andromeda is "maybe" and I think that's a small maybe, is side quests, I hear most think Andromeda does it a little better than inquisition but I don't think it's really much if an improvement.
So the equation would be: DA:I does well sales wise, critically wise, wins multiple GoTY awards, so simply go off inquisition and improve on what people pointed out as issues WHILE keeping what made it good in the process or you will end up with a mass effect andromeda. My own issue with andromeda is it made improvements from the OT but in the process removed what made the OT good so it was one step forward and two steps back.
Honestly, get rid of the hack and slash combat and the next game is already that much better so long as they keep a good story and interesting characters.
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sjsharp2010
N7
Go Team!
Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Mass Effect Andromeda, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
Posts: 10,639 Likes: 18,490
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sjsharp2010
Go Team!
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December 2016
sjsharp2010
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Mass Effect Andromeda, Anthem, Mass Effect Legendary Edition
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Post by sjsharp2010 on May 26, 2017 22:01:32 GMT
Not much as ME:A had many of the same issues. They both need considerably less open world and more substantial side quests/companion quests. I'd also like the main quests to be cut up a little more like they were in ME:A (tho there we nowhere near enough of them), spending so long at the Winter Palace is a drag. If they'd chopped that in two somehow the pacing would've been better. ME:A did have more of an effect after a choice, whereas when you choose the ruler of Orlais or Hawke/Warden you leave and it's never really mentioned again. At least you get specific Pathfinders in ME:A who play a part in the game, and Sloane/Reyes showing up at the end. But other than that DA:I beats ME:A hands down in companions, romances, overall plot and world building. I'd love an update but I suspect they'll be all on the new IP.Yeah I agree any updates we'll get from Boware wlil be based on the new IP or MEA's DLC assuming there is any. Hopefully there are gong to at least be 1 or 2 bits but we'll have to wait and see. I don' texpect to see any DA info yet as I think it's still too early for that. All they've kind of said is they're kind of working on one and we don't know for how long they have been so I wouldn't expect to see anything solid about the next DA until they're done working on the new IP.
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Ponendus
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Games: Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR
Origin: Ponendus
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ponendus
Mass Effect Trilogy, Dragon Age: Origins, Dragon Age 2, Dragon Age Inquisition, KOTOR, Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights, Jade Empire, Mass Effect Andromeda, SWTOR
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Post by Ponendus on May 29, 2017 2:53:40 GMT
Don't do open world. Ever again.
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